Rock N Roll Hall Of Fame! Now it's official.

[pilferk]

pilferk, you're still putting in the fear of the re-union-talking as the main/only argument for this ONE night better not to perform.

Because it's the only one that really matters.  You don't need to make any others..because it's the most compelling, most obvious, and it has the most sway.  It's also grounded firmly in reality.

You can't say "Make another argument" when you can't really get around the point I'm making...YOU can take it as ONE NIGHT all you want.  That doesn't matter one iota.  Can you really promise EVERYONE on the planet, and specifically those involved in the music industry, will INSTANTLY take it as "one night", too?  No, of course not. 

And really...Axl's opinion on that fact is all that really will matter.

"oh my god, oh my god, if they perform there could be a re-union, oh my god"......i just dont think thats how it must have to be seen here. the fear of "bad press" is something Axl got used to a lot and it didnt change him or his plans at all.

You can think anything you want.  It doesn't matter.

What matters is what AXL thinks might happen.  What AXL thinks the effects might be.  It's that simple, really.

Does it HAVE to be seen that way? No...I'm sure there would be cooler heads that wouldn't see it that way.

But that's not the issue:  Would SOME people...people who actually matter and have influence on the success of the band...see it that way.  If you don't see the possibility of that happening, you're don't fully grasp the situation.    It's risk/reward.   Too much risk..little to no reward.

and i disagree about your "that night is not what the fans want", because i think it mainly is! the fans wanted them to be inducted, and the majority of the fans would like to see some performance of the AFD/UYI line-up. they want it but its just not their decision of how it works out!

I'm sure there are a lot of foks who would disagree....because they're looking through their "fan" eyes.  The reality is:  What you want, who you want on stage, and HOW you want them inducted doesn't matter.  It just doesn't.  Because what the fans want has little to no influence on what actually happens.

i also diagree about a possible performance being only Axl's decision here, if Slash doesnt want to perform there it wouldnt happen aswell.

But the process starts with Axl.  Slash doesn't even get to weigh in until Axl gives his yea or nea.  So, ultimately, it starts there.

and no, i also disagree Axl only thinks of what its best with the newer (DJ-)incarnation here, he surely respects what old Guns did archieve....and thats what got them into the HOF and is the reason why he will show up!

Respects, yes.  Makes his decisions, NOW, based on what's best for THAT (AFD/UYI) incarnation? No. Not a hot chance in hell.  The decisions he makes are what's best for Guns, NOW.  Disagree all you want...that's reality.

and i said this lots of weeks before already, they had and still have time to set-up such a performance properly (with press releases, video interviews, live talking etc. that there wont be a re-union tour and all go their seperate ways as to be seen from the booked tours) to calm down the "oh my god, re-union"-people.

Wouldn't work.  Won't work.  Simple as that.

[vicariousexistence]

as much as it wouldn't feel complete, it'd still be really cool to see the original other 4 play without axl. 

[Limulus]

eh, "the fans" wanted GN'R to be there and they got in, off course its the fans' wishes in here! it wasnt any decision from any GN'R members, period! "how" it will turn out is not the fans' decision, sure. but you made "that night is not what the fans want" look like they didnt have anything to do with it in the first place...which isnt true.

"The decisions he makes are what's best for Guns, NOW."  <--- why was he talking about Slash then that often the last months? must be good for Nu-Guns

i think that your fear of the "oh my god-reunion, oh my god"-press talkers doesnt and shouldnt have that much weigth in the decision of a performance/non-performance that night as its about honoring the past that night and not anything else or upcoming stuff.
you're not even given any arguments for the last scenario i put up (that they could set-it up properly), just "wouldnt work, wont work" is a very poor answer. i gave my reasons why it could actually work. it appears they dont want to take care from it for now though. but the excuse "no time to set it up properly" aint a valid one after a non-performance.

and maybe they could and should have fun that night, too?

[HBK]

eh, "the fans" wanted GN'R to be there and they got in, off course its the fans' wishes in here! it wasnt any decision from any GN'R members, period! "how" it will turn out is not the fans' decision, sure. but you made "that night is not what the fans want" look like they didnt have anything to do with it in the first place...which isnt true.

"The decisions he makes are what's best for Guns, NOW."  <--- why was he talking about Slash then that often the last months? must be good for Nu-Guns

i think that your fear of the "oh my god-reunion, oh my god"-press talkers doesnt and shouldnt have that much weigth in the decision of a performance/non-performance that night as its about honoring the past that night and not anything else or upcoming stuff.
you're not even given any arguments for the last scenario i put up (that they could set-it up properly), just "wouldnt work, wont work" is a very poor answer. i gave my reasons why it could actually work. it appears they dont want to take care from it for now though. but the excuse "no time to set it up properly" aint a valid one after a non-performance.

and maybe they could and should have fun that night, too?

