2017 Baseball Season/Off Season Discussion

[JAEBALL]

Yeah considering they had to trade Kyrie, they did very well to get back an all star and what could be a TOP draft pick. Like it for both sides...but regardless.. for Cleveland... Lebron is going...

I don't think the Yanks are gunna chase you guys down... those blown games last week were hugeeee... the Devers hH and the 6-3 lead we blew in Boston were gross.


BUT where do I sign for a good ol Yanks- Sox ALCS.... we need one... haha

It would take an EPIC Sox meltdown (or a sudden Judge resurgance of epic proportions) for the Yanks to make up those 4 loses in 38 games.  It's possible....but I just don't think they are built to do it.  Their youngsters have regressed some, their rotation is...shaky? (and that's being kind) and the back end of their bullpen (*cough* Chapman *cough*) has not been the juggernaut it was supposed to be.

That being said: I didn't expect them to do SHIT this year.....so they are far exceeding my expectations. They have a 4 loss lead for the first wild card, and I think they can probably manage to hold on to that. Realistically, that's better than I thought they'd do, so....I'm good.

NEXT year.....NEXT year I have expectations.

At this point... I will be disappointed to not win the wild card game... making that game doesn't equate to being in the playoffs to me.

BUT like you said we expected nothing coming in to the year... so it's all gravy.

[pilferk]

Cabrera deserves 80 games for that one.

Total sucker punch and the only punches thrown.

If I were MLB, he'd be done for this season, playoffs, and 40 games of next season, too. DONE.

He'll get 10 games, appeal, and end up out 5.

[JAEBALL]

Cabrera deserves 80 games for that one.

Total sucker punch and the only punches thrown.

If I were MLB, he'd be done for this season, playoffs, and 40 games of next season, too. DONE.

He'll get 10 games, appeal, and end up out 5.

Baseball is ridiculous... they drill Sanchez because they can't get him out... so we do the right thing... and Cabrera goes ballistic... what a POS.

Sanchez is fucked tho because he got in some real cheap shots towards the end.

[tim_m]

And that whole umpire crew should be suspended. They enabled it all to continue by not issuing warnings.

[faldor]

Cabrera deserves 80 games for that one.

Total sucker punch and the only punches thrown.

If I were MLB, he'd be done for this season, playoffs, and 40 games of next season, too. DONE.

He'll get 10 games, appeal, and end up out 5.

Uh, and Sanchez should get? And how about Betances? I freely admit I didn't see the whole thing but Sanchez got a few cheap shots in of his own. Ridiculous for all involved, umps certainly included. No way they can let things get that out of hand.

[tim_m]

All they probably had to do was issue warnings after the first HBP but they didn't and it just spiraled downward.

[JAEBALL]

Cabrera deserves 80 games for that one.

Total sucker punch and the only punches thrown.

If I were MLB, he'd be done for this season, playoffs, and 40 games of next season, too. DONE.

He'll get 10 games, appeal, and end up out 5.

Uh, and Sanchez should get? And how about Betances? I freely admit I didn't see the whole thing but Sanchez got a few cheap shots in of his own. Ridiculous for all involved, umps certainly included. No way they can let things get that out of hand.

Betances wasn't trying to get anybody ....

It's 6-6 they just tied the game....nobody thinks he hit him in the head on purpose... just really bad timing for him to be Wild which he has been all year.

[pilferk]

Uh, and Sanchez should get? And how about Betances? I freely admit I didn't see the whole thing but Sanchez got a few cheap shots in of his own. Ridiculous for all involved, umps certainly included. No way they can let things get that out of hand.

You should watch the whole thing. Right from the pitch that hit Sanchez until the Yanks TRIED (unsuccessfully, remember) to stick one up Cabrera's ass.

