Is Interscope/Geffen Blocking The Next Album's Release?

[D-GenerationX]

Why don't you just answer the question?

The universe at large is not conspiring against Axl Rose.  Knock it off.

You spend close to 10 years getting an album out.  We are now over 5 years since that release, and there isn't even a hint of a sniff of a rumor that anything new is on the way.  

To suggest Axl is waking up every day busting his ass to get shit done is completely preposterous.  We can even accept the tried and true "he doesn't owe you anything" routine.  But spare us that he's hard at work 24/7/365, but damn the luck, because these unseen boogeyman make it their life's mission to thwart him at every turn.  

That insults the intelligence of all involved.

[norway]

Axl isnt the flavor of the month with the record company obviously...and obviously all of us are not of that opinion... but maybe he has to adjust his thought process a little bit too.. find some common ground

It is not Axl. Rock is going scheise. Axl has the voice. If only the songs and the arrangements delivered...

The world is awaiting a return of good rockmusic.

[D-GenerationX]

Rock records from rock acts are released every week of every year.

From the up and comer right on through the arena tour level.  Every week, every year.

[jarmo]

Why don't you just answer the question?

The universe at large is not conspiring against Axl Rose.  Knock it off.

Are you serious? Is there really a need to try to ridicule the point I brought up?

You bring up more issues to try to discredit and ridicule.
He doesn't need to work 24/7 on new songs for what I said to be true.... Alll the artists and bands who had problems with their record companies were just not working hard enough for your liking?

People trying to force Axl into doing things that suit them hasn't worked so well over the years. But does that mean nobody is trying?

And no, I didn't say "the universe". That was your idea.

Rock records from rock acts are released every week of every year.

From the up and comer right on through the arena tour level.  Every week, every year.

That is amazing. 



/jarmo

[D-GenerationX]

Rock records from rock acts are released every week of every year.

From the up and comer right on through the arena tour level.  Every week, every year.

That is amazing. 

It truly is, really.

Even though labels hate releasing albums (when that's needed to spin GNR matters).  Even though labels aren't interested in rock (when that's needed to spin GNR matters).  Even though labels hate their artists and work against their interests (when that's needed to spin GNR matters).  Even though labels pay all sort of money for bands to record and then would rather the material never get put out so they might make some return on that investment (when that's needed to spin GNR matters).

Yet somehow, some way...all these albums keep coming out.  Truly incredible.

[jarmo]

It's amazing how good the record companies are at taking care of their artists since the original poster brought up MIA's album being rejected.

It's amazing how Prince felt he had to write SLAVE on his cheek because his record company was so good to him. It's amazing the Smashing Pumpkins couldn't release their Machina II album on their good record label so they released it for free instead. It's amazing how many major bands and artists decide to release music on their own terms even though the record labels are so great at releasing music!




/jarmo

[LongGoneDay]

The fact of the matter is, shit just didn't get done.
Regardless of why, Axl and GN'R has not accomplished much in the grand scheme of things since the split of the classic lineup.

They've had all the time in the world to get it together. Countless bands have formed, broken big and disbanded, more than once while managing to produce/create at a far greater level than GN'R has since '93. Making excuses for them is just that.

Trouble building the band over again essentially from scratch? Sure, understandable. But that's the decision he made and task he took on. Trouble keeping band members? Trouble creating an album the label is willing to release? Trouble creating in anything resembling a timely fashion? Yes I realize hindsight is 20/20, but that doesn't change the facts.
Axl wanted the GN'R name, so yes, the failures do fall at his feet, just like the credit and praise would have had he managed to make it work.

Axl doesn't get the luxury of the GN'R name PLUS immunity to criticism.
He opened himself up to it with his decisions, and I'd be shocked if he didn't know that himself.

[D-GenerationX]

The fact of the matter is, shit just didn't get done.
Regardless of why, Axl and GN'R has not accomplished much in the grand scheme of things since the split of the classic lineup.

They've had all the time in the world to get it together. Countless bands have formed, broken big and disbanded, more than once while managing to produce/create at a far greater level than GN'R has since '93. Making excuses for them is just that.

Trouble building the band over again essentially from scratch? Sure, understandable. But that's the decision he made and task he took on. Trouble keeping band members? Trouble creating an album the label is willing to release? Trouble creating in anything resembling a timely fashion? Yes I realize hindsight is 20/20, but that doesn't change the facts.
Axl wanted the GN'R name, so yes, the failures do fall at his feet, just like the credit and praise would have had he managed to make it work.

