"Next Album" rumor / speculation thread *UPDATE AUG 22/2023*

[mortismurphy]

I had tickets for the 2001 tour (I will admit, I am getting my cancelled tours a bit mixed up here). If this was the same tour that Axl read about on the net, it was Axl who pulled the plug on it, not the management. Goldstein lost his job soon after, which tells you something.

I have just offered additional supporting evidence that CD failed, including two contemporary articles, and comparison with other rock releases from the year 2008. But I suppose, despite producing factual evidence, I am still 'lying' because this evidence does not tell you want you want to believe and does not sustain your Prozac fantasy of absolute positivity.

[jarmo]

I had tickets for the 2001 tour (I will admit, I am getting my cancelled tours a bit mixed up here). If this was the same tour that Axl read about on the net, it was Axl who pulled the plug on it, not the management. Goldstein lost his job soon after, which tells you something.

He admitted to making a mistake. Yet since he's your idol, you won't blame him. Only current management would make a mistake according to you.
That's you in a nutshell.

No shame in that. Just admit it.

I have just offered additional supporting evidence that CD failed, including two contemporary articles, and comparison with other rock releases from the year 2008. But I suppose, despite producing factual evidence, I am still 'lying' because this evidence does not tell you want you want to believe and does not sustain your Prozac fantasy of absolute positivity.

I'm not gonna take anything you say seriously until you start looking at actual facts and not ignore them based on how "you remember things".
You make up shit, and then expect us to have a proper discussion with you while you ignore facts that prove you remember things wrong.

Go back to the $1.99 the week after its release thing. Settle that one first.


Just because an album didn't sell the most of the rock albums in 2008 doesn't make it a failure.

Your two articles prove that A. Best Buy didn't pull out the same marketing campaign that Walmart did for AC/DC and B. that many albums sold less than expected.

I was there, in the USA, when it was released. I walked into a Best Buy in Hollywood only to find them having the latest Will Smith DVD on display at the entrance. Chinese Democracy was hidden inside the store. Best Buy has limited reach compared to Walmart. I'm sure you won't even consider that one.



Keep throwing those insults. It'll really extend your posting career here.





/jarmo

[mortismurphy]

I had tickets for the 2001 tour (I will admit, I am getting my cancelled tours a bit mixed up here). If this was the same tour that Axl read about on the net, it was Axl who pulled the plug on it, not the management. Goldstein lost his job soon after, which tells you something.

He admitted to making a mistake. Yet since he's your idol, you won't blame him. Only current management would make a mistake according to you.
That's you in a nutshell.

No shame in that. Just admit it.

If a management has booked a tour, against the intentions of their artist, then the management has made a mistake.

I have just offered additional supporting evidence that CD failed, including two contemporary articles, and comparison with other rock releases from the year 2008. But I suppose, despite producing factual evidence, I am still 'lying' because this evidence does not tell you want you want to believe and does not sustain your Prozac fantasy of absolute positivity.

I'm not gonna take anything you say seriously until you start looking at actual facts and not ignore them based on how "you remember things".
You make up shit, and then expect us to have a proper discussion with you while you ignore facts that prove you remember things wrong.

Go back to the $1.99 the week after its release thing. Settle that one first.


Just because an album didn't sell the most of the rock albums in 2008 doesn't make it a failure.
Keep throwing those insults. It'll really extend your posting career here.


/jarmo

I will spell it out for you in the most factual way I can, in a way I cannot be possibly accused of lying (which is slander incidentally),

Chinese Democracy: 261,000
Death Magnetic: 490,000
Viva la Vida: 720,000
Black Ice: 784,000

Notice the big numbers jump, from 261,000 to 490,000, and again, from 490,00 into the 700,000s? Such is the difference between success and failure.

I have been accused (wrongly) of avoiding evidence which defeats my own opinions, yet have answered every allegation that has been put before me. I have been accused of lying yet have produced statistics and contemporary articles, both of which have been dismissed (by another user) or ignored (by you). The hypocrisy and blindness around here is startling.

