The Likelihood of A New Album In 2016

[faldor]

How do you know it's Axl's way or the highway? You're making a lot of suppositions. Maybe he's given in on a number of issues but the record company refuses to budge. I'm not sure why you're adamant that Axl is the problem here. CD wasn't released the way he wanted, and he wasn't happy about it in the end. Maybe he's being more careful this time around. He spent nearly a decade creating the album and it was botched. Should he just accept it and agree to do whatever the label suggests? Because they know what's best for him and have his best interests at heart?

Can't dismiss this.  Absolutely not.

On the other hand...7 years now, man.  I can even grant you that you don't start the clock the day after CD comes out.  Not realistic.

So let's fast forward say, 3 years.  4 years, even.  That still leaves us with at least 3 years, and we are still stuck?  On what?  

Well, that's the rub, we don't know.  So we guess.  Many an argument here stems from how much of the "blame" (for lack of a better word) we put on Axl and his team.  And really, how "blame" is even defined.

Axl initially seemed to want to release the follow up soon after CD, maybe even the next year. But obviously something changed. He wanted to tour CD properly and continued to do so. He seemed to have a good time doing it and the focus wasn't on getting the next album out. So I'm not sure he's been fighting with the label for 7, 4, or 3 years to get the next release out. There's also been management changes during that time. Correct me if I'm wrong but, the last time we heard from Axl about new music was when he said they'd finish up the shows in Vegas and take a look at what to do from there. So I'm not sure if the clock honestly doesn't start until then. Let's also remember that Axl doesn't seem to be a big fan of clocks to begin with, so I'm not sure it matters what date we circle back to.

And, like jarmo said, it's ultimately up to Axl if and when he's ready to release an album, assuming of course he comes to an agreement with the label. They toured CD pretty extensively. Maybe he wanted some downtime before the next push. I'd take new music when he's ready and excited to release it, rather than the label forcing a release when his heart isn't into it.

[EmilyGNR]

So you think Axl is motivated by money? I would say you are wrong.

The fact that negotiations may be taking a while does not in any way mean that the work done will be "horded in some basement"

#1, its not being heard by anyone.  Paintings of flowers in the basement, tapes in a vault...what's the difference?  No one is getting anything out of them.

#2, if this isn't about business, then why are they even negotiating?  If Axl was truly content to leave this unheard forever, what are they even talking about, if not business?

And, just as an aside, you are someone that loves calling up old quotes (when it suits you).  Axl has expressly said, as in...as a direct quote, that he did not do all this so it could remain unheard.  

Why are we suddenly glossing over the man's own words?  It was never his intention to leave all this a secret.

He also said The Art comes first, Fortus said in one of his interviews that Axl was about the music.

Nobody ever said it would remain unheard, yet another strawman argument.

[D-GenerationX]

Correct me if I'm wrong but, the last time we heard from Axl about new music was when he said they'd finish up the shows in Vegas and take a look at what to do from there. So I'm not sure if the clock honestly doesn't start until then. Let's also remember that Axl doesn't seem to be a big fan of clocks to begin with, so I'm not sure it matters what date we circle back to.

Hahaha.  Very true.

Honestly, I think people would be in a better place if there was more evidence things were at work since he said that.  Not an album on the shelf, but tangible progress.

Instead, all we have are 3 band defections and some sort of vauge "how you know things aren't happening, smartguy?" type stuff from other defensive fans.

Not exactly airtight, that case.

[EmilyGNR]

How do you know it's Axl's way or the highway? You're making a lot of suppositions. Maybe he's given in on a number of issues but the record company refuses to budge. I'm not sure why you're adamant that Axl is the problem here. CD wasn't released the way he wanted, and he wasn't happy about it in the end. Maybe he's being more careful this time around. He spent nearly a decade creating the album and it was botched. Should he just accept it and agree to do whatever the label suggests? Because they know what's best for him and have his best interests at heart?

Can't dismiss this.  Absolutely not.

