Enjoy the read: Chinese Democracy leak story

[sofine11]

Per Axl, the first round of leaks from February 2006 (Better, IRS, TWAT) came from that time he pre-viewed tracks at The Crazy Horse Too in Las Vegas during the summer of 2003, when he played them for someone he was considering working with.   

And this is really just my case in point.

Those leaks in 2006 were pretty much good to go.  A few minor tweaks were made, but nothing radically different. 

But he got someone involved in in the process a full three years earlier that burned him.  And from there, he waits ANOTHER 2 years.

Yep, for nearly three years whoever had them did not share them with anyone.  We didn't even know Better existed until Axl mentioned it in that Rolling Stone interview a month prior to the leaks.  As you said, eventually they just said "Fuck it".

With potentially coveted songs like The General, Soul Monster & Atlas as much as I'd love to see them part of a proper release, my guess would be the same damn thing is going to happen eventually.

[D-GenerationX]

I actually have a slightly different take.  A sort of positive spin.  Well...sort of.

While leaks are not good for an artist, its sort of is for our artist.  I personally will not believe any sort of work is being done on a new album until there is a another leak.

[sofine11]

I actually have a slightly different take.  A sort of positive spin.  Well...sort of.

While leaks are not good for an artist, its sort of is for our artist.  I personally will not believe any sort of work is being done on a new album until there is a another leak.

I could see that.  Sort of a "Where there's smoke, there's fire" type of thing.

I feel that way when I see management flip out when something leaks.  Gives me a flicker of hope, albeit short-lived. 

[JAEBALL]

My take is a little different... i don't believe the leaks had anything to do with the timing of the release....

as Del James said...and i consider him to be a VERY credible source...

CD was released when Axl was ready to release it.........


which is mind boggling on its own... but i dont think the leaks played much of a part in that ... and if it did... well then thats silly!

[D-GenerationX]

My take is a little different... i don't believe the leaks had anything to do with the timing of the release....

as Del James said...and i consider him to be a VERY credible source...

CD was released when Axl was ready to release it.........


which is mind boggling on its own... but i dont think the leaks played much of a part in that ... and if it did... well then thats silly!

I remember it being floated that the leaks were intentional to gauge interest.  There was certainly some basis for it.

Axl went totally M.I.A. after Philly in 2002.  The three songs that leak are suddenly in the setlist.  No one int he GNR camp seemed to want scalps over the leaks, when with each subsequent leak episode they wanted blood.

[sofine11]

I always did find it utterly bizarre that of 14 tracks slated for Chinese, they chose the 3 that leaked to debut live on that tour.  Coincidence?

[Ali]

But, if the CD with the leaks really came from off of Jimmy Iovine's desk, I'm not sure why you think the length of time had any effect on the probability of a leak.  This wasn't some person brought on to work on the project.  This is the head of GN'R's record company.  The record could've been worked on for two years with someone walking into Jimmy Iovine's office while he was in the process of listening to the record and made or taken a copy, which subsequently leaked.

But that article only talk about the Antiquiet version of the leaks.

We got 3 leaks right before the Hammerstein shows in early spring of 2006.  I had those leaks on my iPod for over 2 full years before I even heard of Skwerl or Antiquiet.

The overall point is that the long wait produces too many variables.  Get on with it already.

If you wrote and record a song in 2003...what is the hold up here?  It needs an (up to this point) 11 year delay in getting released?

Let me be clear:  I fully understand your point and agree with it in theory.  If you're talking about the first set of leaks, that very well may have been the case, although Axl himself said it was because he played the leaks for someone and somehow they were recorded.

Had the Antiquiet leaks come from Caram Costanzo, you could easily make the case that had the album been wrapped up with Sean Beavan or RTB, instead of at least the third producer, the songs may not have leaked.  THAT would be a situation where the particular lesson you describe could and should be learned. 

But, if what Skwerl said is true, and the Antiquiet leaks came from Jimmy Iovine and were taken or copied off his desk, I think that could've happened irrespective of time spent making the album.  So, I don't think the particular lesson you're talking about could necessarily be learned in THIS case.