Axl doesn't get the luxury of the GN'R name PLUS immunity to criticism.
He opened himself up to it with his decisions, and I'd be shocked if he didn't know that himself.

Extremely well said.  The part in bold especially.

[sofine11]

Regardless of who's to blame, it's all just so....sad.

Axl fought so hard to retain control of the GNR name, only to put out 1 album, whether of his own choosing or label restrictions .  What happened to the multi album opus we were waiting for which would be married to years of touring?  Was the label never on board with any of this?  Did the Chinese Democracy fallout shell shock literally everyone involved into never wanting to go through those motions with a GNR album again?  Seems so.

Again, very sad.

[D-GenerationX]

Regardless of who's to blame, it's all just so....sad.

Axl fought so hard to retain control of the GNR name, only to put out 1 album, whether of his own choosing or label restrictions .  What happened to the multi album opus we were waiting for which would be married to years of touring?  Was the label never on board with any of this?  Did the Chinese Democracy fallout shell shock literally everyone involved into never wanting to go through those motions with a GNR album again?  Seems so.

Again, very sad.

No objective analysis of the operation post 1993 could label it a success.  You have to so lower the bar to deem it one, the term loses all meaning.

Getting one record out in 20 years and a few legs of touring here and there is not herculean in its accomplishment, not matter how you slice it.

[sofine11]

Regardless of who's to blame, it's all just so....sad.

Axl fought so hard to retain control of the GNR name, only to put out 1 album, whether of his own choosing or label restrictions .  What happened to the multi album opus we were waiting for which would be married to years of touring?  Was the label never on board with any of this?  Did the Chinese Democracy fallout shell shock literally everyone involved into never wanting to go through those motions with a GNR album again?  Seems so.

Again, very sad.

No objective analysis of the operation post 1993 could label it a success.  You have to so lower the bar to deem it one, the term loses all meaning.

Getting one record out in 20 years and a few legs of touring here and there is not herculean in its accomplishment, not matter how you slice it.

Fact is, other than the forum chats, Axl did absolutely nothing on his end to promote Chinese Democracy.  When he was questioned about this during the chats in regard to wouldn't the album do better if he was promoting it, his response was "That is your opinion and you may very well be right" and went on to say that he thought the label was going to do more to promote it.  Well, what exactly could they have done better without Axl's heavy involvement, which was denied to them.

We know Axl's never been fond of the "Meet em' half way" mindset.  When you look at it that way, and after the luke-warm at best sales of Chinese Democracy, what real incentive does the label have to enthusiastically pursue another Guns N' Roses album?  Little to none would be my guess.

[jarmo]

Depends how you see success.

The album everybody said would never come out, did come out. The current band has played more shows "here and there" than the Use Your Illusion line ups, combined. That's more shows than Matt Sorum played in GN'R, with Izzy AND Gilby.

I wonder if it would be considered a success by you if GN'R put out two albums of material in a year since success seems to be related to how many songs you put out....
Or would it then be about how many copies were sold, how many awards it won and how good the reviews were?



/jarmo

[JAEBALL]

Depends how you see success.

The album everybody said would never come out, did come out. The current band has played more shows "here and there" than the Use Your Illusion line ups, combined. That's more shows than Matt Sorum played in GN'R, with Izzy AND Gilby.





I wonder if it would be considered a success by you if GN'R put out two albums of material in a year since success seems to be related to how many songs you put out....
Or would it then be about how many copies were sold, how many awards it won and how good the reviews were?




/jarmo

I have never understood the Use ur Illusion "lineup" ... it was a different drummer and Gilbey filled in for izzy at the shows... it was still izzy's material and recordings
and since we love to explain the amount of shows played by certain "lineups" around here... who has played more shows? im just curious i guess i could figure it out

buckethead, fink and brain or ron dj and frank?

but tot he topic at hand and to answer ur question... yes we all would judge their success based on all of those things included with how we feel about the songs

but if there is a limited amount of material there isn't much to judge...and yes 1 album in 20 years while maybe isn't a failure...it certainly is disappointing

[sofine11]

Point is, there were some bad feelings on both sides of the fence that left a bad taste in the mouths of both Axl & the label after the release of Chinese Democracy.  Remember how the label claimed that Axl went completely MIA during the fall of 2008?  And, of course, all you need to do is re-read the Billboard interview to see how Axl felt the label handled the release of Chinese, which also put Jimmy Iovine through the ringer.

In retrospect, it's no wonder Axl went from being excited about the next album during his forum-chats to "No idea and don't care" during the Del interview a few months later.  

Let's just hope the last couple of years have seen some MAJOR patching up of these issues, and that some concessions are made on both sides to get the next album out.