[GNR2014]

This is really boring.   
Lock this thread and start a new one about the "next album." 

[mortismurphy]

This is really boring.   
Lock this thread and start a new one about the "next album." 

I do not think there is any need for that. If there is any news about the next album, everybody will automatically cease bickering anyway and start discussing the news.

[jarmo]

If a management has booked a tour, against the intentions of their artist, then the management has made a mistake.

Thank you!

I will spell it out for you in the most factual way I can, in a way I cannot be possibly accused of lying (which is slander incidentally),

Chinese Democracy: 261,000
Death Magnetic: 490,000
Viva la Vida: 720,000
Black Ice: 784,000

Notice the big numbers jump, from 261,000 to 490,000, and again, from 490,00 into the 700,000s? Such is the difference between success and failure.

Coldplay?  

So you think it's a failure to sell that many copies of an album that was pretty much labeled by the media as "not Guns n' Roses"? And it was only sold at Best Buy.
Do you acknowledge the fact that Metallica's album was sold everywhere and AC/DC had the backing of possibly the biggest retail store chain in the USA?

Did you take into account the 8.4 million streams of the album on Myspace before its release? Did any of the others offer their album for free the days before its release?

Did you know Chinese Democracy sold more in its first week than "The Spaghetti Incident?" did? "The Spaghetti Incident?" debuted at #4 on album chart with 189,648 sales in November 1993. In 1993! Before Internet piracy!

Chinese Democracy also had the highest unit sales number of any Interscope Geffen A&M debut in 2008.

After six weeks, it had passed 500,000 sold in the USA.

The album still gets talked about. It's still remembered. For good and bad. But still remembered. I don't see that much talk about Black Ice....
Readers of Billboard voted it the #6 album of 2008. Ahead of any of your examples. Rolling Stone readers voted it at #5 (Coldplay beat GN'R in that one).

Did any of those other albums leak in almost their entirety months before the release?

Easy to forget certain things when you're focused on the so called failure.

 

I have been accused (wrongly) of avoiding evidence which defeats my own opinions, yet have answered every allegation that has been put before me. I have been accused of lying yet have produced statistics and contemporary articles, both of which have been dismissed (by another user) or ignored (by you). The hypocrisy and blindness around here is startling.

You lied about the $1.99 thing. Yes, you claim you remember it that way, but you presented it as a fact.

You present something as a fact while others tell you you were wrong and you can't find evidence to back up your statement.
Then it seems like you just ignore it because "That's how I remember it and you can't tell me I'm wrong!"






/jarmo

[mortismurphy]

Ahh, so there are certain 'modifying factors', are they, factors which do not exist for other artists but W. Axl Rose?

Coldplay?  :rofl

Subjective.

that was pretty much labeled by the media as "not Guns n' Roses"?

Any evidence for this? You are always asking for evidence from me, so I am going to reciprocate here. 

And it was only sold at Best Buy.

Do you acknowledge the fact that Metallica's album was sold everywhere and AC/DC had the backing of possibly the biggest retail store chain in the USA?

Possessing a major retail giant with massive amounts of economic resources such as Best Buy is a, negative? Also, Chinese Democracy was sold everywhere, outside the United States, and it did not exactly set the world on fire, either. It sold better outside of the United States, but still under par.

Did you take into account the 8.4 million streams of the album on Myspace before its release? Did any of the others offer their album for free the days before its release?

This was a decision Guns's band/management had presumably taken, freely, of their own accord. I cannot very well give them a 'Get of Jail' card on success and failure, merely because of their altruism (as credible as it is), penalising those bands who were more financially savvy, holding their product back to the last minute? Anyhow, Metallica leaked three tracks from Death Magnetic on their website.

Did you know Chinese Democracy sold more in its first week than "The Spaghetti Incident?" did? "The Spaghetti Incident?" debuted at #4 on album chart with 189,648 sales in November 1993. In 1993! Before Internet piracy!

