[Updates] July 20th, 2016 Foxborough, MA @ Gillette Stadium (Night #2)

[pilferk]

Going to be Africa hot though.

Near 100 during the day.

The 4 hour marathon was just meant as an example.  I doubt they'll do it.  My point was really they can add as much to the set list as they want. Couple extra songs with Adler? No problem.  That extra CD song? Pfft...whatever.  

No fucks need to be given for time of show.  It's all about how long they want (or can) go on and still manage another show the next day.

There's a chance of a passing shower, late...but so far no indications of T-storms.  I'll tell you, if it started to spritz around 9 PM, I don't think anyone but Lenny would bitch..and maybe not even him.

I'm doubling up on the Axe deoderant.  You're all welcome.

[14 Yrs Of Silence]

By 9pm it'll be 85, so as long as you're not pregaming in the lot all afternoon you should be good!

[pilferk]

I didn't prove your point. I said I'm ging ONLY to the L.A. shows when I could go to MORE if Adler and Izzy were permanent members and the setlist was a bit different.

Are you buying a ticket to a show? Yes you are. Despite all the bitching.

So, yeah...you're proving the point. Despite all the whining, you're still going to put your butt in a seat for a show or two.

"I could go more"?  Yeah, sorry..if anything, that just makes all the bitching worth that much less.  You don't even have the strength of conviction to NOT go to the thing you're bitching about. Ugh...

What do you mean they don't expect to sell second shows? They don't schedule them just for the hell of it. And in some cases when they perfom one show in a given city is not sold out either. We know they have upgraded tickets and the upper decks were closed for some shows. So maybe the WSJ might have a point. That's what I'm saying. I never said MSL was a reliable source. Again see for yourself. Check Ticketmaster and StubHub.

SELL OUT.   They don't expect them to sell out.  They don't. I'm sorry if that concept is foreign to you, or the economics aren't making sense, but they didn't add those shows to sell them out.  They had open dates. First shows sold out fast (mostly).  They figured they could amortize costs and pick up another 25 to 30k in ticket sales.  It makes economic sense.  

And I'm telling you...the WSJ doesn't have a point.  Not suggesting they might not.  Telling you they don't.  They are flat out wrong.  And you can not believe me, but then you have to explain away the LN press release to Fortune giving actual revenue and projected ticket sales information, which would make them one of the top 5 tours of the year.  Go ahead. Have at it.

100 million in revenue when they released the numbers (probably more, now, with walk ups and late ticket sales), 1 million projected tickets sold.

IDK where you're residing, but it's not earth if you think those numbers don't represent a successful tour.

As for the closed upper decks...so what?  So, to you, unless they are sold out every show...it must mean people don't like the set list. Yeah..no.  They're selling 35 to 40k tickets in most of those stadiums, with the upper bowls closed.  That's a successful stadium tour.  Period.

Anyway I don't know why we are discussing this when we were discussing the setlist. I don't know why you brought up my wallet and the winning side crap.

Because, in terms of the setlist, your wallet is the only thing that matters.

1) The band likes the setlist
2) You don't
the only way the band cares about #2 is if enough people feel that way, and it keeps them from going to the shows.

It didn't even keep YOU from going to a show or two. Thus...irrelevant. It's bitching just to have something to bitch about.

And it's not keeping a LARGE number of folks from buying tickets to shows.  We know this by actual attendance figures.

So, at the end of the day, your objections to the set list has exactly ZERO actual value.

It's really sad when a member of the forum says he doesn't like the covers and CD songs. And all he got was insults and bully. You have the right to your opini?n about the setlist and Baconman has every right to say he doesn't like CITR and The Seeker.

Yup, he sure does.

Not liking something does not immediately mean someone should change it to make you happy. Nor does it mean you should make a request for it to be changed, especially in light of everything you have ALREADY gotten, so far, out of this tour.

BUT, having said that, saying they should change the set list just to make you, or Bacon, happy is....well...it's bitching just to bitch.  And proof of my earlier supposition: No matter what, there are some people who are just gonna be unhappy.  They're gonna find something to complain about.  Give them a million bucks, and they'll bitch about the taxes.

And nobody is BULLYING anyone.  How is that you're allowed to express your opinion but others aren't allowed to disagree, and express theirs?

[pilferk]

By 9pm it'll be 85, so as long as you're not pregaming in the lot all afternoon you should be good!

Redds in the afternoon, because AC, food, water, AND libations.

But ye gods, I'm gonna load up on sunscreen so I don't turn into lobster boy that evening!

[Princess Leia]

Baconman was called a troll. Well that's not nice neither true. You have to respect other people's opinion. Instead you call that bitchin. Look if someone says he/she doesn't like Coma I'm not going to agree with that. But that's not bitchin. It's just somebody's opinion. Even more if that person paid for a ticket.

