Anyone else hope Steven ISN'T involved?

[D-GenerationX]

If you told me 5 years ago that there would be a Axl-Slash-Duff reunion and that some people obviously blinded to reality by sentimental nostalgia were whining about Adler being involved, I wouldn't believe it! 

I have to agree.  I'm astounded by this.

I knew Steven had his fanboys, but he's gotta be thrilled with the doggedness of his defenders here.  Stronger than I could have ever imagined.

[TheBaconman]

If you told me 5 years ago that there would be a Axl-Slash-Duff reunion and that some people obviously blinded to reality by sentimental nostalgia were whining about Adler being involved, I wouldn't believe it! 

I have to agree.  I'm astounded by this.

I knew Steven had his fanboys, but he's gotta be thrilled with the doggedness of his defenders here.  Stronger than I could have ever imagined.

The dorks are greedy. 

We have axl slash and duff.   I would of been happy happy with just axl playing big shows again. Let alone with two all time greats. 

Some people always just want more.   We're is Steven.   Where is Izzy!    Well I am sure they will all be involved when there names are needed to sell more tickets

[D-GenerationX]

We have axl slash and duff.   I would of been happy happy with just axl playing big shows again. Let alone with two all time greats. 

Pretty much.

This is an incredible turn of events.  One I have trouble feeling is incomplete or deficient in some way.

This is excellent.

[Spirit]

Digged up some Axl quotes from an interview with the LA Times in 2012. Maybe this is what applies with the "regrouping"?


The quotes:

"Really, you can get guys from the 'Illusion' thing, but the only thing that would make it would be Duff and Slash, really," Axl said. "It's nothing against Izzy and it's nothing against Steven, or anything like that. Steven may want it, but these guys I'm working with right now, they work really hard and it's hard work. I've toured with the other guys and I've also seen what they've done since, and I just know the difficulties."

"I don't have an excitement to work with people that joined in the 'Illusion' time," he said. "There's behind the scenes that was really, really difficult there with different ones. So it's not really even a full reunion."

[HBK]

Digged up some Axl quotes from an interview with the LA Times in 2012. Maybe this is what applies with the "regrouping"?


The quotes:

"Really, you can get guys from the 'Illusion' thing, but the only thing that would make it would be Duff and Slash, really," Axl said. "It's nothing against Izzy and it's nothing against Steven, or anything like that. Steven may want it, but these guys I'm working with right now, they work really hard and it's hard work. I've toured with the other guys and I've also seen what they've done since, and I just know the difficulties."

"I don't have an excitement to work with people that joined in the 'Illusion' time," he said. "There's behind the scenes that was really, really difficult there with different ones. So it's not really even a full reunion."

Good Remember... I Believe Steven Some Songs

[LongGoneDay]

I don't see any irrational Adler-hate- what I see is people realistically evaluating his contributions, his liabilities, his track record and his capabilities.

If you told me 5 years ago that there would be a Axl-Slash-Duff reunion and that some people obviously blinded to reality by sentimental nostalgia were whining about Adler being involved, I wouldn't believe it! 

I have to agree.  I'm astounded by this.

I knew Steven had his fanboys, but he's gotta be thrilled with the doggedness of his defenders here.  Stronger than I could have ever imagined.

If you think that you are realistically evaluating Steven?s contributions and capabilities, I?d offer that you may be doing it wrong.
We weren?t in the room when the classic lineup essentially crafted AFD-UYI.
So we really only have the music, and the words of the people in that room to go on.

I don?t feel like digging them all up, but there is plenty out there like the following:

"His sense of swing was the push and pull that give the songs their feel. When that was gone, it was just... unbelievable, weird. Nothing worked. I would have preferred to continue with Steve, but we'd had two years off and we couldn't wait any longer.?

I?m sure everyone has read them before anyway, and has either forgotten, or chosen to ignore them for whatever reason.

There is plenty of evidence suggesting that Steven is more than capable of performing at a high level.
Are there also videos of off nights? I?m sure there are. Just as there are plenty of Axl, Slash, Duff.

