So is Tommy in or out (your opinions)?

[Princess Leia]

If Axl is working with Slash, Duff and hopefully Izzy I?m more than happy with that. I really hope you are right.

 Axl knew BFF was leaving while on tour in South America. DJ made it clear this year he was leaving. Tommy first said he was "out of the loop". Here Jarmo posted an interview where Tommy pretty much said he was out. Richard has said "2016 will be a great year" or something like that. All this is recent. But Axl had chances from 2010 to 2014 to make a new album. Don?t get me wrong I don?t want a CD twin brother because I didn?t like  CD to begin with. Still I think Axl could?ve put something out. ? would?ve bought it despite my doubts. I will always buy any kind of album that Axl might make. Then of course I may like it or not

The question is why didn?t he make the CD follow up when he had New GN?R together? We don?t have an official statement on the matter. I wish we could have it. The best way to avoid speculations and wrong assumtions it is to have clear explanations from the people involved. Maybe there is a really good reason. But if we don?t know it. It is the same as nothing.

And if something is going to happen in 2016... Well we?re in December 2015

[Wooody]

You answered your own question.
He puts out his music when he's ready to. Not when others think he should.

Tours also cost time and money.
Nice try.


The usual suspects who have a hard time giving Axl any credit are once again questioning him....
Is it that difficult to give him some credit?




/jarmo

Not to sound like the usual suspects   But ?. (There's a But)


I do think Axl's got music integrity, and I do think in his own way he is all about the music. But was he ever ready with Chinese Democracy ? Nevermind, the cover and its print, or the business of it all, Im asking about the music aspect of Chinese Democracy, and this is why I ask:

 He said in an interview or web chat something like how he  wanted the lyrics for Sorry to be better written, or that he wished he had found better lyrics,  but he settled on those. He said it in a way that made me feel like he couldn't find the write lyrics for the whole song, or that he felt like some lyrics just didnt fit but he left them anyway.

Its understandable in a way to me because Ive done that too on a few songs I write,  when I feel like I just want to write and play a sing and have fun, but don't want to go through the hassle of making it perfect. Making music is sometimes very easy, but sometimes very hard. But when you have gone through years of choosing a handful of songs  to make an album, and you decide to include a song that you don't feel is finished in the sense that everything feels finished or right, It makes me wonder whether the 70 or 300 songs that he has on his vault are like Sorry. Songs that may appear finished like Sorry, but somewhat feel unfinished because there are things either in the lyrics or structures that do not feel right.

This is interesting to me because I like to write music and I know what it is to deal with inspiration. A lot of times you want to play and sing the whole day, but nothing you sing or play sounds cool and it is somewhat frustrating, and then at other times you write an entire song in 4 minutes and it comes out perfect.

But the attitude on Sorry was not the same as the one in COMA, Axl said in an interview or something how he struggled to find the lyrics for COMA, months went by and he was not able to find anything, but he was singing in the shower or something one day and it suddenly hit him, and everything fit, and he was able to finish the song. That to  me is very cool, because he didnt finish the song until it felt right, he didnt just write some random lyrics because the song needed to be finished, rather he finished the song because he found the perfect lyrics and melodies for the song.


So if he did have other finished songs on the vault, why not decide to include those and  keep Sorry for ''the second half of Chinese'', or until he felt it was finished. I wonder about that.

From some of Axl's other comments, about other songs (even on UYI), I think there are just songs that stick in his craw as "not right".  Back with AFD and UYI, he had other band mates who had some say who would tell him they were ready.  And they'd push it out the door.

His comments on Sorry remind me of that.  I think he was probably convinced, by either band mates or by management or by a label rep (hahahahahaha) that Sorry was ready to go.  And I think that can happen with other material BUT (and this is the big caveat) I think it's a small segment of folks who can have that kind of influence on him, and I think they are reluctant to use it, mostly.  Much like he had no intention of putting "This I love" on their, but was convinced by the rest of his band mates.

I think the best way for me to explain it is: I think he's very PROTECTIVE of the material.  Almost like the songs were actual living beings...like his children, kinda.  I know that's a weird analogy, but it's the sense I get.  Maybe I'm way off base.  But maybe in some respects....they are, to him.  They're little pieces of himself he's potentially shipping off to exist in the world.  And he wants them to be their best "selves".

