Goodbye Ron (???)

[JAEBALL]

Ron uses the GNR name to promote his efforts...

  @4:36 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fCag821E3i8

I really burst out in laughter..... Ron Thal in a convertible rocking out to Welcome to the Jungle with that grin.....LOL

You don't think the music was added later?



/jarmo

Oh I'm sure... Regardless just as funny

[HBK]

You remember video:

Guns N' Roses - Welcome To The Bumble 2006

[LordRazZ]

Ron uses the GNR name to promote his efforts...

  @4:36 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fCag821E3i8

I really burst out in laughter..... Ron Thal in a convertible rocking out to Welcome to the Jungle with that grin.....LOL

You don't think the music was added later?



/jarmo

Wait J-man. So what you're saying is that band at the end of the video wasn't doing an exact duplicate of Welcome to the Jungle, note for note from the CD live on a stage and making it sound like it was done by the original GnR in the studio in 1987? COME ON!!!!!!!!  Lol

[jarmo]

I'm not sure! 




/jarmo

[NaturalLight]

Copied from PC.com

A Perspective on the Bumblefoot Situation and A Rebuttal on the Blabbermouth Article

Bumble/Ron should avoid the public charade he tends to create.

I was not going to copy the whole thing to avoid a long duplicate wall of text.

But I agree with every word of this article.  It's enough already.

I had no clue who the fuck "bumblefoot" was when he joined. I'll probably catch hell for this, but I just don't give a shit who the guitarists are. There's been so many over the years, I don't bother to keep up. Granted, I thought it was cool when Izzy popped up on stage a few times, but, whatever. I just enjoy listening to the music and hearing the main man sing it.

I suppose you can argue that losing some of the guitarists means potentially missing out on some cool future songs (Didn't Robin Finch write "Better"?), but I don't exactly have my fingers crossed for more music anyway.

[D-GenerationX]

I had no clue who the fuck "bumblefoot" was when he joined. I'll probably catch hell for this, but I just don't give a shit who the guitarists are. There's been so many over the years, I don't bother to keep up. Granted, I thought it was cool when Izzy popped up on stage a few times, but, whatever. I just enjoy listening to the music and hearing the main man sing it.

I suppose you can argue that losing some of the guitarists means potentially missing out on some cool future songs (Didn't Robin Finch write "Better"?), but I don't exactly have my fingers crossed for more music anyway.

Axl could replace every single other person on stage and I would not blink.  I'd just learn the new guy's names.

This is just one of the reasons I find it hard to take these guys seriously as a legit band.  That is not a normal reaction.

Even look at the some of responses to Ron leaving.  At best, you are getting "I guess I'd hate to see him go" (hardly a ringing endorsement) and at worst, you get "who gives a shit?".  To most, it seems, Ron is just a guy that replaced a guy that replaced a guy.  And if the next guy comes along, he'll just be the latest to keep the seat warm.

[JAEBALL]

We all feel the same way for the most part... Because we all love Axl... we don't really care who plays guitar...as long as he continues to sing the songs we love.


However... if you follow that up with "that's why I don't consider this a band" or I don't consider this band Guns N Roses because of such departures... well then that's bad...

[D-GenerationX]

Some stability would help.  That's why I want Ron to stay.  Its the main reason, really.

[JAEBALL]

If Axl did an interview today ..and was asked point blank is Ron still in the band...

you would probably get the same answer as this ...

Is Robin [Finck] in the band?

Last I was aware, he had some interest in touring, though I can't say what that means until then. In our opinion, he's made things a bit awkward publicly, but that's just his way.

[JAEBALL]

Some stability would help.  That's why I want Ron to stay.  Its the main reason, really.

Yeah obviously.

I remember a theory why the Better video wasnt released was because Robin quit, and Axl didn't want a video with him in it for their new single.

So any departure just makes everything that much more complicated.

[mortismurphy]

Another ten years replacing all of BF's solos with the solos of new guy you mean?

Personally, I do not see why they need three guitars. Fortus is criminally underused. He is a much better guitarist than Ashba.

[Spirit]

Some stability would help.  That's why I want Ron to stay.  Its the main reason, really.

Yeah obviously.

I remember a theory why the Better video wasnt released was because Robin quit, and Axl didn't want a video with him in it for their new single.

So any departure just makes everything that much more complicated.

Not sure about that. Buckethead is featured in the video as well, and he quit almost 5 years prior.

[NaturalLight]

I had no clue who the fuck "bumblefoot" was when he joined. I'll probably catch hell for this, but I just don't give a shit who the guitarists are. There's been so many over the years, I don't bother to keep up. Granted, I thought it was cool when Izzy popped up on stage a few times, but, whatever. I just enjoy listening to the music and hearing the main man sing it.

I suppose you can argue that losing some of the guitarists means potentially missing out on some cool future songs (Didn't Robin Finch write "Better"?), but I don't exactly have my fingers crossed for more music anyway.

Axl could replace every single other person on stage and I would not blink.  I'd just learn the new guy's names.

This is just one of the reasons I find it hard to take these guys seriously as a legit band.  That is not a normal reaction.

Even look at the some of responses to Ron leaving.  At best, you are getting "I guess I'd hate to see him go" (hardly a ringing endorsement) and at worst, you get "who gives a shit?".  To most, it seems, Ron is just a guy that replaced a guy that replaced a guy.  And if the next guy comes along, he'll just be the latest to keep the seat warm.

LOL. sort of. For me, anyway. I take the band serious, but they've gone through too many drummers and guitarists for me to care about that position.

I think I'd be more concerned if Tommy left (unless Duff came back) or if Dizzy left. I think those two leaving would better define a breakdown in the overall GnR institution.

if that makes sense.

