2015 Baseball season/Off Season Discussion

[pilferk]

Here's the new thread for the 2015 season!

Because it's Jan 5th and pitchers and catchers report in about 5-6 weeks. 

[pilferk]

The AL East and NL West both look to be BEASTS this year.

"Most Improved" likely goes to AL West, IMHO.

[tim_m]

It should be an interesting year. Lots of players moved around.

[tim_m]

Ok, so they announce the 2015 HOF inductees tomorrow. Who gets in? Johnson, Raines and Martinez for sure. Who else? Biggio? Smoltz? Piazza? Bagwell?

[Falcon]

Ok, so they announce the 2015 HOF inductees tomorrow. Who gets in? Johnson, Raines and Martinez for sure. Who else? Biggio? Smoltz? Piazza? Bagwell?

Raines for sure?

I don't think he's going to get there this year unfortunately.

Johnson and Martinez most definitely along with Biggio and Smoltz probably.

[tim_m]

Well if ESPN would have their way this year it would be Johnson, Martinez, Smoltz, Biggio and Piazza would get in.

[pilferk]

Ok, so they announce the 2015 HOF inductees tomorrow. Who gets in? Johnson, Raines and Martinez for sure. Who else? Biggio? Smoltz? Piazza? Bagwell?

Raines for sure?

I don't think he's going to get there this year unfortunately.

Johnson and Martinez most definitely along with Biggio and Smoltz probably.

I'm a little surprised at Pedro's "sure fire" first ballot status.  I honestly think his time as an analyst have made the writers warm up to him, a LOT.  Even going into last season, I wasn't convinced he'd end up elected on the  first ballot.  Longevity and productivity, as well as his "curmudgeon" factor (and..Don Zimmer)...I THOUGHT might cost him a year.

But, by all accounts...it looks like he's in.

[Falcon]

This is a great site to track ballots that have been made public by writers who vote for the HOF:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/pub?key=0AmkBNPY405WAdEZOUWdybm1iYjBUODA3RnNtZUFIaXc&output=html

Beyond Johnson, Pedro, Smoltz and Biggio, it's going to be close on Piazza - trending his way at the moment.

[pilferk]

This is a great site to track ballots that have been made public by writers who vote for the HOF:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/pub?key=0AmkBNPY405WAdEZOUWdybm1iYjBUODA3RnNtZUFIaXc&output=html

Beyond Johnson, Pedro, Smoltz and Biggio, it's going to be close on Piazza - trending his way at the moment.

Randy Johnson, Pedro Martinez, John Smoltz, and Craig Biggio are in.  Piazza was oh so close (69.8%)..should be in next year.

[Falcon]

Final HOF votes;

Votes    Player     Percentage
534    Randy Johnson    97.3%
500    Pedro Martinez    91.1%
455    John Smoltz    82.9%
454    Craig Biggio    82.7%
384    Mike Piazza    69.9%
306    Jeff Bagwell    55.7%
302    Tim Raines    55.0%
215    Curt Schilling    39.2%
206    Roger Clemens    37.5%
202    Barry Bonds    36.8%
166    Lee Smith      30.2%
148    Edgar Martinez    27.0%
138    Alan Trammell    25.1%
135    Mike Mussina    24.6%
77    Jeff Kent            14.0%
71    Fred McGriff    12.9%
65    Larry Walker    11.8%
64    Gary Sheffield    11.7%
55    Mark McGwire    10.0%
50    Don Mattingly    9.1%
36    Sammy Sosa    6.6%
30    N. Garciaparra    5.5%
21    Carlos Delgado    3.8%
4    Troy Percival    0.7%
2    Aaron Boone    0.4%
2    Tom Gordon    0.4%
1    Darin Erstad    0.2%
0    Rich Aurilia    0.0%
0    Tony Clark    0.0%
0    Jermaine Dye    0.0%
0    Cliff Floyd            0.0%
0    Brian Giles    0.0%
0    Eddie Guardado    0.0%
0       Jason Schmidt   0.0%

[tim_m]

Finally Biggio is in. He should've been in already IMO. Congrats to all the inductees all deserved. I felt Johnson, Martinez and Smoltz were shoe-in's

[faldor]

Ok, so they announce the 2015 HOF inductees tomorrow. Who gets in? Johnson, Raines and Martinez for sure. Who else? Biggio? Smoltz? Piazza? Bagwell?