I know, weird and deep and all that. And I'm literally trying to read a guys mind who I've never met.  But, again, its always the sort of sense I've gotten.

Maybe Sorry hits me the hardest because I agree with him. I don't agree with him that his voice was bad on LIES for example, and I can't think of a single song that sounds wrong on AFD and UYI's (My world doesnt count)

 

[pilferk]

I was with you on that entire post until this bit.

There is never a time for that conversation, in my experience.  It's always out of line.

If 365 days from now, we are having this exact conversation and nothing will have happened in a full year's time, let's not then pretend there is going to be this sudden appetite for some hard questions.

You're directing comments to "the management"...not me.

We've (you and I) HAD those conversations, so I don't think it's unfair to assume that, in 6 months or a year or whatever....we'll have them again.

I just don't think right NOW, that particular sentence benefits from dissection.  Because there's an easy way to poo poo it given the rumors. Or at least hold the dissection on "truth vs not truth" at bay.

[pilferk]

If Axl is working with Slash, Duff and hopefully Izzy I?m more than happy with that. I really hope you are right.

 Axl knew BFF was leaving while on tour in South America. DJ made it clear this year he was leaving. Tommy first said he was "out of the loop". Here Jarmo posted an interview where Tommy pretty much said he was out. Richard has said "2016 will be a great year" or something like that. All this is recent. But Axl had chances from 2010 to 2014 to make a new album. Don?t get me wrong I don?t want a CD twin brother because I didn?t like  CD to begin with. Still I think Axl could?ve put something out. ? would?ve bought it despite my doubts. I will always buy any kind of album that Axl might make. Then of course I may like it or not

The question is why didn?t he make the CD follow up when he had New GN?R together? We don?t have an official statement on the matter. I wish we could have it. The best way to avoid speculations and wrong assumtions it is to have clear explanations from the people involved. Maybe there is a really good reason. But if we don?t know it. It is the same as nothing.

And if something is going to happen in 2016... Well we?re in December 2015

I'm not sure how much Axl "knew" about BBF, and how much he thought might be posturing for a new deal, or whatever.  You're right that BBF was doing the whole countdown thing, so you can adjust my fiction to take that into account, if you like.  And BBF was, IMHO, sort of a dick about the whole thing, so....there was some dealing with that, I'm sure.

Tommy's comments, made more recently, might include some historical perspective in there.  We don't know his intent at the end of the Vegas Residency...only his comments, now.

Ditto with DJ.  I think he announced his departure when he did for a reason.  And it MIGHT not be coincidence that rumors started to heat up almost directly after he left. Maybe. Possibly.

And all that interpretation would be in the light of there being a reunion.  And, FYI: I'm not convinced that's true.  But I'm more willing to at least entertain the notion than I ever have been.

Point being:

I can see a scenario where he was working on new material until some stuff happened that ushered in the possibility of reuniting with members of the former lineup.  And when he said he was going to work on it, he had no idea that was even a realistic option.

As for the rest: I think the reason we didn't see new material in 2009 - 2014 is exactly what I've been supposing: Axl didn't think it was ready, for one reason or another.  Any or all of the ones we've discussed here before (quality of material, assurances from the label over quality of release, etc, etc, etc).

He wants, IMHO, the perfect package.  You can argue that perfection is a futile persuit....and I might agree with you.  Axl might even agree with you, in theory.  But...the thing is...who's definition of "perfection" and "good enough" are we using.

Axls are the only ones that really matter.

[Princess Leia]

If Axl is working with Slash, Duff and hopefully Izzy I?m more than happy with that. I really hope you are right.