Does not surprise me. TSI stinks to high heaven.
 

You lied about the $1.99 thing. Yes, you claim you remember it that way, but you presented it as a fact.

You present something as a fact while others tell you you were wrong and you can't find evidence to back up your statement.

No I did not, Jarmo. I acknowledge that it would be difficult to find a seven year old post but I definitely saw it and am telling the truth. I suppose this is now a, you lied, no I didn't, you lied, no I didn't, discussion. I cannot see it progressing anywhere.

PS

Still ignoring the articles I see, the two people turning up on the day of release?

[jarmo]

Subjective.

I'm sorry but I don't see Coldplay and Metallica playing at Download Festival together, for example. Any of the other bands, sure. Coldplay, not so much.
Why not throw in some boy bands while you're at it? 

Any evidence for this? You are always asking for evidence from me, so I am going to reciprocate here. 

You are evidence enough!
Here's one article pointing out Axl's the only one left in the band: http://www.ew.com/ew/article/0,,20235214,00.html

Possessing a major retail giant with massive amounts of economic resources such as Best Buy is a, negative? Also, Chinese Democracy was sold everywhere, outside the United States, and it did not exactly set the world on fire, either. It sold better outside of the United States, but still under par.

Best Buy is an electronics retailer. People go there to buy a DVD, a TV or a fridge. People go to Walmart to buy toilet paper, potato chips, ammo and socks.
It's like saying a Currys exclusive is as good as Tesco exclusive. Surely you see how absurd it is? Don't you?

This was a decision Guns's band/management had presumably taken, freely, of their own accord. I cannot very well give them a 'Get of Jail' card on success and failure, merely because of their altruism (as credible as it is), penalising those bands who were more financially savvy, holding their product back to the last minute? Anyhow, Metallica leaked three tracks from Death Magnetic on their website.

But would you say this tactic increased sales? That's the question.

Three songs? And they chose the time to do so.
Not nine tracks months before the album was released.

Does not surprise me. TSI stinks to high heaven.

So you're saying the old band had a bigger failure than you consider Chinese Democracy....


 

No I did not, Jarmo. I acknowledge that it would be difficult to find a seven year old post but I definitely saw it and am telling the truth. I suppose this is now a, you lied, no I didn't, you lied, no I didn't, discussion. I cannot see it progressing anywhere.

How do you explain that some of us were there and we remember this happening in 2011. Not the first week after its release.
Please explain.

Google lists a lot of sites reporting the sale. All dated 2011!

Still ignoring the articles I see, the two people turning up on the day of release?

Wait, so you want me to comment on the fact that when a reporter was at a store, two people where there?

What do you want me to say about it? That I wish it was at least three?
Because three would've made it a giant success!

Now, go back and acknowledge the points. Take them into consideration. Do you think any of what I said had any effect on sales? Simple really. The streams, the leaks, the negative attitude towards GN'R (that you yourself are an example of).


The reason why people like to go on and on about it being a failure is because they were proven wrong once already. They kept saying it's never coming out. Turns out they were wrong. Some people really have a hard time admitting they were wrong about something. So the next thing on their agenda is to push the "the album was a failure" rhetoric.



What's your expectations for the next album?



/jarmo

[D-GenerationX]

The European tour that Axl, allegedly, only found out via the internet? Well Axl cancelled that. Goldstein had booked a tour he did not want to play. It led to Goldstein's sacking.

That whole story was just so god damn weird.

The premise that this whole thing was done with Axl out of the loop is obviously preposterous.  I don't know why it got cancelled (thought I have some theories), but that seems pretty silly.

But why would Doug fall on his sword?  Then get sacked and still not say shit?

[rebelhipi]

If a management has booked a tour, against the intentions of their artist, then the management has made a mistake.

Thank you!

