"Next Album" rumor / speculation thread *UPDATE AUG 22/2023*

[Ali]

Not credible? That's a bit disrespectful to say about people who have a different point of view from yours. Especially when the labeling is done based on assumptions.
Maybe in your opinion credibility doesn't mix well with understanding and seeing things from a different point of view....

Then tell me this, Jarmo.  What have they done over the past decade or so that you found some fault with?  I've never heard you be critical of anything, ever.  Can you give me an instance?

I'll start.  I was in a building in Philadelphia with over 10,000 other people waiting to see him and he never showed up.  And we have yet to be been given a reason why.  I have been a fan of his since 6th grade (1988) and December 6, 2002 was going to be the first time I ever got to see him live.

This was no god damn good and a total dick move.  Agree or disagree?

I have to disagree.  A reason and explanation were given from the stage by Axl when GN'R played Philly in 2012.

Ali

[el_loko]

Wow! That was fast! Explanation takes only 10 years.

[jarmo]

Wow! That was fast! Explanation takes only 10 years.

So you go from "no explanation = asshole" to "too slow explanation = asshole". Nice.
We got a winner here!


I'm sure you know all the reasons for all this so there's no point in explaining anything to you.

For the rest, is it possible that anything you say might be used against you so it's better to not comment publicly until the smoke has truly cleared? Who am I kidding, of course not...




/jarmo

[Ali]

Wow! That was fast! Explanation takes only 10 years.

The statement wasn't about a timely explanation.  The statement was that no explanation had been given at all.  While it may not have been timely (I agree), to say no explanation has been given is simply not true.

Ali

[D-GenerationX]

Not credible? That's a bit disrespectful to say about people who have a different point of view from yours. Especially when the labeling is done based on assumptions.
Maybe in your opinion credibility doesn't mix well with understanding and seeing things from a different point of view....

Then tell me this, Jarmo.  What have they done over the past decade or so that you found some fault with?  I've never heard you be critical of anything, ever.  Can you give me an instance?

I'll start.  I was in a building in Philadelphia with over 10,000 other people waiting to see him and he never showed up.  And we have yet to be been given a reason why.  I have been a fan of his since 6th grade (1988) and December 6, 2002 was going to be the first time I ever got to see him live.

This was no god damn good and a total dick move.  Agree or disagree?

I have to disagree.  A reason and explanation were given from the stage by Axl when GN'R played Philly in 2012.

Ali

Him telling us he was not watching a basketball game?

[D-GenerationX]

Then tell me this, Jarmo.  What have they done over the past decade or so that you found some fault with?  I've never heard you be critical of anything, ever.  Can you give me an instance?

Anything on this, Jarmo?

[Ali]

Not credible? That's a bit disrespectful to say about people who have a different point of view from yours. Especially when the labeling is done based on assumptions.
Maybe in your opinion credibility doesn't mix well with understanding and seeing things from a different point of view....

Then tell me this, Jarmo.  What have they done over the past decade or so that you found some fault with?  I've never heard you be critical of anything, ever.  Can you give me an instance?

I'll start.  I was in a building in Philadelphia with over 10,000 other people waiting to see him and he never showed up.  And we have yet to be been given a reason why.  I have been a fan of his since 6th grade (1988) and December 6, 2002 was going to be the first time I ever got to see him live.

This was no god damn good and a total dick move.  Agree or disagree?

I have to disagree.  A reason and explanation were given from the stage by Axl when GN'R played Philly in 2012.

Ali

Him telling us he was not watching a basketball game?

No, him telling the crowd he was in fact sick and the show should've been cancelled earlier in the day.

Ali

[D-GenerationX]

No, him telling the crowd he was in fact sick and the show should've been cancelled earlier in the day.

Eh, didn't that just come across as another variation of his "it wasn't my fault" speech?

And even taking him at his word, how does that make sense?  If that's truly what happened, why not say that?  That's going to bring legal action?  Doesn't add up.

But this is missing the larger point.  I was looking for the most egregious and seemingly indefensible thing I could think of over the past 13 years to see if Jarmo could bring himself to utter a critical word. 

Still I wait.

[jarmo]

Then tell me this, Jarmo.  What have they done over the past decade or so that you found some fault with?  I've never heard you be critical of anything, ever.  Can you give me an instance?

Anything on this, Jarmo?

Why is this of such a personal importance for you?

Everybody can look back at events or decisions and wish they had done things differently. It's easy to be a smart ass in hindsight....

You personally seem to still hold a grudge over events that didn't go according to your wishes in 2002 and 2008. Personally I'm in 2013 and what has happened, or didn't happen, is in the past. No need to dwell on it. You learn from it and move on.

I took a Greyhound from NYC to Portland, ME in 2006. So yeah, I've had shows cancelled too.

