Slash & Fortus

[bigcash2002]

Anyone knows when and under what circumstances Gilby left the band?

I don't think Gilby left the band. My impression is he was offered a contract, he satisfied it, was paid, and it wasn't renewed.

[damnthehaters]

I'm with you Cherry Garcia.

I don't even know how this thing got hijacked like this. It's a shame.

We all love Guns N' Roses, but it is pretty clear that some people aren't that excited about the old band reuniting and are wanting elements of post 1998 Gn'R to be included with this via music, and style.

If I could pick my way... I'd have the Original lineup back (Axl/Izzy/Slash/Duff/Adler) with Dizzy Reed (fuck chris pittman) and then have fortus/Ferrer on standby in case something stupid happens.

That probably won't happen and I"m very cool with Fortus and Ferrer being in, if that is what comes true.

Guns N' Roses has existed in 2 different entities. 85-98 and then everything after 98.

Slash was out in 96, Matt in 97 and then Duff in 98.

For a brief time in 1998 all you had was Axl Rose, Paul Tobias, and Dizzy Reed lmao....

Tommy Stinson to me is almost as important as Duff based on his long tenure in Gn'R, but with just 1 album its hard to make it equal. Other than Axl obviously... no one else in New Guns n' Roses is even close. Well maybe Fortus. That's it.

I'm excited for this.  But when I go to a show, I would love to hear some Chinese.  Why, because it's GNR and I like some of it.  I'm not saying they will play 10 Chinese sings for crying out loud, but maybe 3-4.  Your telling us that we won't hear any Chinese and to deal with it.  Really?  Deal with it?  It's your opinion that they won't play Chinese, not a fact.  And you show no respect for some talented and creative people in GNR after your boys left, by saying you don't give a $&!?.  I don't care if it's 1 album or 10 albums...it's still in GNR's catalogue and good.  Why would Axl just shit on it?

[CherryGarcia]

Anyone knows when and under what circumstances Gilby left the band?

Around June 1994 unofficially, and was out by the fall of 1994 definitely.
Circumstances were he had gotten into a fight with Slash, and then got into an argument with Axl, then aired GN'R's dirty laundry to the public in May 1994, and then Axl called him up saying he wanted to take the band in a different direction, but didn't tell Gilby he was fired. Gilby was never officially fired nor did he officially quit. The band went ahead and recorded Sympathy in the fall of 1994 without bothering to tell him. He launched a lawsuit against the band in 1996.

[HBK]

I'm with you Cherry Garcia.

I don't even know how this thing got hijacked like this. It's a shame.

We all love Guns N' Roses, but it is pretty clear that some people aren't that excited about the old band reuniting and are wanting elements of post 1998 Gn'R to be included with this via music, and style.

If I could pick my way... I'd have the Original lineup back (Axl/Izzy/Slash/Duff/Adler) with Dizzy Reed (fuck chris pittman) and then have fortus/Ferrer on standby in case something stupid happens.

That probably won't happen and I"m very cool with Fortus and Ferrer being in, if that is what comes true.

Guns N' Roses has existed in 2 different entities. 85-98 and then everything after 98.

Slash was out in 96, Matt in 97 and then Duff in 98.

For a brief time in 1998 all you had was Axl Rose, Paul Tobias, and Dizzy Reed lmao....

Tommy Stinson to me is almost as important as Duff based on his long tenure in Gn'R, but with just 1 album its hard to make it equal. Other than Axl obviously... no one else in New Guns n' Roses is even close. Well maybe Fortus. That's it.

Why You Insults Members Of GNR ? Who's You ?

[EmilyGNR]

maybe, but GNR still lacks a solo guitar virtuoso, so we can possibly say goodbye to ChiDem songs in their full shape.

Slash could easily play all those solos.

 

Shacklers?  That is NOT his style.

and don't get me wrong.....I love Slash, but different player play different things

Whos gives a damn? I DON'T want to hear Shackler's Revenge on this tour/Coachella

omg who gives a fuck

I do give, and you can find lot's of other GNR fans that do give too.

You need to understand that ChiDem is a GNR album just as AFD is. And that it's as good as any other GNR album. Time to act like a grown up and accept it.

I really like CD... so who are you trying to kid? I just don't want to hear Shackley's Revenge man. Who gives a fuck about that?

