"Next Album" rumor / speculation thread *UPDATE AUG 22/2023*

[D-GenerationX]

I tend to find Axl a bit more "human" (an eccentric one, to be sure) than a lot of the interpretations I get from both the hardcore supporters and detractors.  I think we all get caught up in absolutes, sometimes....and I don't think that's fair to him from either side.  It's why I tend to do the theorycrafting I do.

I've always been a big picture guy.  I also tend to support the side of the argument with the overwhelming evidence.

In the case of Axl, I find him to be a very difficult person to deal with that can be extremely petty and vindictive and more than a bit juvenile.  There are scores of examples of this.

Now, say that at a GNR board, and you are likely to get the anecdotal story about that time he posed for a picture with that person.  And how he couldn't have been nicer, and everyone has it all wrong.

I disagree.  I'd argue you caught him in one of his better moments.  And while fortuitous for you, I'm not sure that erases everything else, because I highly doubt the whole world is lying.  Sure, some people might have an agenda.  But the whole world?  Nah.

[pilferk]

From what I know of the band members say 98 forward, there is nothing really to forgive, because I don't think they did anything wrong.....

They left the band?  That's really it....   

They all wrote great music and lived up to there contracts..  Played great concerts live and were good to the fans....  Guns got a pretty good deal with all its former members, 98 till now.

Axl may just of been pissed that left, but then cooled down..   

I really think actually that the lack of past members talking in the media about guns actually helps there relationships heal

And if you look at the original membership..the only real remaining "issues" are between Axl and Slash.  I mean...maybe Axl and Steven, but he perpetuates those (still) and the other membership has issues with him, too.  Those are issues involving sobriety and self promotion of his product being linked to GnR...which I "get".

[D-GenerationX]

From what I know of the band members say 98 forward, there is nothing really to forgive, because I don't think they did anything wrong.....

They left the band?  That's really it....   

They all wrote great music and lived up to there contracts..  Played great concerts live and were good to the fans....  Guns got a pretty good deal with all its former members, 98 till now.

Axl may just of been pissed that left, but then cooled down..   

I really think actually that the lack of past members talking in the media about guns actually helps there relationships heal

And if you look at the original membership..the only real remaining "issues" are between Axl and Slash.  I mean...maybe Axl and Steven, but he perpetuates those (still) and the other membership has issues with him, too.  Those are issues involving sobriety and self promotion of his product being linked to GnR...which I "get".

Agreed.

The thing with Slash, I don't get.  At least how over the top he is about it.  There's having a falling out with a guy, and then there is calling him "a cancer" and saying one of you will be dead in a box before you speak again.  That's some pretty hardcore shit.  Unless that guy fucked and/or killed your mother, that's seems a bit much.

Wanting nothing to do with Steven makes sense to me though.

[pilferk]

I've always been a big picture guy.  I also tend to support the side of the argument with the overwhelming evidence.

In the case of Axl, I find him to be a very difficult person to deal with that can be extremely petty and vindictive and more than a bit juvenile.  There are scores of examples of this.

Now, say that at a GNR board, and you are likely to get the anecdotal story about that time he posed for a picture with that person.  And how he couldn't have been nicer, and everyone has it all wrong.

I disagree.  I'd argue you caught him in one of his better moments.  And while fortuitous for you, I'm not sure that erases everything else, because I highly doubt the whole world is lying.  Sure, some people might have an agenda.  But the whole world?  Nah.

I think if you're going to be a "big picture" guy, you have to look at the whole big picture.  Both the good anecdotal, and the bad, and take it into consideration.

You can't JUST give consideration to the bad.

I think the guy is human.  I think he's very passionate about his "work", so you tend to see the pettiness and vindictiveness and anger come out in relation to those things.

I don't disagree he's "prickly" and eccentric.  He is.  But I also don't think he's some rage fueled, 100% vindictive, monster, either.

And there's definitely examples of "progress", given earlier.  He might get worked up, and he might hold on to that stuff for awhile, but in MOST cases..he seems to EVENTUALLY work through it.

[TheBaconman]

I tend to find Axl a bit more "human" (an eccentric one, to be sure) than a lot of the interpretations I get from both the hardcore supporters and detractors.  I think we all get caught up in absolutes, sometimes....and I don't think that's fair to him from either side.  It's why I tend to do the theorycrafting I do.

I've always been a big picture guy.  I also tend to support the side of the argument with the overwhelming evidence.

In the case of Axl, I find him to be a very difficult person to deal with that can be extremely petty and vindictive and more than a bit juvenile.  There are scores of examples of this.

Now, say that at a GNR board, and you are likely to get the anecdotal story about that time he posed for a picture with that person.  And how he couldn't have been nicer, and everyone has it all wrong.

