Goodbye Ron (???)

[JAEBALL]

I am serious about my first question... if Ron demanded those things... I didn't know.. is there a link or is that just speculation?

Considering some of you are were much into speculating, you haven't managed to speculate on why there was such a need to write songs together. There's the outlet of writing songs for solo albums and other bands if there's a need to be creative.




/jarmo

That's great Jarmo, and I agree... any of these guys can write a tune whenever they damn please... but that in no way answers my question. if Ron did demand those things... I didn't know.. which was why I asked...

Im starting to pick up on there is no proof that he did...otherwise you or ur number 1 fan would have answered me instead of going in a completely different direction.

[FunkyMonkey]

Well... when does management make any kind of statement? Not a criticism.. just an observation.
 

Unfortunately, you are right.

[TheBaconman]

"Go do a solo album if you want to release stuff.  We don't do that here."

This is a rational stance, as you see it?

Unless you're in Metallica, you're free to do that.

So what's your way of thinking?

My way of thinking is asking your band whey they never actually, you know...do anything is not some crazy question.

And its not then incumbent on the fans to come up with 47 reasons whey they don't.  Even going so far as to try and paint them as positive (if you think about it).

You are still WAY too wrapped up in the sitting in the room thing.  The actual beef is sitting on their asses for years at a time with no progress. 

You want to tell me he knew that going in, I'll agree.  But if stuff was still getting done, yes, in some way other than all sitting in a room together...there is not an issue.

The issue is that nothing gets done.  Not all sitting in a room.  Not trading tapes back and forth.  Nothing.  Years pass and nothing happens.

How do you know nothing is getting done?   All we know is that Axl didn't want Ron to be involved in the creative process

Although I have also said that Axls best work seems to do his best work, when he has equal partners in the band

And mb time to Axl isn't like time to you or that other guy.   Mb time to Axl is like that movie interstellar   Where once he starts writing and recording material.  Time goes by and strange rates.   To him it is only a month.  But to us its 10 years! Haha

[D-GenerationX]

Well... when does management make any kind of statement? Not a criticism.. just an observation.
 

Unfortunately, you are right.

"When they have something to tell us" is the snippy answer you usually get.  On paper, that makes sense.  

The fact entire calendar years can go by without them having anything to say?  Well, we don't open that door.

[D-GenerationX]

How do you know nothing is getting done?   All we know is that Axl didn't want Ron to be involved in the creative process

Has there been some sort of output that I am missing?

A year like 2012 or 2013 comes and goes without even a hint of a whisper of a rumor things are any closer to being done...I tend to think not much got done.  Pretty simple.

I do not see value in forcing myself to believe they actually spent those 731 days (2012 was a leap year, after all) just busting ass and getting shit done, for two reasons :

1) It strains believability long past its breaking point to suggest they were hard at work for 2 solid years on songs already largely done and didn't finish it.

2) I do not feel like I am risking my fandom, or am just some monster of a human being, to suggest they aren't doing much.  Its not hating.  Its being minimally observant.

From what I see, not much is getting done.  If the big counterargument is that there is all this super exciting and creative ambitious stuff being done behind the scenes, if that makes you feel better, hey...salud. 

Does fuck all for me though.

[jarmo]

My way of thinking is asking your band whey they never actually, you know...do anything is not some crazy question.

And its not then incumbent on the fans to come up with 47 reasons whey they don't.  Even going so far as to try and paint them as positive (if you think about it).

Do you mean why? Serious question. 
So why is it that one guy thinks it's up to him to dictate in public how, why, when things are done? What's the goal? And do you think that is a possibility? 

You are still WAY too wrapped up in the sitting in the room thing.  The actual beef is sitting on their asses for years at a time with no progress.

Just one aspect in a bigger picture.
If you fail to recognize that, you'll have little to no chance of seeing the whole painting. If you make complaints about something not being done in a specific way, and you also know that's never happened, suddenly your complaint seems kinda pointless to begin with.

The issue is that nothing gets done.  Not all sitting in a room.  Not trading tapes back and forth.  Nothing.  Years pass and nothing happens.

The issue is, there's stuff done. Axl spoke about that being the next thing.
Even if it takes X years to release it. It still doesn't mean he needs to drop that in order to facilitate somebody else's wishes.

