Is Interscope/Geffen Blocking The Next Album's Release?

[sofine11]

I was reading the below article about how Interscope recently rejected MIA's new album for not being "dark" enough. This got me thinking: Could the label be doing the same thing to Axl in regards to the next Guns album? Perhaps holding out for something more traditional & hard rock sounding?

Here's Axl's most recent, albeit brief, description of what the next album was going to be in the 2009 Del James interview: "What I can say is if you don't like this [Chinese Democracy], then you probably won't like that [the next album]. Same people, lots more approaches, bit meaner in places and darker in some. Robin does a really great Stevie Ray Vaughan-type solo on one track."

Fast forward 5 years & we've still yet to hear that album.

I for one loved Chinese Democracy, and was really looking forward to hearing the rest of the rumored titles we've been given over the years. I really hope that disagreements over the next album's sound will not keep the next album in limbo for years on end.

DJ has said countless times in interviews that he turned in "10 demos" a couple years back. Could this mean that Axl is slowly shifting back to a more traditional hard rock sound for the next release, possibly due to label pressure?


www.stereogum.com/1229881/m-i-a-s-matangi-rejected-by-label-for-being-too-positive/news/

[BangoSkank]

People really blame Axl's perfectionism for holding things up, but there has to be a ton of label politics involved too.

[D-GenerationX]

Here is something I have considered.

First off, I don't believe Axl has an album together enough to even turn in to be turned down.  I'm talking in terms of mixing and the like, the finishing touches.

But...what is missing on 'Chinese'?  Choruses.  I really like some of the songs, but they don't have many proper choruses. 

Could it be the old line about "the A&R man said 'I don't hear a single'"?

[sofine11]

Here is something I have considered.

First off, I don't believe Axl has an album together enough to even turn in to be turned down.  I'm talking in terms of mixing and the like, the finishing touches.

But...what is missing on 'Chinese'?  Choruses.  I really like some of the songs, but they don't have many proper choruses. 

Could it be the old line about "the A&R man said 'I don't hear a single'"?

I've considered this as well in regard to the next album.  And while I'm sure we (GNR die hards) will all love The General & Atlas Shrugged, I imagine their structure & style will be on par with tracks like TWAT, Catcher, & Prostitute....Amazing musical pieces, BUT definitely not your typical "don't bore us, get to the chorus" rock tracks.  Not very radio/single friendly.

Chinese Democracy was, at best, a lukewarm success sales-wise.  At worst, it was a "commercial" failure.  And that's with all the hype surrounding the "most anticipated album of all time". This album does not have that mystique.

Do they really want to gamble?  Well, I certainly hope so.  But will they?  It remains to be seen.

[One.In.A.Million]

Doesn't matter about what the album will sound like, the label I believe is more concerned about the GN'R of today, image wise. The label doesn't really care really what the albums direction is in, they are more worried about GN'R's image globally and in the media. They obviously are trying to push for some kind of reunion which will never happen, but I don't think they can accept the current band in terms of looks and worldwide appeal.

They see musicians representing Guns, who are not all over google, magazines, music videos... and they are propably worried over future sales based on the below forcased sales figures for CD, and they are thinking "Where do we go now?" pun intended. 

In fact, a GN'R that is industrial, synth based and experimental, much like the 2002 band. Are most likely more appealing than a band who are trying to recreate GN'R's rock n' roll past, because that can never be matched.

If the label is blocking a release, it's not because of the musical merits but because of GN'R's state of affairs in todays music world, both image wise and mass appeal...

[jarmo]

First off, I don't believe Axl has an album together enough to even turn in to be turned down.  I'm talking in terms of mixing and the like, the finishing touches.

Not exactly the point.... As long as songs are recorded, the record company, and anyone else involved in the release, would get an idea of what the finished completely mixed release would be like.


As a side note, I find it somewhat puzzling how some fans think Axl is the "bad guy". For taking his art seriously, for not letting others dictate what to do regarding his work.
So let's say something happens, and it's always his fault. Nobody assumes that people in the business might have egos? Journalists, people at the record companies, concert promoters, festival organizers, other artists etc etc. I've read enough Internet forums to know that some people have online egos, the old "my dad can beat up your dad" syndrome. So, that kind of thinking doesn't exist in the real world? Where people are dealing with big decisions and lots of money.... Not to mention they might have power over somebody. Even if it's just temporary. "I'll show you who's the boss!"....