I disagree.  I'd argue you caught him in one of his better moments.  And while fortuitous for you, I'm not sure that erases everything else, because I highly doubt the whole world is lying.  Sure, some people might have an agenda.  But the whole world?  Nah.

Well when you live the rock star life, I think you are in your own little world.  So mb at times it did feel to him that his whole world was out to get him.  The guy has been living in a rock star vacuum since his early 20s....  
Trust me TheBaconman also lives in a bit of a vacuum and I have to force myself at times to step back and see whats actually going on..  I could only imagine what Axls world vacuum is like.

But also as nutty and hot headed as the guy seemed a few years ago.  I feel recently he seems at piece and from what I can tell, just through pictures and very short interviews, seems happy...   I would love to hear a new interview from the guy, just to see were his heads at these days

[pilferk]

Agreed.

The thing with Slash, I don't get.  At least how over the top he is about it.  There's having a falling out with a guy, and then there is calling him "a cancer" and saying one of you will be dead in a box before you speak again.  That's some pretty hardcore shit.  Unless that guy fucked and/or killed your mother, that's seems a bit much.

Wanting nothing to do with Steven makes sense to me though.

I think without knowing the full story...and we never will...it's hard to judge regarding the thing with Slash.  I know that, if you feel betrayed by someone you once viewed as family...that hurt goes deeper, and lasts longer, than any other kind.  It's an issue of trust...and it's hard to overcome. Especially if it involves ongoing, perceived, dishonesty.

The thing is: We know the two stories (Axl's and Slash's) don't jive on some things.  Sometimes Slash looks to be right, but sometimes he also looks to be way off on his timings (signing over the band name).  The "truth" is likely somewhere in the middle....but neither guy is going to care about that.  It's all about what they THINK is true.

And I'm not going to debate which side of the narrative is "more true" than the other.

[pilferk]

Well when you live the rock star life, I think you are in your own little world.  So mb at times it did feel to him that his whole world was out to get him.  The guy has been living in a rock star vacuum since his early 20s....  
Trust me TheBaconman also lives in a bit of a vacuum and I have to force myself at times to step back and see whats actually going on..  I could only imagine what Axls world vacuum is like.

I think that's called being human.

Our individual crisis of the moment seems like the single most important thing on the plant.  I shudder to think what someone would think if they saw my reactions to every little crisis that pops up.  In that moment...it's not always pretty.  I think that's true for everyone.....though how frequently is different, prolly, person to person.

The difference here is that....every time Axl reacts that way (and I'm not debating it might happen more with him than, say, you or I...it very well might), it's plastered across the universe.  And, honestly, I don't think that helps, given his sensitivity level.  I'm not saying that should change, either.  That's part and parcel of living the kind of life he lives.  But take a guy who has a tendency to....ahem...overreact?....blow up?....get angry, easily?...whatever...and combine it with the above...and I don't think we always see the best in the guy.

In addition...it's always the negative that gets pushed out in the press..because it's the stuff that drives the news cycle.  You don't hear about when he "does it right"...only when he flys off the handle.

Yes, the number of "flying off the handles" is high. Agreed.

[JAEBALL]

Agreed.

The thing with Slash, I don't get.  At least how over the top he is about it.  There's having a falling out with a guy, and then there is calling him "a cancer" and saying one of you will be dead in a box before you speak again.  That's some pretty hardcore shit.  Unless that guy fucked and/or killed your mother, that's seems a bit much.

Wanting nothing to do with Steven makes sense to me though.

I think without knowing the full story...and we never will...it's hard to judge regarding the thing with Slash.  I know that, if you feel betrayed by someone you once viewed as family...that hurt goes deeper, and lasts longer, than any other kind.  It's an issue of trust...and it's hard to overcome. Especially if it involves ongoing, perceived, dishonesty.

The thing is: We know the two stories (Axl's and Slash's) don't jive on some things.  Sometimes Slash looks to be right, but sometimes he also looks to be way off on his timings (signing over the band name).  The "truth" is likely somewhere in the middle....but neither guy is going to care about that.  It's all about what they THINK is true.

And I'm not going to debate which side of the narrative is "more true" than the other.

100 percent true. Taking either's side has always been puzzling to me.

[D-GenerationX]

I think if you're going to be a "big picture" guy, you have to look at the whole big picture.  Both the good anecdotal, and the bad, and take it into consideration.

You can't JUST give consideration to the bad.

I think the guy is human.  I think he's very passionate about his "work", so you tend to see the pettiness and vindictiveness and anger come out in relation to those things.

That's all well and good, but what about the Tommy Hilferger thing?  The Phoenix airport?

