The Biden administration (was: The NEW 2020 Election Thread)

[PermissionToLand]

I wasn't all that impressed with Biden's town hall.  Where is he getting all the money for his programs from? 

This question always gets my goat. Where did Trump get all the money for his giveaways to the rich? Nobody ever asked him that. Where did he get the money for his wall? He stole it from disaster relief funds. The double standard is incredible.

The reality is that we're the richest country on the face of the Earth. We can afford whatever the hell we want to afford.

That said, a town hall is not the place to go into granular financial detail, that's what his platform is for. And even then, he can't promise specifics because the president is not a dictator. Congress is the legislative branch; they do the writing, debating, amending and passing of bills. They would be funded just like literally anything else is funded. As far as tax rates, he's only proposed increasing rates on income above $400k a year. Closing loopholes and actually enforcing the law unlike Trump could bring in hundreds of billions in revenue.

IRS Loses $400 Billion Per Year in Unpaid Taxes

http://www.crfb.org/blogs/irs-loses-400-billion-year-unpaid-taxes

[tim_m]

I wasn't all that impressed with Biden's town hall.  Where is he getting all the money for his programs from? 

This question always gets my goat. Where did Trump get all the money for his giveaways to the rich? Nobody ever asked him that. Where did he get the money for his wall? He stole it from disaster relief funds. The double standard is incredible.

The reality is that we're the richest country on the face of the Earth. We can afford whatever the hell we want to afford.

That said, a town hall is not the place to go into granular financial detail, that's what his platform is for. And even then, he can't promise specifics because the president is not a dictator. Congress is the legislative branch; they do the writing, debating, amending and passing of bills. They would be funded just like literally anything else is funded. As far as tax rates, he's only proposed increasing rates on income above $400k a year. Closing loopholes and actually enforcing the law unlike Trump could bring in hundreds of billions in revenue.

IRS Loses $400 Billion Per Year in Unpaid Taxes

http://www.crfb.org/blogs/irs-loses-400-billion-year-unpaid-taxes

Exactly, if we wanted to let could tomorrow, help our homeless, our vets, begin to address the drug problem, find all undocumented immigrants a path to citizenship and help migrants at the border. You know why we don't? There's no money to be made in solving those problems.

[cineater]

I wasn't all that impressed with Biden's town hall.  Where is he getting all the money for his programs from?  

This question always gets my goat. Where did Trump get all the money for his giveaways to the rich? Nobody ever asked him that. Where did he get the money for his wall? He stole it from disaster relief funds. The double standard is incredible.

The reality is that we're the richest country on the face of the Earth. We can afford whatever the hell we want to afford.

That said, a town hall is not the place to go into granular financial detail, that's what his platform is for. And even then, he can't promise specifics because the president is not a dictator. Congress is the legislative branch; they do the writing, debating, amending and passing of bills. They would be funded just like literally anything else is funded. As far as tax rates, he's only proposed increasing rates on income above $400k a year. Closing loopholes and actually enforcing the law unlike Trump could bring in hundreds of billions in revenue.

IRS Loses $400 Billion Per Year in Unpaid Taxes

http://www.crfb.org/blogs/irs-loses-400-billion-year-unpaid-taxes

Exactly, if we wanted to let could tomorrow, help our homeless, our vets, begin to address the drug problem, find all undocumented immigrants a path to citizenship and help migrants at the border. You know why we don't? There's no money to be made in solving those problems.

Oh don't I know, there's no money to be made in solving those problems.  At least not directly.  There is a lot indirectly in a healthy, productive citizen as opposed to one who drains the system.

I'm still worried.  Where is all this money coming from?  "a total national debt of $26.70 trillion", according to my google search.  That just says we are spending like we are the richest country in the world.  How are we going to get that debt down or are we just adding to it?  I don't want that hanging over future generations.  (Legalize pot and we'll get that debt down there and be happy to do it, tax that.  )

[tim_m]

I'm totally with you on the legalizing marijuana and taxiing it.

[tim_m]

Now the Whitehouse gift shop is selling Trump beat covid-19 commentating coins. For fucks sake, make it stop already.

[cineater]

I'm totally with you on the legalizing marijuana and taxiing it.

I quit a long time ago but if it's for the good of the country......

[cineater]

Now the Whitehouse gift shop is selling Trump beat covid-19 commentating coins. For fucks sake, make it stop already.

Now that one might rise in value a hundred years from now.  I have my Women for Obama button in the save for later box.

[cineater]

We are not the richest country in the world according to this:

Here is the conclusive list of the top fifty-five richest countries in the world, starting with the wealthiest country…

Luxembourg (GDP per capita: $119,719)
Norway (GDP per capita: $86,362)
Switzerland (GDP per capita: $83,832)
Ireland (GDP per capita: $81,477)
Iceland (GDP per capita: $78,181)
Qatar (GDP per capita: $65,062)
The United States of America (GDP per capita: $64,906)
Denmark (GDP per capita: $63,434)
Singapore (GDP per capita: $62,690)
Australia (GDP per capita: $58,824)

Never heat of Qatar.  Isn't Luxembourg smaller than Rhode Island?  Where's Russia and China on that list?