Calm Man... Drink COFFEE !@

 

[Estranged#9]

This should go down the way Metallica's induction went ,but it will probable go down even worse then the Van Halen induction!

+1 this whole thread can be summarized with this quote!

I hope it goes down like Metallicas did, but not holding my breath 

I might still buy a ticket but really don't want to spend 500 for no songs played 

[HBK]

This should go down the way Metallica's induction went ,but it will probable go down even worse then the Van Halen induction!

+1 this whole thread can be summarized with this quote!

I hope it goes down like Metallicas did, but not holding my breath 

I might still buy a ticket but really don't want to spend 500 for no songs played 

Ex.Members Maybe Play... Buy Ticket !@

 

[T-Bone]

as much as it wouldn't feel complete, it'd still be really cool to see the original other 4 play without axl. 

Assuming Axl doesn't want to perform, this is exactly what I'd love to see. The 4 of them play through three or four classics, without a singer. The "Missing Man" formation.

[pilferk]

eh, "the fans" wanted GN'R to be there and they got in, off course its the fans' wishes in here! it wasnt any decision from any GN'R members, period! "how" it will turn out is not the fans' decision, sure. but you made "that night is not what the fans want" look like they didnt have anything to do with it in the first place...which isnt true.

Did the fans vote?  Was there a ballot I missed?

No.  Some entity selected them.  Not the fans.

The fans want them there, yes.  They had no part in really putting them there (unless you count album sales....but even that didn't actually PUT them there).

The fans get to celebrate (and buy tickets...spending money..there's that motivating factor popping up again) for and with the band.  THAT'S what they have to do with the evening.

"The decisions he makes are what's best for Guns, NOW."  <--- why was he talking about Slash then that often the last months? must be good for Nu-Guns

Where and in what context?  Certainly not one that would actually effect the current band.

i think that your fear of the "oh my god-reunion, oh my god"-press talkers doesnt and shouldnt have that much weigth in the decision of a performance/non-performance that night as its about honoring the past that night and not anything else or upcoming stuff.

Mine doesn't.  I've made that pretty clear. Neither does your short sightedness.

Axl's does.

And while you might not WANT it to have anything to do with the present...the decisions made surrounding that night certainly will.  You might not want to acknowledge that fact, but it IS a fact.  Not supposition.  Not trying to get into Axl's head.  But any decision Axl makes will certainly take the current incarnation of GnR into account.  Whether you think that's the right thing to do or not...that's what WILL happen.

you're not even given any arguments for the last scenario i put up (that they could set-it up properly), just "wouldnt work, wont work" is a very poor answer. i gave my reasons why it could actually work. it appears they dont want to take care from it for now though. but the excuse "no time to set it up properly" aint a valid one after a non-performance.

and maybe they could and should have fun that night, too?

It's not a poor answer, it's the truth.  And I've explained, in detail, why in previous posts.  Should I repeat myself for you?

Why you THINK it MIGHT work...for you...doesn't take into account that not everyone thinks LIKE YOU. Explain how you guarantee (not think, not suppose...ENSURE) that NOBODY takes the "one night only" reunion and tries to leverage it into something more.

 If you sit there an promise me that NOBODY on the planet will take it "the wrong way"...I'll laugh, and call you a liar.  Because no matter how much they preface it, no matter how many interviews they do, no matter how much YOU WISH THEY COULD....there are people who can effect the direction, makeup, and future of GnR who absolutely WILL take it the wrong way.  Not might.  Not could. WILL.

Again.....you have fun...but not at the expense of damaging your career and ability to make a living. 

[pilferk]

as much as it wouldn't feel complete, it'd still be really cool to see the original other 4 play without axl. 

Assuming Axl doesn't want to perform, this is exactly what I'd love to see. The 4 of them play through three or four classics, without a singer. The "Missing Man" formation.

You'd essentially have VR.

Couldn't bill themselves as GnR, though.

[T-Bone]

as much as it wouldn't feel complete, it'd still be really cool to see the original other 4 play without axl. 

Assuming Axl doesn't want to perform, this is exactly what I'd love to see. The 4 of them play through three or four classics, without a singer. The "Missing Man" formation.

You'd essentially have VR.

Couldn't bill themselves as GnR, though.

I don't think the matter of what they would be billed as is much of a concern. People will get the point.

[Bobarcord]

this topic has turned into kids on the playground arguing..." No my big wheel is better..."

[GeorgeSteele]

as much as it wouldn't feel complete, it'd still be really cool to see the original other 4 play without axl. 

Assuming Axl doesn't want to perform, this is exactly what I'd love to see. The 4 of them play through three or four classics, without a singer. The "Missing Man" formation.

You'd essentially have VR.

Couldn't bill themselves as GnR, though.