I will spell it out for you in the most factual way I can, in a way I cannot be possibly accused of lying (which is slander incidentally),

Chinese Democracy: 261,000
Death Magnetic: 490,000
Viva la Vida: 720,000
Black Ice: 784,000

Notice the big numbers jump, from 261,000 to 490,000, and again, from 490,00 into the 700,000s? Such is the difference between success and failure.

Coldplay?  

So you think it's a failure to sell that many copies of an album that was pretty much labeled by the media as "not Guns n' Roses"? And it was only sold at Best Buy.
Do you acknowledge the fact that Metallica's album was sold everywhere and AC/DC had the backing of possibly the biggest retail store chain in the USA?

Did you take into account the 8.4 million streams of the album on Myspace before its release? Did any of the others offer their album for free the days before its release?

Did you know Chinese Democracy sold more in its first week than "The Spaghetti Incident?" did? "The Spaghetti Incident?" debuted at #4 on album chart with 189,648 sales in November 1993. In 1993! Before Internet piracy!

Chinese Democracy also had the highest unit sales number of any Interscope Geffen A&M debut in 2008.

After six weeks, it had passed 500,000 sold in the USA.

The album still gets talked about. It's still remembered. For good and bad. But still remembered. I don't see that much talk about Black Ice....
Readers of Billboard voted it the #6 album of 2008. Ahead of any of your examples. Rolling Stone readers voted it at #5 (Coldplay beat GN'R in that one).

Did any of those other albums leak in almost their entirety months before the release?

Easy to forget certain things when you're focused on the so called failure.

 

I have been accused (wrongly) of avoiding evidence which defeats my own opinions, yet have answered every allegation that has been put before me. I have been accused of lying yet have produced statistics and contemporary articles, both of which have been dismissed (by another user) or ignored (by you). The hypocrisy and blindness around here is startling.

You lied about the $1.99 thing. Yes, you claim you remember it that way, but you presented it as a fact.

You present something as a fact while others tell you you were wrong and you can't find evidence to back up your statement.
Then it seems like you just ignore it because "That's how I remember it and you can't tell me I'm wrong!"






/jarmo

I Dont really follow album sales, but Chinese sold pretty damn well i think

[mortismurphy]

Subjective.

I'm sorry but I don't see Coldplay and Metallica playing at Download Festival together, for example. Any of the other bands, sure. Coldplay, not so much.
Why not throw in some boy bands while you're at it? 

Alright. Ignore the fact I cited Coldplay. That still leaves DC and Metallica though!

You are evidence enough!
Here's one article pointing out Axl's the only one left in the band: http://www.ew.com/ew/article/0,,20235214,00.html

''Pointing out Axl's the only one left in the band'' is rather different to claiming the band is, ''not Guns N' Roses''.

Best Buy is a multinational conglomerate with its hands in many pies. CD could have only benefited from it. Lots of people, the ones still buying albums, buy their albums from major supermarkets. Tescos even sell CDs and DVDs online now. 

This was a decision Guns's band/management had presumably taken, freely, of their own accord. I cannot very well give them a 'Get of Jail' card on success and failure, merely because of their altruism (as credible as it is), penalising those bands who were more financially savvy, holding their product back to the last minute? Anyhow, Metallica leaked three tracks from Death Magnetic on their website.

But would you say this tactic increased sales? That's the question.

Three songs? And they chose the time to do so.
Not nine tracks months before the album was released.

I do not think it would have affected sales one way or another. It may have knocked a few thousand off, but removing the Myspace freebie would not have meant, tons of expectant buyers rushing to the shops to buy a physical copy.

Does not surprise me. TSI stinks to high heaven.

So you're saying the old band had a bigger failure than you consider Chinese Democracy....

Commercially or in terms of my own subjective opinion? Well, yes on both counts. I do not like The Spaghetti Incident. I think it is a terrible record, but, it is, only a covers album.

No I did not, Jarmo. I acknowledge that it would be difficult to find a seven year old post but I definitely saw it and am telling the truth. I suppose this is now a, you lied, no I didn't, you lied, no I didn't, discussion. I cannot see it progressing anywhere.

