The Biden administration (was: The NEW 2020 Election Thread)

[jarmo]

two elections in a row where the losing side argued that the election was rigged. is that damaging our democracy?

Trump claimed in both cases that the elections were rigged. But for some reason, he had no issues with the result in 2016..... Why?





/jarmo

Libs cried for 4 years that the election was invalid. Hillary never shut up about it and even left open the possibility of challenging the results more than a year after.

But democracy lives on!

Now if Biden’s buddies in China have their way, things in the US will change. We’ll see if they r successful.

You didn't answer the question.

How come the man who made claims about the elections being rigged accepted one, but not the other?

How come the man that held rallies even after he had won, and kept going on about how he won/beat Hillary for years after?

How come the man who claims the recent election was rigged and there was massive fraud involved accepts the results of all elections except the ones he lost?


Do you see a pattern here?


But let's talk about the liberals!

 

Oh yeah, this is how you discuss things. By answering my questions with off topic things or with questions. I guess the short answer to everything is: But liberals....




/jarmo

[jarmo]

The goal is to have an honest election, overturning anything is irrelevant, we are talking bigger picture here.  We arent a 3rd world country.

Sorry, but your country isn't exactly showing it.

Thanks to Trump and his minions. This is what happens when you claim your elections are rigged. You're in the company of places where they actually are.

Is this what people want? Not you personally, but all the MAGA, America first people. Do they care or even think about the consequences?




Personally, I like our system. We have presidential elections in Finland. Every vote counts equally. First round, every candidate is on the ballot. Second round, only the top two are available unless someone got a majority in the first round....





/jarmo

[tim_m]

two elections in a row where the losing side argued that the election was rigged. is that damaging our democracy?

i don't think so. it's been 4 years of liberals crying about the 2016 election and i don't feel like our democracy has been threatened. i think it would do everyone alot of good to make significant changes to our voting system so that we can help minimize these claims of invalid elections.   

Difference is, we know Russia interfered in that election. Even the senate investigation controlled by Republicans confirmed this. Whether Trump wittingly or unwittingly participated is the unanswered question.

[Dr. Blutarsky]

The goal is to have an honest election, overturning anything is irrelevant, we are talking bigger picture here.  We arent a 3rd world country.

Sorry, but your country isn't exactly showing it.

Thanks to Trump and his minions. This is what happens when you claim your elections are rigged. You're in the company of places where they actually are.

Is this what people want? Not you personally, but all the MAGA, America first people. Do they care or even think about the consequences?




Personally, I like our system. We have presidential elections in Finland. Every vote counts equally. First round, every candidate is on the ballot. Second round, only the top two are available unless someone got a majority in the first round....





/jarmo

  If I follow correctly, sounds like Finland has a 1st vote that is similar to a national open primary where you determine who the top 2 candidates will be.   I assume you all dont have candidates that have 2 years of campaigning heading into an election or billions of dollars of money pumped into campaigns. I like that concept, maybe the US could learn a thing or 2 from your election system..

I think it was laughable how the US handled this past election. Probably for different reasons than many that are here in this thread.  In addition to the irregularities that have been documented in Philly, Detroit, Atlanta as well as a few other places, our corporate and social media have showed themselves taking a side in this race. Problem is many people dont care when its their side that media is  taking.

[Dr. Blutarsky]

Some very good points made -


https://nypost.com/2020/12/16/not-so-looney-look-at-2020-election-results-devine/

A not-so-looney look at 2020 election results in battleground states: Devine

The Electoral College formally affirmed Joe Biden’s victory Monday, but President Trump fights on, much like the Black Knight in “Monty Python and the Holy Grail” who won’t give up, even when his arms and legs have been chopped off.

“ ’Tis but a scratch,” he says after King Arthur severs his right arm.

“It’s just a flesh wound,” he insists as he loses the other arm.

“I’m invincible!” he yells after losing his left leg, to which Arthur replies: “You’re a loony.”

The psychology of the nation, six weeks since the election, is encapsulated in that 1975 movie scene.

On Trump’s side, in his fruitless efforts to overturn the election result, are most of the 74.2 million Americans who voted for him, along with 126 House Republicans who signed on to the Texas lawsuit rejected by the US Supreme Court last week.

Most of the rest of the country thinks they’re all loonies.