[14 Yrs Of Silence]

When you get to the point where you don't consider GN'R a "band" you're really just acknowledging that this is more of a touring band than a studio band.  But we do have a core of songwriters right now, with a clear lineage back to CD sessions and possibly new contributions as well.  Some members now and future will likely always have a touring only role, and some may possibly have a studio only role (how cool would it be if Brain is in studio writing/recording new material?). 

Now it goes without saying, GN'R is Axl, and a group of musicians/songwriters that he chooses to work with.  And Axl could just as easily keep the guys he works with much further out of the spotlight, but he allows each one to shine and show their talents onstage. 

I get that its nice to have continuity, but sometimes change is needed to move forward. 

[D-GenerationX]

When you get to the point where you don't consider GN'R a "band" you're really just acknowledging that this is more of a touring band than a studio band. 

Correct.  That is how I'd define them.

If Ron does indeed have to replaced, its just a slot in the touring band that will be replaced.  Its not like Ron was heavily involved in any new material that might come out either.  You swap him out for the next guy and keep on truckin'.

The "band" that created CD already no longer exists.  And hasn't existed for some time.  It's just a touring band NOW, even with Ron.

[JAEBALL]

Some stability would help.  That's why I want Ron to stay.  Its the main reason, really.

Yeah obviously.

I remember a theory why the Better video wasnt released was because Robin quit, and Axl didn't want a video with him in it for their new single.

So any departure just makes everything that much more complicated.

Not sure about that. Buckethead is featured in the video as well, and he quit almost 5 years prior.

Good point. I'm not saying that was the case... just I remember that being a theory.

[jarmo]

The "band" that created CD already no longer exists. 

Which "band" is that?

Vocals: Axl
Guitars: Buckethead, Paul, Richard, Robin, Bumblefoot,  Axl
Bass: Tommy, Chris
Drums: Brain, Frank
Keyboards/Piano: Dizzy, Chris, Axl


That band never existed at the same moment in time.
You should be more specific. The Josh Freese line up? The 2001-2 touring line up? The 2006-7 touring line up?

Chinese Democracy was obviously created during a time when the band went through changes. Not during one specific line up.
Josh Freese for example, put a big mark on the album, but we never experienced that line up of the band.



/jarmo

[sofine11]

The "band" that created CD already no longer exists. 

Which "band" is that?

Vocals: Axl
Guitars: Buckethead, Paul, Richard, Robin, Bumblefoot,  Axl
Bass: Tommy, Chris
Drums: Brain, Frank
Keyboards/Piano: Dizzy, Chris, Axl


That band never existed at the same moment in time.
You should be more specific. The Josh Freese line up? The 2001-2 touring line up? The 2006-7 touring line up?

Chinese Democracy was obviously created during a time when the band went through changes. Not during one specific line up.
Josh Freese for example, put a big mark on the album, but we never experienced that line up of the band.



/jarmo

That's true.  And if there ever was a 'Chinese Democracy' band featured live, it was no doubt the 2001 lineup, while Paul Tobias was still on guitars.  It cannot be oversaid how important he was to Chinese Democracy.  A close second would be the 2002 lineup when Richard first joined the fold, which I was fortunate enough to see live.

[D-GenerationX]

The "band" that created CD already no longer exists. 

Which "band" is that?

Axl Rose - present
Buckethead - long gone
Robin Finck - more recently gone
Paul Tobias - long gone / was he ever really in?
Tommy Stinson - present
Dizzy Reed - present
Brain - more recently gone

That's the creative force behind the album. 

Ron throwing in a riff over top of a completed song, and Frank adding a few random drum fills is not exactly on par with what that list of dudes did to create the album and the other songs from those sessions we've yet to hear.

But as I said, we already don't have that band, nor have for some time.  So Ron leaving is not really a huge deal.

I'm trying to put the best spin on the situation, Jarmo.  I thought you were all about the best spin.

[sofine11]

The "band" that created CD already no longer exists. 

Which "band" is that?

Axl Rose - present
Buckethead - long gone
Robin Finck - more recently gone
Paul Tobias - long gone / was he ever really in?
Tommy Stinson - present
Dizzy Reed - present
Brain - more recently gone

That's the creative force behind the album. 

Ron throwing in a riff over top of a completed song, and Frank adding a few random drum fills is not exactly on par with what that list of dudes did to create the album and the other songs from those sessions we've yet to hear.

But as I said, we already don't have that band, nor have for some time.  So Ron leaving is not really a huge deal.

I'm trying to put the best spin on the situation, Jarmo.  I thought you were all about the best spin.

You're definitely not wrong as far as, other than Axl & Tommy, the main creative/writing forces being absent from the current touring lineup.

But, I have a feeling that the artists you've listed above are still going to be all over the next album.  I mean, wouldn't they have to be if the plan is to release it "soon", again, in the literal sense of the word?

And IMO this isn't a bad thing.   The combination of Robin & Bucket's styles on tracks like Better, TWAT & IRS were highlights of the album for this fan.  I doubt Axl would refuse to release similar tracks with playing like that, just because they aren't around anymore.  The art has to come first.  It sucks they aren't in the live band anymore, but I'd do anything to hear more music along the line of what was on Chinese.

Ron...I can take or leave at this point.  His contributions on the tracks Shackler's Revenge and Chinese Democracy are great, but again, he didn't write these songs.  The way he constantly complains and then veils it by saying he's "just being real and honest" is getting tiresome as of late.  Being a GNR fan is not always a walk in the park, and having one of the current members constantly acting like he's being slogged through hell doesn't really help.