Death penalty, Abortion, Gun Control, War in Iraq-give your 2 cents

[Axls Locomotive]

a foetus/embryo is not a human being, a human being is conscious thing with emotions ...but a foetus doesnt have that ability until a certain development age...when does a foetus change to a conscious human?...when it splits into 2 cells? 4 cells? 120000 cells?...i dont think anyone knows...

That's just it.  No one knows exactly.  If anything, that is an argument against abortion.

there is also the issue of choice...if a person chose to become pregnant then they should have the choice up until the foetus becomes conscious to have an abortion...

While "choice" is the operative term often used, when it comes right down to it, selfishness is a more central term to the subject of abortion.

a foetus is certainly not conscious at 12 weeks, it certainly becomes conscious many weeks from that date...thats why i think that its ok to have an abortion before that time...

yes choice, its not your concern, the foetus has less functionality than organs in the human body before 12 weeks for sure, are you saying that people cant donate a kidney because it will harm cells in the body? ... i would say you were interfering in the right to choose...

animals have more consciousness than foetuses, do you eat meat?

[GnRNightrain]

In Britain we have a large gang and sadly a large gun culture too. And yet firearms offences are percentage wise considerably below America. These gangs are frequently alledged to be Greek/Turkish/Asian...yes thats right, immigrants too.

Your a racist!? You are saying all gangs are immigrants, Greek, Turkish, Asian.? You are a biggot.? Hitler would be happy to meet you.? (that is the type of response you would give to a similar statement).?

Notice the word 'alledged', Thank you.

So I misread your statement.  Wow that sucks. 

This 'debate' is nonsensical and i choose to leave it. Immigration is one of the many issues the world is dealing with at the moment, its no worse in America than anywhere else I fail to see, as a consequence, why this is a factor in explaining crime levels.

This debate is nonsensical because you made it that way by calling me a racist etc and getting away from what my point actually was.  http://www.cis.org/topics/currentnumbers.html  Are you telling me that the UK has anywhere near these numbers of immigrants entering from such a poor country?  You are wrong, and should just admit it.  Im sure you wont, instead you will resort to calling me a racist or a biggot.

It really is not that hard to figure out:

increase in unemployment = increase in crime
increase in work force = more unemployment
increase in poor immigrants = increased of unemployed in poor neighborhoods

Therefore, the massive increase of poor immigrants that our country cant handle all at once creates unemployment in the inner city poor areas which leads to an increase in crime.

Detroit has one of the highest crime rates in the world, are Mexicans really the cause here too? Is migration of 'poor, uneducated people' really an issue in New York or any other northern city?

Actually there is an issue.  However, you help prove my point.

Detroit has one of the highest unemployment rates
There are lots of poor people in detroit, therefore crime and violence is much higher.  What else explains it?  You think the guns themselves make people evil?  It is poverty that leads to crime.  When there is a massive influx of poor illegal immigrants there is an increase in unemployment and poverty in the inner cities which leads to higher crime.

don't u think it would be far worse for us, considerably closer to these 'poorer' nations?

Who is the UK's Mexico?  We have 1.3 million per year coming in illegally.  DOnt even try to tell me there is a similar scenario happening in the UK, let alone anywhere in Europe.  Show me the evidence.

[Axls Locomotive]

Who is the UK's Mexico?  We have 1.3 million per year coming in illegally.  DOnt even try to tell me there is a similar scenario happening in the UK, let alone anywhere in Europe.  Show me the evidence.

in 2000 there were about 600,000 illegal immigrants coming into the EU...considering that the border isnt exactly policed very well then the figure is probably far higher

[GnRNightrain]

Who is the UK's Mexico?? We have 1.3 million per year coming in illegally.? DOnt even try to tell me there is a similar scenario happening in the UK, let alone anywhere in Europe.? Show me the evidence.

in 2000 there were about 600,000 illegal immigrants coming into the EU...considering that the border isnt exactly policed very well then the figure is probably far higher

That is for the entire EU.  We have 1.2 million yearly just illegal from Mexico.  That is double.

[Axls Locomotive]

Who is the UK's Mexico?  We have 1.3 million per year coming in illegally.  DOnt even try to tell me there is a similar scenario happening in the UK, let alone anywhere in Europe.  Show me the evidence.

in 2000 there were about 600,000 illegal immigrants coming into the EU...considering that the border isnt exactly policed very well then the figure is probably far higher

That is for the entire EU.  We have 1.2 million yearly just illegal from Mexico.  That is double.

where does it say 1.2 million illegal immigrants in the link you gave to the cis website? it says 500,000 not 1.2 million

"Approximately 1 million people receive permanent residency annually. In addition, the Census Bureau estimates a net increase of 500,000 illegal immigrants annually."

and the EU population is 350 million, USA population is around 300 million so its a fair (ish) comparison..the figures arent that different

[jgfnsr]

Most of these clowns on here aren't in the real world yet, facing real issues.