[pilferk]

I wasn't all that impressed with Biden's town hall.  Where is he getting all the money for his programs from? 

Tax increases on those earning more than 400k a year, capital gains tax increase on capital gains over 1 million, caps itemized deductions on those earning 400k at 28%, close tax loopholes, ensuring that megacorporations pay actual taxes by limiting the % of deductions they can take.

Net is about 3 trillion dollars over a decade.

That first time home owners loan sucks.  You give them $15,000 and the price of a home and closing costs will just go up.

No.  First of all, we have history to prove this.  This is the EXACT same program the Obama administration used during the Recession.  It didn't change housing values or closing costs.

Second, real estate is the most market driven commodity in the country.  You can't really mess with pricing because it's so competitive. And loans are tied to appraised property value. For first time buyers, they are very likely using a form of FHA loan...where closing costs are strictly controlled and regulated.

[pilferk]

The sending a psychologist with the police for domestic situations is along the lines of a good idea.  It's true your social worker can get in homes and in their business when the police can't but the moment you have a uniformed officer, even when he just stands back, there's an adversarial thing going on.  We have a mental health team the police can contact and bring in.  We're a decent size county with a tax program that supports mental health.  Works well with mental health issues, we have the child abuse team but nothing for domestic violence, drug use, juvenile delinquency or social unrest.  Problem is a lot of these incidences need need follow up work and some counseling which nobody can afford.  One time intervention means the police are probably going to be back there again and again and again. 

It wouldn't be bad idea to have a social work department connected to the police department or one they can refer you to.  Kind of gives an implied authority telling you to get your shit together.  They already have a program to forgive student loans if you work 10 years in public service.  Could be something to develop.

So, here's the thing:  This is what "defund the police" actually means.

MOST urban (and some large suburban) forces already have these embedded social work departments.   They were created by many state legistlatures a couple decades ago, when it was recognized that these types of interactions could de-escalate dangerous situation.  They have been underutilized, and their funding has been "stolen" to fund other police department initiatives (like better weapons). When they are utilized, they are often not objective since they are being funded by the brotherhood in blue and pressure is brought to bear to rubber stamp police interactions.

Defund the police means taking those resources away, and putting them under their own umbrella.  By making them independent, and untying their funding from police departments, you do a few things.  You make them objective, you remove control (and I would say sometimes mismanagement) of their funding from police departments, and you introduce an independence to their response as 911 Dispatch would control alerts and not police command structure.

[pilferk]

Oh don't I know, there's no money to be made in solving those problems.  At least not directly.  There is a lot indirectly in a healthy, productive citizen as opposed to one who drains the system.

I'm still worried.  Where is all this money coming from?  "a total national debt of $26.70 trillion", according to my google search.  That just says we are spending like we are the richest country in the world.  How are we going to get that debt down or are we just adding to it?  I don't want that hanging over future generations.  (Legalize pot and we'll get that debt down there and be happy to do it, tax that.  )

I agree: Legalize and excise tax.

A good chunk of that national debt is the result of Trumps tax cuts for the rich and the corporations...2 to 3 trillion of it.

But do you really want to reduce the national debt?  Target defense spending. 15% of the total budget and over 50% of discretionary government spending is spent on the DOD.  We outspend China 4 to 1 and Russia 10 to 1.  We rose to be a superpower when our military budget was closer to 10% and 35% of discretionary spending.

We suck at auditing our spending and are still spending $60 for a hammer.  The DOD could be more efficient, more fiscally responsible, and still just as effective.  Yet everyone turns a blind eye because cutting defense spending is political suicide.  Too many people view it as "unpatriotic" or "Not supporting our military".  Getting a government military contract has been perceived by too many corporations as being able to print money.  Too many suppliers mark up their hardware because, they say, of increased specifications.  When audits HAVE gotten done (rarely), this has been shown to be completely untrue.  That $60 hammer is the same $20 construction grade hammer you would buy at Home Depot. 

That money savings could be redirected to other priorities....or it could be used to service and pay down the national debt.

But the national debt is the thing politicians talk about when "the other guy" is in power, and ignore as soon as they are.

[jarmo]

USA or North Korea? https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1313267143232942081





/jarmo

[tim_m]

Oh don't I know, there's no money to be made in solving those problems.  At least not directly.  There is a lot indirectly in a healthy, productive citizen as opposed to one who drains the system.

I'm still worried.  Where is all this money coming from?  "a total national debt of $26.70 trillion", according to my google search.  That just says we are spending like we are the richest country in the world.  How are we going to get that debt down or are we just adding to it?  I don't want that hanging over future generations.  (Legalize pot and we'll get that debt down there and be happy to do it, tax that.  )

I agree: Legalize and excise tax.

A good chunk of that national debt is the result of Trumps tax cuts for the rich and the corporations...2 to 3 trillion of it.

But do you really want to reduce the national debt?  Target defense spending. 15% of the total budget and over 50% of discretionary government spending is spent on the DOD.  We outspend China 4 to 1 and Russia 10 to 1.  We rose to be a superpower when our military budget was closer to 10% and 35% of discretionary spending.