How do you explain that some of us were there and we remember this happening in 2011. Not the first week after its release.
Please explain.

Google lists a lot of sites reporting the sale. All dated 2011!

I assume it has remained in bargain bins ever since. If something hits the bargain bins in the first week, it stands to reason that it will remain there. Jackson's Invincible and one or two latter-period Oasis albums had a similar ordeal by the way. You can now buy copies on ebay and Amazon for less than $1 these days, so low that you wonder how the seller is making a profit.

Wait, so you want me to comment on the fact that when a reporter was at a store, two people where there?

...on, the albums, release day. Surely it tells you something, that one store saw barely any demand for it? Now, how many other stores registered similar results? Then throw on your 261,000 statistic and it is not hard to reach the conclusion that it flopped.

Now, go back and acknowledge the points. Take them into consideration. Do you think any of what I said had any effect on sales? Simple really. The streams, the leaks, the negative attitude towards GN'R (that you yourself are an example of).


The reason why people like to go on and on about it being a failure is because they were proven wrong once already. They kept saying it's never coming out. Turns out they were wrong. Some people really have a hard time admitting they were wrong about something. So the next thing on their agenda is to push the "the album was a failure" rhetoric.



What's your expectations for the next album?



/jarmo

It is all a dodge. It is all one big dodge. It is all, what this forum is about really, which is Jarmo going to extra ordinary lengths to portray Axl and Nu Guns in the best possible light possible, covering up for their mistakes, spinning everything so it looks like Alice in Wonderland: inconvenient commercial flops are buttressed with certain, mitigating factors, unique to W. Axl Rose; managerial cock-ups are disregarded and fuzzed over with rhetorical fluff; stodgy setlists are explained away with the 'casuals' argument; album doubts are reassured with some passing remark from Dizzy Reed (probably from five years ago). And when it gets really difficult for you Jarmo, when the shit really hits the frying pan, there is always the, ''you know nothing'' line.

But to answer your question, I cannot see a second record selling in the slightest. Probably it will sell on par with Slash's albums - maybe slightly more.

[EmilyGNR]

Subjective.

I'm sorry but I don't see Coldplay and Metallica playing at Download Festival together, for example. Any of the other bands, sure. Coldplay, not so much.
Why not throw in some boy bands while you're at it? 

Alright. Ignore the fact I cited Coldplay. That still leaves DC and Metallica though!

You are evidence enough!
Here's one article pointing out Axl's the only one left in the band: http://www.ew.com/ew/article/0,,20235214,00.html

''Pointing out Axl's the only one left in the band'' is rather different to claiming the band is, ''not Guns N' Roses''.

Best Buy is a multinational conglomerate with its hands in many pies. CD could have only benefited from it. Lots of people, the ones still buying albums, buy their albums from major supermarkets. Tescos even sell CDs and DVDs online now. 

This was a decision Guns's band/management had presumably taken, freely, of their own accord. I cannot very well give them a 'Get of Jail' card on success and failure, merely because of their altruism (as credible as it is), penalising those bands who were more financially savvy, holding their product back to the last minute? Anyhow, Metallica leaked three tracks from Death Magnetic on their website.

But would you say this tactic increased sales? That's the question.

Three songs? And they chose the time to do so.
Not nine tracks months before the album was released.

I do not think it would have affected sales one way or another. It may have knocked a few thousand off, but removing the Myspace freebie would not have meant, tons of expectant buyers rushing to the shops to buy a physical copy.

Does not surprise me. TSI stinks to high heaven.

So you're saying the old band had a bigger failure than you consider Chinese Democracy....

Commercially or in terms of my own subjective opinion? Well, yes on both counts. I do not like The Spaghetti Incident. I think it is a terrible record, but, it is, only a covers album.

No I did not, Jarmo. I acknowledge that it would be difficult to find a seven year old post but I definitely saw it and am telling the truth. I suppose this is now a, you lied, no I didn't, you lied, no I didn't, discussion. I cannot see it progressing anywhere.