I'm cool with like 4 CD songs. Lets be honest here though... Gn'R is 85-95 in reality. It always will be.

Ouch. 

Wrong.

You may not like other lineups but that does not mean the band only existed in the years you mentioned.

No I like the other lineups. Aside from the lead guiar issues the bassists/rhythm sections were the same. Axl/Fortus/Stinson was a mainstay from like 2001 onward. Drummers changed like what once in 06? I'm cool with other people being in the band and them playing CD songs.

I just don't want a setlist with 10 CD songs. I mean it isn't what I would want to hear. And like it or not, Gn'R is what the older guys brought. That is what it is. that 10 yearish period from 85 to 95 or so. The whole 1 album in 16 years Gn'R (yes I'm being nice 98-14) doesn't cut it for me. That isn't a "band".

Aside from Axl/Fortus/Stinson and maybe Ferrer the rest can get bent and have no bearing on the Gn'R legacy to me.

What a stupid statement, of course it was a band- look up the definition if you have any doubts. 

Also- you don't get to decide what comprises GNR, or what GNR is and isnt- that is misplaced entitlement nonsense. You can like it, and support it- or you can choose not to- but you don't get to decide what GNR is- look up legacy definition while you're at it.

Who wrote all the lyrics, melodies and determined, in every sense (musically and from a business perspective) what was to be? Who told the band what to play, and how to play it? Who determined what take would be the one that was used? Who determined if, when and where the band would take the stage?

Compare this to another group also named Guns N' Roses where the writing of lyrics and melodies as well as strategic direction and business decisions were shared and not simply made unilaterally.

Derp!

Has nothing to do with that poster I was responding to saying it wasn't a band.

Of course it is/was a band- that is not up for debate.

YOU don't get to decide what is and isn't GNR either, despite all your little list of descriptions.

It is and was GNR whether you like it or not

What separates a band, in the common sense of the word, from a solo project to you?
Is Nine Inch Nails a band?

Nice attempt to deflect-.

GNR is/was  GNR whether they meet your little specifications or not.

Do not care about NIN.

You're the one deflecting. What's the difference between a solo project, and a band to you?
GN'R from 1997-2014 was GN'R....in a legal sense. In a business and artistic sense, it was a solo project.
I mean, if Axl sold the rights to the name Guns N' Roses to another artist, and they made records totally unaffiliated with Axl (or any past or current member) under the Guns N' Roses name...It'd be 100% Guns N' Roses in your book?

No- GNR was a band, and IS a band, has ALWAYS been a band regardless of your little personal stipulations.

IF frogs had wings they wouldn't bump their asses when they hopped- we aren't dealing with IFs here.

[EmilyGNR]

This is unreal... way too many liberal thinking people out there.

Guns N' Roses is clear a band now and it always has been.

When you release 1 album in a period of 10 years as a band it doesn't go in the same level as actual Guns N' Roses. You have to admit this.

Guns N' Roses produced 4 studio albums (AFD, UYI 1 and 2, TSI?) in a period of 7 years or so. I'm not counting Lies... as it is hardly a LP.

When you look at it from a point of credibility... Nu GN'R seems very unofficial to me. Mostly because of the constant lead guitarist changes over the years. Plus it took 2 leads to make 1 Slash.

I do like the newer Guns N' Roses. I saw them live and they were just fantastic. I think too many people here just want Chinese Democracy II... and that isn't going to happen now.

Deal with it.

I don't think you have a good grasp on actual facts- you are very mistaken in your assumptions. 

[EmilyGNR]

You need to understand that ChiDem is a GNR album just as AFD is. And that it's as good as any other GNR album. Time to act like a grown up and accept it.

YOU are now officially crazy ... 

Chinese songs will be played just like Illusion or Spaghetti songs will be played. Illusion and Spaghetti lineup was different than Apppetite.  It's ALL GNR.

Very poor logic there. AFD to UYI simply changed the drummer and added a keyboardist. (Izzy was on the album and its conception, just left into the tour). The Spaghetti album is a little different but its just Gilby on guitar and not izzy. So even then it still was Axl/Slash/Duff/Sorum/Clarke/Reed which is pretty close to the original.