 Axl knew BFF was leaving while on tour in South America. DJ made it clear this year he was leaving. Tommy first said he was "out of the loop". Here Jarmo posted an interview where Tommy pretty much said he was out. Richard has said "2016 will be a great year" or something like that. All this is recent. But Axl had chances from 2010 to 2014 to make a new album. Don?t get me wrong I don?t want a CD twin brother because I didn?t like  CD to begin with. Still I think Axl could?ve put something out. ? would?ve bought it despite my doubts. I will always buy any kind of album that Axl might make. Then of course I may like it or not

The question is why didn?t he make the CD follow up when he had New GN?R together? We don?t have an official statement on the matter. I wish we could have it. The best way to avoid speculations and wrong assumtions it is to have clear explanations from the people involved. Maybe there is a really good reason. But if we don?t know it. It is the same as nothing.

And if something is going to happen in 2016... Well we?re in December 2015

I'm not sure how much Axl "knew" about BBF, and how much he thought might be posturing for a new deal, or whatever.  You're right that BBF was doing the whole countdown thing, so you can adjust my fiction to take that into account, if you like.  And BBF was, IMHO, sort of a dick about the whole thing, so....there was some dealing with that, I'm sure.

Tommy's comments, made more recently, might include some historical perspective in their.  We don't know his intent at the end of the Vegas Residency...only his comments, now.

Ditto with DJ.  I think he announced his departure when he did for a reason.  And it MIGHT not be coincidence that rumors started to heat up almost directly after he left. Maybe. Possibly.

And all that interpretation would be in the light of there being a reunion.  And, FYI: I'm not convinced that's true.  But I'm more willing to at least entertain the notion than I ever have been.

Point being:

I can see a scenario where he was working on new material until some stuff happened that ushered in the possibility of reuniting with members of the former lineup.  And when he said he was going to work on it, he had no idea that was even a realistic option.

As for the rest: I think the reason we didn't see new material in 2009 - 2014 is exactly what I've been supposing: Axl didn't think it was ready, for one reason or another.  Any or all of the ones we've discussed here before (quality of material, assurances from the label over quality of release, etc, etc, etc).

He wants, IMHO, the perfect package.  You can argue that perfection is a futile persuit....and I might agree with you.  Axl might even agree with you, in theory.  But...the thing is...who's definition of "perfection" and "good enough" are we using.

Axls are the only ones that really matter.

When it comes to BBF it wasn?t only the countdown. The GN?R camp issued a stament saying BBF told Axl in South America that he was leaving. They did that after DJ announced he was leaving.

As for CD II, Axl told us about it back 2001. At least at that time he seemed more determine to put it out. Sure he has the right to change his mind and he probably did. But I can?t see Axl being unhappy with the stuff he was working on.

[D-GenerationX]

As for CD II, Axl told us about it back 2001. At least at that time he seemed more determine to put it out. Sure he has the right to change his mind and he probably did. But I can?t see Axl being unhappy with the stuff he was working on.

It's a weird dynamic at work here.

I personally think Axl has lost a lot of fire for the project because so many that played meaningful roles in its creation are long gone.  If they were still around, I think he'd be more bullish.

Of course, the reason they all bailed was because of him, because of his chronic inaction.

So while I think you could argue his current situation is not rosy, who's fault is that, really?

[Wooody]

If Axl is working with Slash, Duff and hopefully Izzy I?m more than happy with that. I really hope you are right.

 Axl knew BFF was leaving while on tour in South America. DJ made it clear this year he was leaving. Tommy first said he was "out of the loop". Here Jarmo posted an interview where Tommy pretty much said he was out. Richard has said "2016 will be a great year" or something like that. All this is recent. But Axl had chances from 2010 to 2014 to make a new album. Don?t get me wrong I don?t want a CD twin brother because I didn?t like  CD to begin with. Still I think Axl could?ve put something out. ? would?ve bought it despite my doubts. I will always buy any kind of album that Axl might make. Then of course I may like it or not

The question is why didn?t he make the CD follow up when he had New GN?R together? We don?t have an official statement on the matter. I wish we could have it. The best way to avoid speculations and wrong assumtions it is to have clear explanations from the people involved. Maybe there is a really good reason. But if we don?t know it. It is the same as nothing.

And if something is going to happen in 2016... Well we?re in December 2015

I'm not sure how much Axl "knew" about BBF, and how much he thought might be posturing for a new deal, or whatever.  You're right that BBF was doing the whole countdown thing, so you can adjust my fiction to take that into account, if you like.  And BBF was, IMHO, sort of a dick about the whole thing, so....there was some dealing with that, I'm sure.