It has nothing to do with being a ?fanboy? of Steven, or a ?fanboy? of Izzy or any individual.
It?s understanding that Guns N? Roses, at it?s creative peak consisted of those 5 guys at it?s core, and later saw contributions from Matt and Dizzy.

Will it be great to see Axl, Slash and Duff up on stage again?
Of course. I bought my tickets with only those three confirmed.

Could it be even better, by including Izzy, Steven, Matt? Fuck yes it could.
And if they aren?t involved, it would be interesting to know why.

[Thorned Rose]

We have axl slash and duff.   I would of been happy happy with just axl playing big shows again. Let alone with two all time greats. 

Pretty much.

This is an incredible turn of events.  One I have trouble feeling is incomplete or deficient in some way.

This is excellent.

Well that is just the thing isn't it? He couldn't play big shows in the USA with just his group of hired muscians that changes every 3-5 years. lol

Now he can, because like it or not Slash and Duff are Guns N' Roses too. Always will be.

[D-GenerationX]

No argument here.

[JAEBALL]

Steven is playing with Slash this week at a small benefit/ fundraiser.

For his sake... he better not slip up with comments about GNR.

[D-GenerationX]

Steven is playing with Slash this week at a small benefit/ fundraiser.

For his sake... he better not slip up with comments about GNR.

Perhaps this is the last test.

[Spirit]

For his sake... he better not slip up with comments about GNR.

Publicly you mean?


It's an interesting situation. Would Slash bring himself to play together with Steven now, if he was blocked from performing with GN'R?

[GypsySoul]

It's an interesting situation. Would Slash bring himself to play together with Steven now, if he was blocked from performing with GN'R?

I think if this is something that Slash had previously committed to doing that he wouldn't back out just because Steven will be there too.

[Spirit]

It's an interesting situation. Would Slash bring himself to play together with Steven now, if he was blocked from performing with GN'R?

I think if this is something that Slash had previously committed to doing that he wouldn't back out just because Steven will be there too.

Steven was added more recently.

A previous poster didn't have Steven's name on it. If Slash had felt uncomfortable, he could have objected to it I think.

It's a benefit though, so he might have thought it would be inappropriate to create any fuzz.

[GypsySoul]

Steven was added more recently.

A previous poster didn't have Steven's name on it. If Slash had felt uncomfortable, he could have objected to it I think.

It's a benefit though, so he might have thought it would be inappropriate to create any fuzz.

Maybe Steven is stalking Slash. 

What/who is the benefit show for?

[Spirit]

[GypsySoul]

Wow.  Thanks.

Sounds like a very worthy cause for anyone to participate in.

Kudos to all involved. 

[EmilyGNR]

I don't see any irrational Adler-hate- what I see is people realistically evaluating his contributions, his liabilities, his track record and his capabilities.

If you told me 5 years ago that there would be a Axl-Slash-Duff reunion and that some people obviously blinded to reality by sentimental nostalgia were whining about Adler being involved, I wouldn't believe it! 

I have to agree.  I'm astounded by this.

I knew Steven had his fanboys, but he's gotta be thrilled with the doggedness of his defenders here.  Stronger than I could have ever imagined.

If you think that you are realistically evaluating Steven?s contributions and capabilities, I?d offer that you may be doing it wrong.
We weren?t in the room when the classic lineup essentially crafted AFD-UYI.
So we really only have the music, and the words of the people in that room to go on.

I don?t feel like digging them all up, but there is plenty out there like the following:

"His sense of swing was the push and pull that give the songs their feel. When that was gone, it was just... unbelievable, weird. Nothing worked. I would have preferred to continue with Steve, but we'd had two years off and we couldn't wait any longer.?

I?m sure everyone has read them before anyway, and has either forgotten, or chosen to ignore them for whatever reason.

There is plenty of evidence suggesting that Steven is more than capable of performing at a high level.
Are there also videos of off nights? I?m sure there are. Just as there are plenty of Axl, Slash, Duff.

