2007-2008 NBA Season

[Layne Staley's Sunglasses]

Jordan>Kobe Bryant hopped up on steroids and with a jetpack on his back.

[AxlsMainMan]

Jordan>Kobe Bryant hopped up on steroids and with a jetpack on his back.

"The Answer" > everyone

[Axl4Prez2004]

Jordan>Kobe Bryant hopped up on steroids and with a jetpack on his back.

"The Answer" > everyone

"Practice?  We talkin' 'bout practice?  I'm the M V P!!?  Practice?"   

[D]

Allen Iverson

maybe the most overrated player in NBA history

[AxlsMainMan]

His career scoring average of 27.8 points per game is third all-time behind only Michael Jordan and Wilt Chamberlain.

Iverson is one of only 30 players in NBA history to score over 20,000 points in his career, and he was the 6th fastest in the history of the game to achieve this feat.

Iverson's trademark crossover dribble is regarded as one of the most effective moves in the game,making him difficult for a defender to contain in one-on-one play.

Iverson is also known for his ability to draw fouls, at times seeming to get the free-throw line almost at will.

He is regularly one of the NBA's leaders in free throws attempted, and in free throw percentage.

Iverson has averaged 6.2 assists per game over his career. He has also averaged 3.9 rebounds per game.

On defense, Iverson is also an adept ball-thief and is known for playing the passing lanes. He regularly ranks among the league leaders in steals and averages over 2 steals per game for his entire career.

Iverson is still generally regarded as one of the best guards to ever play the game, as evidenced by his being named the starting point guard for the Eastern Conference in the NBA All-Star Game for the past seven consecutive seasons.

Iverson's ability to effectively employ such a versatile combination of scoring methods ? driving to the basket, drawing fouls, shooting from outside, and creating his own shot off of the dribble ? all at only six feet tall, has made him one of the most distinctive and dominant players in NBA history.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allen_Iverson

 

[faldor]

Allen Iverson

maybe the most overrated player in NBA history

D, just wondering are there any good players in the NBA that don't play on the Mavericks?  You think KG, Pierce, and Allen are all overrated and underachievers.  You think Kobe's overrated, now Iverson.  You once stated that the trio of Gasol, Odom, and Bryant were WAY better than Pierce, Allen, and KG but have seemed to change your tune on that due to recent events.  You now think Odom is overrated and aren't a big fan of Gasol.  Are there any good players in the NBA who aren't overrated in your opinion?

[Axl4Prez2004]

Allen Iverson

maybe the most overrated player in NBA history

No way D.  Iverson, while in my eyes an a-hole, is tremendously talented.  The man is a lock for the Hall of Fame when he retires, he's that good.  He's still quick, but in his prime I've never seen quicker.  Axlsmainman posted some great numbers. 
 

[D]

Iverson is a great player but he plays horrible team basketball. I would hate for this guy to be on my team.

he is a ballstopper.

He dominates the basketball so his 6 assists are inflated. he shoots a lousy FG percentage and is a horrible defensive player.

he may score 3o but the guy he is guarding almost erases that. He doesnt make anyone o his team better and he has zero championship intangibles.



Kobe is overrated in the context of Micheal Jordan. He is a great player but people were trying to put him on the same pedestal as jordan and in that regard he is overrated.


I say KG is overrated simply because some people claim if u put KG on San Antonio he would have 4 rings instead of Duncan and I dont believe that.

So yeah, KG is overrated in some regards because he cant really put a team on his back offensively.

[faldor]

Iverson is a great player but he plays horrible team basketball. I would hate for this guy to be on my team.

he is a ballstopper.

He dominates the basketball so his 6 assists are inflated. he shoots a lousy FG percentage and is a horrible defensive player.

he may score 3o but the guy he is guarding almost erases that. He doesnt make anyone o his team better and he has zero championship intangibles.



Kobe is overrated in the context of Micheal Jordan. He is a great player but people were trying to put him on the same pedestal as jordan and in that regard he is overrated.


I say KG is overrated simply because some people claim if u put KG on San Antonio he would have 4 rings instead of Duncan and I dont believe that.

So yeah, KG is overrated in some regards because he cant really put a team on his back offensively.

D, I respect you and your opinions, but we don't seem to see eye to eye.  For one I think Iverson is a much better defensive player than you give him credit for, especially taking into account how good of an offensive player he is.  He's undersized, but at 6'0" you'd be hard pressed to find a more aggressive/better defender. 

How can you even compare Duncan and Garnett as far as championships go?  Has Duncan not been on far better teams than KG till this year?  Maybe I've missed something.  It seems you expect ONE guy to be able to take a team to the promised land when that's just not the case.  Every all time great has had some help along the way.  You tell me one guy who could fit that role from KG's days with the T'Wolves?  That's right, there was no one.  He was all alone.  This year he has some SERIOUS support, and look what has happened.  Amazing, huh?

I really don't see your argument on how you replace KG for Duncan and the Spurs don't win.  Do you think the T'Wolves would've won if they had Duncan?