Raines for sure?

I don't think he's going to get there this year unfortunately.

Johnson and Martinez most definitely along with Biggio and Smoltz probably.

I'm a little surprised at Pedro's "sure fire" first ballot status.  I honestly think his time as an analyst have made the writers warm up to him, a LOT.  Even going into last season, I wasn't convinced he'd end up elected on the  first ballot.  Longevity and productivity, as well as his "curmudgeon" factor (and..Don Zimmer)...I THOUGHT might cost him a year.

But, by all accounts...it looks like he's in.

I never understood your stance on not thinking Pedro was a 1st ballot HOF. I understand he didn't have the lengthiest career. He didn't have 300 wins or 4000 K's. But he dominated hitters in the steroid era. You put his stats up against any other pitcher in that era and there's no comparison. He was the best pitcher in baseball over a 6 year span. I'm shocked he only got 91% of the vote.

Maybe your views come from the fact that the Yankees handled Pedro as well as any team during his career. And I always thought he was affable as they come and got along well with the media. Again, I could be a bit biased I guess. Wouldn't be the first time.

[tim_m]

Ok, so they announce the 2015 HOF inductees tomorrow. Who gets in? Johnson, Raines and Martinez for sure. Who else? Biggio? Smoltz? Piazza? Bagwell?

Raines for sure?

I don't think he's going to get there this year unfortunately.

Johnson and Martinez most definitely along with Biggio and Smoltz probably.

I'm a little surprised at Pedro's "sure fire" first ballot status.  I honestly think his time as an analyst have made the writers warm up to him, a LOT.  Even going into last season, I wasn't convinced he'd end up elected on the  first ballot.  Longevity and productivity, as well as his "curmudgeon" factor (and..Don Zimmer)...I THOUGHT might cost him a year.

But, by all accounts...it looks like he's in.

I never understood your stance on not thinking Pedro was a 1st ballot HOF. I understand he didn't have the lengthiest career. He didn't have 300 wins or 4000 K's. But he dominated hitters in the steroid era. You put his stats up against any other pitcher in that era and there's no comparison. He was the best pitcher in baseball over a 6 year span. I'm shocked he only got 91% of the vote.

Maybe your views come from the fact that the Yankees handled Pedro as well as any team during his career. And I always thought he was affable as they come and got along well with the media. Again, I could be a bit biased I guess. Wouldn't be the first time.

I've always thought he was first ballot. I personally dislike him as a person for obvious reasons but the fact still remains he was flat out dominant for a good portion of his career.

[pilferk]

Ok, so they announce the 2015 HOF inductees tomorrow. Who gets in? Johnson, Raines and Martinez for sure. Who else? Biggio? Smoltz? Piazza? Bagwell?

Raines for sure?

I don't think he's going to get there this year unfortunately.

Johnson and Martinez most definitely along with Biggio and Smoltz probably.

I'm a little surprised at Pedro's "sure fire" first ballot status.  I honestly think his time as an analyst have made the writers warm up to him, a LOT.  Even going into last season, I wasn't convinced he'd end up elected on the  first ballot.  Longevity and productivity, as well as his "curmudgeon" factor (and..Don Zimmer)...I THOUGHT might cost him a year.

But, by all accounts...it looks like he's in.

I never understood your stance on not thinking Pedro was a 1st ballot HOF. I understand he didn't have the lengthiest career. He didn't have 300 wins or 4000 K's. But he dominated hitters in the steroid era. You put his stats up against any other pitcher in that era and there's no comparison. He was the best pitcher in baseball over a 6 year span. I'm shocked he only got 91% of the vote.

Maybe your views come from the fact that the Yankees handled Pedro as well as any team during his career. And I always thought he was affable as they come and got along well with the media. Again, I could be a bit biased I guess. Wouldn't be the first time.

Its that his total career numbers are relatively low. His season by season numbers are amazing. He had probably the greatest 6 year span in mlb history, all things considered. But it was a relatively short career, in terms of dominance. 219 wins isnt stellar, though. Neither are most of his other cumulative totals. From 97 to 2003, he was a god. The rest of his career? Pretty average numbers.