It was over. The Yanks pitcher got thrown out (which was stupid because the umps never issued warnings...which was the entire problem, here), Chapman had warmed up and was ready to go. Basically, all but two people in the whole stadium had gotten over it. One of them was back in the Yanks clubhouse (Joe G), and the other was stepping into the batters box.  Cabrera escalated it all over again as soon as he came to the plate. He started the "conversation" with Romine. It's pretty obvious Miggy came to the batters box with intent to punch out Romine. This wasn't a heat of the moment exchange....the heat was gone. Hell, he didn't even GET HIT.

Cabrera shoved Romine back JUST to get him into range so he could throw the haymaker and sucker punch him. That's not a fight, it's premeditated assault.

Sanchez should get 3 games (appealed to 2). Yes, he took a couple cheap shots...in a situation that wouldn't ever have happened if Cabrera had just come up and taken his AB.

Betances should get nothing because there was zero intent on that pitch.  If you think there was, you're nuts. It's a 6-6 ballgame. He's been a little wild all year..just terrible timing.  I get why McCann was upset. I get (stupid as it is...warnings were in place) why Betances gets thrown out. But there is zero actual grounds for further discipline.  That's not to say MLB won't try...but if you ask what he deserves..the answer is nothing.

And Romine should get ZERO, too.  Cabrera was the aggressor, and he was just defending himself. He even had the balls to drop his mask, unlike some other catchers I might mention.   What's the guy supposed to do? Drop, turtle, and take a beating? Fuck that. If they think Romine's actions deserve a suspension.....whatever number they think he deserves, they should just add those games to Cabrera's suspension.  Make it 90 games. He is the entire reason (well, besides the umpiring crew, but even then) for all of it. Every time the sides left the dugout, they should consider that on him, too, and add 10 games, each. And make his 110 game suspension contingent on 90 days of anger management classes, to boot.

Given the way he's comported himself over the last few years, I've had very little respect for Miggy. Now I have zero.  Punk ass pussy hypocrite. Talk about protecting your teammates, but when you're the target of the other team....you act like a crybaby....and what's worse, you sucker punch someone and then bitch when you get knocked around.  He should take his ball and go home til June, 2018.

[JAEBALL]

Uh, and Sanchez should get? And how about Betances? I freely admit I didn't see the whole thing but Sanchez got a few cheap shots in of his own. Ridiculous for all involved, umps certainly included. No way they can let things get that out of hand.

You should watch the whole thing. Right from the pitch that hit Sanchez until the Yanks TRIED (unsuccessfully, remember) to stick one up Cabrera's ass.

It was over. The Yanks pitcher got thrown out (which was stupid because the umps never issued warnings...which was the entire problem, here), Chapman had warmed up and was ready to go. Basically, all but two people in the whole stadium had gotten over it. One of them was back in the Yanks clubhouse (Joe G), and the other was stepping into the batters box.  Cabrera escalated it all over again as soon as he came to the plate. He started the "conversation" with Romine. It's pretty obvious Miggy came to the batters box with intent to punch out Romine. This wasn't a heat of the moment exchange....the heat was gone. Hell, he didn't even GET HIT.

Cabrera shoved Romine back JUST to get him into range so he could throw the haymaker and sucker punch him. That's not a fight, it's premeditated assault.

Sanchez should get 3 games (appealed to 2). Yes, he took a couple cheap shots...in a situation that wouldn't ever have happened if Cabrera had just come up and taken his AB.

Betances should get nothing because there was zero intent on that pitch.  If you think there was, you're nuts. It's a 6-6 ballgame. He's been a little wild all year..just terrible timing.  I get why McCann was upset. I get (stupid as it is...warnings were in place) why Betances gets thrown out. But there is zero actual grounds for further discipline.  That's not to say MLB won't try...but if you ask what he deserves..the answer is nothing.

And Romine should get ZERO, too.  Cabrera was the aggressor, and he was just defending himself. He even had the balls to drop his mask, unlike some other catchers I might mention.   What's the guy supposed to do? Drop, turtle, and take a beating? Fuck that. If they think Romine's actions deserve a suspension.....whatever number they think he deserves, they should just add those games to Cabrera's suspension.  Make it 90 games. He is the entire reason (well, besides the umpiring crew, but even then) for all of it. Every time the sides left the dugout, they should consider that on him, too, and add 10 games, each. And make his 110 game suspension contingent on 90 days of anger management classes, to boot.