This damaging divide won’t be resolved by Biden moving into the White House, no matter how much he talks about “unity.”

When 62 percent of Republicans are convinced it is “very likely the Democrats stole the election,” according to a Rasmussen poll, and 28 percent of independents and 17 percent of Democrats agree, “Houston, we have a problem.”

Sen. Ron Johnson (R-Wis.), chairman of the Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs Committee, put it best in Wednesday’s “Examining Irregularities in the 2020 Election” hearing:

“This is not a sustainable state of affairs in our democratic republic.”

It is clear to reasonable people that something was fishy about this unusual election, conducted during a pandemic.

Where people differ is whether the fishiness was enough to change the election result and, even if it was, whether it is possible to prove.

Trump would have to overturn at least 44,000 votes in three states — Georgia, Wisconsin and Arizona — a high bar made insurmountable by a pile of failed ­lawsuits.

The rational choice is to move on and not jeopardize the two all-important Georgia Senate runoff races on Jan. 5, which will determine whether Biden can enact radical change.

But where everyone ought to agree is that a thorough investigation is needed to ensure public faith in the integrity of future elections.

To that end, renowned economist and White House trade adviser Peter Navarro has conducted a forensic analysis of reported election irregularities and distilled his findings into a 35-page report to be released Thursday.

Navarro has collated allegations in battleground states — ranging from outright voter fraud and ballot mishandling to statistical anomalies — contained in 50 lawsuits and judicial rulings, thousands of affidavits and declarations, and testimony from state hearings.

He concludes that “patterns of election irregularities . . . are so consistent across the six battleground states that they suggest a coordinated strategy to, if not steal the election, strategically game the election process in such a way as to . . . unfairly tilt the playing field in favor of the Biden-Harris ticket.”

Some of the material in the ­report is questionable, particularly about voting machines.

Far-fetched tales by lawyer Sidney Powell about a plot by Hugo Chavez, George Soros, Hillary Clinton and sundry communists to rig voting machines manufactured by the Dominion Voting Systems company have poisoned that well.

But plenty in the report is credible.

For instance, it cites affidavits alleging exploitation of the elderly and infirm.

In one case, the family of an elderly man in a Georgia nursing home discovered that a mail-in ballot had been requested and submitted in his name without his consent.

In Pennsylvania, two parents and their Down-syndrome-afflicted daughter “discovered that a mail-in ballot had both been requested and submitted for the daughter without her consent.”

But these instances, while disturbing, can’t change the election result.

Where the report is most compelling is in its thesis that, under cover of the pandemic, Democrats and allied voting-rights activist organizations managed to get voter-ID requirements relaxed to such an extent that widespread ballot harvesting or outright fraud was able to occur without detection.

For example, the report cites 130,000 questionable votes in Wisconsin due to relaxed voter-ID requirements for “indefinitely confined” voters who said they were unable to get to the polls in person. These voters were seen “attending weddings, riding their bikes, going on vacation and otherwise [being] anything but confined.” Yet they evaded the rigorous ID checks required for in-person voting.

The number of “indefinitely confined” voters in Wisconsin almost tripled from 2019 to 2020, when 200,000 people took advantage of relaxed voter-ID laws due to the pandemic.
 

“This 130,000-vote increment of new indefinitely confined voters is more than five times the Biden victory margin in Wisconsin.”

Across battleground states, relaxed ID requirements for mail-in and absentee ballots “disproportionately benefited [Biden] because President Trump had a much higher percentage of in-person voters.”

The report also cites indications of ballot harvesting — for instance, 25,000 ballots requested from nursing-home residents in Pennsylvania at the same time.

In Nevada, it claims Native Americans were “bribed” to vote by Biden operatives with Visa gift cards, jewelry and other swag.

Perhaps the biggest “tell” that something was amiss was the obstruction of Republican poll watchers in Georgia, Michigan and Pennsylvania, where they claim they were denied entry to ballot-counting centers or “directed to stand at unreasonably lengthy distances from ballot counters.”

Whether or not you think the skepticism of half the country is “loony,” only a bipartisan and transparent investigation of these allegations will allow the country to move on with some semblance of the “unity” Biden claims to desire.

Assange is due a pardon

If President Trump is planning to issue more pardons, there are few people more deserving than WikiLeaks founder Julian Assange, currently languishing in London’s Belmarsh prison pending extradition to the US.

