Here Today... Gone To Hell!

http://www.anus.com/zine/articles/rock/

This web site is perhaps the most hated out there. The signal to noise ratio of relevant information is about 15% at best. The writer is a biased black metalhead who doesn't like much of anything else. However, there is one thing about this article that really hit me.

A lot of GnR fans have turned into people expecting a product, and a lot of them will eat up whatever says "Chinese Democracy" on it. They aren't interested in worthwhile art. Axl is. He understands that catering to the whimsical crowd is how to become an instant rock star, yet it can also turn away just as quickly; he knows this more than anyone here. His rock star period is finished. He's rich and famous now.

He's prepared to give us the finest album he can. Even if it's a dud, his intent is still good. In fact, this is probably the first album he's putting out with merit in mind, since he did have to make a lot of pop filler to get rich first, which is an unfortunate waste. This is what plagued the UYI albums, which otherwise would have been nearly perfect. This also explains the TSI mess. I'm just glad it's over.

I believe his "new" band that he toured with a few years ago was just getting into the world and getting new ideas. Fresh tours often do that for bands. They were interesting in credibility more than anything else. Of course, this did result in cancelled concerts, and the crowd often rioted. The ones who caused property damage over a concert are the ones who want the product, and they don't really appreciate it at all.

Instead of trying to force metal or classical on people, we should talk about good rock music instead of attacking the current music scene. If we're lucky, maybe we'll get rock music that isn't dumbed down, even if dumbed down music is nearly the definition of rock, at least currently.

cool read

Yeah but you know what they say, the road to hell is paved with good intentions.

yada yada yada
Then, yawn.

exactly.. Enough excuses for why he can't put out an album.. Nothing wrong with making a good product or taking your time, but it's not like they are all hard at work still doing cd.. He just doesn't want to put it out for whatever reason and that's it.. Afd was a pure RNR masterpiece.. Great things happen in little time.. Nothing wrong with the illusions either, can you have two big albums of all great music? The illusions would have never happened if they tried to perfect everything.. But whatever axl wants he will have since he is high priest..

I look at it as a fan not as axl.. For me as a fan I want to be able to see him live I want to be able to turn on the tv or radio and hear the music, I want to enjoy something from him while I am still young as well as himself.. Maybe some have trhe vision tha the longer it takes the better it is.. Not me..

Its definitely put up or shut up time for Axl. Either put your cards on the table and show us your hand, or take your chips and go home. Simple as that. Release it or retire. Flip a fucking coin if you have to.

Axl is not doing the right thing. Yes it is his decision what and when his music gets released, but have some respect for the fan base who have been waiting and have allowed Axl to live the lifestyle he does. Put out some form of an update in a press release to at least say " Hi this is Axl, still working on the album, hang in there & thanks for sticking around" or something like that.

Or
"Yes, I'm still in GN'R. Yes, Chinese Democracy is coming out."

A Good read and a very interesting view. : ok:
I share the opinion halfway. But I doubt that Axl shares it.

Correct, it doesnt take this amount of time to get your shit together its time to stop with the excuses and deliver and also for the die hard axl fans to realise he doesnt walk on water.

as GnRFL mentioned,  Axl has shut his mouth without excuse for ages. Don't you know that or do you hear from him?

No Axl fan has ever told me that he walks on water. Are you that diehardfan?

Easy. He'll do it when the time comes. Yeah I hope the time will come when he does it.

Musically, if Axl really was doing the right thing, by now he'd have released Chinese Democracy to both critical aclaim and strong sales, toured the world and be writing the follow up album...

This must singlehandedly be the worst statement I have ever read from a fellow GNR fan on a message board in my 8 years coming to HTGTH. If you want to call 2/3rds of GNR's material (UYI & TSI) "plagued with pop filler" then I feel sorry for you because you can't even appreciate the greatness of the old band. Rather you cling onto a fantasy band who's appearance 3 years ago not only disgraced the GNR name (VMA performance of Paradise City) but hurt and disillusioned many fans like myself from ever liking Axl for who he is today.

GNR never made "pop filler" to sell records. They made songs based on truth, experiences with life, love & frustrations & hopes & with a band that was so talented that it influenced many to take up guitar, drums, not just vocals. Maybe Axl doesn't have the fondest memories of releasing UYI, but that doesn't mean his die hard fans shouldn't either. He didn't have fond memories of releasing November Rain the video, that didn't stop it from being a classic video and winning the fans and furthering the legacy of GNR. YOu hate November Rain too?You let this man dictate your taste of GNR's material, rather than letting certain songs sink in, maybe even buying a bootleg or two to watch Axl when he was in glory performing these songs in the same passion and heart that he performed the material from AFD would help you maybe. TSI rocks too, and it showed other sides of GNR that hadn't been seen, like coevring doo-woop songs & punk covers & 70's metal.

