Tommy: "We want to make a new album, it's a good time"

[jarmo]

So do you agree that your logic pretty much disqualifies the Gilby line up as a real band?

Because to me, all the line ups that played together on stage have been a "real band". And I'm not talking about including Don Henley as a member of the band.




/jarmo

[GNR2014]

Are we really discussing what makes a real band, and what makes a real fan?  This is a little silly. GNR are touring, they have the most stable lineup of all time, they finally have competent management, Axl is happy and communications with his fans. They have (several) good websites now, fan clubs, a Blu-ray video on the way, and soon enough another record. Guns fans have every reason to rejoice.

[D-GenerationX]

So do you agree that your logic pretty much disqualifies the Gilby line up as a real band?

No.  Covered several times now.

Because to me, all the line ups that played together on stage have been a "real band". And I'm not talking about including Don Henley as a member of the band.

Super.  So who cares what I think?

We have a difference of opinion over a semantic argument that is unlikely to change no matter how hard you pound on the desk or call me mean names. 

Make your peace with it already.  There are times in life people express an opinion on something you do not share.  This is one of those times.

[D-GenerationX]

Are we really discussing what makes a real band, and what makes a real fan?  This is a little silly. GNR are touring, they have the most stable lineup of all time, they finally have competent management, Axl is happy and communications with his fans. They have (several) good websites now, fan clubs, a Blu-ray video on the way, and soon enough another record. Guns fans have every reason to rejoice.

And I'm right with you.

I expressed an opinion on the matter (several days ago now) Jarmo doesn't agree with.  It happens.  He seems hellbent on getting me to recant my obvious heresy on the subject for whatever reason.

The band just announced domestic tour dates with hopefully more to follow.  A member of the band is actually talking new album.  That should be the focus.  Not how dare I have an opinion the moderator does not share.

[sandman]

i had been assuming the band was having problems with the label, but based on these comments, tommy seems to imply that it's on the band to get it done.

total speculation of course, but it doesn't seem like they have been trying to get an album out. so if the band does decide to make a new album a priority, hopefully the record label will not do anything to delay it.

I agree.

As I, and several others have said, the label as boogeyman routine seems to be an excuse for the inactivity. 

But Tommy, Ron, or whoever else lighting a fire under Axl to get the show on the road is a good thing, and should be seen as such.

i agree....definitely a good thing.

i was disappointed to read Tommy's comments, cause i had been giving Axl the benefit of the doubt regarding other forces (most likely the label) being the reason for no new album. but now it sounds like its just an issue with Axl not wanting to do it. Tommy certainly implies that it is up to the band (i.e. Axl) to decide when to put one out.

so now there's alot of mixed messages regarding new music from all members of the band. except for Axl. maybe he will give us an update on what he is thinking. in the chats a few years ago he had said something about "same bat time, same bat channel."

if there are plans to release an album of old recorded stuff, Axl could be working behind the scenes to get that out and it could happen relatively quickly (assuming no road blocks from the label).

but if they are planning on including new songs to be written by this band, we are probably looking at a release at least 12-18 months from now, and probably much longer than that. i'm keeping my fingers crossed that we hear a new song or 2 played live in the next few months. that would be a good sign, and i'd just love to hear something new.

[jarmo]

I explained why I think your logic is flawed. So in short, what exactly of what I said is "wrong" in your opinion?

Do you disagree that half of the band that toured in 1992-3 weren't present when the initial creation of the Use Your Illusion albums started? They joined later and took part in the recording and touring. Except Gilby who "only" toured. He would later record for a cover album on which he didn't create new material with the band.

 


/jarmo

[D-GenerationX]

i was disappointed to read Tommy's comments, cause i had been giving Axl the benefit of the doubt regarding other forces (most likely the label) being the reason for no new album. but now it sounds like its just an issue with Axl not wanting to do it. Tommy certainly implies that it is up to the band (i.e. Axl) to decide when to put one out.

And I would say that is why you found it disappointing whereas I felt it was actually encouraging.