An extraordinary audio recording released yesterday by Project Veritas shows how Assange tried to minimize the risk to individuals of government leaks to his organization.

He is heard warning a State Department attorney in 2011 that a rogue former WikiLeaks employee is planning to publish damaging classified material.

Assange’s real crime is that he released stolen Democratic National Committee e-mails that were damaging to Hillary Clinton before the 2016 election.

The deep state will never forgive him, which is why Trump should.

[jarmo]

 If I follow correctly, sounds like Finland has a 1st vote that is similar to a national open primary where you determine who the top 2 candidates will be.   I assume you all dont have candidates that have 2 years of campaigning heading into an election or billions of dollars of money pumped into campaigns. I like that concept, maybe the US could learn a thing or 2 from your election system..

What usually happens is that all the major parties that have seats in the parliament nominate their candidates who then campaign. On top of that, if someone independent gets enough nominations/signatures, they can also take part...




/jarmo

[sandman]

two elections in a row where the losing side argued that the election was rigged. is that damaging our democracy?

Trump claimed in both cases that the elections were rigged. But for some reason, he had no issues with the result in 2016..... Why?





/jarmo

Libs cried for 4 years that the election was invalid. Hillary never shut up about it and even left open the possibility of challenging the results more than a year after.

But democracy lives on!

Now if Biden’s buddies in China have their way, things in the US will change. We’ll see if they r successful.

You didn't answer the question.

How come the man who made claims about the elections being rigged accepted one, but not the other?

How come the man that held rallies even after he had won, and kept going on about how he won/beat Hillary for years after?

How come the man who claims the recent election was rigged and there was massive fraud involved accepts the results of all elections except the ones he lost?


Do you see a pattern here?


But let's talk about the liberals!

 

Oh yeah, this is how you discuss things. By answering my questions with off topic things or with questions. I guess the short answer to everything is: But liberals....




/jarmo

because trump is a pompous asshole who hates losing, and this time the fraud in the election may have cost him the win?

maybe because the media works closely with Big Tech and the DNC to interfere with our elections by suppressing negative information about the Dem candidate?
  
i don't know the man, but those would be my guesses. what do you think?

You are missing the larger point because you and all the libs are obsessed with Trump. A huge percentage of americans - Rs and Ds alike - do not have absolute faith in our voting process. this goes back to the 90s, was a huge issue in 2000, was an even bigger issue for the last 4 years, and has been an issue the past month.

there's a post in this thread that is still talking about Russia interference. How about Twitter interference? how about interference from Iran (and Russia) in THIS election?


(CNN)Director of National Intelligence John Ratcliffe said Wednesday both Iran and Russia have obtained US voter registration information in an effort to interfere in the election, including Iran posing as the far-right group Proud Boys to send intimidating emails to voters.

Ratcliffe, appearing alongside FBI Director Chris Wray, said at a hastily arranged news conference Wednesday evening that Iran was responsible for the email campaign, made to look like it came from the Proud Boys, as well as spreading disinformation about voter fraud through a video linked in some of the emails.

"This data can be used by foreign actors to attempt to communicate false information to registered voters that they hope will cause confusion, sow chaos and undermine your confidence in American democracy," Ratcliffe said.

"We have already seen Iran sending spoof emails designed to intimidate voters, incite social unrest and damage President (Donald) Trump," Ratcliffe added. "You may have seen some reporting on this in the last 24 hours, or you may have even been one of the recipients of those emails."



why don't you or any of the other Trump-obsessed liberals care about this? You all cried about it for OVER 4 fucking years for crying out loud.  

but not a peep on this one.

partisanship? hypocrisy?

the answer is obvious.  

[jarmo]

I don't remember "crying" for four years.

This is yet another of your tactics. To make yourself seem better. Deflect. So obvious.



If anyone cried about it, it was Trump. Just because someone corrects his lies doesn't mean they're crying about shit. There's a difference.




Now you're using a Trump employee as your source. What do you think he'll say? That everything was fine?



Last time there was an investigation, it was a hoax and witch hunt. Now, it's "Iran used disinformation to hurt Trump"!
One election, election interference shouldn't be investigated... Another election it's important to look at everything. But only in the ones he lost, not in places where he won.  For fuck's sake. Make up your mind. If something isn't important one election, it shouldn't be important to you the next.