On the other hand...7 years now, man.  I can even grant you that you don't start the clock the day after CD comes out.  Not realistic.

So let's fast forward say, 3 years.  4 years, even.  That still leaves us with at least 3 years, and we are still stuck?  On what?  

Well, that's the rub, we don't know.  So we guess.  Many an argument here stems from how much of the "blame" (for lack of a better word) we put on Axl and his team.  And really, how "blame" is even defined.

Why would you, and the circle of other known trolls determine that "blame" is even warranted?

There is no set nor accepted schedule on which an Artist "must" release music.

The entire concept of "blame" is concocted in the minds of misguided entitled "fans".

[faldor]

Axl gave the fans an update and an unofficial release date in an open letter to the fans prior to CD's release. That date came and went without a release. So what good did that do?

I think it did a lot of good, actually.  Reaction to it was very positive.  People were just happy he finally reached out.

And keep in mind, I wasn't here yet.  This was when I only posted ay MYGNR.  Who I don't think I have to tell you, doesn't exactly grade on nearly the curve this place does.  But people were appreciative for the update.

I've been a music fan my whole life, but I have never seen such an aversion to fan outreach like I do with this band.  Its treated like playing Russian Roulette or having a battle of wits with Barzini over where the iocane powder is.

Obviously the update was well received. Like the fan chats Axl had. Fans starve for that kind of interaction with their favorite artists. But when that date came and went with no release and then no update, people were not too happy. Should he have come back with another letter giving another release date that may or may not come to fruition? He tried once, it didn't work out. Maybe because of that, they play things more close to the vest.

I wouldn't mind if they kept giving projected release dates, even if they missed a bunch of them. But lots of people would have a field day with thst kind of a charade and I don't think that'd be good for business.

[EmilyGNR]

Correct me if I'm wrong but, the last time we heard from Axl about new music was when he said they'd finish up the shows in Vegas and take a look at what to do from there. So I'm not sure if the clock honestly doesn't start until then. Let's also remember that Axl doesn't seem to be a big fan of clocks to begin with, so I'm not sure it matters what date we circle back to.

Hahaha.  Very true.

Honestly, I think people would be in a better place if there was more evidence things were at work since he said that.  Not an album on the shelf, but tangible progress.

Instead, all we have are 3 band defections and some sort of vauge "how you know things aren't happening, smartguy?" type stuff from other defensive fans.

Not exactly airtight, that case.

Ashba quit in July, Ron quit during the SA tour, but it sounds better to some detractors to overlook that detail.

Why do you need someone to hold your hand through the entire process ?

The last statement about the next album from Axl was in Revolver, he hasn't said anything has changed in that respect, and tweeted that picture from a studio.

[OscarAxl22]

Correct me if I'm wrong but, the last time we heard from Axl about new music was when he said they'd finish up the shows in Vegas and take a look at what to do from there. So I'm not sure if the clock honestly doesn't start until then. Let's also remember that Axl doesn't seem to be a big fan of clocks to begin with, so I'm not sure it matters what date we circle back to.

Hahaha.  Very true.

Honestly, I think people would be in a better place if there was more evidence things were at work since he said that.  Not an album on the shelf, but tangible progress.

Instead, all we have are 3 band defections and some sort of vauge "how you know things aren't happening, smartguy?" type stuff from other defensive fans.

Not exactly airtight, that case.

Ashba quit in July, Ron quit during the SA tour, but it sounds better to some detractors to overlook that detail.

Why do you need someone to hold your hand through the entire process ?

The last statement about the next album from Axl was in Revolver, he hasn't said anything has changed in that respect, and tweeted that picture from a studio.

and we've come full circle. Why did those members quit again?

[jarmo]

Why do you need someone to hold your hand through the entire process ?

But Axl wasn't there for him when he released Chinese Democracy. And he canceled that show in 2002!
It's not easy being that guy you know....

This conversation will lead to nothing. In a few weeks he'll be asking you about all this again....