I have never for one second believed anything other than Axl being the one needing a little kick in the ass.  Never believed he's just moving heaven and earth behind the scenes and just can't get a break form all the forces of evil conspiring against him.  That's all nonsense, as far as I'm concerned.

I have been asking for years when the others eventually go to him and sort of prod him to get moving forward.  If that is what's happening now, that's awesome.  I celebrate it.  As fans, that's nothing but a good thing.  

[D-GenerationX]

I explained why I think your logic is flawed. So in short, what exactly of what I said is "wrong" in your opinion?

I think, as usual, you are reaching to make a strained comparison if it means not having to say anything critical about the current situation.

Which is another topic we have covered rather extensively, occasionally to the annoyance of the others here.

Do you disagree that half of the band that toured in 1992-3 weren't present when the initial creation of the Use Your Illusion albums started? They joined later and took part in the recording and touring. Except Gilby who "only" toured. He would later record for a cover album on which he didn't create new material with the band.

I have said I find the comparison to the current situation to be flawed.  Said it several times now.

You don't agree.  Oh well.

[jarmo]

It's fine, you don't need to agree. Isn't the whole point of a discussion to have somebody say something, and then you say why you don't agree. You give examples and so on.
Not that "you don't agree with me".

It's not the first time you think something that happened in the 1990s was good/ok while the same, or a very similar thing, nowadays isn't a big deal.




/jarmo

[D-GenerationX]

It's fine, you don't need to agree. Isn't the whole point of a discussion to have somebody say something, and then you say why you don't agree. You give examples and so on.
Not that "you don't agree with me".

I agree with that concept, but in this case, we just have a fundamental difference here.

I think a band is judged for what they can do when they write and record an album.  You are willing to say that a bunch of other people who are long gone can write and record songs they left behind, and if a few new guys throw a few riffs over top of those songs...its the same thing. 

We just don't agree there and never will.  I'm sure we will have plenty to spar over going forward, believe me, but this one is pretty much all talked out.

It's not the first time you think something that happened in the 1990s was good/ok while the same, or a very similar thing, nowadays isn't a big deal.

Well, that's your jihad and not mine.

You seem to embrace this victim mentality where you are always arguing over perceived slights and other forms of unfairness towards the current band or management, as you see it.  I have very little interest in that area of discussion.  This is a rock band I like and follow, not my family.  You argue this stuff like I am insulting your family.

[jarmo]

I think a band is judged for what they can do when they write and record an album.  You are willing to say that a bunch of other people who are long gone can write and record songs they left behind, and if a few new guys throw a few riffs over top of those songs...its the same thing.

No.

Didn't say that at all!
I pointed out that Ron and Frank are part of the recording we call Chinese Democracy. It's a fact.

I also pointed out how in the past a new person joined the band and didn't "create" any original material with the rest of the band, yet you don't seem to label that particular line up as not being a "real band".

You seem to embrace this victim mentality where you are always arguing over perceived slights and other forms of unfairness towards the current band or management, as you see it.  I have very little interest in that area of discussion.  This is a rock band I like and follow, not my family.  You argue this stuff like I am insulting your family.

Nope. Wrong.

I just don't get what I see as double standards.
If you're gonna have that kind of attitude, at least be honest about it.

Either you judge the whole history of GN'R the same way, or you don't. And if you don't, then you should be honest and say so.
It's a bit difficult to take a person who lacks consistency in a discussion that seriously.... 




/jarmo

[D-GenerationX]

You seem to embrace this victim mentality where you are always arguing over perceived slights and other forms of unfairness towards the current band or management, as you see it.  I have very little interest in that area of discussion.  This is a rock band I like and follow, not my family.  You argue this stuff like I am insulting your family.

Nope. Wrong.

Agree to disagree then. 

Just doesn't seem like much of anything can come down the pike without jumping to how the "haters" will react, as if that's what is important. 

Look at this very thread.  We have several people talking about Tommy's comments are a good thing (even known dissidents like myself) and where is your focus?  Forecasting how someone might have a problem down the line.  Or how you can't ever please everyone.  Or how some people were mean on the internet 6-8 years ago.