And you're acting like the 98+ lineups of Axl/Fortus/Stinson/Buckethead/Ashba/Reed/Mantia/Ferrer/Finck/Bumblefoot/Tobias      is just the same?

Check yourself. lmao

You don't have to name all the lineups for me bro.  and weather you like it or not, Chinese songs may very well be played, because Chinese is GNR.  By your logic, "pretty close" is ok....but once Slash and Duff left...than its not ok.  Get real

Seems to be a lot of these people springing up that think they get to decide what GNR is and isn't, depending on what they like

Yep.  Now that Slash and Duff are back, they think they know all the answers and how things are.  What they don't understand is that their opinion isn't the truth. 

All these bandwagon fans popping up and thinking they know it all are laughable (and annoying) 

[EmilyGNR]

maybe, but GNR still lacks a solo guitar virtuoso, so we can possibly say goodbye to ChiDem songs in their full shape.

Slash could easily play all those solos.

 

Shacklers?  That is NOT his style.

and don't get me wrong.....I love Slash, but different player play different things

Whos gives a damn? I DON'T want to hear Shackler's Revenge on this tour/Coachella

omg who gives a fuck

I do give, and you can find lot's of other GNR fans that do give too.

You need to understand that ChiDem is a GNR album just as AFD is. And that it's as good as any other GNR album. Time to act like a grown up and accept it.

I really like CD... so who are you trying to kid? I just don't want to hear Shackley's Revenge man. Who gives a fuck about that?

I'm cool with like 4 CD songs. Lets be honest here though... Gn'R is 85-95 in reality. It always will be.

Ouch. 

Wrong.

You may not like other lineups but that does not mean the band only existed in the years you mentioned.

No I like the other lineups. Aside from the lead guiar issues the bassists/rhythm sections were the same. Axl/Fortus/Stinson was a mainstay from like 2001 onward. Drummers changed like what once in 06? I'm cool with other people being in the band and them playing CD songs.

I just don't want a setlist with 10 CD songs. I mean it isn't what I would want to hear. And like it or not, Gn'R is what the older guys brought. That is what it is. that 10 yearish period from 85 to 95 or so. The whole 1 album in 16 years Gn'R (yes I'm being nice 98-14) doesn't cut it for me. That isn't a "band".

Aside from Axl/Fortus/Stinson and maybe Ferrer the rest can get bent and have no bearing on the Gn'R legacy to me.

What a stupid statement, of course it was a band- look up the definition if you have any doubts. 

Also- you don't get to decide what comprises GNR, or what GNR is and isnt- that is misplaced entitlement nonsense. You can like it, and support it- or you can choose not to- but you don't get to decide what GNR is- look up legacy definition while you're at it.

Who wrote all the lyrics, melodies and determined, in every sense (musically and from a business perspective) what was to be? Who told the band what to play, and how to play it? Who determined what take would be the one that was used? Who determined if, when and where the band would take the stage?

Compare this to another group also named Guns N' Roses where the writing of lyrics and melodies as well as strategic direction and business decisions were shared and not simply made unilaterally.

Derp!

Has nothing to do with that poster I was responding to saying it wasn't a band.

Of course it is/was a band- that is not up for debate.

YOU don't get to decide what is and isn't GNR either, despite all your little list of descriptions.

It is and was GNR whether you like it or not

What separates a band, in the common sense of the word, from a solo project to you?
Is Nine Inch Nails a band?

Nice attempt to deflect-.

GNR is/was  GNR whether they meet your little specifications or not.

Do not care about NIN.

You're the one deflecting. What's the difference between a solo project, and a band to you?
GN'R from 1997-2014 was GN'R....in a legal sense. In a business and artistic sense, it was a solo project.
I mean, if Axl sold the rights to the name Guns N' Roses to another artist, and they made records totally unaffiliated with Axl (or any past or current member) under the Guns N' Roses name...It'd be 100% Guns N' Roses in your book?

From 1987 To 1996 Also

 

And the legal entity and partnership which existed from 1985 to 1996 was a different legal entity than what existed after 1996. Even from a legal perspective, GN'R prior to 1996 and GN'R after 1996 were two different 'groups':

"This will serve as notice [that] effective Decemeber 30th 1995, I will withdraw from the partnership. I intend to use the name 'Guns N' Roses' in connection with a new group which I will form." - Axl's letter to Slash and Duff, 8/31/1995.