I'm sorry D, but I think you're mistaken.

And just while we're at it, when has Tim Duncan ever taken the game over offensively?  I view he and KG as comprable players.  Great on both sides of the ball.  I don't remember ever saying that Duncan was an unstopable force on offense though.  Good yes, great on D, yes.  Much like Garnett.  I really don't see your point here.

Anyway, Go Celtics!!!

[Layne Staley's Sunglasses]

Iverson is a great player but he plays horrible team basketball. I would hate for this guy to be on my team.

he is a ballstopper.

He dominates the basketball so his 6 assists are inflated. he shoots a lousy FG percentage and is a horrible defensive player.

he may score 3o but the guy he is guarding almost erases that. He doesnt make anyone o his team better and he has zero championship intangibles.

+1

I hate repeating myself.

[D]

Tim Duncan won 3 championships with an aging broken down David robinson and really no other superstars. he had Stephen Jackson...........



the last two he didnt have another top 20 player on his team.


Kobe has Gasol

KG has Paul Pierce who is one of the top 5 players at his position.

KG came out of a weak East.


TD takes over the game offensively. U obviously didnt watch the finals cause he would have MONSTER games.  KG shys away in big moments, Duncan is as clutch as it comes.

TD is the best PF to ever play the game. KG probably isnt even top 5 in the last 20 years of players.

I personally think Dirk Nowitzki is better than KG. Dirk doesnt have any other all stars on his team and should've won a title.

it took KG playing with 2 other hall of famers in a horrible Eastern conference and they still barely beat Atlanta and Cleveland. Had Chauncey Billups not been injured, Im not sure they are here. LA have unravelled thanks to primadonna Kobe.

1.Duncan
2.Malone
3.McHale
4. Barkley
5. Dirk Nowitzki

[Bodhi]

Allen Iverson

maybe the most overrated player in NBA history

D, just wondering are there any good players in the NBA that don't play on the Mavericks?  You think KG, Pierce, and Allen are all overrated and underachievers.  You think Kobe's overrated, now Iverson.  You once stated that the trio of Gasol, Odom, and Bryant were WAY better than Pierce, Allen, and KG but have seemed to change your tune on that due to recent events.  You now think Odom is overrated and aren't a big fan of Gasol.  Are there any good players in the NBA who aren't overrated in your opinion?

Faldor I agree with you about D, everyone is apparently overated...but I think he is right on Iverson...dont get me wrong the guy played HARDER than anyone...especially with a huge size disadvantage....but i remember PLENTY of playoff games where Iverson shot something in the range of 5-30...especially during that 2001 playoff run.....Iverson is a very good player....but not great....def not the "answer"

D, did you just put Dirk Nowitski on the Top 5 greatest power forwards of all time?  are you fucking kidding me?  Talk about overated players...MVP my ass...MVP's dont get bounced out of the first round by 8th seeded teams....and it wasnt even close....they got ROCKED....

[faldor]

Okay D, it's obvious you will never give the Celtics and/or KG the credit they deserve so I'll stop looking for that from you.  A couple weeks ago you were saying how overrated the current "Big 3" are and how they were all underachievers.  Now your saying KG is succeeding because he's playing with 2 Hall of Famers.  Your running around in circles.  And good point about Dirk Plitt-Mania.  Sure the C's went to 7 games with the Cavs and Hawks, but you know what, they won those series.  The same can't be said about Dirk.  And let's stop with the whole Western Conference dominance, because I know that's where you'll go.  The Celtics are a better team than ANY Western Conference team.  They're proving it now.  It's a different style of play out West.  More offensive minded.  Cleveland was a good defensive team, the C's had trouble on offense and were forced to 7 games.  The Hawks were athletic and gave the C's fits in Atlanta.  The Lakers aren't a good defensive team and are not very athletic.  66 wins in the regular season, a great record against the West, but that's not good enough for you.  That's fine, I'll take a championship with one more win.

[D]

notice my list, i said last 20 years.


Dirk is a 7footer who has revolutionized the game for big men.

keep in mind, he has ZERO hall of famers and ZERO all stars on his team.

I said the big three are overrated in comparison to the REAL big three in Bird,Parish and Mchale.

Boston are not better than every team in the west.

Boston dont beat SA or Phoenix

LA got the luckiest draw of any team possible in the west.

they got Denver who just suck and have two of the most overrated players ever in AI and Carmelo

They then got Utah who are still figuring it out and are a player away.

after that, they get a SA team who was pushed to the brink by two amazing western conference teams in Phoenix and NO so their gas tank was drained when they met LA.

Boston struggled against Atlanta

Struggled against cleveland who had they  not traded Hughes and Gooden, WOULDVE beaten Boston, they also lost a huge part of their team "Daniel Gibson" in that series.

Against Detroit, Chauncey wasnt 100 percent or i dont think they beat Det.

point with KG/TD is this:

No way if u trade places atlanta takes a TD led Boston team to 7.