The courts have so far dismissed multiple cases from Trump and his merry men. But you keep repeating the fraud line.

This is the kind of "Third world" behavior you'd expect elsewhere. 




Trump is going down in history as the worst president the country has ever had. Most leaders around the world are glad to see him gone. The only ones who like him are leaders just like him. Right wing populists promising quick fixes to nonexistent made up problems.

Until the next time.... We thought W was crap, but then along comes this guy... So, until next time the Silly party nominates a celebrity.... We haven't seen the last narcissist yet.




/jarmo

[PermissionToLand]

Who's blinded by partisanship?? BTW this was not the biggest landslide in American history   - look up the 1984 election for an example of a landslide.

So you have no counterpoint. What a desperate dodge.  

 

306 electoral votes For Biden in 2020

306 Electoral  votes for Trump in 2016.

So are you saying Trump beat Clinton in a landslide?  

WHOOSH.  

Nice try, kid.

PermissionToLand is trying too hard for that gotcha moment.

Just try to have a little more self-awareness next time, boys.  

If I say "Joe Biden has the most beautiful bigly job numbers in the history of the universe, even more beautiful than his daughter, or that 13 year old he raped in 1994 with Jeffrey Epstein", that should be a clue.  

But hey, thanks for conceding the argument Sandie. I knew you were bigger than dying on the hill of denying that Donald Trump escalated drone strikes year over year to tremendous levels never before seen in history.

[PermissionToLand]

Back to my point....Americans and our election system would be much better served if we can have some across the board standards.

You keep your tyrannical federal government hands off my election! REEEEEE!!!!

Uhh, shit, what was it they said about Obama? Oh yeah, "I don't want a KING!"

[PermissionToLand]

the irregularities that have been documented in Philly, Detroit, Atlanta as well as a few other places,

 

You mean the ones that got laughed out of court?

Denial of reality is about as pathetic as it gets. Ya boy lost. Bigly. Get over it, cupcake. You aren't a "victim" of "the media". You just lost. Time to put on your big boy pants and take some personal responsibility for your loss. Real men don't cling to fake news like a child clutching a stuffed toy.

And again, if you wish to criticize anybody else about any kind of factual claim whatsoever, maybe don't utterly discredit yourself by clinging to lies.

[PermissionToLand]

because trump is a pompous asshole who hates losing, and this time the fraud in the election may have cost him the win?

maybe because the media works closely with Big Tech and the DNC to interfere with our elections by suppressing negative information about the Dem candidate?
  
i don't know the man, but those would be my guesses. what do you think?

You are missing the larger point because you and all the libs are obsessed with Trump. A huge percentage of americans - Rs and Ds alike - do not have absolute faith in our voting process. this goes back to the 90s, was a huge issue in 2000, was an even bigger issue for the last 4 years, and has been an issue the past month.

there's a post in this thread that is still talking about Russia interference. How about Twitter interference? how about interference from Iran (and Russia) in THIS election?


(CNN)Director of National Intelligence John Ratcliffe said Wednesday both Iran and Russia have obtained US voter registration information in an effort to interfere in the election, including Iran posing as the far-right group Proud Boys to send intimidating emails to voters.

Ratcliffe, appearing alongside FBI Director Chris Wray, said at a hastily arranged news conference Wednesday evening that Iran was responsible for the email campaign, made to look like it came from the Proud Boys, as well as spreading disinformation about voter fraud through a video linked in some of the emails.

"This data can be used by foreign actors to attempt to communicate false information to registered voters that they hope will cause confusion, sow chaos and undermine your confidence in American democracy," Ratcliffe said.

"We have already seen Iran sending spoof emails designed to intimidate voters, incite social unrest and damage President (Donald) Trump," Ratcliffe added. "You may have seen some reporting on this in the last 24 hours, or you may have even been one of the recipients of those emails."



why don't you or any of the other Trump-obsessed liberals care about this? You all cried about it for OVER 4 fucking years for crying out loud.   

Hoo boy, are you up against the ropes!



Remind me, which party passed MULTIPLE election security bills through the House and which party controlling the Senate let them all die?