Tommy's comments, made more recently, might include some historical perspective in there.  We don't know his intent at the end of the Vegas Residency...only his comments, now.

Ditto with DJ.  I think he announced his departure when he did for a reason.  And it MIGHT not be coincidence that rumors started to heat up almost directly after he left. Maybe. Possibly.

And all that interpretation would be in the light of there being a reunion.  And, FYI: I'm not convinced that's true.  But I'm more willing to at least entertain the notion than I ever have been.

Point being:

I can see a scenario where he was working on new material until some stuff happened that ushered in the possibility of reuniting with members of the former lineup.  And when he said he was going to work on it, he had no idea that was even a realistic option.

As for the rest: I think the reason we didn't see new material in 2009 - 2014 is exactly what I've been supposing: Axl didn't think it was ready, for one reason or another.  Any or all of the ones we've discussed here before (quality of material, assurances from the label over quality of release, etc, etc, etc).

He wants, IMHO, the perfect package.  You can argue that perfection is a futile persuit....and I might agree with you.  Axl might even agree with you, in theory.  But...the thing is...who's definition of "perfection" and "good enough" are we using.

Axls are the only ones that really matter.

I wouldn't go as far as to call him a dick, he was always very nice to the fans and it seemed he had issues with some bandmembers that did not welcome him with open arms (Especially Tommy). But maybe they were dicks to Him. We don't know.

[pilferk]

I wouldn't go as far as to call him a dick, he was always very nice to the fans and it seemed he had issues with some bandmembers that did not welcome him with open arms (Especially Tommy). But maybe they were dicks to Him. We don't know.

He might not BE a dick.

But he was a dick about the way he left.  From start to finish.

You might disagree...that's fine.  But to me, seeing what I saw, reading what I read....he was.

[Wooody]

I wouldn't go as far as to call him a dick, he was always very nice to the fans and it seemed he had issues with some bandmembers that did not welcome him with open arms (Especially Tommy). But maybe they were dicks to Him. We don't know.

He might not BE a dick.

But he was a dick about the way he left.  From start to finish.

You might disagree...that's fine.  But to me, seeing what I saw, reading what I read....he was.

Maybe his mistake was being a dick about it publicly hahaha.

[D-GenerationX]

Both sides handled his exit very poorly.

Ultimately Ron was more at fault, and by a good margin.  He really acted like a child.

But how do you let him run that game on everybody for a year?  Don't you shut that down?

[norway]

."fuck the haters" (in his opinion) is probably his morning meditation mantra.

'stay resentfull, be bitter and blame everyone else' he has on his refigerator, or something like that.

[EmilyGNR]

As for CD II, Axl told us about it back 2001. At least at that time he seemed more determine to put it out. Sure he has the right to change his mind and he probably did. But I can?t see Axl being unhappy with the stuff he was working on.

It's a weird dynamic at work here.

I personally think Axl has lost a lot of fire for the project because so many that played meaningful roles in its creation are long gone.  If they were still around, I think he'd be more bullish.

Of course, the reason they all bailed was because of him, because of his chronic inaction.

So while I think you could argue his current situation is not rosy, who's fault is that, really?

Don't think you can state "chronic inaction" as fact, truth is you don't know the exact reasons people chose to leave.

I am very optimistic about the next developments for GNR.

[EmilyGNR]

If Axl is working with Slash, Duff and hopefully Izzy I?m more than happy with that. I really hope you are right.

 Axl knew BFF was leaving while on tour in South America. DJ made it clear this year he was leaving. Tommy first said he was "out of the loop". Here Jarmo posted an interview where Tommy pretty much said he was out. Richard has said "2016 will be a great year" or something like that. All this is recent. But Axl had chances from 2010 to 2014 to make a new album. Don?t get me wrong I don?t want a CD twin brother because I didn?t like  CD to begin with. Still I think Axl could?ve put something out. ? would?ve bought it despite my doubts. I will always buy any kind of album that Axl might make. Then of course I may like it or not

The question is why didn?t he make the CD follow up when he had New GN?R together? We don?t have an official statement on the matter. I wish we could have it. The best way to avoid speculations and wrong assumtions it is to have clear explanations from the people involved. Maybe there is a really good reason. But if we don?t know it. It is the same as nothing.

