Here Today... Gone To Hell!

Last Updated: Sunday, February 25, 2007 | 10:12 PM ET

Article (http://www.cbc.ca/canada/story/2007/02/25/hijab-soccer.html)

Five young teams from across Canada walked out of a Quebec soccer tournament Sunday because a young Muslim girl was ejected for wearing a hijab.

Calling the rule banning the headscarf worn by Muslim women racist, four other teams followed Asmahan Mansour's team, the Nepean Selects from Ottawa, after she was thrown out for running afoul of a Quebec Soccer Association rule.

Asi and teamates on the Nepean Selects.
(CBC) "The referee was staring and pointing. 'She can't play,'" said Asmahan, Asi to her friends. "I was like why? Why can't I play?"

Because of a safety rule, league spokesman Lyes Arfa said. He pointed out that the referee is Muslim himself, and that the ban on hijabs is to protect children from being accidentally strangled.

"We have to protect the players on the field, and that's the main point. It's not against the Muslims."

And the league had told organizers about the rule ? "The wearing of the Islamic veil or any other religious item is not permitted" ? before the game.
Asi's team was aware of the rule, but didn't expect it would be enforced.

So when it was, many players and adults were outraged.

Girls backed up teammate

"I automatically went back to the referee: 'Are you sure this is what you wanna do?'" said Louis Maneiro, the Selects' head coach. When nothing changed, he said, "I just decided that there's no way that I would allow our team to continue, and the girls backed up Asi very strongly."

Asi's teammates supported the move. "I felt disgraced, I was crushed, I couldn't see Asi like that," said Lisa Furano.

"It's just a piece of material, it can't do any harm," added Alicia Stainton.
The Selects left the tournament in good spirits. But they say they won't came back until the rule changes.

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ok...... so i guess that saftey is not important............. and that if the kid died/injured as a result someone would not have been sued?

this is why we say mainlanders are the stupid ones

she should have taken if off.
it can be dangerous.
same with jewelry and such.

i disagreee. she has a right to follow religion through. I think problem with Muslim society is they dont encourage females to engage with each other as much. If there was a woman only football including a female referee she wouldnt hav needed the headscarf. Muslims are collapsing because they dont work 2gether.

So if she got strangled by it, theyd get sued by society for not carrying out procedure.

And muslims arnt collapsing, the very fact is they do stick together.

Just make her sign a waiver, saying that if she's strangled, decapitated or in any way injured because of it, then it's her own problem.  Seems simple enough.

 ::)


so you suggest suggerating the muslims from play with non muslims?

frankly if you want to play sports and there are safty concerns that involve relgious customs, then you should remove the itmes in question, or dont play...... there is no grey area for something that is for safty. if you work in a industry where you are required to wear protective equipment, ie. hard hats, and your relgion requires turbon, if you want to work the job you dith the turbon unill after you are off site.

This even has made #3 in national news today, and it seems that further details state that only when she is partaking in play on the field was she required to remove the hijab.

you're wrong here.
it's not about muslims.
it's about sports.
you just dont wear things on your head or around your neck
no jewelery
shirt must be tucked in the short

these are the soccer rules
on a soccer field Allah is meaningless. Jesus is void.


and, muslims HAVE to stop with that veil thing.
it's never clear why they wear it. always confused.

next will hear about a muslim stripper who wanted to keep it on! come on.
it's a soccer field, i think the audience will see more than her hair when she's running all sweaty.

i HAVE to hear his father " oh no my daughter cannot show her hair !! it's indecenccy !!! no hair ! .... yeah she can play with short shorts and sweat in her clothes in front of the whole shcool and take off her shirt when she scores !!! "



ps: waiting for hannahat to tell me i am anti semitic !!! ?_?

notice how waivers are being signed for eerything? they dont do shit anymore to protect anyone, it is more or less now oh u signed a waiver, ok.... so the coach should not try and act in a responsible manner to protect his/her players?

she wasnt ejected for wearing it....she wasnt allowed to have it on in the first place....

i agree it sucks for her, but like was already mentioned, its for safety reasons...thems the rules...ultimately it was her choice to play or not

I don't know if you're anti-semitic, but you're French, and the French and Americans have very different ideas about the separation of church and state. 

