2012 Baseball Season/Off-Season Discussion

[Falcon]

If this is true, the Red Sox have gone batshit crazy (well, more than usual)..

They're the frontrunners for Shane Victorino, 3 yrs at 38 mil.

I'm down with overpaying on the short term but this is just goofy.

I guess their new philosophy is over spend short term instead of long term

Indeed it is, let's not forget the Gomes deal as well.

Short term insanity vs full on dementia it seems.

[tim_m]

If this is true, the Red Sox have gone batshit crazy (well, more than usual)..

They're the frontrunners for Shane Victorino, 3 yrs at 38 mil.

I'm down with overpaying on the short term but this is just goofy.

I guess their new philosophy is over spend short term instead of long term

Indeed it is, let's not forget the Gomes deal as well.

Short term insanity vs full on dementia it seems.

I'm not expecting that to work out any better either.

[AxlsMainMan]

NASHVILLE, Tenn. -- Wary of attracting unwanted attention, Mets general manager Sandy Alderson held a clandestine meeting Monday evening with Bo McKinnis, the agent for R.A. Dickey. In a parking lot outside the Gaylord Opryland Resort & Convention Center, amidst a sea of valet attendants and exhaust fumes, the two discussed a contract extension.

They also discussed the possibility of a trade.

"As time has progressed," McKinnis said of his client, "I think he is getting more to a peace with it."

More and more, the Mets appear willing to become the seventh team in Major League history to trade a reigning Cy Young Award winner before the following year's Opening Day. The greatest obstacle -- perhaps the only obstacle at this point -- is finding a deal that makes sense. As Alderson reiterated to McKinnis during their parking lot rendezvous, he will not deal Dickey, who is under team control for one more year, without receiving an impact player in return.

http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20121204&content_id=40524256&vkey=news_mlb&c_id=mlb

[Falcon]

Insanity continues..

The Giants just gave 37 year old Marco Scutaro 20 million over 3 years.

Yes, a 3 year deal for a 37 year old middle infielder.

Seems as though a few Giant free agents are cashing in some of that post season equity.

78 million bones committed to Affeldt, Pagan and Scutaro.

[faldor]

If this is true, the Red Sox have gone batshit crazy (well, more than usual)..

They're the frontrunners for Shane Victorino, 3 yrs at 38 mil.

I'm down with overpaying on the short term but this is just goofy.

I guess their new philosophy is over spend short term instead of long term

Indeed it is, let's not forget the Gomes deal as well.

Short term insanity vs full on dementia it seems.

I'm not expecting that to work out any better either.

I approved of the Napoli deal far more than the Victorino deal.  With Napoli, you're paying a guy who you hope can hit around 30 HR's.  That may not be worth 13 million a year, but you do usually have to pay for a legit right handed power hitter.  Victorino on the other hand, I guess if he plays his best COULD be worth 13 million, but that seems like a stretch and I don't really expect him to return to his All Star caliber.  He's probably a lesser version of Carl Crawford, and the Sox were paying him 20 million per, so I guess if you look at it that way it's a deal.

So I don't have a problem with Victorino the player, just the terms of the deal.  But I think those 2 moves do make their lineup much better, and their overall payroll sits at 119 million right now, down from 175 last year.  They could still use a SS and a SP.  Again, I'm not expecting them to contend until they prove they can pitch.  And I don't see anyone they could acquire that could change my mind on that end.  They could put a competitive team out there though, and that's a lot better than what they trotted out last season.  So it IS a step in the right direction, hopefully.

And as has been pointed out, it's not just the Red Sox that are overspending.  That's what happens in free agency.  That's why it's such a gamble.  You can hit it big, or set yourself back a few years.  But you have to pay in free agency.  Unless you wait it out and take fliers on guys that fall through the cracks.

[faldor]

More on the Sox and the Victorino signing.  As rumors have popped up today about Ellsbury's name being floated around and even linked to the Phillies in connection with Cliff Lee.  Let me first say that I would do that deal in a heartbeat.  I don't care that Cliff Lee is owed like 80 million dollars over the next 3 years.  Again, I can accept overpaying in the short term, ESPECIALLY if it's for proven pitching.  With that being said, I don't think the Phillies would do that deal, at least not straight up.  I mean, yes, they would shed a good deal of payroll, but they'd be taking on a player in his contract year who'd be unlikely to sign an extension (Boras client).  So I think THEY could get more for Lee, and the Sox would probably have to lower their expectations on what they'd receive for Ellsbury.

All that being said, the Victorino signing does give the Sox flexibility.  They could stand pat and go with an OF of Gomes, Ellsbury, Victorino.  Hold onto Jacoby and hope he has a monster walk year.  That would increase his value so they could possibly get more for him at the trading deadline.  Or, they play it out, let him sign elsewhere and get the draft pick compensation, if they feel that would be of more value.  Then next season they could shift Victorino to CF, where he's more valuable (lack of power for a corner OF).  Or they could try and trade Ellsbury right now for either an established pitcher or a prospect.  Then shift Victorino to CF and sign Cody Ross to play RF. 