/jarmo

[Annie]

We have all heard stories about the horrors and tribulations that major labels inflict on Artists- why is it so difficult to believe that they are being difficult with GNR?

Its not.  At least, I don't think.

But you almost seem to be describing a scenario where if he can't get everything precisely how he wants, then it never comes out.  And this is somehow noble.

That doesn't make sense to a lot of us.  Every artist wants the best deal they can get, but at the expense of never having your work heard?

Pretty extreme stance.

That is merely your speculative nonsense talking again, nobody ever said that "if he can't get everything he wants it is never coming out".

Strawman idiocy.

'

Nobody said anyone said it.  I believe I said that it *seems like* that is what you are describing.

if that's not what you are describing, please feel free to elaborate or correct the record in some way.  Ain't got nothing but time.

Negotions may be time consuming and difficult- why is this so difficult a concept for some?

The "extreme stance" you have cooked up in your head is fan fiction, you should put that to good use and write a book.

The positive points are that Ume has gotten some new faces since the last Album release and the same people aren't running the show, but you are still talking about a very powerful and almost monopoly of an organization.

I believe that there is alot of truth to this statement. 3 years ago I was chosen to be in a documentary about Hello Kitty fanatics. The project was sanctioned by the multibillion dollar corporation SANRIO. The director Roger Gastman and his crew came to my house to film me and my extensive collection of Hello Kitty art, shoes, jewelry, clothing ETC. The filming of the project took place 3years ago. The movie was suposed to be shown in art house movie theaters 2 years ago. He had hoped to be nominated for an Academy Award. The movie is yet to be released. I saw Roger at 2 VIP SANRIO events in LA.When I saw him in JUne he told me that he had no idea if/when the movie was going to be released. It was in the hands of the SANRIO executives. I said I hoped it came out, and he said so did he. He seemed very disappointed and frustrated.I also attended some panel discussions with artists who spoke about the difficulties and complexities of working with the Sanrio brand, licensing, approval etc. And the main designer of Hello Kitty, an older Japanese lady was one of the coldest and aloof people whom I have ever met. She was so rude that I almost burst into tears.

[Ginger King]

In short, yes, I choose to take Axl's side instead of taking the record company's side. Why does it make sense for you to come to a fan site and always point the fingers at the artist? Like if somebody says "Oh, but there's several parts that are involved in all this", you'll be there to remind everybody that it's mostly about Axl. How come? I find it puzzling to be honest.

Yes, let's say the album's done and has been paid for and all that.
Now, the record company wants to make some money. But what they plan, isn't what the artist wants. Who's to blame? Some of you say, it's Axl. No matter what, it's always Axl. Because other bands release music! And other record companies release music every week, they're the good guys. They just want what's best for us music fans and the artists. Everybody knows that.

Some of you basically want Axl to bend over backwards for the record company, as long as you get that album you can listen to and then disregard to repeat the cycle ASAP.... Sorry if that offends some of you sensitive discussion lovers. Fortunately there are fans who aren't that needy. And they can see the other side of the coin.

/jarmo

Not bend over backwards, but certainly understand it?s a negotiation process and he?s going to have to give on a few points.  That?s life.  

My point is that if Axl?s ?negotiating? position is ?I get everything I want? that?s not realistic.  That?s not a negotiating position at all, and certainly not real life?I don?t care if you?re releasing an album or buying a house.  But it seems you would support such a decision as preserving his artistic integrity.  IMO, such a position indicates he has no real desire to release it at all.  

Also, none of us here "always" point the finger at Axl.  That's a bit too dramatic.  Sometimes we do.  I get that that bothers you, but the man in not infallible.  He has, even by his own admission, made mistakes.

How do you know it's Axl's way or the highway? You're making a lot of suppositions. Maybe he's given in on a number of issues but the record company refuses to budge. I'm not sure why you're adamant that Axl is the problem here. CD wasn't released the way he wanted, and he wasn't happy about it in the end. Maybe he's being more careful this time around. He spent nearly a decade creating the album and it was botched. Should he just accept it and agree to do whatever the label suggests? Because they know what's best for him and have his best interests at heart?