From what I've seen in recent years, with the banning headscarves and other religious symbols/clothing in French schools, your country's (general) approach is to prevent any religious imagery in areas of government/state.

In the US, on the other hand, the approach would be to allow everyone to wear their various religious garbs, in that banning them is seen as a greater violation of personal freedom.

It's just a fundamental difference in how two country's vary in their approach to religion.  I don't know the (general) Canadian approach, off hand.

as far as i know we are pretty open in canada about allowing others to express beleifs...but this doesnt seem to be about religion its about safety of the kids...and it's not he referees job to decide the rules...it would be the soccer league...so i dunno if refs had avoided it up until this point or what but say the girl did fall and someones cleats got tangled in her scarf and she got choked or whatever then its the refs fault for allowing it...just saying can't fault someone for doing his/her job :-\

i must anti semitic, HannaHat says so and i disagree with Israel colonization policies ! oh god ! save me !

Yes religion have to be as far as possible as the state. (That is why Sarkozy must NOT be president)

We are here talking about social matters, not political. She has the right to believe. She has the right to wear a scard. But any time there is a Republican (meaning from the Republic) rule, may it be stupid, it overpass any religious freedom.

If tomorow there is a law saying that you cannot show People nailed on a cross to people under 18, every church will have to screen ID at the doors.
These are my opinions, the Republic laws overpass any religious belief. keep your god at home and in your head.

Personnal freedom is something tricky to use, because your freedom stops where my begins.
She agreed to play a sport, that have rules, her freedom stops there.

Same with school, when you enter French School you enter a world free of God, therefore Jesus and Allah and Yavh? stay outside.

No, I'm saying that the rules are in place to protect them and, since violating this rule doesn't actually affect the competition (i.e. it isn't "cheating"), then she should be allowed to waive her right to hold someone accountable, should she be injured because of it. 

Though, at some point, if a religion demands things of you, you have to make a choice between completely obeying the religions rules, and doing as you wish.  I'm not sure this is such a case.  Maybe some Muslim children chose not to participate; perhaps others didn't wear the banned clothing.  I don't know.  But we're so concerned with safety these days, that kids can't learn through pain, like the thousands of generations before them have.  Perhaps there's been a rash of Muslim children strangulations during soccer matches that I'm unaware of?  If so, then I suppose they have a reason for this rule.  I think the risk of injury to the number of NFL players who stupidly wear earrings during competition is exponentially higher than the risk, here. 

soccer rules forbid wearing of any thing but the regular soccer clothing.
Goal keeper was once allwoed to wear a cap, i dont think it's one anymore.
scarf is def. out. and it's jst stupid to begin with, who does sport with a scarf on the head ?


what is the point? please, i need a muslim to enlighten me.

alot of schools have dress code too....so if one is allowed to wear somethign on their head then everyone should be....if its democracy....again them's the breaks :-\

NFL players are grown adults...these are kids....whos safety lies in others :peace:

Well, I'm not a Muslim, but I would imagine that if my faith demanded something of me, and I took that demand seriously, that I would do as dictated. 

Soccer cleats are certainly more dangerous than a headscarf. 

i'm not saying that it was right or wrong but the official had to make a decision and the one was the choice with the least amount of liability to them.....

i'm all for expression of ones beliefs but sometimes you need to abide by the rules :peace: if you dont like the rules you dont play...its a pretty simple concept. again its he players choice to play or not....one could always petition for the rule to be changed :-\

barely...

Anyway, what it really comes down to, for me, is whether this is a public or private league.  If it's privately organized and run, then they can make any demand they want (whether they SHOULD or not, is another argument).  If it's organized by the government in some way, then I would imagine it's subject to laws regarding such things.

Quebec Soccer Association....so its a Provinical League...so public sports

Well, then I suppose it's subject to whatever laws are pertinent...of course, most of my take is based on the American Constitution, so it's not entirely valid.  How your laws dictate issues like this be handled could be very different, just due to minor differences.

i'm actually shocked htis happened in canada...in the nations capital of all things :hihi: you can bet your ass this is gonna undergo some kind of review....

but if a muslim ref is the one who made the decision to not allow her to play then that has to say something

I was a bit surprised when the US elected it's first Muslim to Congress, and he went on a cable news program and the guy asked him how we know he's not a terrorist or something like that.  I was dumbfounded. 