Given the way he's comported himself over the last few years, I've had very little respect for Miggy. Now I have zero.  Punk ass pussy hypocrite. Talk about protecting your teammates, but when you're the target of the other team....you act like a crybaby....and what's worse, you sucker punch someone and then bitch when you get knocked around.  He should take his ball and go home til June, 2018.

Yup... perfectly said all around... I HATE pitchers who throw at people just because they can't get him out...makes me sick... AND ON TOP OF IT... they get suspended for 5 days and don't even miss a start!!! There is nothing for them to fear so they keep doing it... especially in the AL.

Love the catcher mask dig lol.

That was one of the wildest baseball games I have ever seen...

[pilferk]

I should also add, in relation to Betances, I feel the same way about the Tigers Smith hitting Frazier in the thigh.  I get why they threw him out, but there should be zero further discipline.  No way that was intentional!

And in both cases, the players that got hit agree. Both McCann and Frazier said they don't think they were getting thrown at. Just bad timing.

[pilferk]

Yup... perfectly said all around... I HATE pitchers who throw at people just because they can't get him out...makes me sick... AND ON TOP OF IT... they get suspended for 5 days and don't even miss a start!!! There is nothing for them to fear so they keep doing it... especially in the AL.

Love the catcher mask dig lol.

That was one of the wildest baseball games I have ever seen...

What really irks me, too, is Miggy's account of what happened at the plate. He outright lies about it. Like...bald faced lie. Give him another 10 games for that!

I'm passably good at reading lips.  If you read Romine's account of what happened, and what was said....it's pretty much dead on (minus an expletive or two).

Miggy said: "You got a fucking problem with me? Do you? Do you have a fucking problem?"
Romine said something behind the mask that I can't see, stood up, took off his mask, and said "This isn't even fucking about you!"

Miggy got in his face, shouted something (back to the camera...I can't see what..but I imagine "Fuck you" is pretty close), shoved, and punched.

He went up looking to punch Romine out. Period. His panties were all in a bunch because a) He'd gotten thrown at and b) afterward, in pursuit of the umpire, Romine said to him (again, clear as day): "I'm not talking to you, man" and stepped around him. I'll say it again: Punk. Ass. Pussy. Hypocrite.

[Layne Staley's Sunglasses]

Baseball players should never ever fight.  They always end up looking like Nancies.

If a ballplayer leaves the dugout and bullpen, it should be MANDATORY to throw punches. 

They're SO TOUGH holding each other back and yelling at each other.

[tim_m]

Now Cabrera is trying to claim Judge sucker punched him in the throat.

[Layne Staley's Sunglasses]

Now Cabrera is trying to claim Judge sucker punched him in the throat.

Cabrera needs to shut the hell up, is what he needs to do.  Couldn't even land a punch and now he's crying.  You reap what you sow.

Go Dodgers.

[C0ma]

Baseball players should never ever fight.  They always end up looking like Nancies.

If a ballplayer leaves the dugout and bullpen, it should be MANDATORY to throw punches. 

They're SO TOUGH holding each other back and yelling at each other.

Nolan Ryan disagrees...

[Layne Staley's Sunglasses]

Baseball players should never ever fight.  They always end up looking like Nancies.

If a ballplayer leaves the dugout and bullpen, it should be MANDATORY to throw punches. 

They're SO TOUGH holding each other back and yelling at each other.

Nolan Ryan disagrees...

Yes he does.  But Nolan Ryan handled his business.

[faldor]

Cabrera deserves 80 games for that one.

Total sucker punch and the only punches thrown.

If I were MLB, he'd be done for this season, playoffs, and 40 games of next season, too. DONE.