Ali

[Ali]

Per Axl, the first round of leaks from February 2006 (Better, IRS, TWAT) came from that time he pre-viewed tracks at The Crazy Horse Too in Las Vegas during the summer of 2003, when he played them for someone he was considering working with.   

And this is really just my case in point.

Those leaks in 2006 were pretty much good to go.  A few minor tweaks were made, but nothing radically different. 

But he got someone involved in in the process a full three years earlier that burned him.  And from there, he waits ANOTHER 2 years.

I disagree with that.  The mixes of all the songs that leaked were much better, crisper and cleaner on the album version the leaked version, particularly the 2006 leaks.

That alone makes the album versions preferable to listen to, for me, at least.

Ali

[D-GenerationX]

I always did find it utterly bizarre that of 14 tracks slated for Chinese, they chose the 3 that leaked to debut live on that tour.  Coincidence?

Does seem weird.

And Axl was even joking about it in some of those early shows.  Joking about "downloading motherfuckers" and how we knew the words.

[D-GenerationX]

I disagree with that.  The mixes of all the songs that leaked were much better, crisper and cleaner on the album version the leaked version, particularly the 2006 leaks.

That alone makes the album versions preferable to listen to, for me, at least.

Ali

The only leak I prefer to the finished version is 'Prostitute'.

What the hell is that crunchy sound (for lack of a better term) that is underneath the track on the finished version?

[sofine11]

If I had to guess what's going to leak next, it's going to be Silkworms.  Because MSL has it & whether he does it himself or indirectly, he loves the attention he gets from GNR fans when something leaks.

As we saw from the recent 'Going Down' leak, it's only a matter of time before that 10K muzzle they put on him comes loose.

[D-GenerationX]

I also think it would be something we have already heard in at least some form.

I'd be pretty shocked if it was a totally new song, completely unheard.

[sofine11]

Jackie Chan has been floating around all these years, although whoever has is likely scared to let the dogs loose with that one.  Who knows? But yeah, I tend to think Silkworms, OMG or both.

[gnrfan1797]

I disagree with that.  The mixes of all the songs that leaked were much better, crisper and cleaner on the album version the leaked version, particularly the 2006 leaks.

That alone makes the album versions preferable to listen to, for me, at least.

Ali

The only leak I prefer to the finished version is 'Prostitute'.


What the hell is that crunchy sound (for lack of a better term) that is underneath the track on the finished version?

I liked the Blues when it debuted in rock and rio still better to this day.

[One.In.A.Million]

Talking about leaks, who else thinks that the leak of "If The World" was in some ways superior to the album version?. I preferred how the "laaaa, la, laaaa, laaa la's" in between the verses, was the same volume as the rest of the song. I'm not a fan of how in the album version it pans from left to right, as it goes REALLY quiet.

Just something I've always felt...

[faldor]

Let's face it, Axl probably isn't the easiest guy to deal with, especially when it comes to business. He wants things done in a way that benefit him and the band. He's not concerned with making the label money. The label obviously is looking out for their own interests and after their less than stellar dealings with Axl over the years, they're probably not eager to bend over backwards to make things more comfortable for him. Plus, we all know they'd rather have other notable former members in the band and lots of people in the business seem to think if they make life difficult for Axl, they could accomplish this. It sure seems like a losing battle to me, but they really have nothing to lose. The 2 sides don't work well together, that's painfully easy to see. So why some think it'd be so easy to just release another album is beyond me. Have you not been following this saga for the last 10-15 years?

[D-GenerationX]

I disagree with that.  The mixes of all the songs that leaked were much better, crisper and cleaner on the album version the leaked version, particularly the 2006 leaks.

That alone makes the album versions preferable to listen to, for me, at least.

Ali

The only leak I prefer to the finished version is 'Prostitute'.


What the hell is that crunchy sound (for lack of a better term) that is underneath the track on the finished version?

I liked the Blues when it debuted in rock and rio still better to this day.

Oh, no doubt.  Taking out that initial guitar part was a step backwards, in my view.

That concert is still my favorite version of 'Madagascar' and 'Chinese' too.  'Chinese' is a simple straight forward rocker.  Not sure it needed all that added nonsense on the album.