If you think about it (there's that T word again), why is it up to Ron to decide where GN'R should go next? It's not his band. Sorry.
I know you think he should because it works for you. That's great. I hope you enjoy his solo album, since that's the one thing he can control.




/jarmo

[D-GenerationX]

The issue is, there's stuff done. Axl spoke about that being the next thing.
Even if it takes X years to release it. It still doesn't mean he needs to drop that in order to facilitate somebody else's wishes.

If you think about it (there's that T word again), why is it up to Ron to decide where GN'R should go next? It's not his band. Sorry.
I know you think he should because it works for you. That's great. I hope you enjoy his solo album, since that's the one thing he can control.

This stuff that is supposedly done is the mystery girlfriend who "lives in Niagara Falls".  You can only talk about her so long before a long annoyed public asks you to produce her.

I think you are too wrapped in this new deflection that this was about Ron trying run the band.  I'm not saying that and never have.  This was about no progress being made in any real way.  But you don't want to touch that one, so you have redoubled your efforts making sure all we talk about how out of line Ron was trying to run shit.

- If Ron thought griping to Axl was going to change things, Ron was wrong.
- If Ron thought expressing frustrations to fans at concerts was going to change things, Ron was wrong.
- If Ron thought passive agressive tweets and FB posts were going to change things, Ron was wrong.

Are we clear now?  Nothing Ron thought or did was right.  Not one thing.

So he bounced.  He can bounce.  We are lifelong fans.  We stay, regardless.

[jarmo]

No progress? Did you miss the tiny bit of info about the band being on tour for years? For a band with a reputation of canceling shows, that's progress!   

One guy created this drama. Totally unnecessary in my opinion.
If the band is such a horrible thing to be in, you go find something more enjoyable in life.




/jarmo

[D-GenerationX]

No progress? Did you miss the tiny bit of info about the band being on tour for years? For a band with a reputation of canceling shows, that's progress!   

I did miss that.  Have they been on tour?  Damn. 

I guess I was just too caught up in listening to all those albums they release.  Only so many hours in the day, you know.

One guy created this drama. Totally unnecessary in my opinion.
If the band is such a horrible thing to be in, you go find something more enjoyable in life.

Very much agreed.

[mortismurphy]

I am serious about my first question... if Ron demanded those things... I didn't know.. is there a link or is that just speculation?

Considering some of you are were much into speculating, you haven't managed to speculate on why there was such a need to write songs together. There's the outlet of writing songs for solo albums and other bands if there's a need to be creative.




/jarmo

Is this you admitting that GN'R have now pretty much axed creativity?

[jarmo]

Is this you admitting that GN'R have now pretty much axed creativity?

No.
I'll spell it out for you: If you are in need of oxygen, water, food and song writing, and you can't get the latter at this exact moment in GN'R, you're always free to do so outside of GN'R. Simple really.

The other guys manage this.

I guess I was just too caught up in listening to all those albums they release.  Only so many hours in the day, you know.

Maybe if you posted less drivel, you'd have more time for these things?





/jarmo

[mortismurphy]

Is this you admitting that GN'R have now pretty much axed creativity?

No.
I'll spell it out for you: If you are in need of oxygen, water, food and song writing, and you can't get the latter at this exact moment in GN'R, you're always free to do so outside of GN'R. Simple really.

The other guys manage this.

I guess I was just too caught up in listening to all those albums they release.  Only so many hours in the day, you know.

Maybe if you posted less drivel, you'd have more time for these things?





/jarmo

And this is a 'band', exactly how? None of the members can contribute ideas. There does not even seem to be much evidence on any progress on the ideas that are already (allegedly) recorded. One of the reasons Slash quit was, there was an empty studio with a lot of expensive equipment around but no Axl. It is conceivable that a lack of activity is one of the reasons Bumblefoot - like Bucket and Slash before him - quit.

[D-GenerationX]

I guess I was just too caught up in listening to all those albums they release.  Only so many hours in the day, you know.

Maybe if you posted less drivel, you'd have more time for these things?

I didn't post that much last week.

Based on what I saw here, I thought maybe everybody took a pledge not to.  Wanted to fit in.

[jarmo]

And this is a 'band', exactly how? None of the members can contribute ideas.