I don't think I said Axl's the problem.  In fact, I believe I said, "I?m saying there?s no real evidence to support either being the hold up.  It?s probably some combination of the two."

Honestly, I don't think he has a sense of urgency to release a new album...and he's completely within his right to feel like that.  If that's the case then just own it.  Instead, we're fed scraps (studio tweets by Pittman) to create the impression that things may be in motion...but it's all done in a way where nobody can be blamed if nothing happens.  If an album comes out, then the message is "well yeah, that studio tweet should've told you something.  That's obvious."  If no album comes out, then it's "why would you rely on a studio tweet?  That's stupid."

It's culpable deniability.  Just own it.  If you want to release it, great.  If you don't want to release it, super.  If you're not sure if you want to release it, good for you.  But pick one.  The story seems to oscillate between these three themes. 

[D-GenerationX]

I wouldn't mind if they kept giving projected release dates, even if they missed a bunch of them. But lots of people would have a field day with thst kind of a charade and I don't think that'd be good for business.

What have you go to lose though?  I guess that's how I see it.

I agree, there would be some of what you are talking about.  But from anyone that's been fair to him lately?

Obviously, if we are still hanging in, we've made our peace getting nothing.  So if he threw us anything, that's just gravy.  Won't be anything but appreciated by any of us.

But the people that might make light of missed deadlines, are they even in this game anymore?  I don't know those types of people really would give him credit for anything at this point.

[D-GenerationX]

Honestly, I don't think he has a sense of urgency to release a new album...and he's completely within his right to feel like that.  If that's the case then just own it.  Instead, we're fed scraps (studio tweets by Pittman) to create the impression that things may be in motion...but it's all done in a way where nobody can be blamed if nothing happens.  If an album comes out, then the message is "well yeah, that studio tweet should've told you something.  That's obvious."  If no album comes out, then it's "why would you rely on a studio tweet?  That's stupid."

Yeah, maybe. 

I still think it was a smart move, though.  People were excited about it.

[D-GenerationX]

Ashba quit in July, Ron quit during the SA tour, but it sounds better to some detractors to overlook that detail.

What's all this supposed misdirection getting at?  What's the angle?

Axl gave the interview mid last year.  Since he did, 3 people that were in the band are not in the band anymore.

This is wrong?  Because I sure didn't see them at the staff meeting this morning.

[Ginger King]

Honestly, I don't think he has a sense of urgency to release a new album...and he's completely within his right to feel like that.  If that's the case then just own it.  Instead, we're fed scraps (studio tweets by Pittman) to create the impression that things may be in motion...but it's all done in a way where nobody can be blamed if nothing happens.  If an album comes out, then the message is "well yeah, that studio tweet should've told you something.  That's obvious."  If no album comes out, then it's "why would you rely on a studio tweet?  That's stupid."

Yeah, maybe. 

I still think it was a smart move, though.  People were excited about it.

I think it was a smart move, too.  But if nothing comes of it, then we're duped (again) and everyone can walk away blamelessly.  If you're going to give the impression (however vague) that things are in motion, and say you're "very seriously" looking into releasing music that's already recorded, then it's not crazy, a year and half later, to wonder what's going on and hope for an update.  But that's what Fernando's going to deliver "soon."

[D-GenerationX]

I think it was a smart move, too.  But if nothing comes of it, then we're duped (again) and everyone can walk away blamelessly.  If you're going to give the impression (however vague) that things are in motion, and say you're "very seriously" looking into releasing music that's already recorded, then it's not crazy, a year and half later, to wonder what's going on and hope for an update.  But that's what Fernando's going to deliver "soon."

Part of me feels bad for him though.

That's the nature of the job, I guess.  But being the guy on the firing line is no fun.

I consider White House press secretary the worst job in the world.  You have to be a sadist to want that job.