It doesn't make any difference to me if I think Axl should've done 1000000 interviews in November 2008 and sit here five years on feeling upset about it.




/jarmo

[D-GenerationX]

Then tell me this, Jarmo.  What have they done over the past decade or so that you found some fault with?  I've never heard you be critical of anything, ever.  Can you give me an instance?

Anything on this, Jarmo?

Why is this of such a personal importance for you?

We're just having a conversation on the internet here.  We're not solving the worlds problems, by any stretch.

But you were the one that got all salty over the "not credible" tag.  This is now three passes you have had at telling me something, anything, that you have found fault with over the past 13 years.  You can't seem to come up with one.  Ergo, someone that wants to label you as a guy with the rose colored glasses on 24/7/365, and therefore not really objective on the matter of this band, you really can't snap at them, can you?  We all have the reps we have in life based on our actions.  Breaks of the game, I'm afraid. 

Since we seem to be past the pulling punches portion of the program, might as well just lay it out there.  I'm sure its not lost on you that the vast majority of GNR fandom feels you can't speak negatively on any subject, ever, because you are not allowed.  I'm not sure I totally buy that.  But is a display like this one really refuting that premise?  I presume this is when you tell me that you don't care what people think, but I'm not sure that addresses the issue.

I doubt very highly you are losing sleep over any of this, but perceptions are often reality to most folks.

[Ginger King]

Anyone else think that Jarmo will write a tell-all in 15 years (perhaps coinciding with the release of CDII ) where he tells us what he really thinks?  Until then, take all the "nothing to see here", "everything's fine", "they're just like other bands" [except when that argument doesn't work, then] "they're not like any other band" comments with a grain of salt.

I'm such a sucker for all things GnR, I'll probably pre-order that one...

[spgunner]

I see it as rationalization, nothing more.  And never uttered by anyone but rose colored fanboys.

What's a fanboy and why are you so afraid of being labeled one?

With all due respect...you.  A fanboy is someone that finds no fault with anything, spins everything that happens as positive, and rips apart anyone else who dares speak anything resembling a dissenting opinion.

I don't want to be labeled one because that's not a credible person to me.  Anyone that tells me this is a well run operation with no legit gripes to be had is someone that you can't take super seriously.  I'm sure you have your reasons for saying the things you do (many of which we can all guess) but that doesn't mean its the gospel truth.  Its spin and the party line.  It is what it is, and we all know what it is.

Nothing in the world is super terrific awesome 24/7/365.  Sometimes, its OK to say certain things are wrong.  Anyone that cannot ever seem to do so, is a fanboy.  Simple as that.  It doesn't make them a bad person overall, obviously, but their credibility on that particular topic can be questioned, because objectivity seems to not be part of the equation.

Could you, in your not-fanboy-100%-objective opinion, honestly say that everybody gave the album a fair chance and that all the opinions, such as the above, are solely based on listening to the music with an open mind?

Of course not.  That would be ridiculous to say. 

Many people long gave up on Axl.  And were never going to give this album a chance without Slash.  I don't agree with that take, but I would say it was the vast majority of the music listening public.

But I'm not going to then sit here and get frosty that people have that opinion, and try to whip up some goofball argument it was because it was all so super complex and layered and they just didn't get it.  That's pretty self serving and frankly, ridiculous.  It was a rock album.  Done by a rock band, playing rock songs.  If people either didn't like it, or simply never gave it a chance, it was not because they were just too dumb to appreciate the brilliance contained within.

If you can't understand that sometimes people don't get the concept, the songs, the general idea of an album... well. Nirvana's "In Utero" isn't complex at all. But many fans didn't like it when it was released (probably because many fans wanted a Nevermind II and they got one hell of a raw album full of destruction). 20 years has passed. These days many fans choose In Utero as their favorite album. Remembering Lou Reed (RIP): "The Velvet Underground & Nico" was a failure at the charts and it's a classic album these days (same thing with Stooges' "Raw Power" and the list goes on).
You may not like CD but face it: Many people didn't get it when it was released and many didn't even mind to give the album a chance. I'm glad some people now get it and that some people are giving it a second chance.

And it's not about being "fanboys" or trying to see a positive side on everyhting. Guns N' Roses is a band. Period. There are no rules. Axl doesn't need to give interviews, he doesn't need to release singles or videos, he does whatever he wants. CD was number one or at the top 5 in almost everywhere worldwide without one single video or single being released and played everywhere + internet and downloads on.... I see the sales of CD as a major success if you consider all the circumstances.  For whatever reasons (and we barely know what lies on the surface because Axl spoke a little bit about it) there was no huge promotion... doesn't matter. What really matters is that the fans who enjoyed the album were SO LUCKY to have this masterpiece in hands. People complain about so many things in a way that looks like the band needs to fulfil your personal dreams. This is sick. If the band keeps on with the same gig for 10 more years and if they release a new record in 15 years from now... so what? You're free to leave anytime you want. But it's not fair to demand things. I guess it's just because some sick fans believe Axl and the band owes them something. This is so damn sick.