There is no obligation to love every single song the band plays. If someone says "I'd like to hear Pretty Tied Up instead of The Seeker" That's not bitching either. It's someone who likes that song and ovbiously wants to here it play in  live show. i don't see anything wrong with that.

[Factory Girl]

I think this tour is all about making concessions and the whole thing was built to mix a bit of what everyone likes, including the fans.

Axl said he knows Slash would love to play Coma and the fans would love to see them playing Coma, so he's playing Coma. Slash and Duff are not the biggest fans of the ballads, but Axl loves them, so they're playing a bunch of them. There's a chance we'll even get Slither!
I'm actually happy they're now mature enough to be able to do this and I don't think they're suffering by doing so. They seem to be having great fun onstage every night, so no ones needs to worry about their well being either.

Regarding CD, we'll never know if Slash and Duff really likes the songs or they're just doing it because otherwise there would be no reunion tour. Even if they say anything publicly about the songs, we have to take it with a grain of salt. They want to keep everything peaceful, just like Axl is being careful about writing a book and getting into another argument with Slash and Duff.
Maybe Slash loves the songs and had to admit they're great songs; maybe he hates playing them but knows that he could never tell Axl. We will never know, just accept this.

As I said, they're considering fans to make this setlist, but they also must be able to play what they want to. Said that, I do think that adding more CD songs will hurt the public's experience. CD is an album that most people never heard and since this is a stadium tour, with most casual fans, they have to take this into consideration.

I'm happy with anything really, but I have to say that I much rather prefer to see them playing more UYI songs than CD songs. Four songs is too much IMO. And no, I'm not whining, I'm just giving my honest opinion and trying to see it as if I was a casual fan. I'll be at the show regardless.

[pilferk]

Baconman was called a troll. Well that's not nice neither true. You have to respect other people's opinion. Instead you call that bitchin. Look if someone says he/she doesn't like Coma I'm not going to agree with that. But that's not bitchin. It's just somebody's opinion. Even more if that person paid for a ticket.

There is no obligation to love every single song the band plays. If someone says "I'd like to hear Pretty Tied Up instead of The Seeker" That's not bitching either. It's someone who likes that song and ovbiously wants to here it play in  live show. i don't see anything wrong with that.

He was ASKED if he was a troll, and obviously by someone not familiar with his posting history. There is a difference, and not just a semantic one.

Bacon is definitely not a troll.

There is a difference between "I don't like" (which is expressing an opinion) and "They should change" (which is bitching).

One expresses your preference, the other forces that preference on the people making the decision, implies that everyone else should/would/does want that samething, and, actually, questions the decision that was made by the band in constructing their set list.

"I'd really like to hear My Michelle at the show" is an opinion.

"They should swap in My Michelle, and replace Sorry, at the show, because they play too many covers and CD songs already" is bitching.

If you disagree...fine.  But, as you are allowed your opinion on set list content, I'm allowed mine on what is, and isn't, bitching.

This is.

[D-GenerationX]

"I'd really like to hear My Michelle at the show" is an opinion.

"They should swap in My Michelle, and replace Sorry, at the show, because they play too many covers and CD songs already" is bitching.

They are both just opinions, man.

And you are belaboring the shit out of this.

[pilferk]

"I'd really like to hear My Michelle at the show" is an opinion.

"They should swap in My Michelle, and replace Sorry, at the show, because they play too many covers and CD songs already" is bitching.

They are both just opinions, man.

And you are belaboring the shit out of this.

Sorry, they're not D-X. Not really. Not in context of the discussion.

One is an opinion. The other is asking someone to do something to cop to your wishes.

One is an expression of preference. The other is an expression of entitlement, and that YOUR opinion is the only right one.

One is something you feel, the other is something you want someone to do FOR YOU.

One is an expression of desire, the other is a complaint.

And again...an example that, no MATTER WHAT, people will find something to bitch about.

DX, we had this discussion. I told you, at the time, before this reformation was even a glimmer..that if it all ever happened, even if everything being wished for came to be,that someone, somewhere, would find something to complain about.  They'd never be happy. They'd always want something "more".

I hold this up as exhibit A. 

Am I belaboring this? No, we're rounding out a long standing conversation, and making a point.   And yes..I'm totally bitching about the bitching. 100% fucking guilty.  Though, notice I've not told anyone to STOP bitching..but I'm labeling for what it is. 

If you disagree with what constitutes bitching....and I suspect that's because you've been put in the bitching bucket before...again, that's fine.

But just as you (and they) have the right (within whatever parameters jarmo sets) to bitch, I have the right to point out that it's bitching. Fair enough?

[siraddam]

Slash actually makes the CD songs sound like great classic GnR music!

[gunsbetterthanever]

Slash actually makes the CD songs sound like great classic GnR music!

Exactly!

