Tommy Stinson article - September 2, 2015

[EmilyGNR]

Oh Jesus!!! Here we go again. If's / Buts / Maybe's.

GNR Management please just confirm what the hell is going on with a facebook statement or whatever. How hard is it to just let the fans know whats going on?? The fans are the ones that buy the cd's / dvd's and buy the tickets without them you got nothing. Show a little respect for once.

I know its never going happen because its GNR. But miracles do happen.

Shades of misguided entitlement issues here.

If you buy a ticket-you get a show
If you buy an album-you get to own a copy of the music.

Nobody honestly "owes" you any inside information on how things are run, business matters, or internal affairs.

When there is something to announce, it will be announced. When an update is ready, it will be relayed.

Pretty simple concept, and I know it isn't what you want to hear, but it is the truth.

"All we need is just a little patience."

No shades of misguided entitlement issues here. I'm an adult, I know how things work. All I was saying is that how crap GNR in general treat their fans. I think almost everybody here will agree with that. I get it they cant make a big announcement like a reunion etc. until everything is done, but just say we are working on getting something together an album / tour whatever. Everything with GNR is so secret.

Look I guess we will find out somewhere down the line.

Super, I'm an adult too- that has very little to do with certain mindsets and maturity levels, as well as levels of expectation or entitlement.

How are you mistreated? It isn't some inherent right for fans to know inside details - until they are ready to be announced.

When an announcement is ready it will be made, Fernando said in a couple of months we would have news.

[pilferk]

No shades of misguided entitlement issues here. I'm an adult, I know how things work. All I was saying is that how crap GNR in general treat their fans. I think almost everybody here will agree with that. I get it they cant make a big announcement like a reunion etc. until everything is done, but just say we are working on getting something together an album / tour whatever. Everything with GNR is so secret.

Look I guess we will find out somewhere down the line.

We GOT that, didn't we? That kind of generality?  Fernando just said, a couple weeks ago, we should have big news in a couple/few months?

Harkening back to that conversation....Ye gods....the new gnr store that's supposed to sell GnR merch from across the entire breadth of their existence....that could, again, feed nicely into this little trip down the rabbit hole we're taking.

[Princess Leia]

Oh Jesus!!! Here we go again. If's / Buts / Maybe's.

GNR Management please just confirm what the hell is going on with a facebook statement or whatever. How hard is it to just let the fans know whats going on?? The fans are the ones that buy the cd's / dvd's and buy the tickets without them you got nothing. Show a little respect for once.

I know its never going happen because its GNR. But miracles do happen.

They will never chime in.  Their communication skills are a joke.

That might be the best thing to come of this if it happens,actually.  There will be people in the fold that actually talk to us.

The positive way to look at it is that, for once, perhaps there is a reason to stay mum.  If it comes out in 3 months there is some sort of reunion deal in place, but they couldn't say until it was all hammered out and signed off on, I can't imagine anyone will care.

Conversely, if nothing comes of any of this, there is no reunion, and all we get is some vague assurance they are "still trying to sift through the material" for a CD follow up, at that point...you throw up your hands.

Agree! After the BBF fiasco. I don?t want to see another pathetic statement saying "I don?t understand why Tommy continues to be evasive..." Or yet  "I don?t understand why Richard said 2016 was going to be a great year..."

It is better to just leave things to flow. And just deal with whatever happens.

[Slashrose]

I believe Tommy is outside the band

[ROSE]

Oh Jesus!!! Here we go again. If's / Buts / Maybe's.

GNR Management please just confirm what the hell is going on with a facebook statement or whatever. How hard is it to just let the fans know whats going on?? The fans are the ones that buy the cd's / dvd's and buy the tickets without them you got nothing. Show a little respect for once.

I know its never going happen because its GNR. But miracles do happen.

Shades of misguided entitlement issues here.

If you buy a ticket-you get a show
If you buy an album-you get to own a copy of the music.

Nobody honestly "owes" you any inside information on how things are run, business matters, or internal affairs.

When there is something to announce, it will be announced. When an update is ready, it will be relayed.

Pretty simple concept, and I know it isn't what you want to hear, but it is the truth.