"Secretary of DHS Kirstjen Nielsen was told not to bring up election security in front of the president. Nielsen had been pushing for a White House-led Cabinet meeting on securing the 2020 elections. While DHS has the lead, election security crosses many federal government departments. A Cabinet-level meeting would help put the issue front and center. But the Secretary’s attempts were foiled and she was forced out that same month."

https://www.brookings.edu/blog/fixgov/2019/08/28/trumps-hostility-to-election-security-preparedness/

Funny how you suddenly claim to care about election security the day after November 3rd. And unlike your projection of your own partisan hackery, Covid is still very much real after November 3rd.

Does it get exhausting making excuses for such obviously rapacious, pillaging elites with no morals or consistency except for their own self-interest? They don't even try to hide it, making your job as their useful pawn who will never get their cookie crumbs, that much harder. I feel for you, I really do. 

[sandman]

I don't remember "crying" for four years.

This is yet another of your tactics. To make yourself seem better. Deflect. So obvious.

i could give you thousands of quotes from politicians. tens of quotes from the 5 or 6 posters in this thread. and pictures of liberal lunatics literally crying about Russian interference and how the 2016 election was rigged. 

as for your "deflect" comment, i have no idea what you are talking about. you constantly lie and make vague comments that make no sense whatsoever. try being more detailed and actually making an argument for once.   

i was not deflecting. i answered your question. i then pointed out the issues that millions on BOTH SIDES have brought up related to our election process.

as for Trump, he has been totally consistent. he did not focus much on outside interference in either election. he did focus on voter fraud in BOTH elections, including the one he won, despite your claim otherwise. he set up a voter fraud task force months after his election won and continued to talk about it throughout the past 4 years.

also, all of your hypocrisy comments can easily be flipped the other way around. for some reason, that really makes you uncomfortable. no idea why that bothers you. but i'll let you in on a little secret....both sides of the political spectrum are loaded with hypocrisy. 

you also assume that everything Trump says is my view as well. i've made it painfully clear over the years - that is not true. i know you don't like to hear that either cause it kills your petty arguments. so you ignore it. but it's true, and i have consistently made it clear.

as for making myself look better? you think i care what i look like in this garbage can of the online world? This thread is the bottom of the barrel, my friend. lowest of the low. i couldn't care less how i look. 

SOME on this board treat their online persona very seriously, and are constantly trying to "OWN" others. ironically, they do that while accusing the other side of trying to "own the libs", despite no evidence to support those claims. i can only imagine how sad and empty their personal lives must be. it's a shame.

[jarmo]

Ok, for the sake of crying: Are you saying that outsiders didn't interfere with your 2016 presidential election?


If you're against one kind of election fraud, shouldn't everything that doesn't belong in a democratic election be investigated? No matter who did it, who it benefited etc.?

So the Democrats lost in 2016, and they wanted to know what/who had part in that. Certain blame can be put on themselves, but who/what else happened? It's not crying, it's learning....

Considering the kind of person Trump is, do you think it's a surprise people suspect he's not a poster boy for conservative Christians in the way he conducts himself? Instead he, and plenty of his supporters, acted like they were trying to hide shit. Then it turns out plenty of his associates were found guilty of all kinds of things. In court....

Meanwhile, Hillary still isn't locked up like they "demanded".... So who's crooked?

you think i care what i look like in this garbage can of the online world? This thread is the bottom of the barrel, my friend. lowest of the low.

Good, you don't care. But that's how you come across. That you do care....

I don't agree with your opinion on how low this thread or site is.

I mean, it's a Guns N' Roses fan site. If you're expecting some kind of political experts here, you might have the wrong expectations....

Anyway, I disagree.





/jarmo

[sandman]

Ok, for the sake of crying: Are you saying that outsiders didn't interfere with your 2016 presidential election?

did I say that or suggest that?

If you're against one kind of election fraud, shouldn't everything that doesn't belong in a democratic election be investigated? No matter who did it, who it benefited etc.?

yes

So the Democrats lost in 2016, and they wanted to know what/who had part in that. Certain blame can be put on themselves, but who/what else happened? It's not crying, it's learning....

believe whatever you like

Considering the kind of person Trump is, do you think it's a surprise people suspect he's not a poster boy for conservative Christians in the way he conducts himself? Instead he, and plenty of his supporters, acted like they were trying to hide shit. Then it turns out plenty of his associates were found guilty of all kinds of things. In court....

no one every believed he was a poster boy for the religious right. that's not what he was about. for one, he's the most pro-gay president of our lives.