You seem very invested in keeping the dissension front and center, apparently so you can then rail against it.  That's a victim mentality.  Its unhealthy.

[jarmo]

Haha. That's funny.

I'm merely pointing out the ridiculousness in some of the complaints I see. It's hard to take many of these comments seriously because the complain is something, then something changes and it becomes something else. I think I already posted that we went from some people claiming the band doesn't want to move forward, yet here we have Tommy saying the opposite. So that whole idea went down the toilet. Good thing right? Not for some, because the album isn't out yet...

I see the absurdity in that. It's kinda funny. Does it bother me? No. I think it bothers some people when I point it out to them though.


I'm a victim? How's the possible? I'm not the one who's upset about the lack of an album.... Or get upset every time the band posts something about Internet trolls...
Ironic!

I'm not the one waking up every day going "Poor me! poor me! No new GN'R album today either!".
Nope. More like "Hell yeah! Exciting spring ahead!".



/jarmo

[bicycle handgrenade]

DX--

You are the one that has claimed there is no evidence to counter your claim that GNR is a greatest hits nostalgia act.

I provided ample evidence that countered your claim.

Since the evidence has been provided, you have absolutely refused to address said evidence or even address which of the points you disagree with.

So, you establish a faulty premise, declare that nothing could possibly contradict your position and when your position is contradicted, you refuse to acknowledge or address the information you previously claimed didn't exist.

Which then goes back to my earlier point. GNR's release schedule doesn't meet your personal expectations and therefore you've decided to lump GNR in with classic bands that play  the same 90 minute set of hits year after year. Even though nothing could be further from the truth.

? Nostalgia acts do not play 10-13 songs a night from their new album ever, let alone a year or two after release.

? Nostalgia acts do not play 7 songs a night from their new album ever, let alone three or four years after release.

? Nostalgia acts do not play 4 songs a night from their new album ever, let alone five years after release.

? Nostalgia acts show up, play the hits, and go home. They do not play for over three hours.

They do not play solo material from their members. They do not play random cover songs. They do not play deep cuts from their most recent album. They do not play deep cuts from their first album. They do not play deep cuts from EPs. They do not play b-sides from EPs. They do not skip out on playing some of their hits so that they have plenty of room in the set for material from their new album.

Etc etc etc.

The facts do not support your premise.

GNR may be a lot of things, but a jukebox hits machine is not one of them.

If you don't like the set, stay home. If you like the set, go. But whatever you do, please don't try to paint GNR as something they're not. When they start going out in the Summer to co-headline amphitheaters, play 70 mins of nothing but classic singles, and then go home, you let me know.

When they actually start behaving in a way that supports your premise, you let me know. Thanks.

[D-GenerationX]

Looks like a big loss for me then, huh? 

Well, coach 'em up, get 'em next time.

[DizzyReedsexmachine]

CD 2 is going to be amazing 

[raindogs70]

Nostalgia act is only when the audience is around the same age as the band, or slightly younger because they grew up on the music, the band members are out of high school while the singer's old enough to be collecting pension checks. At least with GNR they're all around the same age.  I think DJ was the last one to hit the big 4-0. Tommy's been in bands since he was a fetus.

[Gilbyfan]

Hey Tommy was telling the truth, sorta. We are getting a new album. It's just a live one that's all. Hey at least were getting a cd/dvd/blu ray of Appetite For Democracy while we wait for a new studio album.

[jarmo]

Pretty sure he didn't mean a live album.   


But if Universal is putting out the DVD/Blu-ray, maybe that could mean things between band and label are better?




/jarmo

[sofine11]

Pretty sure he didn't mean a live album.   


But if Universal is putting out the DVD/Blu-ray, maybe that could mean things between band and label are better?




/jarmo

Was thinking the same thing.  Hopefully, the label is acutely aware of what a great opportunity all the activity that is going on this spring will afford GNR and do their part to keep the momentum going. 

There's still a lot of time left in 2014, and a lot of finished music that could use their support.