Stay of Execution?

[D-GenerationX]

I'm so curious as to what the reaction would be from people if this is indeed a new project for Axl...pushing touring under the GNR banner to the side..

That GNR is most likely over.

Think about it.  He's been sitting on finished songs for a decade, yet he'd rather start up something totally different that would take all his time and energy?

Not a ringing endorsement for GNR's future.

[italian queen]

he'd rather start up something totally different that would take all his time and energy?

I could like it..

[JAEBALL]

I'm so curious as to what the reaction would be from people if this is indeed a new project for Axl...pushing touring under the GNR banner to the side..

That GNR is most likely over.

Think about it.  He's been sitting on finished songs for a decade, yet he'd rather start up something totally different that would take all his time and energy?

Not a ringing endorsement for GNR's future.

Well maybe Axl now views things differently... that a lot of the guys who created Chinese are long gone... now Ron is gone... maybe he thinks it's time...

It's not that I want "GNR to be over"... but if it means new and more music from Axl... then i'm all for it.

(I know this is all speculative, just thinking out loud)

[Spirit]

Am I getting this right?

- A song (the music) can be copyrighted
- A song name can neither be copyrighted or trademarked
- An album (the music) can be copyrighted
- An album title can neither be copyrighted or trademarked
- A band name can be trademarked
- Phrases used on band merchandise can be trademarked

Unsure:
- Tour name (If anything, trademark?)
- DVD/Blu-ray release (Can't trademark name, but copyright on content?)


- A trademark is protected forever, but it has to be actively used and a renewal has to be submitted after the first 5 years.

[D-GenerationX]

I'm so curious as to what the reaction would be from people if this is indeed a new project for Axl...pushing touring under the GNR banner to the side..

That GNR is most likely over.

Think about it.  He's been sitting on finished songs for a decade, yet he'd rather start up something totally different that would take all his time and energy?

Not a ringing endorsement for GNR's future.

Well maybe Axl now views things differently... that a lot of the guys who created Chinese are long gone... now Ron is gone... maybe he thinks it's time...

It's not that I want "GNR to be over"... but if it means new and more music from Axl... then i'm all for it.

(I know this is all speculative, just thinking out loud)

I'd always be interested in anything Axl does.  Sticking with him all this time is evidence of that.

[LIGuns]

This is just a theory, however...

Remember when The Offspring decided to get some easy press by claiming they were going to call their new album "Chinese Democracy... You Snooze, You Lose" or something? And I think at least one band (unknown band) put out a disc actually called Chinese Democracy.

Yes Warrior Soul put out a CD, available through the mail, called CD..Later it was renamed...

[Trash Boat]

Maybe I am just a fool, but I am excited about this 

Any news is good news 

[ckgent]

This is just a theory, however...

Remember when The Offspring decided to get some easy press by claiming they were going to call their new album "Chinese Democracy... You Snooze, You Lose" or something? And I think at least one band (unknown band) put out a disc actually called Chinese Democracy.

Yes Warrior Soul put out a CD, available through the mail, called CD..Later it was renamed...

And to be fair the Warrior Soul album was great also. They only pressed about 150 copies. I have one of them. Gonna see Kory Clarke live in the UK this may. They were actually on geffen at the same time as Guns.
Its cool Axl has something new or not? but lets see how it pans out.

[ITARocker]

I love the new band but who wouldn't want the original back if at all possible.

I wouldn't want to see my favorite band sellout. Plus the current band is much better than old band in my opinion.

As i said many time before, for years, The "current band" is not a "band". Axl Rose lost his bet, even if he won't admit it (or maybe he just don't care, but history won't remember the last 15 years of "new gnr"). He couldn't handle the all thing, he actually took over the old line up (wanted or not, good or bad) but he just failed. He couldn't recreate the "magic". Obviosly there's no problem, another employee is joining in but,,, it's kinda sad, really.

[snead hearn]

Am I getting this right?