"All we need is just a little patience."

No shades of misguided entitlement issues here. I'm an adult, I know how things work. All I was saying is that how crap GNR in general treat their fans. I think almost everybody here will agree with that. I get it they cant make a big announcement like a reunion etc. until everything is done, but just say we are working on getting something together an album / tour whatever. Everything with GNR is so secret.

Look I guess we will find out somewhere down the line.

Super, I'm an adult too- that has very little to do with certain mindsets and maturity levels, as well as levels of expectation or entitlement.

How are you mistreated? It isn't some inherent right for fans to know inside details - until they are ready to be announced.

When an announcement is ready it will be made, Fernando said in a couple of months we would have news.

You and I have a difference of opinion lets just leave it there. Life is too short.

[ROSE]

No shades of misguided entitlement issues here. I'm an adult, I know how things work. All I was saying is that how crap GNR in general treat their fans. I think almost everybody here will agree with that. I get it they cant make a big announcement like a reunion etc. until everything is done, but just say we are working on getting something together an album / tour whatever. Everything with GNR is so secret.

Look I guess we will find out somewhere down the line.

We GOT that, didn't we? That kind of generality?  Fernando just said, a couple weeks ago, we should have big news in a couple/few months?

Harkening back to that conversation....Ye gods....the new gnr store that's supposed to sell GnR merch from across the entire breadth of their existence....that could, again, feed nicely into this little trip down the rabbit hole we're taking.

Hopefully we will get some real news soon. A reunion would be great, but cant see that happening.

[HBK]

I believe Tommy is outside the band

You Have 2 Options:

1- Maybe YES
2- Maybe NOT

 

[DeN]

silence is a very old marketing trick to generate demand and curiosity
happy to see it still works in 2015


?speech is silver, silence is golden?

[C0ma]

silence is a very old marketing trick to generate demand and curiosity
happy to see it still works in 2015


?speech is silver, silence is golden?

Unless it undermines the direction you are trying to take your organization in. This has all peaked interest in one thing and one thing only, a reunion. The domino's falling, or more appropriately appearing to fall in the direction they have are working these forums and online media outlets into a frenzy about said reunion. If you let that build steam and then follow it up by announcing a tour with John and Jeff Doe on guitar touring on an album that came out in 2008 or an upcoming album that was largely written and produced in the early 2000's your are going to see a negative reaction or at best a very flat reception.

Personally I am happy with shows and music from Axl one way or another, but I am not everyone... and certainly I am not everyone outside of this online fan community.

Your point though is perfectly valid if you assume in the next month or two we are going to get word that Axl, Duff, Slash, and fill in the blanks are touring... Then this speculation fuels the excitement for the announcement when it comes.

[Ginger King]

I don't buy that he doesn't know... and if he does know that there indeed isn't a plan yet... then Frank and Richard are liars... so which one is it?

When you consider that Frank and Tommy are currently working together, I don't buy that one knows and the other doesn't.

I disagree.

I think you can be at a place where everyone is telling the truth, based on their level of comfort with knowing what's going on.

Frank and Richard have heard enough to get them excited.  They might not have exact specifics, though.

Tommy has heard the same things (through whatever source...directly or indirectly) but without the specifics HE isn't comfortable commenting.  Also, IF (note I'm going to use that word a lot in reference to his status) he has sort of, kind of, left the band, then he probably carries a modicum of professionalism and isn't going to share what information he DOES have.  He's not lying.  He simply doesn't have enough information to comment categorically and what info he does have he feels isn't his to share.  I think that's a perfectly legit "I really don't know what's going on, exactly" use of phrasing.

But saying "I don't know" when you really do know, but just don't want to comment on (for good reasons) is technically lying, which I think was the point of the original post.  Perhaps the term"liar" is too harsh for some, so perhaps he was mistaken or intentionally diverted conversation away from the truth.

[ice cream sand pig]

silence is a very old marketing trick to generate demand and curiosity
happy to see it still works in 2015


?speech is silver, silence is golden?

I can say that it sure as hell is keeping me hooked!