He had a penchant for being sarcastic with the media....forgetting to speak englsh, for example. He threw at players, a lot. He pushed an 80 year old guy in the dirt.

I thought there was a good chance the writers cost him a year, just because of those things. I honestly think his time as an analyst helped his case (and his "legend"). He absolutely belongs in the hall. I just thought it would be on the second ballot, given how crowded his innagural class was and the other factors in play.

[tim_m]

Next years class has some interesting newcomers. Griffey Jr. Trevor Hoffman, Billy Wagner and Jim Edmonds.

[pilferk]

Ok, so they announce the 2015 HOF inductees tomorrow. Who gets in? Johnson, Raines and Martinez for sure. Who else? Biggio? Smoltz? Piazza? Bagwell?

Raines for sure?

I don't think he's going to get there this year unfortunately.

Johnson and Martinez most definitely along with Biggio and Smoltz probably.

I'm a little surprised at Pedro's "sure fire" first ballot status.  I honestly think his time as an analyst have made the writers warm up to him, a LOT.  Even going into last season, I wasn't convinced he'd end up elected on the  first ballot.  Longevity and productivity, as well as his "curmudgeon" factor (and..Don Zimmer)...I THOUGHT might cost him a year.

But, by all accounts...it looks like he's in.

I never understood your stance on not thinking Pedro was a 1st ballot HOF. I understand he didn't have the lengthiest career. He didn't have 300 wins or 4000 K's. But he dominated hitters in the steroid era. You put his stats up against any other pitcher in that era and there's no comparison. He was the best pitcher in baseball over a 6 year span. I'm shocked he only got 91% of the vote.

Maybe your views come from the fact that the Yankees handled Pedro as well as any team during his career. And I always thought he was affable as they come and got along well with the media. Again, I could be a bit biased I guess. Wouldn't be the first time.

I've always thought he was first ballot. I personally dislike him as a person for obvious reasons but the fact still remains he was flat out dominant for a good portion of his career.

About a third. 6 out of about 18 seasons. About half his career wins come in those 6 seasons, too.
He has other good seasons sprinkled in, to be sure...and a few clunkers, too.
Outside those 6 years, hes about a 3.75 era, 13-15 win pitcher (if you project a bit...his later seasons are almost all shortened).

[tim_m]

Ok, so they announce the 2015 HOF inductees tomorrow. Who gets in? Johnson, Raines and Martinez for sure. Who else? Biggio? Smoltz? Piazza? Bagwell?

Raines for sure?

I don't think he's going to get there this year unfortunately.

Johnson and Martinez most definitely along with Biggio and Smoltz probably.

I'm a little surprised at Pedro's "sure fire" first ballot status.  I honestly think his time as an analyst have made the writers warm up to him, a LOT.  Even going into last season, I wasn't convinced he'd end up elected on the  first ballot.  Longevity and productivity, as well as his "curmudgeon" factor (and..Don Zimmer)...I THOUGHT might cost him a year.

But, by all accounts...it looks like he's in.

I never understood your stance on not thinking Pedro was a 1st ballot HOF. I understand he didn't have the lengthiest career. He didn't have 300 wins or 4000 K's. But he dominated hitters in the steroid era. You put his stats up against any other pitcher in that era and there's no comparison. He was the best pitcher in baseball over a 6 year span. I'm shocked he only got 91% of the vote.

Maybe your views come from the fact that the Yankees handled Pedro as well as any team during his career. And I always thought he was affable as they come and got along well with the media. Again, I could be a bit biased I guess. Wouldn't be the first time.

I've always thought he was first ballot. I personally dislike him as a person for obvious reasons but the fact still remains he was flat out dominant for a good portion of his career.

About a third. 6 out of about 18 seasons. About half his career wins come in those 6 seasons, too.
He has other good seasons sprinkled in, to be sure...and a few clunkers, too.
Outside those 6 years, hes about a 3.75 era, 13-15 win pitcher (if you project a bit...his later seasons are almost all shortened).

He was also an 8 time all star. A world series winner 3x cy young winner. triple crown winner. all star game mvp, al wins champion, 5 time al  era champion an 3 time al strikeouts champion. All that certainly helped.

[Falcon]

Next years class has some interesting newcomers. Griffey Jr. Trevor Hoffman, Billy Wagner and Jim Edmonds.