- A song (the music) can be copyrighted
- A song name can neither be copyrighted or trademarked
- An album (the music) can be copyrighted
- An album title can neither be copyrighted or trademarked
- A band name can be trademarked
- Phrases used on band merchandise can be trademarked

Unsure:
- Tour name (If anything, trademark?)
- DVD/Blu-ray release (Can't trademark name, but copyright on content?)


- A trademark is protected forever, but it has to be actively used and a renewal has to be submitted after the first 5 years.

for a song, look at the parts within:
1) There's the music/composition
2) There's the lyrics
3) There's also the arrangement.
All 3 of which can be copyrighted.

A song name will be copyrighted, since it's the title. So, if you apply a title to the above song made up of the above 3 parts, then that's how the title would be copyrighted.

So how come there's numerous songs with the same title? Well, each song will have different composition, lyrics and arrangements.
It's like.....how many other people and pets are named Axl in the world? The title is one thing, the make up of a song is different.

A song name can be trademarked, however it has to be in context of the song title. Also if someone holds a copyright, then they hold the power to at least grant the permission on the trademark.

As for an album and album title, it kind of goes along with the above. All of the songs that make up the album would be copyrighted. As for the album title, that's copyrighted along with the album. As for the album title being trademarked, this is only if you are applying it in context onto a product or logo.

Band names can most certainly and SHOULD be trademarked. Why do you think there's variations on band names? Forget about when shit goes down with band turmoils. Think of time and territory. Did you know there was a band from the 60s called Nirvana? Why do you think bands add "U.K." to their title? Cuz there's probably a band in another territory who has rights on the name.

If by "phrases" you mean album titles or lyrics, or even expressions or mottos, all of these will encompass the design itself that gets applied to the product (say t-shirts for example), of which that can be trademarked. Remember the mention of "goods and services"? Apparel is one such category. So, within the filing of a trademark would be a certain design, of which the trademark holder holds the rights.

it's when things are waaaay too similar, or bootlegged that you get into infringement and that stuff.

Tour Name? It can be, but what are you trademarking it with? or to? What type of goods and service? You can't copyright or trademark a 'tour', literally the act of touring. Would you apply, say, "Get In The Ring" to a design on a t-shirt?

DVD/Blu-Ray/any type of 'mechanical' release, whehter promo or commercial product: Copyrightable. It's your product that is a copy of a creatively produced event that has been recorded and fixed to a mechanical document. Even without recording, the performance of the concert or recording itself would be copyrightable. As for trademarking, you can, but it has to be exploited.

Yes, a mark of trade can last forever, but has to be actively exploited.

Of course, rights and such will vary country to country. I recommend the "In A Nutshell" series for US law. It's like Cliff Notes but for law. The book on Intellectual Property is GREAT.

[jarmo]

As i said many time before, for years,

And you'll keep saying the same for for years to come.

Move along.




/jarmo

[Spirit]

Thanks for the insight snead hearn!

Based solely on the information we have on what it could be, what are you leaning against the most?

[jarmo]

Cool name. So I guess it means all the attention seeking ass clowns looking for easy attention won't be able to use it! 


/jarmo

[snead hearn]

Thanks for the insight snead hearn!

Based solely on the information we have on what it could be, what are you leaning against the most?

Just putting out the proverbial disclaimer force field, cross fingers before responding-my thoughts and thoughts alone.....ok, here's what i think-speculating & spitballing:

Could this be a label of sorts? Some sort of indie label entity? HE filed for a trademark and is the owner. It's not under the GNR partnership. Nor is it under a label, Universal or similar. It's Axl. And it's the only Trademark associated to him individually. All rest where he is listed are under the GNR partnership with Duff and Slash.

The goods and services are Digital Media and Entertainment. When I say I don't think this is GNR related, I say it's not touching upon the collective group (aka Chi Dem lineups and songs) or anything pre Chi Dem, from a creative music standpoint.

I also don't see it as a 'Chinese Democracy II" or record release, or even a DVD release. Anything to those type of music or A/V release-there has to be label involvement, IF for the fact that (unbeknownst to us) Axl/GNR may still be under label contract.