It has nothing to do with being a ?fanboy? of Steven, or a ?fanboy? of Izzy or any individual.
It?s understanding that Guns N? Roses, at it?s creative peak consisted of those 5 guys at it?s core, and later saw contributions from Matt and Dizzy.

Will it be great to see Axl, Slash and Duff up on stage again?
Of course. I bought my tickets with only those three confirmed.

Could it be even better, by including Izzy, Steven, Matt? Fuck yes it could.
And if they aren?t involved, it would be interesting to know why.

For every positive pro-Adler  reason and quote you can come up with there are equally an abundance of relevant negatives-  such as:

As I feared, [Steven] had become the odd man out. At rehearsals, Duff and I had the tedious job of dealing with him. While Axl was aware of the situation, he wasn't obligated to watch over Steven 24/7 like we were. (...) Steven was becoming a heavier burden every day [Bozza, Anthony, & Slash (2007). Slash. Harper Entertainment: New York. p. 300]

Steven was fully strung out and babbling incoherently much of the time [Duff's autobiography, "It's So Easy", 2011, p. 151]

When we started rehearsing the material [for Use Your Illusion] that's when Steven's house of cards came crashing down. He was utterly useless when put to the test: most of the time he'd fade away from the proper time signature somewhere in the middle of the song or just forget where he was altogether. He was just incapable of locking in with Duff or me like he used to do. It was pretty dire; something had to be done (...). That's not to say we weren't really patient with Steven. We tried everything we could think of, though we probably should've taken further action...though I'm not sure what that could have been. We'd gone so far as to bring in people like Bob Timmons, the rehab specialist who had helped clean up M?tley Crue, and others who were experienced in dealing with extreme cases. Their efforts were futile [Bozza, Anthony, & Slash (2007). Slash. Harper Entertainment: New York. p. 301]

We were saying to him, 'Steven, you're fucked up.' We said: 'Me and Slash, we're fucked up, but you're really fucked up'. I remember saying to him: 'If me and Slash think you're fucked up, think about who's saying that...[Classic Rock Duff McKagan Interview, Classic Rock October 2002]

Steven didn't leave. Steven was fired. We gave him every ultimatum, we tried working with other drummers, we had Steven sign a contract saying that if he went back to drugs he was out. He couldn't leave his drugs...and other things had happened involved with Steven that Steven is basically someone I used to know. It makes me feel bad, but there's other things beside the band that he was involved in with his drugs that's been very dangerous and scary and I want nothing to do with him- Axl  [Famous Last Words, MTV, 1990]


Steven just kept on lying. He kept saying he'd given up. I'd already been around to his dealer's house and threatened to kill him if he sold Steven any more drugs. And one night I went round to Steven's house and pressed the redial button on his phone. And guess where it went? And that was that- Duff [Classic Rock, May 2006]


Izzy-
I even had lunch with Steven last week. He is clean, today, but he is affected physically and mentally[Hard Rock Interview, June 2001]

Dizzy-
Paraphrased: Wow... what to say about this guy... I just recently played with Steven with the Starfuckers... actually it was both him and C.C. Deville of Poison. It was like this really hyped up concert because here's two big names playing with us... and let me tell you... at the concert... you could hear a pin drop. C.C. DeVille was terrible.. the guy can't play for the life of him... and Steven... he can't even hold a beat anymore let alone play drums. We'd look bad and the guy was literally smoking crack while on stage during the songs. It was possibly the worst concert of my life... I mean... there's only so many times that a guy can die from an overdose and come back alive...[Madagascar88, January 2006]

With 'Appetite,' for me the parts, playing, etc., timing flaws, whatever, are perfect, and as a moment in time for me, the whole record is. That said, the sound of the drums, which at the time in our niche of the woods was a bit of a bold statement and a somewhat successful effort to change things from the current flow at the time, and so may have been necessary but for me sound the most dated of anything there sound-wise (...) The public has no idea what went into Steven's parts and the notion of getting through songs in rehearsal if ever, with no exaggeration, was unfortunately a nightmare that neither I or Izzy could take, and eventually the others as well, though they lasted longer for other reasons [Axl interview by Del James, spinner.com, 2009]

[Bridge]

I have to agree.  I'm astounded by this.