Sure didn't have anything to do with his work.

I don't disagree he's "prickly" and eccentric.  He is.  But I also don't think he's some rage fueled, 100% vindictive, monster, either.

And there's definitely examples of "progress", given earlier.  He might get worked up, and he might hold on to that stuff for awhile, but in MOST cases..he seems to EVENTUALLY work through it.

I think the "bad Axl" comes out at a moment's notice over anything.  And its sometimes disproportional to the matter at hand.  The thing with Madison over at MYGNR?  What the hell was that?

But I'd agree he has mellowed a bit with age, as evidenced by him patching up some relationships most people thought were fucked forever.

[JAEBALL]

From what I know of the band members say 98 forward, there is nothing really to forgive, because I don't think they did anything wrong.....

They left the band?  That's really it....   

They all wrote great music and lived up to there contracts..  Played great concerts live and were good to the fans....  Guns got a pretty good deal with all its former members, 98 till now.

Axl may just of been pissed that left, but then cooled down..   

I really think actually that the lack of past members talking in the media about guns actually helps there relationships heal

And if you look at the original membership..the only real remaining "issues" are between Axl and Slash.  I mean...maybe Axl and Steven, but he perpetuates those (still) and the other membership has issues with him, too.  Those are issues involving sobriety and self promotion of his product being linked to GnR...which I "get".

I THINK Axl doesn't begrudge any "new" guys departures because they didn't have any history together, they were his employees for a little time and then moved on... The wounds from what Axl views were slights by the original members are a whole different thing.

Plus the public wouldn't give a shit if Robin or Bucket said anything negative about Axl after they left. So its moot.

[D-GenerationX]

Agreed.

The thing with Slash, I don't get.  At least how over the top he is about it.  There's having a falling out with a guy, and then there is calling him "a cancer" and saying one of you will be dead in a box before you speak again.  That's some pretty hardcore shit.  Unless that guy fucked and/or killed your mother, that's seems a bit much.

Wanting nothing to do with Steven makes sense to me though.

I think without knowing the full story...and we never will...it's hard to judge regarding the thing with Slash.  I know that, if you feel betrayed by someone you once viewed as family...that hurt goes deeper, and lasts longer, than any other kind.  It's an issue of trust...and it's hard to overcome. Especially if it involves ongoing, perceived, dishonesty.

The thing is: We know the two stories (Axl's and Slash's) don't jive on some things.  Sometimes Slash looks to be right, but sometimes he also looks to be way off on his timings (signing over the band name).  The "truth" is likely somewhere in the middle....but neither guy is going to care about that.  It's all about what they THINK is true.

And I'm not going to debate which side of the narrative is "more true" than the other.

100 percent true. Taking either's side has always been puzzling to me.

I don't understand the civil war within GNR fandom.  I call it the "Fat Axls" vs. the "$la$hs"  What is the endgame of that interfandom feud?  Are they not both 2 of our favorite artists ever?  Why shit on either of them?

As for what's what with Slash, I agree we don't know exactly what his beef supposedly is.  But I don't think that's by accident either.  I think if he laid out exactly what the reason for the ill will is, there is a more than good chance people would roll their eyes.  A reaction of "Seriously?  That?  All this vitriol...over THAT??" would not be out of the question.  Not to say its inconceivable that thins went south with both men.  But if you heard the actual reasons, do you think they would match up with some of the over the top rhetoric over the years?  

[D-GenerationX]

I THINK Axl doesn't begrudge any "new" guys departures because they didn't have any history together, they were his employees for a little time and then moved on... The wounds from what Axl views were slights by the original members are a whole different thing.

Plus the public wouldn't give a shit if Robin or Bucket said anything negative about Axl after they left. So its moot.

Agreed on both.

[pilferk]

That's all well and good, but what about the Tommy Hilferger thing?  The Phoenix airport?

Sure didn't have anything to do with his work.

In hearing the Tommy story...it sure sounds like he was being a dick, egging Axl on, and was on a drunken bender that...quite frankly....isn't atypical (check out some of the page 6 type blurbs about him).  Mix a guy who becomes a drunken, chauvanistic, leacherous asshole with a hot head who thinks he's defending his and someone else's honor?  I think, for that one, I give Axl a pass.

The airport? http://www.mygnr.com/news/1998/980212.html

Yeah, he overreacted.  For sure.

But, again...those are the types of things that make the press, remember. Not any of the "reacted well" stuff.  That's not giving him a pass, either.  Def an example of how NOT to react in airport security.  If he did that now, post 9/11 (since this was 1998), he'd be doing time.