How do the band's legal issues affect your enjoyment of the music?

Some people need to stop thinking they know it all and just settle down and be fans (if they are fans at all).

[EmilyGNR]

I'm with you Cherry Garcia.

I don't even know how this thing got hijacked like this. It's a shame.

We all love Guns N' Roses, but it is pretty clear that some people aren't that excited about the old band reuniting and are wanting elements of post 1998 Gn'R to be included with this via music, and style.

If I could pick my way... I'd have the Original lineup back (Axl/Izzy/Slash/Duff/Adler) with Dizzy Reed (fuck chris pittman) and then have fortus/Ferrer on standby in case something stupid happens.

That probably won't happen and I"m very cool with Fortus and Ferrer being in, if that is what comes true.

Guns N' Roses has existed in 2 different entities. 85-98 and then everything after 98.

Slash was out in 96, Matt in 97 and then Duff in 98.

For a brief time in 1998 all you had was Axl Rose, Paul Tobias, and Dizzy Reed lmao....

Tommy Stinson to me is almost as important as Duff based on his long tenure in Gn'R, but with just 1 album its hard to make it equal. Other than Axl obviously... no one else in New Guns n' Roses is even close. Well maybe Fortus. That's it.

Why are you insulting Chris Pitman? How old are you? 

[Voodoochild]

I'm with you Cherry Garcia.

I don't even know how this thing got hijacked like this. It's a shame.

We all love Guns N' Roses, but it is pretty clear that some people aren't that excited about the old band reuniting and are wanting elements of post 1998 Gn'R to be included with this via music, and style.

If I could pick my way... I'd have the Original lineup back (Axl/Izzy/Slash/Duff/Adler) with Dizzy Reed (fuck chris pittman) and then have fortus/Ferrer on standby in case something stupid happens.

That probably won't happen and I"m very cool with Fortus and Ferrer being in, if that is what comes true.

Guns N' Roses has existed in 2 different entities. 85-98 and then everything after 98.

Slash was out in 96, Matt in 97 and then Duff in 98.

For a brief time in 1998 all you had was Axl Rose, Paul Tobias, and Dizzy Reed lmao....

Tommy Stinson to me is almost as important as Duff based on his long tenure in Gn'R, but with just 1 album its hard to make it equal. Other than Axl obviously... no one else in New Guns n' Roses is even close. Well maybe Fortus. That's it.

I'm excited for this.  But when I go to a show, I would love to hear some Chinese.  Why, because it's GNR and I like some of it.  I'm not saying they will play 10 Chinese sings for crying out loud, but maybe 3-4.  Your telling us that we won't hear any Chinese and to deal with it.  Really?  Deal with it?  It's your opinion that they won't play Chinese, not a fact.  And you show no respect for some talented and creative people in GNR after your boys left, by saying you don't give a $&!?.  I don't care if it's 1 album or 10 albums...it's still in GNR's catalogue and good.  Why would Axl just shit on it?

I agree 100%. I don't think people are asking for more than 3 or 4 CD songs either, despite what Thorned Rose have been saying in some other thread.

Also, the "one album in X years" doesn't make sense at all. Like it or not, the band was active after 2000, with some quiet (long) periods in between, but still an entity. And they RELEASED one record, doesn't mean they stopped working on studio or whatever. 

Anyways, I think people are genuinely excited to see Slash and Duff back in the band. I really don't think there are people complaining about them that much, or wanting the CD era band back so much... It's just that fans - and I mean real fans, not fairweather fans who jump the wagon whenever they want to go to a concert and who don't even know who Izzy is - care about Chinese Democracy because it is a GNR album, like it or not. We just don't want to see it neglected just because Slash and Duff are back - on the opposite, we would love to see them playing it and put their own personal style on it. I can't see how is this a bad thing.

[Thorned Rose]

A bunch of post 98 NU Gn'R purists lol 

[EmilyGNR]

A bunch of post 98 NU Gn'R purists lol 

No- have always been a GNR supporter and support all lineups.

You clearly don't know what you are talking about 99℅ of the time, and there is no such band as NUGNR..it is Guns N' Roses.