You say the album didn't change the world. What did you want? The whole world to stop upon the release and China to give up their dictatorship? Maybe you were waiting too much!! Maybe you were the one who was seeing it as much more than "just a rock album". Its influence on other artists and bands will be seen in the future just like it happened in the past.

[spgunner]

Then tell me this, Jarmo.  What have they done over the past decade or so that you found some fault with?  I've never heard you be critical of anything, ever.  Can you give me an instance?

Anything on this, Jarmo?

Why is this of such a personal importance for you?

Everybody can look back at events or decisions and wish they had done things differently. It's easy to be a smart ass in hindsight....

You personally seem to still hold a grudge over events that didn't go according to your wishes in 2002 and 2008. Personally I'm in 2013 and what has happened, or didn't happen, is in the past. No need to dwell on it. You learn from it and move on.

I took a Greyhound from NYC to Portland, ME in 2006. So yeah, I've had shows cancelled too.

It doesn't make any difference to me if I think Axl should've done 1000000 interviews in November 2008 and sit here five years on feeling upset about it.




/jarmo

People need to move on and stop pointing fingers at Axl for no reason. Some fans over the internet are so unfair to him and to the band. issue is... some fans do think they have reasons to point fingers. This is so stupid.

[D-GenerationX]

I think I'd like to amend my definition of a fanboy after reading that, spgunner.  Good lord, are you a true believer. 

In the right context, I'll agree that CD selling what it did was pretty amazing with no proper single, interviews, promotion, or any of that.  Absolutely agree.

As for what did I expect?  5 years after an album is released, I think its not great news no one could tell you a song off of it, unless they took a shot with the title track.  I think its not great news that after all this time, no one outside these forums could tell you who is in the band.  You don't see these as problems?

[D-GenerationX]

People need to move on and stop pointing fingers at Axl for no reason. Some fans over the internet are so unfair to him and to the band. issue is... some fans do think they have reasons to point fingers. This is so stupid.

I have a question for you, then.

Is anything critical ever allowed to be said?  I'm never sure what to make of these "fans are too demanding" comments.  We aren't going to his house, guns drawn, and demanding things from him. 

But is saying "Man, would it kill him to shoot out a press release?", is that some crazy demand?  Or is that an observation a fan makes from time to time?  Is "Sure hope the next album doesn't take another 10 years" us demanding things?  Or again, is this an observation?

And should the answer to anything and everything be some variation of "man, you got some balls on you"?

[spgunner]

"I think I'd like to amend my definition of a fanboy after reading that, spgunner.  Good lord, are you a true believer.  "

This reminds me of a old Commando's line: "you're a funny guy sully i like you. that's why i'm going to kill you last".

"In the right context, I'll agree that CD selling what it did was pretty amazing with no proper single, interviews, promotion, or any of that.  Absolutely agree."

Maybe there's liht at the end of the tunnel for you!

"As for what did I expect?  5 years after an album is released, I think its not great news no one could tell you a song off of it, unless they took a shot with the title track.  I think its not great news that after all this time, no one outside these forums could tell you who is in the band.  You don't see these as problems?"

Many people not only recognize songs such as Better and Madagascar but they cheer to it at the live gigs. Would be better if there were singles and vids promoting it in a way to make the songs and the record more of a commercial success? maybe, But in the end why does it matter so much? The record is there. If many people won't hear it because of that, unlucky them. I'm pretty sure Axl didn't want the release the way it happened but it's done. That's how it happened. Turn the page.
Well yeah many people have no idea who's in the band. And even so they go see the band. I wish people recognized the band the way it happened to former members and maybe it will happen someday. But if it doens't... does it change your life? Does it change the way you love (if you do) the band?
As a fan I wanted 5 videos for CD, I wanted more CD songs played live, I wanted CD II to be released asap, I wanted Tommy to be recognized by the fans as a much more important member in the band than Duff ever was (to name one current member) I wanted so many things. But all I want - and all we all want, it's just a bunch of "wishes" and "ifs" and no more than that. It's not up to me, not up to you or to anyone but Axl (assuming he can do whatever he wants, which, by the way, doesn't seen to be 100% because of record company and their bullshit).  
I guess there are so many rotten issues inside this business and I guess so many things didn't happen the way Axl wanted. Apart from that he needs to deal with pissed off fans? Gimme a break. You don't need to agree on everything. But you gotta understand that the band doesn't have any kind of obligations with the fans. So... let's hope for a great future ahead and let's enjoy CD and whatever that comes to us. Period !

[spgunner]

"I have a question for you, then.