And if something is going to happen in 2016... Well we?re in December 2015

I'm not sure how much Axl "knew" about BBF, and how much he thought might be posturing for a new deal, or whatever.  You're right that BBF was doing the whole countdown thing, so you can adjust my fiction to take that into account, if you like.  And BBF was, IMHO, sort of a dick about the whole thing, so....there was some dealing with that, I'm sure.

Tommy's comments, made more recently, might include some historical perspective in there.  We don't know his intent at the end of the Vegas Residency...only his comments, now.

Ditto with DJ.  I think he announced his departure when he did for a reason.  And it MIGHT not be coincidence that rumors started to heat up almost directly after he left. Maybe. Possibly.

And all that interpretation would be in the light of there being a reunion.  And, FYI: I'm not convinced that's true.  But I'm more willing to at least entertain the notion than I ever have been.

Point being:

I can see a scenario where he was working on new material until some stuff happened that ushered in the possibility of reuniting with members of the former lineup.  And when he said he was going to work on it, he had no idea that was even a realistic option.

As for the rest: I think the reason we didn't see new material in 2009 - 2014 is exactly what I've been supposing: Axl didn't think it was ready, for one reason or another.  Any or all of the ones we've discussed here before (quality of material, assurances from the label over quality of release, etc, etc, etc).

He wants, IMHO, the perfect package.  You can argue that perfection is a futile persuit....and I might agree with you.  Axl might even agree with you, in theory.  But...the thing is...who's definition of "perfection" and "good enough" are we using.

Axls are the only ones that really matter.

I wouldn't go as far as to call him a dick, he was always very nice to the fans and it seemed he had issues with some bandmembers that did not welcome him with open arms (Especially Tommy). But maybe they were dicks to Him. We don't know.

Not only was he a dick, but he was a passive aggressive kvetching dick.

[norway]

why u say that?

[EmilyGNR]

why u say that?

Gee, because of his passive aggressive mentions and not so subtle allusions to GNR in his interviews.

Example:

Ron Thal interviewed in Thailand. Jokes about not having to play with them anymore (GNR) and no more of this song (SCOM).
That the "reign of doom" is over
http://pattaya103.com/guns-n-roses-ron-bumblefoot-thal-interview-thailand/

kvetch
[kvech] Slang.
verb (used without object)
1.
to complain, especially chronically.

[D-GenerationX]

Oh, Ron was totally passive aggressive.

I thought he made the band look bad too, with all his crap about not being able to talk, which turned out to be total bullshit.

[Spirit]

I think Ron had good intentions, but in the end his desire to "be on the fans' side" looked quite unprofessional. Not that the fans might have been right about some things, but if you're a member of a band you're supposed to stick together and "speak with one voice".

[EmilyGNR]

I think Ron had good intentions, but in the end his desire to "be on the fans' side" looked quite unprofessional. Not that the fans might have been right about some things, but if you're a member of a band you're supposed to stick together and "speak with one voice".

He ended up appearing self-serving and very disingenuous IMO.

[D-GenerationX]

I think Ron had good intentions, but in the end his desire to "be on the fans' side" looked quite unprofessional. Not that the fans might have been right about some things, but if you're a member of a band you're supposed to stick together and "speak with one voice".

Agreed. 

Guy "went into business for himself", as the saying goes.

[pilferk]

I think Ron had good intentions, but in the end his desire to "be on the fans' side" looked quite unprofessional. Not that the fans might have been right about some things, but if you're a member of a band you're supposed to stick together and "speak with one voice".

I think ron had good intentions to raise rons profile in the gnr community, so ron could hopefully sell more albums. I dont thnk ron was trying to serve the fanbase, or do anything more than serve rons own best interests.

And i think rons "good intentions" totally backfired.

And...for the record..i think ron totally played the gnr camp..and fanbase (because he knew the camp would likely react with silence) just like he plays that giant foot shaped guitar.