[MrMojoRa]

Setlist breakdown:

AFD:         8
Illusions:   8  (9 if Don't Cry makes encore)
Lies:         1  (if Patience makes encore)
TSI:          1  (Duff)
CD:           4
Covers:     1  (Seeker as of late; Whole Lotta Rosie, Riff Raff, earlier this year)


Chinese songs are perfectly placed to not kill the mood for those not familiar with them. Before anybody has a chance to wonder what Chinese Democracy is, Welcome to the Jungle makes them forget. CD is an all out rocker that Slash has a blast playing. He gets youthful spinning around while jamming to CD. He obviously has a blast rocking out to CD.


This I Love seems to be the only song where people fall off a bit. That song is for us, the lovers of the Chinese songs.


Better should be appreciated by all. What a fuckin masterpiece.


Sorry & Catcher in the Rye are for us. US!!! And for Axl.


Does anybody here have any idea if Slash & Duff enjoy putting their spin on Chinese songs? Anybody?? No. We have no idea. My guess is that Slash takes it upon himself to practice Sorry and then CITR. My guess is that he lets Axl know when he's ready to give it a shot live.


Beggars Can't Be Choosers, Bitchers Gonna Bitch, Whiners Gonna Whine, The Pursuit of UNhappiness, all come to mind when I see Chinese Democracy fans complaining about the number of CD songs in a setlist. It's not killing the show. Their inclusion is a nod for us, a nod for Axl, a bridge between 1995 & 2016 connecting what wasn't supposed to happen......Not In This Lifetime.

Fuck it, I'm making my own:



Seriously, the above post is gold. Well put, and perfectly laid out. I salute you, sir. You are a scholar and a gentleman.

Haha, I HATE Facebook-Like shit, but I'll take it.


Quite the compliment pilferk.


 Thank you   


Edited to Add: And I completely agree with what's been said as of late in this thread, that Slash brings the Classic-GN'R vibe to Chinese Democracy songs.

[tim_m]

Ugh and once again i am reminded why i hate coming here sometimes and reading comments. Same old story bitch, moan, complain. Some people can never just be happy no matter what.

[faldor]

So long as CITR is in place of another CD song swapped out, I don't see the harm.

But 3 CD songs should be the absolute max.  They aren't moving 40,000 to 50,000 tickets to hear a plethora of CD tunes.

Get real.

They're also not selling 40-50k tickets for people to hear "Move to the City", "Breakdown", "Bad Obsession", etc. either. As much as WE would like to hear those songs, the vast majority would use those as bathroom breaks. You know full well what songs they NEED to play, and I use that word loosely because they even alternate two songs that would probably fall into that category in "Don't Cry" and "Patience". They're playing 23-24 songs a night, minus the jams. You're never going to come up with a universally accepted setlist, and I have news for you. A large number of the crowd knows "Right Next Door to Hell" just as well/not so well as "Catcher in the Rye". There's a large segment of the crowd who know the hits and that's it. 50k people per city didn't see them back in 92 or have been waiting for the opportunity since then. That's just not reality.

[faldor]

We know they swap Don't Cry and Patience, right? Both songs are classic, big hits GN'R songs. Now CD and TIL are not. Why are those 2 untouchable when this is a reunion tour? Swap those two. Or swap CD and The Seeker instead of doing it with Patience and Don't Cry. Nobody is asking them to play only AFD songs only. Or maybe instead of The Seekeer, why not play some UYI song that hasn't been played since 92 or 93?

Again nobody is asking for a radical change in the set list. Just shake things up a little making sure that old/classic songs are not on the losing side.

Simple answer: They like it this way.  And they're the ones putting on the show.

You don't. Oh well....

Vote with your wallet, if it's that big a deal to you. Plenty of others will (and have) voted with theirs.  We'll see who "wins". I'm pretty sure it won't be you.

And the classic songs AREN'T suffering (see Ra's breakdown, above). CITR was swapped for Sorry, for example.  And Sorry was added in place of NOTHING. New slot in the setlist.  Nobody here is likewise arguing they should absolutely ADD more than 3 or 4 CD songs (which is where we're at now).  It's all GnR material, and it's represented, IMHO, at the level it should be all things considered. And more importantly, it seems to be represented at the level it should be, all things considered, in the opinion of THE BAND. And, no matter what you and I think, THATS WHAT MATTERS.

The set list is fine, and bitching about it is nitpicking of the highest order.  Again, it's proof that, no matter how good it is, there will always be people who find SOMETHING to complain about it.  I've long detailed this EXACT theoretical scenario: That, even if Slash and Duff rejoined the fray, even if they went on, on time, every night, even if they played amazing shows every night, someone, somewhere, would find something to bitch about. No matter what they do, no matter how thy do it, you just can't please everyone (and they shouldn't try, IMHO). Sometimes, I hate being right.