Damn..... thats just plain ignorance....this is something else

Here's the vid of that interview...not QUITE as bad as I remember, as I didn't see his intro:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JegKCAO6N7I

When I started year 12 at a catholic school there was a muslim kid with a beard but the school had a no facial hair policy but the school let him go with it. I was nearly suspended for not shaving. Even tho this kid wasn't born here nor the same religion as the school it was ok for him but I got my arse kicked coz I wasn't the right religion.

Another catholic school in sydney last year was taunted by protestors and the media because they had a no Non School uniform headwear policy. A Muslim girl wanted to wear her scarf but the school said its not uniform. So she complained to A Current Affair and they ran the story every night untill this sook got her own way. While the rest of the Catholic kids got fuck all.

Hows that for Democracy?


 :peace:

They treated that muslim girl as an equal. Just like theyd treat a white person, surely equality is what we want?

but of course because she couldnt get her own way she had to pull the discrimination shit out of the hat.

Its pathetic, does she wanna risk being killed?

The school system is going to fuck with your child's rights no matter what.

Sad but true :-\

They wernt fucking with any rights, they were treating her as anyone wearing something which was potentially harmful to them.

I think these lines are pretty clear. Don?t know why some people always try to make it appear like racism or something like that. ::)

Things we all agree on:

The referee was right.  He followed the rules.

Things we disagree on:

The rule is dumb.  Freedom78 said it best.  If it is something that could only harm that particular player, let the family sign a waiver. 

I was a basketball official for 7 years and I live in the United States.  I have seen both sides of the issue.  I've required men who say they've never taken off their wedding ring, ever, to take it off.  If they hit another player and it causes damage, guess who's getting sued?  That's right, the official.  No jewelry, period.  A head scarf strangling someone???  What the hell???
 :rofl:  That's just ridiculous.  All the controversy could be avoided if they all just properly tied the thing, or taped it.  Some people just love controversy. 

Because they're a minority. A few years ago we took a bunch of refugees from Africa somewhere. Alot live near me they dont seem to bad. But a heap of em were moved to a town about 3 hrs from here called tamworth. They were given jobs and housing but didn't like their jobs so they quit and went on the dole. They younger ones were starting street gangs and being a real fucking menese.
A few months ago the Mayor of Tamworth refused to let anymore in unless they were really keen to contribute to society.
According to the uni students, he is a racist and was using the unemployment issue as an excuse to not allow anymore.


 :peace:

I've got it!  Velcro religious garb, for sports!  That way, if someone's cleats get caught in her headscarf, it'll just rip away! 

^^^That's funny...I had the same idea, except I was thinking of plastic buttons to fasten it!  Leave it to us Americans to try and find a way to make some extra $$$ and solve the problem at the same time.   :hihi:

I'm sure there's someone at Wal-Mart, with a warehouse full of 'em, just waiting for the MidEast to be more friendly.  :rofl:

I'm picturing Gil, the bad salesman from The Simpsons trying to pressure Wal-Mart into buying his latest product..."I'm tellin ya, all the kids think these things are Ara-Phat!"  "Get 'em while they're hot! ol' Gil needs a sale, c'mon!!"   :peace:

I would have done the same thing.

As the ref that is.

You're on the team:

The girl refuses to take it off and leaves the game, do you stay or do you leave with her?   What about if you're one of the other teams?

now you are assuming that catholics run the church on a democracy :hihi:

and thats the second gnr album!!! CATHOLIC DEMONCRACY!

I'm wondering...did you intentionally misspell democracy?

sorry to dissapointed but i didnt.

Soccer officials fail to change rules about wearing hijab
Last Updated: Saturday, March 3, 2007 | 3:36 PM ET
CBC News
An 11-year-old Ottawa soccer player said Saturday she will continue to fight for her right to wear her hijab, even though the the world's top soccer association has refused to change its rules on the issue.

"I thought it was disappointing because I thought I would actually make a difference, but I didn't," Asmahan Mansour told CBC News from Ottawa.

"I'm proud that my team was there with me and my coach."

Mansour had been hoping that the F?d?ration Internationale de Football Association, or FIFA, would produce a ruling in her favour on the matter as it held its annual general meeting in Manchester, England.