Griffey's in for sure first ballot.

Hoffman will get in eventually, he's an accumulator but will have to wait with the likelihood of Griffey and Piazza getting in and Bagwell on the rise.

Wagner's got no shot anytime soon, probably never.

Edmonds is an interesting case that will get consideration as his eligibility moves ahead, he's not a first ballot guy by any means but may gain momentum later in his eligibility.

Hopefully Raines gets the call before he falls off, 2 years to go and needs 20% more - that's going to be close.

[tim_m]

Next years class has some interesting newcomers. Griffey Jr. Trevor Hoffman, Billy Wagner and Jim Edmonds.

Griffey's in for sure first ballot.

Hoffman will get in eventually, he's an accumulator but will have to wait with the likelihood of Griffey and Piazza getting in and Bagwell on the rise.

Wagner's got no shot anytime soon, probably never.

Edmonds is an interesting case that will get consideration as his eligibility moves ahead, he's not a first ballot guy by any means but may gain momentum later in his eligibility.

Hopefully Raines gets the call before he falls off, 2 years to go and needs 20% more - that's going to be close.

Agreed on Griffey. Hoffman should get in sooner than later imo. He was a damn good closer. Obviously not Rivera level but you don't get 601 saves by accident. Raines needs to be in Bagwell as well.

[faldor]

Ok, so they announce the 2015 HOF inductees tomorrow. Who gets in? Johnson, Raines and Martinez for sure. Who else? Biggio? Smoltz? Piazza? Bagwell?

Raines for sure?

I don't think he's going to get there this year unfortunately.

Johnson and Martinez most definitely along with Biggio and Smoltz probably.

I'm a little surprised at Pedro's "sure fire" first ballot status.  I honestly think his time as an analyst have made the writers warm up to him, a LOT.  Even going into last season, I wasn't convinced he'd end up elected on the  first ballot.  Longevity and productivity, as well as his "curmudgeon" factor (and..Don Zimmer)...I THOUGHT might cost him a year.

But, by all accounts...it looks like he's in.

I never understood your stance on not thinking Pedro was a 1st ballot HOF. I understand he didn't have the lengthiest career. He didn't have 300 wins or 4000 K's. But he dominated hitters in the steroid era. You put his stats up against any other pitcher in that era and there's no comparison. He was the best pitcher in baseball over a 6 year span. I'm shocked he only got 91% of the vote.

Maybe your views come from the fact that the Yankees handled Pedro as well as any team during his career. And I always thought he was affable as they come and got along well with the media. Again, I could be a bit biased I guess. Wouldn't be the first time.

I've always thought he was first ballot. I personally dislike him as a person for obvious reasons but the fact still remains he was flat out dominant for a good portion of his career.

About a third. 6 out of about 18 seasons. About half his career wins come in those 6 seasons, too.
He has other good seasons sprinkled in, to be sure...and a few clunkers, too.
Outside those 6 years, hes about a 3.75 era, 13-15 win pitcher (if you project a bit...his later seasons are almost all shortened).

He was also an 8 time all star. A world series winner 3x cy young winner. triple crown winner. all star game mvp, al wins champion, 5 time al  era champion an 3 time al strikeouts champion. All that certainly helped.

Good stats Tim. Those surely look 1st ballot worthy to me. I realize his "dominance" was only over a 6 year period, but you have to factor in the era in which he did it. Offense was at a premium, and he made hitters look foolish. His numbers looked like they came from the Dead Ball Era.

Obviously I loved Pedro as a competitor, so I could overlook the "head hunting" and such. As long as he produced, and he did so quite often. But I did see this article by the writer who didn't hand his ballot in. He said it was a mistake on his part, which sounds suspect. But he talks about whether he would've voted for Pedro or not. He says he thought he was a punk and hated him for dominating the Indians, but ultimately would've cast a vote for him.

http://www.cleveland.com/tribe/index.ssf/2015/01/coming_clean_about_why_i_didnt.html#incart_story_package

I also read a few articles where voters didn't vote for Pedro and RJ because they felt there were more than 10 worthy candidates on the ballot and felt they would get in anyway. That's just wrong. If you feel a guy is a HOF, vote for him. Don't rely on others to do it for you. They really need to look into making some changes. Why limit it to 10 votes if there are more than that worthy?