Finally, calling any GNR song "wasteful" is disgraceful.
If GNR was guilty of anything, it was not putting out UYI 3 with more songs on it like Ain't Goin Down, Shadow Of Your Love, Crash Diet, etc, which they had been discussing in 1990.
 :confused:
MNR

Great post, Mark. You're absolutely right. Its pathetic how some people around here base their opinions and taste of certain GNR songs/albums based on Axl's mindless ramblings of the past few years. I dont understand it. Now that Axl says Illusions wasn't completely ready, people put down the epics. Axl hates the November Rain video, so now everyone else does? Axl puts down Slash, so now everyone hates him? Shameful. No wonder Axl is taking so long. There's too many people willing to follow him into the black hole abyss of his mind.

I could think of a few that Illusions would have been better off not having. One in particular comes to mind.

Oh, come on. UYI was absolutely loaded with filler. AFD has its weaker moments as well, even if these songs are stratospheric compared to most other bands. The point is, GnR could have gotten away with 2 albums: AFD and UYI, with Lies as a short farewell album. They didn't have to do a bunch of punk covers, and UYI did not have to be 2 albums. After all of this, Axl can get away with taking his time and putting out an album with 100% integrity. It would be the perfect way to make up the UYI mess with his fans. The problem is, many fans want a product with no merit to it; these are the guys who tend to claim all GnR songs are masterpieces. This is simply not true.

November Rain is one of GnR's best songs, and one of rock's finest moments. It was also very unfortunate that songs like Crash Diet were excluded in favor of filler like So Fine.

Yes, me too.
But the thing is that we fans disagree on which 2-3 songs should have been excluded.
Its not worth mentioning the song titles, just be grateful they were recorded and put out.
The other unreleased songs are demos anyways, obtainable by P2P.

MNR

AFD had weaker moments? The weakest moment on any GnR album was the abysmal 'My  World'.  Axl needs to make up the UYI mess to his fans? Are you on crack? THe only mess created is the 'nu' GnR debacle that has disgraced a great band's legacy, tarnished it's image forever, and made people forget how truly powerful and rocking they were.  The nu collection of rented stiffs is a freak show.  The MTV appearance, whil interesting, was pretty lousy.  Chinese Democracy, Rhiad, and Silk Worms don't hold up to any 'classic' Gnr, although Madagasacr and Blues were good songs.

Yeah, "So Fine" was a great little ballad.  Not a classic, but a great listen.


Yeah, the latter two sounded good, but even then, they are only unreleased tracks on bootlegs.  Knowing Axl, he could've tinkered with them 1000 times since then and they could sound completely different if they ever get released.  And thats assuming that Axl even puts those songs on any album he ever releases.  At present the only thing to Axls name is "Oh my God", which was a dreadful song.  And even if you like it, it still isn't even near what you'd call a Guns N Roses song.

I really don't get how some of you people complain about all GN'R's filler songs.  I'm happy there were so many songs on the UYIs.  I don't think any of them are bad except My World.  Some are better than others, but they're all good songs.  How could you wish GN'R had less songs?  They have put out way too few songs as it is, and some of you wish they had less?  Be happy that you got what you did.

I used to enjoy the lesser songs more, but I have so much music to listen to now that I've picked up over time. I still listen to GnR, but I tend to skip the weaker songs more often now.

"So Fine" is great until Duff ruins it with his horrible vocals.

I like Duff's vocals.  And I like So Fine.

I like them on "Attitude" but nothing else.  His voice just annoys me.

"Yeah that made me haaaaaaaaaaaaaaapppppppppppppppppyyyyyyyyyyy!!!!"

Ugh.

Its funny how 'So Fine' was always considered a little gem on the Illusions records until Axl started to dislike Duff. Now most GNR fans hate it. I've always loved the song, and no band members' opinion of another band member is going to change that. Some people need to stop being so fickle and enjoy GNR's albums without basing their opinion of it by what Axl says.

Right.  But I've always disliked Duff's vocals on that song.  Axl could move Duff into his L.A. home and I'd still skip over his lines on "So Fine."

I used to skip the whole song along with think about you and my michelle but I didn't know Duff was singing on it and Axl disliked the song?

I don't necessarily think Duff can sing all that well, but his vocals suit the song well, I think.