I knew Steven had his fanboys, but he's gotta be thrilled with the doggedness of his defenders here.  Stronger than I could have ever imagined.

For me, it's exactly the opposite.  Guns N Roses was established and defined by five guys playing rock n roll music that reflected their genuine living-on-the-edge lifestyle.  Regardless of how long any given member stayed in the band, I look at the original five as an unit -- separable by life bullshit but inseparably linked based on what they created and accomplished together, and what they gave the fans as a unit together.

For anyone out there -- let alone those on a Guns N Roses fansite -- to discredit, insult, or hurl outright hatred towards any of those five guys is truly astounding to me.  Steven (like the other four guys) made mistakes and isn't a saint, but the hatred towards him -- on a Guns N Roses fansite, no less -- is staggering to me.

For every positive pro-Adler  reason and quote you can come up with there are equally an abundance of relevant negatives-  such as:

True indeed.  But all of those are related to his drug usage.  A clean Steven would be much different than the Steven described in those quotes.

I personally have never denied that Steven would need to be fully clean for any kind of GNR reunion.  But if he is, there is no reason why the band (who knows him better than we do) and Steven couldn't reconcile and include him in any upcoming shows.  It's been pointed out several times that he sounded incredibly tight musically with Slash and Duff at the Hall of Fame performance.

[EmilyGNR]

I have to agree.  I'm astounded by this.

I knew Steven had his fanboys, but he's gotta be thrilled with the doggedness of his defenders here.  Stronger than I could have ever imagined.

For me, it's exactly the opposite.  Guns N Roses was established and defined by five guys playing rock n roll music that reflected their genuine living-on-the-edge lifestyle.  Regardless of how long any given member stayed in the band, I look at the original five as an unit -- separable by life bullshit but inseparably linked based on what they created and accomplished together, and what they gave the fans as a unit together.

For anyone out there -- let alone those on a Guns N Roses fansite -- to discredit, insult, or hurl outright hatred towards any of those five guys is truly astounding to me.  Steven (like the other four guys) made mistakes and isn't a saint, but the hatred towards him -- on a Guns N Roses fansite, no less -- is staggering to me.

For every positive pro-Adler  reason and quote you can come up with there are equally an abundance of relevant negatives-  such as:

True indeed.  But all of those are related to his drug usage.  A clean Steven would be much different than the Steven described in those quotes.

I personally have never denied that Steven would need to be fully clean for any kind of GNR reunion.  But if he is, there is no reason why the band (who knows him better than we do) and Steven couldn't reconcile and include him in any upcoming shows.  It's been pointed out several times that he sounded incredibly tight musically with Slash and Duff at the Hall of Fame performance.

No, I don't agree that is is only his various addictions and drug use- he seems not to have a filter in interviews and is easily led and manipulated into saying the most regrettable and unfortunate statements, he has blatantly lied about his state of sobriety in the past- how many times since he was fired has he been "six months sober"?, it is as much what he says as it is his chemical problems and I honestly wonder if he hasn't permanently damaged his brain with the various drugs and overdoses.

I don't think he did an exemplary job at the RRHOF, he seemed to be out of the pocket completely at times and relying on Duff to maintain his timing.

 That said, it would be a noble gesture of GNR to give him a guest spot or two- do I think he is capable or reliable enough to handle it full time without incidents? No.

Do I think he will be offered a full time slot? Thankfully No.

[Thorned Rose]

Steven was added more recently.

A previous poster didn't have Steven's name on it. If Slash had felt uncomfortable, he could have objected to it I think.

It's a benefit though, so he might have thought it would be inappropriate to create any fuzz.

Maybe Steven is stalking Slash. 

What/who is the benefit show for?

Or maybe since he got him into playing guitar and maybe since they used to be close friends... maybe they are just jamming for this thing?

Oh.. I forgot, you're an Adler basher. Opps.

My bad.