[D-GenerationX]

Unless it undermines the direction you are trying to take your organization in. This has all peaked interest in one thing and one thing only, a reunion. The domino's falling, or more appropriately appearing to fall in the direction they have are working these forums and online media outlets into a frenzy about said reunion. If you let that build steam and then follow it up by announcing a tour with John and Jeff Doe on guitar touring on an album that came out in 2008 or an upcoming album that was largely written and produced in the early 2000's your are going to see a negative reaction or at best a very flat reception.

Personally I am happy with shows and music from Axl one way or another, but I am not everyone... and certainly I am not everyone outside of this online fan community.

Well said.  Agreed all around.

I never get swept up in the reunion stuff.  But its gotten me this time, finally.

And I can't lie.  If, at the end of this, all we get is an announcement Axl has hired 2 more randos so he can keep singing AFD songs in clubs...that's going to be a gutpunch.

[pilferk]

But saying "I don't know" when you really do know, but just don't want to comment on (for good reasons) is technically lying, which I think was the point of the original post.  Perhaps the term"liar" is too harsh for some, so perhaps he was mistaken or intentionally diverted conversation away from the truth.

No, it's not.

Because his definition of "know" isn't the same as, say, Franks.

Tommy saying "I don't know what's going on, really" isn't necessarily a lie if he he only has the vaguest of outlines or ideas about what's going on.  By his definiton, he doesn't know enough to comment, or want to comment.  There's not enough specifics, FOR HIM, to say "Yeah, I know what's going on".

While (again, as an example) Frank, with those same details, might say "I'm excited for what's coming in 2016".

Neither person lied.  What they did was use their personal (and maybe professional) value judgement on what "Knowing" means.

[pilferk]

Let me follow that up:

If, at work, you have bits and pieces of information...but not the whole story...but, say, your boss does...when your coworker, or someone, comes up to you and asks you about that topic, you have a few choices:

1) Relay the bits of information you have, unsure if they are still accurate, timely, or complete...knowing that what info you DO have is probably going to beget a lot more questions that you know you can't answer

2) Express your opinion of the matter with very few specifics

3) Say "I'm not really sure what's going on, really" and refer them to your boss.


I don't think any one of those 3 is lying (#1 may or may not be ill advised, but that would depend)...even if you impart information you think is correct in #1 that turns out not to BE correct.

Frank seems to have chosen #2

Tommy maybe chose #3.

Now, I'm sure, someone comes in and says "Yeah, but the boss is on vacation/unreachable/unwilling to talk about the subject".  Maybe so...but that doesn't change your choices. Or your obligation to choose a specific choice.

[JAEBALL]

But saying "I don't know" when you really do know, but just don't want to comment on (for good reasons) is technically lying, which I think was the point of the original post.  Perhaps the term"liar" is too harsh for some, so perhaps he was mistaken or intentionally diverted conversation away from the truth.

No, it's not.

Because his definition of "know" isn't the same as, say, Franks.

Tommy saying "I don't know what's going on, really" isn't necessarily a lie if he he only has the vaguest of outlines or ideas about what's going on.  By his definiton, he doesn't know enough to comment, or want to comment.  There's not enough specifics, FOR HIM, to say "Yeah, I know what's going on".

While (again, as an example) Frank, with those same details, might say "I'm excited for what's coming in 2016".

Neither person lied.  What they did was use their personal (and maybe professional) value judgement on what "Knowing" means.

This all spiraled because one poster got so upset at the term liar being used. As others pointed out it's just that none of these guys are on the same page. Only time will tell who has a clue and who doesn't.

I also just really hope that we don't get new guy 1 and new guy 2 on guitar next year.

[pilferk]

This all spiraled because one poster got so upset at the term liar being used. As others pointed out it's just that none of these guys are on the same page. Only time will tell who has a clue and who doesn't.

I also just really hope that we don't get new guy 1 and new guy 2 on guitar next year.

To be honest...I object to it, too.  Emily beat me to pointing out the objection, though.

It's a term we often use here when there are alternate scenarios in play (like being wrong or having circumstances change or, like in this case, having two alternate points of view).

I see you have since agreed that the use of that term probably wasn't apt...so we can move on from there.    