Axl has the trademark for this. So he in theory (punch holes as you see fit) could look to trademark for releasing a product. What that product is is a completely different question. And I say there's not even enough to speculate for that. I just want to figure what would be a logical theory for "Stay Of Execution". Could this be a side project? Perhaps, but that's trying to read too much into a black hole right now.

You know what? Look around to see what other bands and people have done. I just entered "Foo Fighters" and also did a separate search for "Roswell Records", and yet another for "David Grohl" as the owner name. Same thing for Paul Westerberg and The Replacements. There you can see what the Goods and Services are, and who would own the name/trademark.

Spirit-what sayeth you?

[Spirit]

Oh, at first I thought it was an album title. But after doing some research, I have pretty much abandoned that.

Then, looking at the categories of use for the trademark, I think it fits with a side-project, a band name.

The label theory is also very plausible. I haven't got the complete overview of what Black Frog really is. To my knowledge there are both Black Frog Music and Black Frog Publishing. I'm not sure if the former is classified as a label. If it is, I'm not sure if it's logical that Axl is establishing one more label.

Black Frog has ties with Universal though, so it might be as you say, that Stay of Execution is a new indie label.

[snead hearn]

Anything with "Black Frog" will be within the publishing catalog name. Sort of, like, an album title will be a title associated with a collection of songs. So, when you have a catalog of songs, they will be published under a name/title with it, that's what the Black Frog name is about. If you look at this whole protocol, it's soooo antiquated, like early 20th Century. But, this is how the way of intellectual property rights are.

The catalog for the newer Guns songs, for Axl's share, is under "Black Frog". The catalog for these titles seem to be administrated by Universal Publishing (not the label). So, that's where the Universal connection is. As for Geffen being under Universal, that's all label side stuff, not the publishing side.

If you look up "Black Frog" on the USPTO site, the mark is owned with some midwestern band. Nothing to do with Axl/GNR. There seem to be a few "DEAD" Black Frog listings in other goods and services. Not sure if 1 or 2 of the Dead ones may or may not have had involvement with Axl. Cannot determine.

Also, for giggles, if you look up "Uzi Suicide" on the trademark site, that's now abandoned, dead. And the owners listed are Slash and Duff.

[Spirit]

If you look up "Black Frog" on the USPTO site, the mark is owned with some midwestern band. Nothing to do with Axl/GNR. There seem to be a few "DEAD" Black Frog listings in other goods and services. Not sure if 1 or 2 of the Dead ones may or may not have had involvement with Axl. Cannot determine.

Axl is listed as the principal for those dead companies, so they had involvement with him. But as you say, Black Frog Entities is dead.



I don't know if it means anything but the official GNR Facebook page has listed Black Frog as the record company. It's probably just a mistake, and it is only the publishing company. Appetite For Democracy was after all released with Geffen being the record company.

The catalog for the newer Guns songs, for Axl's share, is under "Black Frog". The catalog for these titles seem to be administrated by Universal Publishing (not the label). So, that's where the Universal connection is. As for Geffen being under Universal, that's all label side stuff, not the publishing side.

That's correct. Universal Publishing is the parent company of Black Frog Music Publishing.




The reason I brought this up is that I don't think Black Frog was always intended to be solely a publishing company. I was not sure of the status of the company, but as you said, Black Frog Entities is not active, only Black Frog Publishing is alive.

Black Frog Entities used to be the parent company of BF Music and BF Publishing, but it seems to be a long time ago. I thought BF Music might have been Axl's intent to have an own label, maybe with an association with Sanctuary Records (not publishing). But I don't know about that.

I didn't know that this whole structure was long gone. I tried to find the site I remember seeing this information, but it was some sort of company profile search site.

[DeN]

well,

1) the band is on a hiatus.
2) Axl was spotted in studio.
3) a new LP is almost ready, they say.
4) a new name is copyrighted.
5) it's the same kind of name as Appetite For Destruction or Use Your Illusion.

so in my mind, Stay of Execution is the name of the new album.

[sky dog]

Who is "they" you are referring to in regards to a new album being "ready"?

[Dead N' Bloated]

As far as I know, an album title can't be copyrighted. Is that right?


It could be a new residency?