He'll get 10 games, appeal, and end up out 5.

Uh, and Sanchez should get? And how about Betances? I freely admit I didn't see the whole thing but Sanchez got a few cheap shots in of his own. Ridiculous for all involved, umps certainly included. No way they can let things get that out of hand.

Betances wasn't trying to get anybody ....

It's 6-6 they just tied the game....nobody thinks he hit him in the head on purpose... just really bad timing for him to be Wild which he has been all year.

It wouldn't be the first time a pitcher hit a batter with purpose and the game still in the balance. That's the beauty of it. Nobody is expecting it because the game is still on the line. There's no way anyone can say he didn't do it on purpose in my mind. Only he knows for sure and he's not going to admit it if he did. Maybe he tried to go up and in and it got away from him. Still dangerous, and I don't let him off the hook just because it was a tie game at the time.

[pilferk]

Cabrera deserves 80 games for that one.

Total sucker punch and the only punches thrown.

If I were MLB, he'd be done for this season, playoffs, and 40 games of next season, too. DONE.

He'll get 10 games, appeal, and end up out 5.

Uh, and Sanchez should get? And how about Betances? I freely admit I didn't see the whole thing but Sanchez got a few cheap shots in of his own. Ridiculous for all involved, umps certainly included. No way they can let things get that out of hand.

Betances wasn't trying to get anybody ....

It's 6-6 they just tied the game....nobody thinks he hit him in the head on purpose... just really bad timing for him to be Wild which he has been all year.

It wouldn't be the first time a pitcher hit a batter with purpose and the game still in the balance. That's the beauty of it. Nobody is expecting it because the game is still on the line. There's no way anyone can say he didn't do it on purpose in my mind. Only he knows for sure and he's not going to admit it if he did. Maybe he tried to go up and in and it got away from him. Still dangerous, and I don't let him off the hook just because it was a tie game at the time.

Sorry, but thats you being a homer.

Betances said it wasnt intentional.

Girardi says it wasnt.

The guy HE HIT said it wasnt.

And mlb said it wasnt, when levying suspensions.

Theres a lot more evidence and reason to believe it wasnt than the contrary.

Today, in a 6-2 game, he uncorked one high and tight to the screen against the m's. Him, the catcher, and the batter all looked shocked. The call was fastball, low and away. Hes done it all year. Every so often, he loses the grip early, and goes wild.

AND...you're doing the same thing: assuming intent. But with less evidence. And you're obviously assuming smith hit frazier, same game, on purpose, too. Right?

[faldor]

Cabrera deserves 80 games for that one.

Total sucker punch and the only punches thrown.

If I were MLB, he'd be done for this season, playoffs, and 40 games of next season, too. DONE.

He'll get 10 games, appeal, and end up out 5.

Uh, and Sanchez should get? And how about Betances? I freely admit I didn't see the whole thing but Sanchez got a few cheap shots in of his own. Ridiculous for all involved, umps certainly included. No way they can let things get that out of hand.

Betances wasn't trying to get anybody ....

It's 6-6 they just tied the game....nobody thinks he hit him in the head on purpose... just really bad timing for him to be Wild which he has been all year.

It wouldn't be the first time a pitcher hit a batter with purpose and the game still in the balance. That's the beauty of it. Nobody is expecting it because the game is still on the line. There's no way anyone can say he didn't do it on purpose in my mind. Only he knows for sure and he's not going to admit it if he did. Maybe he tried to go up and in and it got away from him. Still dangerous, and I don't let him off the hook just because it was a tie game at the time.

Sorry, but thats you being a homer.

Betances said it wasnt intentional.

Girardi says it wasnt.

The guy HE HIT said it wasnt.

And mlb said it wasnt, when levying suspensions.

Theres a lot more evidence and reason to believe it wasnt than the contrary.

Today, in a 6-2 game, he uncorked one high and tight to the screen against the m's. Him, the catcher, and the batter all looked shocked. The call was fastball, low and away. Hes done it all year. Every so often, he loses the grip early, and goes wild.