Meanwhile, Hillary still isn't locked up like they "demanded".... So who's crooked?

if believing Hillary is a saint helps you sleep at night, go for it.

you think i care what i look like in this garbage can of the online world? This thread is the bottom of the barrel, my friend. lowest of the low.

Good, you don't care. But that's how you come across. That you do care....

if I cared, i would not partake in such a shit show of a thread.

I don't agree with your opinion on how low this thread or site is.

You lie again - i never said a word about this site. specifically referenced this thread. surprised you disagree.

I mean, it's a Guns N' Roses fan site. If you're expecting some kind of political experts here, you might have the wrong expectations....
Anyway, I disagree.
/jarmo

i have no expectations whatsoever for this thread. yet it still the garbage can of the internet.

I don't know how you define a "political expert" or what that entails. But I have seen posters over the years that i would consider political experts.

I also know that years ago the political threads on this site were filled with regular debates that were thoughtful and respectful. I saw comments from various people that really made me think and consider different perspectives. that hasn't happened in 4+ years, which is why my expectations are non-existent today. but there was a time....

[Dr. Blutarsky]

the irregularities that have been documented in Philly, Detroit, Atlanta as well as a few other places,

 

You mean the ones that got laughed out of court?

Denial of reality is about as pathetic as it gets. Ya boy lost. Bigly. Get over it, cupcake. You aren't a "victim" of "the media". You just lost. Time to put on your big boy pants and take some personal responsibility for your loss. Real men don't cling to fake news like a child clutching a stuffed toy.

And again, if you wish to criticize anybody else about any kind of factual claim whatsoever, maybe don't utterly discredit yourself by clinging to lies.

I'll refer you to the article I posted a few comments back.  Fishy shit happened with the mail in ballots in some places. But you could care less because you got the outcome you wanted. Like I mentioned before, an honest election goes beyond if your guy won this time.

[Dr. Blutarsky]

I also know that years ago the political threads on this site were filled with regular debates that were thoughtful and respectful. I saw comments from various people that really made me think and consider different perspectives. that hasn't happened in 4+ years, which is why my expectations are non-existent today. but there was a time....

I was here back in the day and I concur it was different. And there was a lot more of us engaged in political discussions.


 

[PermissionToLand]

Ok, for the sake of crying: Are you saying that outsiders didn't interfere with your 2016 presidential election?


If you're against one kind of election fraud, shouldn't everything that doesn't belong in a democratic election be investigated? No matter who did it, who it benefited etc.?

So the Democrats lost in 2016, and they wanted to know what/who had part in that. Certain blame can be put on themselves, but who/what else happened? It's not crying, it's learning...


/jarmo

As usual, he's just trying to gaslight you. We all know that the 2016 election was not secure, and that the GOP spent the entire Trump presidency fighting any kind of investigation into it or attempts to improve security for future elections. Suddenly, the DAY AFTER Trump loses, they are the world's biggest champions of election security and demand investigation.

he set up a voter fraud task force months after his election won and continued to talk about it throughout the past 4 years.

Hey, what ever happened to that task force? Oh yeah, it disbanded with no findings. Trump proves to be a lying sore loser once again.

also, all of your hypocrisy comments can easily be flipped the other way around. for some reason, that really makes you uncomfortable. no idea why that bothers you. but i'll let you in on a little secret....both sides of the political spectrum are loaded with hypocrisy. 

"For some reason, false equivalencies bother you. Can't imagine why" 

as for making myself look better? you think i care what i look like in this garbage can of the online world? This thread is the bottom of the barrel, my friend. lowest of the low. i couldn't care less how i look.

There you go, every time your arguments get obliterated, just claim ironic detachment. 

You're literally the guy who gets his advances rejected and says "I don't care, you're ugly anyway!"

The coping mechanisms are so obvious. Of course, the key difference is that you never saw a Clinton supporter force their way onto a stage and scream "The Trump Crime Family is stealing this election, the media is covering it up! REEEEEE!!!!!"



And of course, Clinton never solicited a mountain of FAKE NEWS affidavits to give her supporters false hope and feed into the kind of very real talks of attempting a coup that are going on right now.