[Axl4Prez2004]

   D!  You rippin' my Syracuse homeys?  Carmello is a phenomenal talent.  Give him time.  The AI/Anthony combo couldn't be worse for 'melo.  I'll forgive you this time since you're a nice guy! 

D, AI is a strange kind of player.  With the right supporting cast, the guy is amazing.  When he was with Philly, I was hoping they could have landed an aging Rodman.  AI needs to be surrounded with solid defenders who don't need to shoot.  'melo and AI both need 20 shots a game.  It's not a good fit.  Also, there's no way Iverson is a bad defender. 

Garnett had a bad situation with the T-wolves, he needed to be surrounded by a supporting cast that could at least tie their own shoes...they couldn't.     I really like KG.  Personally, I'll stick with Duncan as the best ever.  I've seen him take over games on O and D.  Class act too. 

When talking power forwards, as a Syracuse fan, I'd be remiss not to mention Karl Malone's quote on Derrick Coleman...Malone had said DC would be the best power forward ever...if he wanted to be.  Methinks DC liked doughnuts better than practice.    Damn shame. 
   

[faldor]

D, I love how you state it as fact that Boston wouldn't be able to beat San Antonio or Phoenix.  You do realize they beat the Spurs both times they played them this year and split with the Suns including a 20 point win at home.  I'm sure those wins must've come at traumatic times for the Spurs and Suns though.  There must be some reason they won those games other than they ARE the BETTER TEAM.  And they wouldn't have beaten the Pistons with a healthy Billups or the Cavaliers with a healthy Gibson.  Obviously we'll never know, since injuries occured and certain teams lost.  Hey, you think what you want.  They've beaten every team they've played, and that's all that matters.

As for tonight, I'm sure you were the happiest non-Laker fan in the world when KG missed those two free throws down the stretch.  Bad game for KG tonight, no argument there.  And Pierce had that crucial turnover, despite playing a fantastic game.  He has a tendancy to turn the ball over, but it was a great defensive play by Kobe.  Could've been called a foul, possibly if the game was in Boston.  But that's not getting called in LA.  I still think Boston is the better team.  They'll just have to win it on their home floor now.  On to game 6.

[D]

People use too much fantasy instead of what they really bring to a team.


Carmelo Anthony shoots and scores

he helps no one else on his team. He cant make anyone better and plays HORRIBLE defense. he isnt a good rebounder for his height and position, not a good passer and doesnt show the passion u would want to see from your franchise player.

KG coming up small again

13pts in a close out game.

The thing that pisses me off about KG so much is, he could be one of the most dominate players EVER but he chooses not to be for whatever reasons.  He is way too passive and doesnt have that hard of a lion on the offensive end.

[Layne Staley's Sunglasses]

I think the Lakers are afraid of winning, I really do.

WTF is up with blowing TWO double digit leads!?

The Lakers lucked away with a win, at least the Celtics can celebrate at the Garden.

(AI and 'melo have found each other.  Two street thugs who will never win at a professional level.  Fuck them.)

[faldor]

People use too much fantasy instead of what they really bring to a team.


Carmelo Anthony shoots and scores

he helps no one else on his team. He cant make anyone better and plays HORRIBLE defense. he isnt a good rebounder for his height and position, not a good passer and doesnt show the passion u would want to see from your franchise player.

KG coming up small again

13pts in a close out game.

The thing that pisses me off about KG so much is, he could be one of the most dominate players EVER but he chooses not to be for whatever reasons.  He is way too passive and doesnt have that hard of a lion on the offensive end.

You're right about Garnett to a point.  He is WAY too unselfish at times.  I'm screaming at him nonstop to take over offensively.  Pau Gasol can't cover him one on one.  There's just no way.  The times he does take him to the basket, he scores.  Sometimes he's doubled, so then I understand to kick the ball out.  He's got to get on the block way more, he stands around the top of the paint for the most part.  I know that's a big part of his game, but he is by far the best frontcourt player in this series.  There is no one on the Lakers who can match up with him down low.  So for that, I agree.

But, offense is only one part of his game.  He's still rebounding like a champ and playing great defense.  So while he did come up small on the offensive side of the ball, he did play well in other areas.  Hopefully he'll play better at home in game 6.  More importantly, hopefully he won't have to play well in a game 7.  Whatever it takes, get this over in 6.

[faldor]

I think the Lakers are afraid of winning, I really do.

WTF is up with blowing TWO double digit leads!?

The Lakers lucked away with a win, at least the Celtics can celebrate at the Garden.

(AI and 'melo have found each other.  Two street thugs who will never win at a professional level.  Fuck them.)

Yeah it was a weird trend these last 2 games.  The Lakers jumping out to a huge lead, only for the Celtics to come right back at them.  On the one hand you could say the C's are clearly the better team being able to come back from such large deficits on the road.  Then again, what's up with the Celtics getting off to such slow starts and digging themselves in a hole?  Could one of these teams play consistent basketball for 48 minutes?  I know the NBA is filled with runs, but this is beginning to get re-god-damn-diculous!