They have options.  They are also listening to offers on Lester.  Like I said last season, they should listen to offers for ANYONE on the team.  A complete overhaul would be fine with me.  They're already well on their way.  They're looking to reload a few years down the line when their high prospects will hopefully be ready to contribute, and hopefully at a high level.  Until then, the goal is to try and put a competitive product on the field and if everything clicks the right way they could get lucky and overachieve.

[tim_m]

Shields and Davis from the Rays to the Royals for several minor league players.

[Falcon]

Shields and Davis from the Rays to the Royals for several minor league players.

I have never seen a trade invoke more overreaction from both ends of the spectrum.

The Royals got 300 plus innings and the Rays got potential, easy enough.

[pilferk]

Pending physical, Youk to Yanks in a 1 year deal, 12 million.

Should be a good stop gap til Arod comes back in june/july.

[Falcon]

Pending physical, Youk to Yanks in a 1 year deal, 12 million.

Should be a good stop gap til Arod comes back in june/july.

Love the deal.

I wouldn't be shocked if Youk is the 3B for the entire season, not sure ARod will be a factor this year whatsoever.

[faldor]

Pending physical, Youk to Yanks in a 1 year deal, 12 million.

Should be a good stop gap til Arod comes back in june/july.

Love the deal.

I wouldn't be shocked if Youk is the 3B for the entire season, not sure ARod will be a factor this year whatsoever.

Me either.  Although, Youkilis hasn't been the model of physical fitness the last few years either.  So I tend to think they'll be using other bodies at 3B along the way.  Especially playing 3B, that position has taken a toll on Youkilis since he switched back over from 1B.  Much more demanding, obviously.

[Falcon]

Pending physical, Youk to Yanks in a 1 year deal, 12 million.

Should be a good stop gap til Arod comes back in june/july.

Love the deal.

I wouldn't be shocked if Youk is the 3B for the entire season, not sure ARod will be a factor this year whatsoever.

Me either.  Although, Youkilis hasn't been the model of physical fitness the last few years either.  So I tend to think they'll be using other bodies at 3B along the way.  Especially playing 3B, that position has taken a toll on Youkilis since he switched back over from 1B.  Much more demanding, obviously.

Yep, I doubt Youk's gonna do 140 games at 3B but he'll do more than whomever else they have over there I'd suspect.

I think ARod's closer to done than he is to being anything much more than a fringe player, bad hips on an old guy already on the downside is a bad combination.

[Falcon]

Done deal - Josh Hamilton to Angels 5/125.

[tim_m]

I guess the Angels learned nothing from their mediocre season last year after their outlandish spending.

[faldor]

I guess the Angels learned nothing from their mediocre season last year after their outlandish spending.

That would SEEM to be another big blow to the Rangers.  Last year they stole CJ Wilson away, this year Hamilton.  However, it didn't really work out for them last year as the Rangers still finished on top.  But Texas needs to do something here.  And I don't know if signing Adam LaRoche is the answer.

Sox signed Ryan Dempster.  I'm not too thrilled with that deal.  Yes, they needed starting pitching.  But I don't view Dempster as anything more than a 4 or 5 starter, MAYBE a 3 at best in the AL.  So while he may eat some innings, I'm not expecting a sterling season from him.  Bottom line is, their pitching still leaves a lot to be desired, and that's not a good thing.

The Napoli deal too, has yet to be made official.  Apparently they saw something they didn't like as far as his health goes.  So they may be trying to protect themselves by re-working the contract a bit.

[AxlsMainMan]

Blue Jays making a big push for Dickey

[faldor]

They certainly are.  Seems pretty much like a done deal.  Jays have vastly improved this off-season, on paper.  We'll see if that translates on the field.  But they could be a major player in the AL East this year.

And my Red Sox fall further and further down the line, looking all the more like the last place team they were in 2012.

[GeorgeSteele]

Very sad to see R.A. go.  Got decent prospects I suppose, but my sense is they could have done better.  We're now going on 3 seasons in a row where the team is punting contention before the season even begins.

How about them Jays, though?  They're shaping up to be a force.  R.A. Dickey's numbers against the AL East are stellar. 

[LongGoneDay]

I'm a Sox fan, but man these moves just have to make you laugh. Spending a lot of money to be mediocre, if they're lucky.
At least they are only locked into bad short term deals as opposed to horrible long term deals.
That's progress I guess. Go Sox!

[AxlsMainMan]

How about them Jays, though?  They're shaping up to be a force.  R.A. Dickey's numbers against the AL East are stellar. 

They're now the Vegas favorite to win the World Series