Is anything critical ever allowed to be said?  I'm never sure what to make of these "fans are too demanding" comments.  We aren't going to his house, guns drawn, and demanding things from him.  "

You can say whatever you want, we live in free countries. But to demand... it's not nice to say the least. And believe me...some fans would love to force xl to do things.

"But is saying "Man, would it kill him to shoot out a press release?", is that some crazy demand?  Or is that an observation a fan makes from time to time?  Is "Sure hope the next album doesn't take another 10 years" us demanding things?  Or again, is this an observation?"

Ok. Is it up to you or to Axl to shoot out a press release? I guess it's up to him. If I'm right (let me know if I'm not), Axl and ONLY Axl will know when it's time to do that. If he feels like, if there' s a reason for it. Period.
And yes we can wish a new album won't take so many years. But people aren't like this. One thing is to write "Oh I hope we get a new album sooner than CD". But YOU know people aren't like this. People demand, people offend, people want what they want no matter what.
Getting back to "shoot out a release". I ask myself why. If Axl doesn't say a word, people point fingers at him for not saying a word. If he does say something, people will analyze every single word he says to then... bitch about it as well. So, maybe Axl should never say a word again !

[D-GenerationX]

Many people not only recognize songs such as Better and Madagascar but they cheer to it at the live gigs. Would be better if there were singles and vids promoting it in a way to make the songs and the record more of a commercial success? maybe, But in the end why does it matter so much? The record is there. If many people won't hear it because of that, unlucky them. I'm pretty sure Axl didn't want the release the way it happened but it's done. That's how it happened. Turn the page.

What exactly does this mean?  Is anyone disputing that's how it went down?  Of course that's how it went down.  We were all there.

But why is saying "boy did that get fucked all up" this crime against humanity?  Its an observation, no?

It's not up to me, not up to you or to anyone but Axl

This is another one I hear a lot of.  Under this premise, how could we ever comment on anything, ever, except our own personal lives?

- Can't talk politics.  We aren't the President.  Doesn't matter what we think.
- Can't talk sports.  We aren't the coach.  Doesn't matter what we think.
- Can't talk about a TV show.  We aren't the writer.  Doesn't matter what we think.

Is this a logical mindset, as you see it? 

If we are never supposed to comment on things that happen, why is this site in existence?  Why is ANY message board in existence?  Do you know how many boards are out there talking about those sorts of topics?  Do you really have to be a card carrying member of the business in question to be allowed to express an opinion?

[jarmo]

But you were the one that got all salty over the "not credible" tag. 

Ok, I'll explain it to you.

Is Axl not "credible" regarding things related to his life and career? Would you say that? Would you say somebody who's not Axl and has less idea of what it's like to be Axl or what's it like to be in GN'R is more credible?

I'm not comparing myself to Axl, before you ask. Just saying that people have different perspectives and knowledge/understanding. To label somebody as not credible based on that is somewhat disrespectful. Or are you saying I know nothing about the subject? Because claiming somebody who knows nothing about a subject to be less credible would be, normal...


I have no issues with you, or ay other Internet poster saying I'm not objective. To me that's not some badge of honor. I always assumed people who want 100% objective comments wouldn't go to a fan site. But that's just me.

Questioning the credibility is another thing. Not credible to me means people who make shit up, who lie, attention seekers who'll do anything for attention and so on.


There's many things we as fans wish were different. But it's in the past. I don't dwell on it.
Do I wish we would have 30 studio albums by GN'R out by now? Sure. Do I wish they would've released every show for free for every fan on the planet? Sure, yes please. Do I wish world peace was a fact? Yes, I do.

But these things didn't happen, yet. Because of a number of reasons. I don't have a desire to sit here and make lists of "My grievances with my favorite band so my online image looks better". I'm sorry. Things happened, I moved on. Some didn't.

 


One of the main reasons this to me is pointless because things have been pretty good ever since the release of Chinese Democracy. Got the album, got the shows, got a stable band, got official site, got more communication, got a fan club, got live streams, got shows in places that shows were canceled in the past etc....




/jarmo

[D-GenerationX]

One of the main reasons this to me is pointless because things have been pretty good ever since the release of Chinese Democracy. Got the album, got the shows, got a stable band, got official site, got more communication, got a fan club, got live streams, got shows in places that shows were canceled in the past etc....

What are you looking for in this upcoming year?

And please don't tell me that you have no control over that, I know that.  But just you and I, shooting the shit...what are you looking for?

Once again, I'll start.  Some other touring leg seems inevitable, likely South America.  OK, fine.  I'm all for people all over the world being able to see the band.

However, I would be pretty disappointed if a tour leg completed between January through March is the only thing they do all year.  It would be my hope that after a few months to recharge, work could begin in earnest on a new album.

Is that out of line, as you see it?