How do you explain that some of us were there and we remember this happening in 2011. Not the first week after its release.
Please explain.

Google lists a lot of sites reporting the sale. All dated 2011!

I assume it has remained in bargain bins ever since. If something hits the bargain bins in the first week, it stands to reason that it will remain there. Jackson's Invincible and one or two latter-period Oasis albums had a similar ordeal by the way. You can now buy copies on ebay and Amazon for less than $1 these days, so low that you wonder how the seller is making a profit.

Wait, so you want me to comment on the fact that when a reporter was at a store, two people where there?

...on, the albums, release day. Surely it tells you something, that one store saw barely any demand for it? Now, how many other stores registered similar results? Then throw on your 261,000 statistic and it is not hard to reach the conclusion that it flopped.

Now, go back and acknowledge the points. Take them into consideration. Do you think any of what I said had any effect on sales? Simple really. The streams, the leaks, the negative attitude towards GN'R (that you yourself are an example of).


The reason why people like to go on and on about it being a failure is because they were proven wrong once already. They kept saying it's never coming out. Turns out they were wrong. Some people really have a hard time admitting they were wrong about something. So the next thing on their agenda is to push the "the album was a failure" rhetoric.



What's your expectations for the next album?



/jarmo

It is all a dodge. It is all one big dodge. It is all, what this forum is about really, which is Jarmo going to extra ordinary lengths to portray Axl and Nu Guns in the best possible light possible, covering up for their mistakes, spinning everything so it looks like Alice in Wonderland: inconvenient commercial flops are buttressed with certain, mitigating factors, unique to W. Axl Rose; managerial cock-ups are disregarded and fuzzed over with rhetorical fluff; stodgy setlists are explained away with the 'casuals' argument; album doubts are reassured with some passing remark from Dizzy Reed (probably from five years ago). And when it gets really difficult for you Jarmo, when the shit really hits the frying pan, there is always the, ''you know nothing'' line.

But to answer your question, I cannot see a second record selling in the slightest. Probably it will sell on par with Slash's albums - maybe slightly more.

You come here on a daily basis to whine, complain, invent facts, moan, groan, and attempt to spin your speil to paint GNR as well as mgmt in the worst possible light.

It is very boring and tiresome reading the regurgitated bitching from the same people day in and day out.

I'm very excited for events to unfold this year, maybe an album release and a new tour! 

[TheBaconman]

I dont have a clue why the guy is here.   Its like a dog chaising its own tail

I also dont know why the guy is continued to allow to post here.  If i wanted to hear all this negativity and drama i would talk to my ex wife. 

[jarmo]

The premise that this whole thing was done with Axl out of the loop is obviously preposterous. 

Not really.

You're saying people never make decisions thinking it's the correct one? Or that people never make decisions thinking they can convince whoever else is involved that it's the right thing to do? Or that people never make decisions being too optimistic regarding time?

You're basing your opinion on the fact that you think Axl micromanages every single detail about GN'R.
So yes, it's possible Axl never agreed to do those shows but they were booked anyway, hoping he'd agree later.

''Pointing out Axl's the only one left in the band'' is rather different to claiming the band is, ''not Guns N' Roses''.

Connect the dots. One leads to the other. Logic really.

Best Buy is a multinational conglomerate with its hands in many pies. CD could have only benefited from it. Lots of people, the ones still buying albums, buy their albums from major supermarkets. Tescos even sell CDs and DVDs online now.

I didn't say there were no benefits. I'm saying, there are simple logical reasons why a Walmart exclusive could do better. And thus comparing the two is like apples and oranges really.

Tesco was brought up as an example of a chain in the UK where people go for a bit of everything. They walk in to buy a Ribena and walk out with a CD as well. If you walk into Currys, you're there for something relating to electronics.

Can't you see how one has a broader appeal? Same is true for Walmart vs Best Buy. That was the point.