[Ginger King]

This all spiraled because one poster got so upset at the term liar being used. As others pointed out it's just that none of these guys are on the same page. Only time will tell who has a clue and who doesn't.

I also just really hope that we don't get new guy 1 and new guy 2 on guitar next year.

To be honest...I object to it, too.  Emily beat me to pointing out the objection, though.

It's a term we often use here when there are alternate scenarios in play (like being wrong or having circumstances change or, like in this case, having two alternate points of view).

I see you have since agreed that the use of that term probably wasn't apt...so we can move on from there.    

Fine...but I just think he knows and is not choosing to say.  And I think he's well within his right not to tell us.

I tend to believe that over he actually doesn't know.  If he truly has no idea what's going on...then that's a really shitty way to treat someone who's been one of the longest serving tenured members of the band.

[EmilyGNR]

This all spiraled because one poster got so upset at the term liar being used. As others pointed out it's just that none of these guys are on the same page. Only time will tell who has a clue and who doesn't.

I also just really hope that we don't get new guy 1 and new guy 2 on guitar next year.

To be honest...I object to it, too.  Emily beat me to pointing out the objection, though.

It's a term we often use here when there are alternate scenarios in play (like being wrong or having circumstances change or, like in this case, having two alternate points of view).

I see you have since agreed that the use of that term probably wasn't apt...so we can move on from there.    

Fine...but I just think he knows and is not choosing to say.  And I think he's well within his right not to tell us.

I tend to believe that over he actually doesn't know.  If he truly has no idea what's going on...then that's a really shitty way to treat someone who's been one of the longest serving tenured members of the band.

First sentence here is great, he is under no obligation-real or imagined, and would be ill-advised to blurt out everything he knows. Only Idiots spew everything they know.

Second sentence here you are ASSUMING that he has somehow been mistreated and you are jumping to the usual conclusions and drama queen antics. 

[EmilyGNR]

Unless it undermines the direction you are trying to take your organization in. This has all peaked interest in one thing and one thing only, a reunion. The domino's falling, or more appropriately appearing to fall in the direction they have are working these forums and online media outlets into a frenzy about said reunion. If you let that build steam and then follow it up by announcing a tour with John and Jeff Doe on guitar touring on an album that came out in 2008 or an upcoming album that was largely written and produced in the early 2000's your are going to see a negative reaction or at best a very flat reception.

Personally I am happy with shows and music from Axl one way or another, but I am not everyone... and certainly I am not everyone outside of this online fan community.

Well said.  Agreed all around.

I never get swept up in the reunion stuff.  But its gotten me this time, finally.

And I can't lie.  If, at the end of this, all we get is an announcement Axl has hired 2 more randos so he can keep singing AFD songs in clubs...that's going to be a gutpunch.

Poor you, you suffer so greatly in your supposed "fandom" 

[D-GenerationX]

Unless it undermines the direction you are trying to take your organization in. This has all peaked interest in one thing and one thing only, a reunion. The domino's falling, or more appropriately appearing to fall in the direction they have are working these forums and online media outlets into a frenzy about said reunion. If you let that build steam and then follow it up by announcing a tour with John and Jeff Doe on guitar touring on an album that came out in 2008 or an upcoming album that was largely written and produced in the early 2000's your are going to see a negative reaction or at best a very flat reception.

Personally I am happy with shows and music from Axl one way or another, but I am not everyone... and certainly I am not everyone outside of this online fan community.

Well said.  Agreed all around.

I never get swept up in the reunion stuff.  But its gotten me this time, finally.

And I can't lie.  If, at the end of this, all we get is an announcement Axl has hired 2 more randos so he can keep singing AFD songs in clubs...that's going to be a gutpunch.

Poor you, you suffer so greatly in your supposed "fandom" 

I won't be alone on that either, my dear.

So you will have no shortage of people that can add to your list of folks you try and sell that long delays that lead to nothing are super awesome.

You should be rooting harder than anyone, frankly.  An absurd delay that leads to a great payoff is a favorable outcome.  An absurd delay that leads to nothing is basically what we've been going through the past few years.

How do you feel that's going over with the peeps?  Pretty well, is it?