Instead, FIFA officials remained firm in their intention to not change the regulations.

"If you play football there's a set of laws and rules, and law four outlines the basic equipment," Brian Barwick, chief executive of the English Football Association, told reporters.

Continue Article

"It's absolutely right to be sensitive to people's thoughts and philosophies, but equally there has to be a set of laws that are adhered to," he said.

In particular, FIFA said it would not alter the law dealing with items that a player is entitled to wear. Head scarves are not mentioned in that law.

On Feb. 25, Mansour was not allowed to participate in a soccer game in Laval, Que., because she was wearing a hijab, a headscarf worn by many Muslim women. The Quebec Soccer Association said the ban on hijabs is to protect children from being accidentally strangled.

FIFA officials made it clear they were not going to change the existing rules ? or explain them, the CBC's Adrienne Arsenault reported from Manchester.

"We understand from people who were in or near the meeting that it was quite a heated discussion," Arsenault said.

"Do the rules mean a hijab is or is not allowed? The answer kept coming back that the laws are what the laws are," she said.

"Obviously, it's a disappointing decision. It's very difficult for us as a team," coach Louis Maneiro told CBC News.

"I, for one, am in agreement that there have to be rules to protect the children," he said.

"If it had been a safety issue and the referee could clearly demonstrate that was the case then I wouldn't have had any problem with that. I hope Quebec can see that."

After Mansour was ejected from the game on Feb. 25, her team withdrew from the tournament saying they won't come back until the rules are changed.

"I just hope that one day Quebec will change the rules and I'll be able to play," Mansour told CBC News.

"I'm just hoping that any girl with the hijab does not go through what I went through."

Regarding why muslim women cover:  (found this one explanation online)
"when a woman is covered, men cannot judge her by her appearance but are forced to evaluate her by her personality, character, and morals. "I tell them that the hijab is not a responsibility, it's a right given to me by my Creator who knows us best. It's a benefit to me, so why not? It's something every woman should strive to get and should want."
Muslim women only cover themselves in front of men who are not direct relatives (brothers, fathers, and uncles) to prevent indecent acts or thoughts."

Women's hair has had a historical context of representing sexuality, sensuality, etc.  It probably is in the same vein as why nuns have covered their hair with the habits.  It's an expression of modesty and piety.

Any of you hear the quotes from Sjeik al Heilaly (or some spelling) (The Australian Mufti) down under. Now I know they were condemned by a lot of the muslim community down here, but equally so they were praised and supported by many.

He said something about how a woman that does not wear the headscarf is a lot like a piece of meat that is left uncovered in the street. If one does not cover it up, you can hardly blame the dogs for coming up and eating it. You blame whoever did not cover it up.

What he seems to be implying here is that Australian women who don't cover themselves from head to toe deserve to be gang raped. While the muslim men doing the raping, are nothing but "dogs" who cannot control their urges and shouldn't be exprected to anyway.

I cannot believe to tell you how much this statement pissed me (and a lot of Australians) off (although I refused to attend the absolute macho Aussie bullshit that took place in Cronulla on that fateful day).
If I was a muslim man I would be equally pissed, being referred to as a "dog" by my own Muslim leader.

... because all men are raging sex beasts that don't think, and women never judge men by their appearance.

i don't see anything wrong with what the ref did.

i don't see why the girl needs any special treatment. its a two way street. if muslims want to fit in with society and be equal then they can't turn around and say "hey i'm special so the rules shouldn't apply" when it works in their favour.

and her whole team not playing because of it?

come on. the world does not revolve around her.

no jewellery or hats or scarfs or anything are allowed while playing most sports like soccer and basketball.

it just so happens that the religion of islam happens to have a rule about the hijab. its not like the federation of soccer when creating the rules thought "hmmmmmmmmm whats the best way we can exclude those muslims from our game". ::)

lucky theres nothing like that in the bible.........otherwise we'd have every christian complaining that they shouldnt have to take off their cross when they play soccer.

personally i was always under the impression these vail things were invented when osama and co took over after the soviet failed on its war on afghanistan.....im sure i read that before this the women did not wear them.

No, they didn't invent them.  It's just a more "by the book," strict interpretation of Islam.  And, since the Taliban were pretty strict Muslims, the women wore them.