You know, when you state things like this as a fact, it really makes you look like a dimwit. Sorry, it does.
You really need to pay attention to what other band members have said about how everybody contributes instead of just doing a song the way one person tells them to.

Wanted to fit in.

Hope you had a productive week. Don't worry about fitting in, it ain't happening like I've told you before.



/jarmo

[mortismurphy]

I guess I was just too caught up in listening to all those albums they release.  Only so many hours in the day, you know.

Maybe if you posted less drivel, you'd have more time for these things?

I didn't post that much last week.

Based on what I saw here, I thought maybe everybody took a pledge not to.  Wanted to fit in.

If it is either, don't post at all or post positivity, you arrive at a blank wall. In my defense, I do not see Jarmo posting much unless he is responding to perceived 'negativity' so presumably, Jarmo is struggling to find something to talk about that is positive also.

And this is a 'band', exactly how? None of the members can contribute ideas.

You know, when you state things like this as a fact, it really makes you look like a dimwit. Sorry, it does.
You really need to pay attention to what other band members have said about how everybody contributes instead of just doing a song the way one person tells them to.

Wanted to fit in.

Hope you had a productive week. Don't worry about fitting in, it ain't happening like I've told you before.



/jarmo

I have read, all thousand renditions of the same interview the band members use. Let me guess, ''we are going through songs to decide what to choose'' - Correct? ''There is so much material that it is just about deciding what to put out'' Am I right?

[D-GenerationX]

You know, when you state things like this as a fact, it really makes you look like a dimwit. Sorry, it does.
You really need to pay attention to what other band members have said about how everybody contributes instead of just doing a song the way one person tells them to.

The way you puff out your chest like this, one would think there were more than 15 total songs released by this band in the past 20 years (and counting).

All sitting together, only 2 guys sitting together, guys sending each other stuff on zip drives from 5 states away...WHO CARES?

Its producing things at a pace of less than one song a year for 2 decades now.  Are you REALLY getting that much satisfaction out of the fact they don't all sit together versus doing it piecemeal, when the results are so meager?

[jarmo]

I have read, all thousand renditions of the same interview the band members use. Let me guess, ''we are going through songs to decide what to choose'' - Correct? ''There is so much material that it is just about deciding what to put out'' Am I right?

No, you're wrong. Again.
You said:

None of the members can contribute ideas.

IF you were aware of how the band writes songs, IF you read the song credits, you'd know your statement is nothing but 100% bullshit.

You clearly are clueless about this. And stating things like that as a fact just makes you look more clueless.

Even the person who this thread is about contributed his ideas to Chinese Democracy. And yet you make that kind of claims!

Are you REALLY getting that much satisfaction out of the fact they don't all sit together versus doing it piecemeal, when the results are so meager?

Another one who doesn't even get the issue.
Blurt out something that's not based on facts only to twist it being about something else.


Are you really getting that much frustration from not getting what you want?

I'm sorry you cant get more songs from GN'R to dissect. Maybe crying about it a bit more will make you feel better.
Life sucks, get a fucking helmet!




/jarmo

[D-GenerationX]

Are you REALLY getting that much satisfaction out of the fact they don't all sit together versus doing it piecemeal, when the results are so meager?

Another one who doesn't even get the issue.
Blurt out something that's not based on facts only to twist it being about something else.

I've told you repeatedly that I am right with on all things Ron related.  We are in lockstep there.

But from that conversation about how the band works, your stuff has this absurd tone of "I think their way of doing things is going just fine, smartguy."

Are you fucking kidding me? 

Using process A, process B, or process C, D, or E.  Who gives a shit?  Its not producing anything.  So I'd probably stow that unfounded smugness that things are humming along, because its completely ridiculous.

[jarmo]

Their way of doing things is what it is. I don't spend my time whining about it and hoping they were more like somebody else. Waste of time.

You on the other hand...

Who's kidding who?

There's no smugness. Just the realization that you've been doing this same "act" for years and got no results. It's funny.




/jarmo

[mortismurphy]

Are you honestly saying that, after 2008, any band member can introduce ideas and for the band to begin work on them? As I type, there is a brand new Ron interview in which he states that he had two songs originally intended for Guns.

Your argument is a straw man since I am well aware of how GN'R have composed in the past. Is this happening now? Could DJ go, ''right, let's record a new album''?