I do not think it would have affected sales one way or another. It may have knocked a few thousand off, but removing the Myspace freebie would not have meant, tons of expectant buyers rushing to the shops to buy a physical copy.

I think it all affected the sales to some degree. You remove the element of surprise first with the leaks. Then on top of that you stream the whole thing for free. It's not a taster. It's like you get the whole meal, for free.

Commercially or in terms of my own subjective opinion? Well, yes on both counts.

So the old band failed more with "TSI?" than Chinese Democracy did. That's quite a statement from you.
Thanks for the honesty.  

I assume it has remained in bargain bins ever since. If something hits the bargain bins in the first week, it stands to reason that it will remain there. Jackson's Invincible and one or two latter-period Oasis albums had a similar ordeal by the way. You can now buy copies on ebay and Amazon for less than $1 these days, so low that you wonder how the seller is making a profit.

But IT DID NOT SELL FOR $1.99 during its first week at Best Buy.

I was there. In the USA at the time
Others here remember it happening in 2011. Google searches point to 2011 as well.
Not from the first week until 2011. Sorry. It did not happen the way you hoped/remember.

You're repeating a lie. I'm sorry.

...on, the albums, release day. Surely it tells you something, that one store saw barely any demand for it? Now, how many other stores registered similar results? Then throw on your 261,000 statistic and it is not hard to reach the conclusion that it flopped.

Yeah, it tells me that not a lot of people rush to Best Buy stores in Manhattan to buy albums in the mornings....

And when it gets really difficult for you Jarmo, when the shit really hits the frying pan, there is always the, ''you know nothing'' line.

I don't run away from discussions and act like nothing happened.
Are you disputing the fact that most of us really have no idea how things work in a band? Let alone one that sold millions of albums? Or sold a shitload of tickets? Or that just because you heard one side of the story doesn't mean you know the story? I'm sure you're not seriously saying none of that is true....


The fact remains, some like to complain and find things to complain about. Even if facts are in front of their eyes, they ignore them. Just to keep complaining.

I don't get any kind of pleasure from dwelling on the past. Unlike some. Shows were canceled. It happened. No matter who the manager was. it's unfortunate, it happened and hopefully something was learned from it. Move on.

And no, I don't pretend everything is perfect. That's stupid. I do live in the reality that things are what they are. It's not 2002 anymore. That's my reality. I don't whine about it.
If you can't find anything good in the last decade or so in the history of the band, sorry. Maybe it's time to find another band you can feel that invested in that'll make your dreams come true....


I don't know what you expected Chinese Democracy to sell. Considering the facts that have been presented to you. The ones you ignore.
A discussion is about taking into account what others say, then present why you think that's wrong. You choose to just repeat your lines with little regard to what's said. "it's a failure because this article says only two people were in a store".

You're just happy Googling articles that prove you were "right". For some reason you don't seem to be able to find articles backing up your lie about the $1.99 sale the week after its release though.

But to answer your question, I cannot see a second record selling in the slightest. Probably it will sell on par with Slash's albums - maybe slightly more.

What would be a success?





/jarmo

[jarmo]

I dont have a clue why the guy is here.   Its like a dog chaising its own tail

The standard answer is: Because I want to hear new music.

Ironic for people who don't consider the band GN'R and/or haven't liked anything the band has done in the last decade or so.
Why the fuck are you on a Guns N' Roses fan site then? You can go on any music site and post while wanting to hear that new music. I'm sure those people dislike GN'R as much as these kinds of so called fans do.




/jarmo

[EmilyGNR]

I dont have a clue why the guy is here.   Its like a dog chaising its own tail

I also dont know why the guy is continued to allow to post here.  If i wanted to hear all this negativity and drama i would talk to my ex wife. 

Haha, thank you for the smile.

I agree with you 100%, attempting to talk garbage at GNRs' expense isn't going to go over big here, so why keep on trying to push a negative agenda?

I get tired of seeing the bitching personally.