Exactly, you can't win with some people no matter what you play. I've heard the argument before that they play too many ballads. Maybe that's a reason they alternate "Patience" and "Don't Cry" instead of playing them both. Sure you could substitute one for Sorry/CITR, but again if that's what THEY want to play and they're getting rave reviews and sending fans home happy as pigs in shit, then why change a thing?

[bjd2944]

They've been playing all the "staples." That's the thing about a concert - you're not GUARANTEED anything. If they want to play the entire Chinese record, there is nothing saying they can't. I think at this point you pretty much know what you're getting. A pretty solid set with everything you want to hear, a few covers and a few rotating CD songs.

I like enough of the catalog expanding old band, new band, rarities, covers, Velvet Revolver, Snakepit, Loaded, etc... where they can pretty much do anything and I'll be a happy camper.

I personally view Chinese Democracy, Better and This I Love as three of the weaker CD songs, but if that's what they want to play - so be it. Seems to be a good "get your money's worth" show.

[faldor]

Baconman was called a troll. Well that's not nice neither true. You have to respect other people's opinion. Instead you call that bitchin. Look if someone says he/she doesn't like Coma I'm not going to agree with that. But that's not bitchin. It's just somebody's opinion. Even more if that person paid for a ticket.

There is no obligation to love every single song the band plays. If someone says "I'd like to hear Pretty Tied Up instead of The Seeker" That's not bitching either. It's someone who likes that song and ovbiously wants to here it play in  live show. i don't see anything wrong with that.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion, obviously. But you have to admit, there are certain songs you'd love to hear that others could care less about. It doesn't make one person right or wrong. Izzy and Adler aren't and never were meant to be major players for this tour. The lineup is what it is. They're playing for 2:40 or so a night. They're alternating some songs, maybe they'll continue to add. I'll guarantee you though, people are always going to prefer to hear other songs. I'd venture to guess that this tour is making money hand over fist. You have to work real hard to make it seem like a failure, or even falling below expectations. The sheer fact that they added 2nd dates for a number of cities proves that they've exceeded expectations. I'm not sure you can argue against that.

[Voodoochild]

4 songs isnt a "plethora". Really. And ever thought that the band thinks its actually a good idea to expose those 50k people to these songs now?

They have had 15 years now.

Are you honestly suggesting they were unaware of them?  Or had not heard them?

8 of 10 people at my show were in some sort of GNR garb.  Care to guess how many CD era shirts I saw?

I'll just disregard the argument about shirts, this is nothing, really. And its not 15 years, but anwyays, not important either.

No, I'm not suggesting they were unaware. I am suggesting they might want people to be exposed to the songs. Maybe they even like it after hearing it live with Slash.

Why? Because people didnt even give the album a fair chance because of who were not in the band. Also, there were tons of casual fans who only knew SCOM, WTTJ and Paradise. Those are being exposed to deeper cuts like Coma and DTJ too. And Im not suggesting they were not aware of the Illusions 25 years ago.

[Bazfreak]

I really hope they keep CITR for the south american shows...its my favorite CD song and one of the best GNR songs to date IMO...brings me back some good memories too, this song means a lot to me!

[TheBaconman]

I love this place sometimes.  

You do not have to like every song and you can still be a huge fan of a bad

I think CITR sucks.  I think a lot of songs on the CD album are bad.  I also think a few are great and one is in my top GNR songs

I couldn't care less if the band plays any CD songs.  I consider them all guns songs.    Good or bad.  Still guns

What I would love to see though is a show with less covers in it and if they are going to include CD songs while not attempting other classic songs.   Please scrap covers and play more guns songs

No matter how long a band plays a cover song for doesn't make it there's.   I hate live and let die.   I really hate knocking on heavens door.   These are not guns songs  and I think it's bad that the band has been playing them so long lots of fans consider them guns songs.    In 10 years are people going to say the same about The Seeker ?

If you have a time limit on a show.  Play as many guns songs as you can.  Just scrap the covers

If you have a no time limit show.   Play what ever the hell you want

Not every post has to be a possitive one.  Not ever my post has to be a damn they sounded great tonight.  Damn I love this and that.  

I think Guns is doing great.  they all seem happy.  

I am also a fan of the greatest baseball team I. The history of the world

Now even though I have such an over top pvr for the GREAT Toronto Blue Jays.   You can still be critical of the team at times

I do love the.  

Just accept the band and everything that's going on now!

And

You can't dislike anything guns n roses   Your not a fan comments.  Haha. They are priceless

My ticket is still booked.  I am still going.   Just like past shows I have seen play. Durring heavens door. I will just go buy some more beer.   Keep on repeating those lyrics.   Ugh.  It's like that kiss song rock in roll all night and party every day.   One verse repeated over and over and over and over again.  

But that's just my opinion.  

Keep the covers coming!