But if Fernando gets burned, he's the one that is going to take the heat.  Look how that "three hour meeting" thing took on a life of it's own.

[EmilyGNR]

Ashba quit in July, Ron quit during the SA tour, but it sounds better to some detractors to overlook that detail.

What's all this supposed misdirection getting at?  What's the angle?

Axl gave the interview mid last year.  Since he did, 3 people that were in the band are not in the band anymore.

This is wrong?  Because I sure didn't see them at the staff meeting this morning.

Actually Ron quit long before the Revolver interview-but continue on with your assumptions, and wrong conclusions.

[EmilyGNR]

Honestly, I don't think he has a sense of urgency to release a new album...and he's completely within his right to feel like that.  If that's the case then just own it.  Instead, we're fed scraps (studio tweets by Pittman) to create the impression that things may be in motion...but it's all done in a way where nobody can be blamed if nothing happens.  If an album comes out, then the message is "well yeah, that studio tweet should've told you something.  That's obvious."  If no album comes out, then it's "why would you rely on a studio tweet?  That's stupid."

Yeah, maybe. 

I still think it was a smart move, though.  People were excited about it.

I think it was a smart move, too.  But if nothing comes of it, then we're duped (again) and everyone can walk away blamelessly.  If you're going to give the impression (however vague) that things are in motion, and say you're "very seriously" looking into releasing music that's already recorded, then it's not crazy, a year and half later, to wonder what's going on and hope for an update.  But that's what Fernando's going to deliver "soon."

Did the Revolver interview give you a specific date for a release or promise updates?

Yes or no?

[EmilyGNR]

I think it was a smart move, too.  But if nothing comes of it, then we're duped (again) and everyone can walk away blamelessly.  If you're going to give the impression (however vague) that things are in motion, and say you're "very seriously" looking into releasing music that's already recorded, then it's not crazy, a year and half later, to wonder what's going on and hope for an update.  But that's what Fernando's going to deliver "soon."

Part of me feels bad for him though.

That's the nature of the job, I guess.  But being the guy on the firing line is no fun.

I consider White House press secretary the worst job in the world.  You have to be a sadist to want that job.

But if Fernando gets burned, he's the one that is going to take the heat.  Look how that "three hour meeting" thing took on a life of it's own.

Yeah that Three hour Meeting is as amusing as the rest of Troll lingo and Troll logic.

Fernando said there would be an update in a few months, I believe him.

[EmilyGNR]

Correct me if I'm wrong but, the last time we heard from Axl about new music was when he said they'd finish up the shows in Vegas and take a look at what to do from there. So I'm not sure if the clock honestly doesn't start until then. Let's also remember that Axl doesn't seem to be a big fan of clocks to begin with, so I'm not sure it matters what date we circle back to.

Hahaha.  Very true.

Honestly, I think people would be in a better place if there was more evidence things were at work since he said that.  Not an album on the shelf, but tangible progress.

Instead, all we have are 3 band defections and some sort of vauge "how you know things aren't happening, smartguy?" type stuff from other defensive fans.

Not exactly airtight, that case.

Ashba quit in July, Ron quit during the SA tour, but it sounds better to some detractors to overlook that detail.

Why do you need someone to hold your hand through the entire process ?

The last statement about the next album from Axl was in Revolver, he hasn't said anything has changed in that respect, and tweeted that picture from a studio.

and we've come full circle. Why did those members quit again?

Why don't you go ask them and get back to us

[D-GenerationX]

Actually Ron quit long before the Revolver interview-but continue on with your assumptions, and wrong conclusions.

Not sure this is really the game changer you think it is, Emily.  It makes zero difference in the grand scheme.

2 guitar players, definitely gone.  A bass player that sure looks like he's gone.  These are not super developments.

Fatal?  Of course not.  Ideal?  Hardly.

But "Um, point of order, Ron actually quit in March...not May or afterwards, so....yeah.  You think on that."  

Who cares?  What's it change?