/jarmo

[14 Yrs Of Silence]

I feel like Axl used to fight the good fight, and while he continues to stand his ground, it seems that he'd rather sit on the sidelines than deal with the forces that are against him.  Its pretty evident that Axl is a sensitive soul, and perhaps he's no longer willing to fight an uphill battle at the expense of his personal happiness.  Can't say I blame him. 

[faldor]

Doesn't matter about what the album will sound like, the label I believe is more concerned about the GN'R of today, image wise. The label doesn't really care really what the albums direction is in, they are more worried about GN'R's image globally and in the media. They obviously are trying to push for some kind of reunion which will never happen, but I don't think they can accept the current band in terms of looks and worldwide appeal.

They see musicians representing Guns, who are not all over google, magazines, music videos... and they are propably worried over future sales based on the below forcased sales figures for CD, and they are thinking "Where do we go now?" pun intended. 

In fact, a GN'R that is industrial, synth based and experimental, much like the 2002 band. Are most likely more appealing than a band who are trying to recreate GN'R's rock n' roll past, because that can never be matched.

If the label is blocking a release, it's not because of the musical merits but because of GN'R's state of affairs in todays music world, both image wise and mass appeal...

I think it's a combination of all things that have been discussed here.  First off, Axl is a perfectionist, so things don't move too swiftly.  He's not going to change his ways after so much time, nor should he.  The band has a contentious relationship with the label, so it wouldn't appear that either is going to bend over backwards for the other.  Either side can, probably has, and probably will continue to dick each other around just because they can.

Ultimately, there's not much money to be made with album sales anymore outside of the pop world, which obviously GNR is not a part of.  Luckily for them, they can make good coin out on the road, but they don't stand to gain all that much financially with another album release.  Same for the label.  They probably don't think a new release would sell like hotcakes, so it's not at the top of their priority list. 

GNR needs someone at the record company to be on their side, to believe in them, to be a fan.  I don't know if that person exists.  If not, it seems like an extreme uphill battle to release another album for a variety of reasons that we can't even begin to imagine or understand.

[GnR-NOW]

If there is label problems. It's hard to keep fighting the same battles.

[GNR4L]

They would be stupid not to accept or promote a new Guns CD.  Then again we are talking about the music industry.... the one's that didn't embrace the internet.  They want all the money they can squeeze out of a reunion... but it WILL NEVER HAPPEN.  GnR has a lot of momentum with 3 hr shows, great fan reviews, starting on time, playing festivals.  People are becoming more acceptable of the current lineup.  I think we will see a 2014 release just my personal opinion, if it doesn't happen oh well... I won't be mad, as long as they tour 

[ITARocker]

Obviously they aren't...

Fact: labels have no money. GNR is still an historical trademark who can relatively sell  a lot. So why should they stop Mr. Rose? 

Option 1: they have shitty material...but if it were for the label, it would have been already released, anyway.
Option 2: they have no finished material

What i think about it: new line up hasn't written a fuckin song since bumblefoot joined the band in 2006 (8 fuckin years). Maybe axl want to record/ mix something along with the new line up but there's already been a huge waste of money so that label want to release the old material first (even if it sucks) but axl stopped it.
So that's why he's not been truly interested in recording new material.

[spgunner]

I just hope everything goes the way Axl wants and that IF there's a new record and WHEN it's released (doesn't matter when) I hope it happens the way he wants and that it won't be a messy release the way Chinese Democracy was (as regards the record company, booklet, etc).
I do have hopes to hear more songs from the CD era with Bucket, Robin, Paul and Brain plus additional stuff from the current band. The songs from Chinese Democracy are so great that makes me wonder what else was done back then!
I also wonder about the remixes album and the other booklets. I know it's been a long time and that we'll probably never see the light of day for these two precious items but hope is the last to die! !!
5 years past its release I still hear Chinese Democracy basically on daily basis and much more than any other GN'R album. And I still find myself amused and surprised by many things inside of this work of art.

[D-GenerationX]

As a side note, I find it somewhat puzzling how some fans think Axl is the "bad guy".

Yeah, we know you do, Jarmo.  Believe me.

So let's say something happens, and it's always his fault. Nobody assumes that people in the business might have egos?

Of course we realize that.