AND...you're doing the same thing: assuming intent. But with less evidence. And you're obviously assuming smith hit frazier, same game, on purpose, too. Right?

Again, I didn't see it all unfold live but yeah I wouldn't be shocked if all the batters in that game were hit on purpose. I could say the very same thing about you being a homer and thinking it wasn't on purpose because he's on your team. I'm not as obsessed with the Yankees as you may think. I really don't care whether he did or didn't do it on purpose, I'm just stating that in my opinion there could have been purpose despite what you think, what he said, what anyone else said.

Chris Sale threw behind a batter on the Orioles in an inopportune time to avenge Machado's hard slide into Pedroia. He said it wasn't on purpose, Farrell said the same, he wasn't tossed and I don't think the benches were even warned. But you're damn right I think there was intent. Kluber hit Nunez this past week with a runner on in a tie game after he went down to one knee on a swing. I thought that was purposeful too. Nunez responded with an RBI double and later a 3 run HR. After the game he said he didn't believe Kluber hit him on purpose. I'm not singling out Betances because he plays for your beloved Yankees. Don't flatter yourself. It's what I believe. Simple as that.

[pilferk]

Again, I didn't see it all unfold live but yeah I wouldn't be shocked if all the batters in that game were hit on purpose. I could say the very same thing about you being a homer and thinking it wasn't on purpose because he's on your team. I'm not as obsessed with the Yankees as you may think. I really don't care whether he did or didn't do it on purpose, I'm just stating that in my opinion there could have been purpose despite what you think, what he said, what anyone else said.

Ok, so, to be clear:

1) The pitcher says it wasn't intentional
2) Both managers say they don't think it was intentional
3) The PLAYER WHO GOT HIT says he doesn't think it was intentional
4) BOTH Home and Away announcers said, in the moment, they didn't think it was intentional.
5) EVERY professional Analyst crew (fox sports, ESPN, MLB) all say they're pretty sure it wasn't intentional
6) MLB DETERMINED it wasn't intentional when handing out fines and suspensions
7) pilferk thinks it wasn't intentional (and is applying the same standard to the Tigers pitcher who hit Frazier).

vs

1) faldor (a Sox fan) and a few Tigers homers think it was (or might be) intentional.

Fair enough. Enjoy your island. I certainly think mine has better company (if you decide you want to join us!).

Chris Sale threw behind a batter on the Orioles in an inopportune time to avenge Machado's hard slide into Pedroia. He said it wasn't on purpose, Farrell said the same, he wasn't tossed and I don't think the benches were even warned. But you're damn right I think there was intent. Kluber hit Nunez this past week with a runner on in a tie game after he went down to one knee on a swing. I thought that was purposeful too. Nunez responded with an RBI double and later a 3 run HR. After the game he said he didn't believe Kluber hit him on purpose. I'm not singling out Betances because he plays for your beloved Yankees. Don't flatter yourself. It's what I believe. Simple as that.

Again, I'm not singling out Betances, either.  Smith (a Tiger) pegged Frazier (a Yankee) square in the thigh, same game. I don't believe there was intent, there, either.

I didn't see the Sale pegging, nor the Kluber pitch. So its hard for me to weigh in, there. But I don't think, even in the face of coincidence, that every pitch that hits someone is meant to hit them.  I think sometimes a pitcher just wants to claim the inner part of the plate, or has a mechanical issue on a particular pitch, and shit happens.

What I do know, with very little doubt, is that Betances and Smith both weren't aiming for the batters they were pitching to.  Ditto with Robertson who hit a guy in the wrist...on a check swing. Betances has uncorked wild pitches all year.  The only reason you haven't heard more about it is because...there's never anyone on base when it happens.   I'd say once every other appearance, one goes back to the screen, on the right side of the plate.  Has happened vs lefties too (so, you know....the OPPOSITE side from the batter).