I think the "bad Axl" comes out at a moment's notice over anything.  And its sometimes disproportional to the matter at hand.  The thing with Madison over at MYGNR?  What the hell was that?

But I'd agree he has mellowed a bit with age, as evidenced by him patching up some relationships most people thought were fucked forever.

He's definitely a hot head. No arguments.  My point is that he's not JUST a hothead, all the time.  He's a person.

[jarmo]

I think some of the big picture guys have lost focus. They've focused so much on the bad, they can't see the good. These people themselves admit to being frustrated, yet if Axl got frustrated at an airport in 1998, it's labeled bad. But don't call them being frustrated as being bad because it's just normal for a positive GN'R fan!

Amusing. Like a clown.



/jarmo

[pilferk]

I THINK Axl doesn't begrudge any "new" guys departures because they didn't have any history together, they were his employees for a little time and then moved on... The wounds from what Axl views were slights by the original members are a whole different thing.

Plus the public wouldn't give a shit if Robin or Bucket said anything negative about Axl after they left. So its moot.

Agree.

And, honestly, I think that's by design.

I think Axl thinks he "learned" from that experience.  People wonder why the band is made up the way it is, and why it functions the way it does....I think that's way.

I think, really, only Tommy sort of comes close to functioning like one of the "original" membership did.  That's spitballing, but it's the impression I get.  And I think a lot of that is because Tommy is used to working with mercurial, eccentric, bandmates/front-men. Maybe Dizzy, too....but to a lesser extent.

The rest might be creative partners, but they're not "close" like Axl was with Duff, Izzy, Slash, and Stephen.  And I think Axl keeps things that way for precisely the reasons we're discussing here...he feels he was "burned" once. Now he's a little more protective of those feelings.

[jarmo]

I THINK Axl doesn't begrudge any "new" guys departures because they didn't have any history together, they were his employees for a little time and then moved on... The wounds from what Axl views were slights by the original members are a whole different thing.

Not sure I agree with that. i think essentially it's not about when you were in the band or how long. It's what you do/did.
Like in any relationship. Professional or otherwise.



/jarmo

[pilferk]

I THINK Axl doesn't begrudge any "new" guys departures because they didn't have any history together, they were his employees for a little time and then moved on... The wounds from what Axl views were slights by the original members are a whole different thing.

Not sure I agree with that. i think essentially it's not about when you were in the band or how long. It's what you do/did.
Like in any relationship. Professional or otherwise.



/jarmo

I agree with that, too.  I don't think the two are mutually exclusive points.

I think one is sort of related directly to the other (creative participation/contribution to time/history/etc.). I'm talking in terms of professional stuff.

[D-GenerationX]

And, honestly, I think that's by design.

I think Axl thinks he "learned" from that experience.  People wonder why the band is made up the way it is, and why it functions the way it does....I think that's way.

I think, really, only Tommy sort of comes close to functioning like one of the "original" membership did.  That's spitballing, but it's the impression I get.  And I think a lot of that is because Tommy is used to working with mercurial, eccentric, bandmates/front-men. Maybe Dizzy, too....but to a lesser extent.

The rest might be creative partners, but they're not "close" like Axl was with Duff, Izzy, Slash, and Stephen.  And I think Axl keeps things that way for precisely the reasons we're discussing here...he feels he was "burned" once. Now he's a little more protective of those feelings.

That's interesting.  You might be onto something here.

Many have said that this is so unlike a real band in so many ways.  One of those ways is that the band seems like a job.  And maybe that is part of it.  Its not the "we're all blood brothers" type of a thing.  Its just a job.  They are co-workers, not besties.

[pilferk]

That's interesting.  You might be onto something here.

Many have said that this is so unlike a real band in so many ways.  One of those ways is that the band seems like a job.  And maybe that is part of it.  Its not the "we're all blood brothers" type of a thing.  Its just a job.  They are co-workers, not besties.

I think there are relationships between the OTHER members....and I think, specifically, there are relationships between the other members and Tommy. And I suspect a strong friendship between Tommy and Axl. In my fantasy world, Axl is the Don, and Tommy is the consigliere.

But I think maybe that Axl sort of puts up some walls to protect him from getting "hurt" like he was with the original membership.  He's not quite so trusting, now.

I wouldn't qualify it as "just a job", either, though. I think it's a creative collaboration. I think they do bond...but over the music, not over personal connections. And....that's not as unusual as some people think it is. Maybe it's not as widely talked about with those bands..but there are plenty of bands where the whole group isn't besties.

Again, I'm so totally theorycrafting here, it's remarkable.

[D-GenerationX]

Again, I'm so totally theorycrafting here, it's remarkable.

Yeah, but so what?  There is no innate crime in speculation.  And most of what you've said is interesting.