And you're the guy always talkin' about other people's egos?? Yeah, that's right, SLCPUNK.? You're the lone sage here and the rest of us have lived in a fuckin' bubble all our lives.? Keep telling yourself that...

They sit behind a computer and tell everybody to educate themselves etc etc.

Holy shit!? If I had a dollar for every time you've told somebody on this board to "go read a book" during an argument, I'd have a private jet on stand-by.

Wait til they get screwed by their HMO, their brother dies in the war, their job goes overseas, work more to earn less, social security is gone and they have to play with the crooks on wallstreet.....etc etc...Nobody gives a damn until they are getting screwed, then they call for a change. Look at Nancy Reagan and the stem cell debate. All of a sudden when old Ronald was part of the diaper patrol, she condoned stem cell research.)

"Wait til...??

Huh?? What exactly will happen if any of those things happen to us "clowns?"

You really think we're fall in line with you?? Don't hold your breath...

[SLCPUNK]

Could some of you pro-lifers put your money where your mouth is and start adopting the children once abortion is illegal again?

What are you crazy??

They'll all be too busy signing up for the military to go fight for good causes overseas.....?

Most that are in the military support the war.? Every conflict you support you have to jump in and go enlist?

So Im not sure where your argument stands.? Furthermore, my brother adopted a child, my parents did foster care for many years.? Im almost certain one day I will adopt a child.? I have already discussed it with my girlfriend.? So spare me on the bullshit.?

You guys are pathetic.

Like I said, all I hear is excuses.

[SLCPUNK]

Couldn't be bothered to read your rubbish, i showed u up for the rascist fool u r, but one point i will pick u up on

Where the fuck did I say "immigrants are all criminals."?

Just here:

These people move to the inner-cities, are not educated and end up joining gangs and committing crimes.

 

I'm swayed by your views. There is no immigration in Europe and all Mexicans are evil. I'm so sorry i doubted your wisdom.

You dont read any explanation, but continue to call me a biggot and put words into my mouth that I never said.?

LOL, look who gets all pissy when the shoe is on the other foot.

[GnRNightrain]

LOL, look who gets all pissy when the shoe is on the other foot.

On the other foot?? When have I accused you of being a racist or a biggot.? Especially when you can get no such thing from the post.  In fact, last I remember, you were the one making an attack against me without being able to give any evidence of what you claimed.

[SLCPUNK]

LOL, look who gets all pissy when the shoe is on the other foot.

On the other foot?? When have I accused you of being a racist or a biggot.? Especially when you can get no such thing from the post.? In fact, last I remember, you were the one making an attack against me without being able to give any evidence of what you claimed.

I didn't see one person disagree with me. Your American arrogance abounds on this board, for all to see.

You take things too literally, I can't believe you are that dumb, so must believe that you do so to ignore my point(s). Of course you have never called anybody a racist or biggot. But have made generalizations about other groups on this board, insulting other members. When you get it back, you get upset about it. Point = don't dish it out if you can't take it back.

[usedtoloverher]

Is it any coincidence that half the posters on this thread or banned?

[Skeba]

You really gotta stop digging almost year old threads...

[the dirt]

Yeah, stick to the ones that are at least 2 and a half years old...

[Bandita]

Is it any coincidence that half the posters on this thread or banned?

Are you looking to join them so soon in your day here, I have to ask-
 

[Chelle]

Death Penalty - Against.

Abortion - Against.

Gun Control - Against.

War in Iraq - Against.

[SLCPUNK]

Is it any coincidence that half the posters on this thread or banned?

Actually, most are still here.............

You dug this up to say that?

[T_Roxie]

Death Penalty - Against.

Abortion - Against.

Gun Control - Guns should be tightly controlled.
War in Iraq - Against.

[usedtoloverher]

Is checking out old threads not allowed?

[Jim]

Is checking out old threads not allowed?

If you consider shoveling them up, giving them a good bumping for absolutely no reason at all, such as your good self has now done twice in the space of twelve hours, 'checking out old threads,' then yes, checking out old threads is not allowed.

[usedtoloverher]

Is checking out old threads not allowed?

If you consider shoveling them up, giving them a good bumping for absolutely no reason at all, such as your good self has now done twice in the space of twelve hours, 'checking out old threads,' then yes, checking out old threads is not allowed.

I never knew.