[jarmo]

Just a friendly reminder to those who use the quote button to reply.

There really is little need to quote a number of posts if you're only responding to the last sentence of the latest one.
You can always use this button if editing the quotes is too difficult:

Thank you.




/jarmo

[D-GenerationX]

You clearly don't know what you are talking about 99℅ of the time, and there is no such band as NUGNR..it is Guns N' Roses.

How long you been preaching this?  Feel it's landing, do ya?  See a lot of progress on that front?

Its a semantic term.  You don't like it...oh well.  You have about as much chance of eradicating it as you do blocking out the sun.

Accept that people are going to use it and learn to live with it.

[EmilyGNR]

You clearly don't know what you are talking about 99℅ of the time, and there is no such band as NUGNR..it is Guns N' Roses.

How long you been preaching this?  Feel it's landing, do ya?  See a lot of progress on that front?

Its a semantic term.  You don't like it...oh well.  You have about as much chance of eradicating it as you do blocking out the sun.

Accept that people are going to use it and learn to live with it.

I don't stand much chance in eradicating blatant stupidity, ignorance and endless complaining either, but that doesn't mean I'll turn a blind eye to it.

There is no such thing as NUGNR.

[D-GenerationX]

Seems a strange hill to die on.  It's that big a deal?

Whenever that term comes up in any thread, you are there like someone just flashed the fucking bat signal, but I've not seen one shred of evidence you have shown anyone the supposed error of their ways.

Doesn't Axl himself call them "new Guns" in those chats?

[Sosso]

Seems a strange hill to die on.  It's that big a deal?

Whenever that term comes up in any thread, you are there like someone just flashed the fucking bat signal, but I've not seen one shred of evidence you have shown anyone the supposed error of their ways.

Doesn't Axl himself call them "new Guns" in those chats?

No.
"In regard to nuGUNS, I get that sometimes it helps to be able to clarify. Personally I call this GUNS and the 'Illusions' or previous lineups 'old GUNS.'"
Read more at http://www.blabbermouth.net/news/axl-rose-why-i-am-continung-to-use-name-guns-n-roses/#vUMALWU8VMJHHFT0.99

[jarmo]

The so called NuGN'R is now the old band. Stop hating the old band.

Edited to add: I suggest you stop that particular discussion. Axl seems to understand why some use the term, maybe the rest of us could do the same and move on....



/jarmo

[Thorned Rose]

All I've been doing Emily is support my claims with FACTS...

You clearly are a huge huge supporter of the New Guns N' Roses. I am too. Maybe not as huge as you though.

It is quite clear that Guns N' Roses exists in 2 separate things. The classic old band 85-96 and then the new band 98-2014. If anyone doesn't see it this way then I guess they just don't have any logic.

When you take out EVERY member of a very good band, and it is Axl, Paul Tobias and Dizzy Reed (some of 1998 was like this)

you don't have a band and what once was... isn't.

It is great that NU Gn'R  came about. I'm glad about that for sure. I'm just saying that they are 2 separate things. The band name is the same, but the band doesn't resemble anything from the first era. Rarely in rock does this happen like this. Actually maybe it has never happened now to think of it. Van Halen did it in reverse with the singer being gone and everyone else staying mostly.

Dare to dream.

[Thorned Rose]

This is unreal... way too many liberal thinking people out there.

Guns N' Roses is clear a band now and it always has been.

When you release 1 album in a period of 10 years as a band it doesn't go in the same level as actual Guns N' Roses. You have to admit this.

Guns N' Roses produced 4 studio albums (AFD, UYI 1 and 2, TSI?) in a period of 7 years or so. I'm not counting Lies... as it is hardly a LP.

When you look at it from a point of credibility... Nu GN'R seems very unofficial to me. Mostly because of the constant lead guitarist changes over the years. Plus it took 2 leads to make 1 Slash.

I do like the newer Guns N' Roses. I saw them live and they were just fantastic. I think too many people here just want Chinese Democracy II... and that isn't going to happen now.

Deal with it.

I don't think you have a good grasp on actual facts- you are very mistaken in your assumptions. 

Everythis stated above by me makes a lot of sense and are all facts. You're just romanticizing about a band you can't enjoy any longer.  (Nu gnr)