[TheBaconman]

I dont have a clue why the guy is here.   Its like a dog chaising its own tail

I also dont know why the guy is continued to allow to post here.  If i wanted to hear all this negativity and drama i would talk to my ex wife. 

Haha, thank you for the smile.

I agree with you 100%, attempting to talk garbage at GNRs' expense isn't going to go over big here, so why keep on trying to push a negative agenda?

I get tired of seeing the bitching personally.

Its the definition of insane   

The guy has admited he is not a fan of the guns n roses currently.   Not a fan of anything they have do e in the past 20 years.   Finds endless things to compalin abaout

And then

Comea to this website!!   This website, that makes it very clear its here to support guns n roses here and now!!  Now 30 yeara ago

Its like someone who liked adam sandler in Happy Gilmore, but hasnt liked him in any other movie in the past 20 years, going to a recent adam sandler movie and complaining    Then going to a adam sandler website and bitching and complaining about how he hasnt been good for 20 years.   Guess what, you are not a adam sandler fan

Guess what you are not a guns n roses fan.  Just because u liked them 20 years ago doesnt mean you have to loke them now

And there is nothing wrong with that

Why you come to a website daily to spew your negativity, i dont get

[damnthehaters]

I had tickets for the 2001 tour (I will admit, I am getting my cancelled tours a bit mixed up here). If this was the same tour that Axl read about on the net, it was Axl who pulled the plug on it, not the management. Goldstein lost his job soon after, which tells you something.

He admitted to making a mistake. Yet since he's your idol, you won't blame him. Only current management would make a mistake according to you.
That's you in a nutshell.

No shame in that. Just admit it.

If a management has booked a tour, against the intentions of their artist, then the management has made a mistake.

I have just offered additional supporting evidence that CD failed, including two contemporary articles, and comparison with other rock releases from the year 2008. But I suppose, despite producing factual evidence, I am still 'lying' because this evidence does not tell you want you want to believe and does not sustain your Prozac fantasy of absolute positivity.

I'm not gonna take anything you say seriously until you start looking at actual facts and not ignore them based on how "you remember things".
You make up shit, and then expect us to have a proper discussion with you while you ignore facts that prove you remember things wrong.

Go back to the $1.99 the week after its release thing. Settle that one first.


Just because an album didn't sell the most of the rock albums in 2008 doesn't make it a failure.
Keep throwing those insults. It'll really extend your posting career here.


/jarmo

I will spell it out for you in the most factual way I can, in a way I cannot be possibly accused of lying (which is slander incidentally),

Chinese Democracy: 261,000
Death Magnetic: 490,000
Viva la Vida: 720,000
Black Ice: 784,000

Notice the big numbers jump, from 261,000 to 490,000, and again, from 490,00 into the 700,000s? Such is the difference between success and failure.

I have been accused (wrongly) of avoiding evidence which defeats my own opinions, yet have answered every allegation that has been put before me. I have been accused of lying yet have produced statistics and contemporary articles, both of which have been dismissed (by another user) or ignored (by you). The hypocrisy and blindness around here is startling.

So because other albums out sold Chinese, Chinese was a failure?  I just don't get your logic?  Not too mention all the things Jarmo mentioned. 

So again, maybe you should rethink your expectations.  Seems to me, you were expecting Chinese to sell millions world wide and be the best selling album of the year.  Even though it's a new band who hadn't put out an album in 15 years...among plenty of other reasons to prove GNR was and is not a hot topic in this country like it was in the early 90's. 

[jarmo]

Or that's how he remembers it, so he Googled some articles to prove he's remembers correctly....


/jarmo

[sky dog]

Fact is Chinese actually sold 1.3 million in the US as Best Buy bought them all on a one way ticket. They could not return unsold copies like the normal standard in the industry. The record company and Axl were a success right there, right off the bat. I am quite sure the record company got their costs back, Ax and Azoff pocketed some cash and promptly parted ways. Chinese then sells a few million overseas which should have generated some more good income for the record company and Axl....NOT a failure financially.