[JAEBALL]

Point is, there were some bad feelings on both sides of the fence that left a bad taste in the mouths of both Axl & the label after the release of Chinese Democracy.  Remember how the label claimed that Axl went completely MIA during the fall of 2008?  And, of course, all you need to do is re-read the Billboard interview to see how Axl felt the label handled the release of Chinese, which also put Jimmy Iovine through the ringer.

In retrospect, it's no wonder Axl went from being excited about the next album during his forum-chats to "No idea and don't care" during the Del interview a few months later.  

Let's just hope the last couple of years have seen some MAJOR patching up of these issues, and that some concessions are made on both sides to get the next album out.

I agree... nobody benefits from them bitching with each other.... including us

[D-GenerationX]

Depends how you see success.

The album everybody said would never come out, did come out. The current band has played more shows "here and there" than the Use Your Illusion line ups, combined. That's more shows than Matt Sorum played in GN'R, with Izzy AND Gilby.

This is exactly what I was talking about. 

Its how far you want to lower the bar to be able to call it a success.  It depends how much a person is willing to do so.  Is it a successful date as long as the other person actually shows up and doesn't spit on you?  It is if that is what you are willing to accept as defining success, I suppose.

I wonder if it would be considered a success by you if GN'R put out two albums of material in a year since success seems to be related to how many songs you puout....
Or would it then be about how many copies were sold, how many awards it won and how good the reviews were?

This is actually very easy to answer. 

It would be a success if Axl simply gave a shit.  Let's say he put out 3 albums over the past 12 years.  He laid it all out there, wore it on his sleeve, and put his heart and soul into giving it a chance to succeed.  Even if all 3 album totally tanked, you'd have to respect him for trying.  He wanted things his way, he gave his way a shot.  That's success.

What was that old Matt Sorum quote?  It was something like "Axl wanted things his way.  He's either going to take the ball and run with it or drop the ball.  He dropped the ball."  My wording might be off a bit, but that was the gist.  And I agree.

If you asked anyone in 1997 if by 2014 they would have one new GNR album released under cover of night and not promoted and various legs of the same tour, and would they consider that a success...what would they say?  Be honest, if you can.

[JAEBALL]

it always morphs in to this back n forth...

I just want all parties to be a little more flexible moving forward...they need to meet half way on certain things... at least thats the way it appears

[D-GenerationX]

it always morphs in to this back n forth...

I just want all parties to be a little more flexible moving forward...they need to meet half way on certain things... at least thats the way it appears

Like sofine11 said, the label is likely pretty pissed with Axl's disappearing act in 2008.  That might be hard to overcome. 

[LongGoneDay]

Depends how you see success.

The album everybody said would never come out, did come out. The current band has played more shows "here and there" than the Use Your Illusion line ups, combined. That's more shows than Matt Sorum played in GN'R, with Izzy AND Gilby.

I wonder if it would be considered a success by you if GN'R put out two albums of material in a year since success seems to be related to how many songs you put out....
Or would it then be about how many copies were sold, how many awards it won and how good the reviews were?



/jarmo

It's really hard for me to be impressed by the amount of touring GN'R has done.
I mean, don't get me wrong, I've seen them multiple times, and I rank the '06 Hammerstein up with my favorites so I'm grateful for the opportunity.

But the fact that they've toured more than Izzy, is that really a feather in their cap?
Izzy co-wrote most of those songs the current band is touring behind, and he did quite a bit or touring himself.

I'm really not sure it's a win for the current lineup that they've toured more than the classic, yet produced 1/5 of what the classic lineup did in 6 years.

Touring is how bands make their money today, so glad they are getting theirs and fans are getting multiple chances to see a great live show, but tough to see it as any more than that.

And to answer your question, no I don't think releasing new music necessarily equals success.
If they release music for the sake of it, and it's obviously half hearted, that doesn't do anyone any good.

Not really a concern at this point in time though, as records aren't the cash grabs they used to be.

I don't personally equate releasing albums as success, but I certainly do equate 1 album since '93, '98 what have you, by an active band a failure.

[jarmo]

Well, they played more shows than one of the line ups many consider classic. Which means we can put the "its not a band" shit to rest. So in that sense it's a success. All the "Axl can't keep a band together" shit is irrelevant.

Just like for years we heard "GN'R always cancel shows" or "Axl is always late". Those aren't exactly true anymore either.

Some just forget fast what they were "criticizing" the week before and find something else. No new album -> No tour -> Late starts -> same setlist etc etc.... 




/jarmo