We suck at auditing our spending and are still spending $60 for a hammer.  The DOD could be more efficient, more fiscally responsible, and still just as effective.  Yet everyone turns a blind eye because cutting defense spending is political suicide.  Too many people view it as "unpatriotic" or "Not supporting our military".  Getting a government military contract has been perceived by too many corporations as being able to print money.  Too many suppliers mark up their hardware because, they say, of increased specifications.  When audits HAVE gotten done (rarely), this has been shown to be completely untrue.  That $60 hammer is the same $20 construction grade hammer you would buy at Home Depot. 

That money savings could be redirected to other priorities....or it could be used to service and pay down the national debt.

But the national debt is the thing politicians talk about when "the other guy" is in power, and ignore as soon as they are.

It's the industrial military complex FDR warned us about.

[PermissionToLand]

I'm still worried.  Where is all this money coming from?  "a total national debt of $26.70 trillion", according to my google search.  That just says we are spending like we are the richest country in the world.  How are we going to get that debt down or are we just adding to it?  I don't want that hanging over future generations.  (Legalize pot and we'll get that debt down there and be happy to do it, tax that.  )

Here's the little secret that conservatives don't want you to know; the national debt doesn't really matter that much. We're making the payments just fine and not under any threat of defaulting or losing credibility as a borrower. And more importantly, right now is the worst time to be thinking about the debt because we have the more pressing issue of an economy on a 40 year decline compounded by the Covid crisis' economic effects. Fixing that will take investment, not divestment.

However, if we want to at least stem the growth of the debt, we have to look at what we did that blew it up to this scale in the first place; endless wars and tax cuts. Trump's tax cut alone blew a Trillion dollar hole in the deficit

https://www.axios.com/warren-buffett-national-debt-6fa22c24-bc40-4cda-8895-973605ea465a.html

https://www.newsweek.com/us-deficit-trump-coronavirus-economy-recession-1494263

And for a deeper dive: https://www.currentaffairs.org/2020/08/our-money-where-our-mouth-is

We are not the richest country in the world according to this:

Here is the conclusive list of the top fifty-five richest countries in the world, starting with the wealthiest country…

Luxembourg (GDP per capita: $119,719)
Norway (GDP per capita: $86,362)
Switzerland (GDP per capita: $83,832)
Ireland (GDP per capita: $81,477)
Iceland (GDP per capita: $78,181)
Qatar (GDP per capita: $65,062)
The United States of America (GDP per capita: $64,906)
Denmark (GDP per capita: $63,434)
Singapore (GDP per capita: $62,690)
Australia (GDP per capita: $58,824)

Never heat of Qatar.  Isn't Luxembourg smaller than Rhode Island?  Where's Russia and China on that list?

We're the largest by nominal GDP:



Regardless, being 7th largest in GDP per capita certainly doesn't disprove the point that we have plenty of ability to spend on our citizens. Look at the countries on that list and compare their living standards to ours. The contrast is stark.

And yes, Luxembourg is a tiny haven for the wealthy. If you split the wealthiest American county into its own country, it would probably beat Luxembourg.

[PermissionToLand]

A humbling Herman Cain/coronavirus timeline:

6/24: Attends Trump rally, maskless

7/2: Tests positive for Covid-19

7/10: Says he’s improving

7/15: Says his doctors seem happy

7/27: Says he’s really getting better

7/30: Dies

[pilferk]

Stephen Miller...covid positive. Another person in the Trump orbit infected.

[tim_m]

Also another aide has tested positive, as well as a joint chiefs of staff promoting 7 to have to quarantine.

[tim_m]

Gotta wonder if Trump is all there, after a report that said without a stimulus the economy is going to tank, then Trump says no stimulus until after i win. Did he just officially end his presidency. I am beginning to think he's trying to lose now.

[pilferk]

Gotta wonder if Trump is all there, after a report that said without a stimulus the economy is going to tank, then Trump says no stimulus until after i win. Did he just officially end his presidency. I am beginning to think he's trying to lose now.

He is pretty sure he is going to lose...and this is his tantrum.

As well as being an ultimatum: want stimulus in 2020? Vote for me.or you get nuthin. And if dems dont take the senate AND kill the filibuster, mitch will make sure you gwt nuthin in 2021.

Its full scortched earth.

[tim_m]

Gotta wonder if Trump is all there, after a report that said without a stimulus the economy is going to tank, then Trump says no stimulus until after i win. Did he just officially end his presidency. I am beginning to think he's trying to lose now.

He is pretty sure he is going to lose...and this is his tantrum.

As well as being an ultimatum: want stimulus in 2020? Vote for me.or you get nuthin. And if dems dont take the senate AND kill the filibuster, mitch will make sure you gwt nuthin in 2021.

Its full scortched earth.

This might pretty much ensure the Senate flips and the Dems go nuclear and the Republicans will only have themselves to blame. The independents and undecided voters are not going to view this favorably.

I think this is Trump wanting out, he just can't allow his narcissism to resign and save a little dignity for him and the party.