[D-GenerationX]

Let's face it, Axl probably isn't the easiest guy to deal with, especially when it comes to business. He wants things done in a way that benefit him and the band. He's not concerned with making the label money. The label obviously is looking out for their own interests and after their less than stellar dealings with Axl over the years, they're probably not eager to bend over backwards to make things more comfortable for him. Plus, we all know they'd rather have other notable former members in the band and lots of people in the business seem to think if they make life difficult for Axl, they could accomplish this. It sure seems like a losing battle to me, but they really have nothing to lose. The 2 sides don't work well together, that's painfully easy to see. So why some think it'd be so easy to just release another album is beyond me. Have you not been following this saga for the last 10-15 years?

But in order to accept that premise, you need to accept this.

Axl is going to get a finished record done.  He's going to present it to the label.  The label will then say "eh...no thanks."

Simply put, is that credible?  The first part isn't even credible, because it suggests Axl gets to work.  But let's pretend that is real world.  He gets the album done and turns it in. 

At that point, the label is so dug in on forcing a reunion and/or just fucking with Axl, um...because (depending who you ask) that they tell him to piss off?

[GeorgeSteele]

Let's face it, Axl probably isn't the easiest guy to deal with, especially when it comes to business. He wants things done in a way that benefit him and the band. He's not concerned with making the label money. The label obviously is looking out for their own interests and after their less than stellar dealings with Axl over the years, they're probably not eager to bend over backwards to make things more comfortable for him. Plus, we all know they'd rather have other notable former members in the band and lots of people in the business seem to think if they make life difficult for Axl, they could accomplish this. It sure seems like a losing battle to me, but they really have nothing to lose. The 2 sides don't work well together, that's painfully easy to see. So why some think it'd be so easy to just release another album is beyond me. Have you not been following this saga for the last 10-15 years?

But in order to accept that premise, you need to accept this.

Axl is going to get a finished record done.  He's going to present it to the label.  The label will then say "eh...no thanks."

Simply put, is that credible?  The first part isn't even credible, because it suggests Axl gets to work.  But let's pretend that is real world.  He gets the album done and turns it in. 

At that point, the label is so dug in on forcing a reunion and/or just fucking with Axl, um...because (depending who you ask) that they tell him to piss off?

Thing is, the label's involvement comes before a record gets done.  The process of making a record costs big money.  Who pays for that?  There's been big numbers thrown around about how much the label paid to make Chinese; I don't know what to believe, but I'm sure it was a lot and not something that the label is interested in fronting this time around.

[Ginger King]

Let's face it, Axl probably isn't the easiest guy to deal with, especially when it comes to business. He wants things done in a way that benefit him and the band. He's not concerned with making the label money. The label obviously is looking out for their own interests and after their less than stellar dealings with Axl over the years, they're probably not eager to bend over backwards to make things more comfortable for him. Plus, we all know they'd rather have other notable former members in the band and lots of people in the business seem to think if they make life difficult for Axl, they could accomplish this. It sure seems like a losing battle to me, but they really have nothing to lose. The 2 sides don't work well together, that's painfully easy to see. So why some think it'd be so easy to just release another album is beyond me. Have you not been following this saga for the last 10-15 years?

But in order to accept that premise, you need to accept this.

Axl is going to get a finished record done.  He's going to present it to the label.  The label will then say "eh...no thanks."

Simply put, is that credible?  The first part isn't even credible, because it suggests Axl gets to work.  But let's pretend that is real world.  He gets the album done and turns it in. 

At that point, the label is so dug in on forcing a reunion and/or just fucking with Axl, um...because (depending who you ask) that they tell him to piss off?

Thing is, the label's involvement comes before a record gets done.  The process of making a record costs big money.  Who pays for that?  There's been big numbers thrown around about how much the label paid to make Chinese; I don't know what to believe, but I'm sure it was a lot and not something that the label is interested in fronting this time around.

What's there to front, though?  Aren't there already songs completed?  It's not like they are at square one.  We know there are songs in the queue ready to go.  I find it hard to believe that the evil record company is the one preventing their release.