"Eighty and more million of us request that you use the Insurrection Act, Suspend the December Electoral College Vote, and set up Military Tribunals immediately" - Sydney Powell

https://www.thetelegraph.com/news/article/Tweet-encourages-coup-by-Trump-supporters-15795943.php

Michael Flynn tweeted out, two weeks ago, a petition warning that “the threat of a shooting civil war is imminent,” and urging Trump to declare martial law, suspend the Constitution, and order a new Presidential election

The Arizona Republican Party recently sent a tweet asking supporters if they are willing to die to overturn the election results.

https://www.newyorker.com/news/our-columnists/trumps-coup-attempt-isnt-over

You didn't have Democrats leaving their own party in droves because of how anti-American this party of traitors has become:

https://thehill.com/homenews/news/530623-lincoln-project-co-founder-former-new-hampshire-gop-chair-leaving-republican

You didn't have anybody associated with Clinton advocating the barbaric execution of someone who dared counter their lies and propaganda:

“He should be drawn and quartered, taken out at dawn and shot.”

https://www.peoplesworld.org/article/trump-steps-up-terror-threats-in-leadup-to-biden-inauguration/

You also didn't have anything like Trump supporters and Proud Boys stabbing people in DC.

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/12/12/us/4-stabbed-and-one-shot-as-trump-supporters-and-opponents-clash.html

When even a majority of Fox News viewers feel Trump is "weakening Democracy", you cannot any longer deny the reality that this is not remotely comparable to any previous election. At least, not without being a complete loon divorced from reality because you simply can't cope with your candidate losing. Which it turns out a shit ton of Trump supporters are.

https://static.foxnews.com/foxnews.com/content/uploads/2020/12/Fox_December-6-9-2020_National_Topline_December-11-Release.pdf

SOME on this board treat their online persona very seriously, and are constantly trying to "OWN" others. ironically, they do that while accusing the other side of trying to "own the libs", despite no evidence to support those claims. i can only imagine how sad and empty their personal lives must be. it's a shame.

Aww, look who's playing the victim card again! I play one obvious little trick on you and all of the sudden the king of "gotchas" is running home crying foul to mommy. You and Blutarsky were dancing in the end zone, spiking the football thinking you got me before I revealed the trap. Everyone knows you care deeply, kiddo.

You know, you really can't make the gaslighting attempts as obvious as saying "SOME people are obsessed with "owning" others, what a bunch of sad little losers, right? Haha, OWNED!"

What's truly sad is that you think it actually takes effort on our end to discredit your weak excuses.

[PermissionToLand]

I'll refer you to the article I posted a few comments back.  Fishy shit happened with the mail in ballots in some places. But you could care less because you got the outcome you wanted. Like I mentioned before, an honest election goes beyond if your guy won this time.

As always, you argue a strawman. I've never said anything to indicate that my estimation of the legitimacy of an election hinges on who wins. I know projection of their own behavior is how right wingers can feel justified in their reprehensible lies, but it really doesn't benefit you to delude yourself about your opposition.

Did you even read the article you posted? It literally admits "yeah, a bunch of the stuff in this report is pants-on-head insane hoaxes. But maybe some of it could be credible? Because reasons?"

I like that you read a right wing media article saying "It is clear to reasonable people that something was fishy about this unusual election" with no citation or anything at all to back up that assertion, and just take it as a fact.

And the whole article is built around a report that WASN'T EVEN RELEASED YET.

Now that it was released, it's been utterly discredited.

"The report hinges on debunked allegations that have largely been rejected when raised in court, and one nonpartisan ethics watchdog criticized Navarro for writing it."

The nonpartisan Citizens for Responsibility and Ethics in Washington (CREW) questioned Navarro’s decision to publish a heavily politicized report while working at the White House. The Hatch Act generally bars federal staffers like Navarro from engaging in politics while on the job. “I'd question how one of President Trump's top economic advisers has so much free time to chase conspiracy theories and irresponsibly undermine faith in our democracy"

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2020/12/18/this-might-be-most-embarrassing-document-created-by-white-house-staffer/

So no, there is no actual proof that anything "fishy" happened whatsoever. It does not benefit you in any way to delude yourself into thinking otherwise.

[PermissionToLand]

I was here back in the day and I concur it was different. And there was a lot more of us engaged in political discussions.

I agree, the Trump administration really lowered the bar for political discourse.