However, we could just as easily ask you why you NEVER think its his fault.  To be blunt, I'd rather defend any of us on the matter than you.  Even we awful, rotten, no good, complaining fans at times take Axl's side of it.  You?  You NEVER put the blame on him.  The closest you come is to lecture us on speculating without "the facts".  The comedy there being that we are jerkoffs for speculating he's in the wrong because we can't support that with "the facts".  You, on the hand, can speculate all you want about how Axl is the greatest guy ever working his ass off to give something to the fans.  And despite you not having "the facts" to back any of it up, that's no problem.

Come on now.

[JAEBALL]

I dont think that Axl is a or the bad guy .... firstly i don't know him personally ha and at thee end of the day he is just a rock n roll singer...

I just think he has handled certain aspects of the GNR saga very poorly... not all of it his fault... but at the end of the day it falls on him.



his stubbornness to the way he wants to do things (i.e. how he wants the label to approach his work) is honorable to an extent... but the fan in me who wants the product loses out



I just really cant believe that the label wouldn't allow him to release another album of stuff that they have already paid for.... for what? to spite themselves?

would they really never release more tracks to force him to call Slash? they gotta know thats never happening right?

or they wont release it because the songs are too dark and dont have choruses, not radio friendly? (they aren't but thats besides the point)

the money is already spent.... why wouldn't they wanna try to recover at least some of it?

all speculation at the end of the day

[D-GenerationX]

his stubbornness to the way he wants to do things (i.e. how he wants the label to approach his work) is honorable to an extent... but the fan in me who wants the product loses out

I think this is really the bottom line.

I think people convincing themselves how great is that Axl "refuses to play their game" is little more than Stockholm Syndrome.  Its not easy putting a good spin on all this inactivity.  So they look as hard as they can for a silver lining, and settled on that.

[JAEBALL]

his stubbornness to the way he wants to do things (i.e. how he wants the label to approach his work) is honorable to an extent... but the fan in me who wants the product loses out

I think this is really the bottom line.

I think people convincing themselves how great is that Axl "refuses to play their game" is little more than Stockholm Syndrome.  Its not easy putting a good spin on all this inactivity.  So they look as hard as they can for a silver lining, and settled on that.

yeah I can't disagree

Maybe Axl has had a hard time coming to grips with the fact that he isnt 28 years old anymore and it isn't of the same value to geffen/interscope as he once was for many different reasons (different band, different era of music, different economy, people dont buy records anymore)

and because of this they treat him differently and he cant come to terms with why causing such a rift between both sides

[norway]

In fact, a GN'R that is industrial, synth based and experimental, much like the 2002 band. Are most likely more appealing than a band who are trying to recreate GN'R's rock n' roll past, because that can never be matched.

tru dat, maybe Axl is playing this 'safe'. I 4 one would <3 some spite_musicly_ coming from him.

[jarmo]

However, we could just as easily ask you why you NEVER think its his fault.  To be blunt, I'd rather defend any of us on the matter than you.  Even we awful, rotten, no good, complaining fans at times take Axl's side of it.  You?  You NEVER put the blame on him.  The closest you come is to lecture us on speculating without "the facts".  The comedy there being that we are jerkoffs for speculating he's in the wrong because we can't support that with "the facts".  You, on the hand, can speculate all you want about how Axl is the greatest guy ever working his ass off to give something to the fans.  And despite you not having "the facts" to back any of it up, that's no problem.

Come on now.

Nice twist.

It's easy to feel better about yourself and point fingers in hindsight isn't it?

Why don't you just answer the question? I guess in a way you did and then started attacking me.
Same old, same old.


The whole point is that some of you think nobody else seems to be able to "fight" against Axl and/or the band. That everybody wants what's best for him and GN'R. I don't buy it.
This isn't about whether or not I support or believe Axl, it's about the fact that there are a bunch of other people in the business and maybe, just maybe, they're not just easy going music lovers who happen to be huge fans of Axl and GN'R....




/jarmo

[norway]

"I'll show you who's the boss!"....

mhm, remember that axl sued over that guitar-hero thing. Slash hasn't representet gnr since 96.

[JAEBALL]

The whole point is that some of you think nobody else seems to be able to "fight" against Axl and/or the band. That everybody wants what's best for him and GN'R. I don't buy it.
This isn't about whether or not I support or believe Axl, it's about the fact that there are a bunch of other people in the business and maybe, just maybe, they're not just easy going music lovers who happen to be huge fans of Axl and GN'R....




/jarmo
[/quote]


this is kinda what I am talking about... Axl isnt the flavor of the month with the record company obviously...and obviously all of us are not of that opinion... but maybe he has to adjust his thought process a little bit too.. find some common ground