I don't think the matter what they would be billed as is much of a concern. People will get the point.

What would be the point of that exactly?

[pilferk]

I don't think the matter what they would be billed as is much of a concern. People will get the point.

I think you'd be surprised at just how much it WOULD matter.... in many, many respects.

And, if you did that...without offering Axl something in return (like the current incarnation of GnR performing)...you'd likely find that Axl didn't show.

Maybe they'd be OK with that...but now you have VR performing at GnR's induction, and no sign of one of the founding members (and, in some respects, as much of the "sound" of classic GnR as Slash's riffs were).  That certainly throws a shadow over the evening.

People might get A point...it might not be the point you want them to get though.

[pilferk]

this topic has turned into kids on the playground arguing..." No my big wheel is better..."

I don't think either big wheel is better (and I don't think my dick is bigger, either).

What I do think is that people don't think their fantasy scenarios all the way through....it's all about what they want, or would like to see (or, in some cases, feel entitled to see).  They're like dogs with a bone who can't let go.  As a fan, I understand why people do that (to some extent), and where they're coming from.

But there comes a point when business, reality, AND all the personal bullshit that has gone in has to be taken into account, rather than get ignored to play "what if".

However, I will admit that it's getting tiresome...because I, at least, seem to be repeating myself an awful lot without making any headway.

That being said....I'll let this issue go.  I've said my piece...I don't think I need to beat it into the ground any more.

[Limulus]

Why you THINK it MIGHT work...for you...doesn't take into account that not everyone thinks LIKE YOU.  If you sit there an promise me that NOBODY on the planet will take it "the wrong way"...I'll laugh, and call you a liar.

Again.....you have fun...but not at the expense of damaging your career and ability to make a living. 

same goes to you, just because you put the performance scenario like it would be the end of Axl's and the new bands' career doesnt mean they or others do think so. and i highly doubt that the members do!

promise....wth is that about? if you're so full of fear that if more newspapers would say smth. re-unionwise.....eh, there has been GN'R re-union talking all the years. it will never stop until they die! damaging Axl's career? i could very well see positive outcome (for you "good press") when showing some less bitterness towwards old friends and maybe even performing them, this is more helping his career - not that i think he cares or needs it much though. but in the end he has made his living from old Guns!

see the last DJ quote? hell yeah, he even would like to see smth. cool!
get on the phones, damn! 

[LongGoneDay]

as much as it wouldn't feel complete, it'd still be really cool to see the original other 4 play without axl. 

Assuming Axl doesn't want to perform, this is exactly what I'd love to see. The 4 of them play through three or four classics, without a singer. The "Missing Man" formation.

You'd essentially have VR.

Couldn't bill themselves as GnR, though.

I don't think the matter what they would be billed as is much of a concern. People will get the point.

What would be the point of that exactly?

Entertainment. That's pretty much what the night is about, for the fans anyway. They are buying tickets to be entertained.
I'm not sure I'd be interested in watching them play w/o a singer, though.
I'd like to say all or nothing. Come together and perform, or don't.
Don't half ass it, or continue the feud in public by playing w/o Axl, or playing w/o Slash.
At the same time though, the fans, and the guys who want to play shouldn't be punished by the ones who don't.
Personally I'd like to see Slash and Izzy jam with the Faces. Seeing Rod attempt to return to his roots is almost as interesting to me as the GN'R fiasco.
I think the Faces have issues of their own though, so unfortunately it appears as though what could have been one of the most exciting evenings in RHOF history could could shape up to be a real snooze fest. Maybe Axl can front the Faces and vice versa...
Anything to keep the Beastie Boys off of the stage.

[pilferk]

same goes to you, just because you put the performance scenario like it would be the end of Axl's and the new bands' career doesnt mean they or others do think so. and i highly doubt that the members do!

promise....wth is that about? if you're so full of fear that if more newspapers would say smth. re-unionwise.....eh, there has been GN'R re-union talking all the years. it will never stop until they die! damaging Axl's career? i could very well see positive outcome (for you "good press") when showing some less bitterness towwards old friends and maybe even performing them, this is more helping his career - not that i think he cares or needs it much though. but in the end he has made his living from old Guns!

see the last DJ quote? hell yeah, he even would like to see smth. cool!
get on the phones, damn! 

Every point addressed in previous posts (though you seem to be missing them...especially re: risk/reward)....so, as I said, not going to continue to beat my head against the wall on the topic.

Rock out with your cock out, dude.  Just don't get it caught in the zipper. 

[volcano62]

The whole situation reminds me of...

LLOYD: I'm gonna ask you something flat out and I want you to answer me honestly: What do you think the chances are of a girl like you and a guy like me ending up together?

Mary is obviously thrown by this question.

MARY: Lloyd, that's difficult to say. I mean we hardly --
LLOYD: I asked you to be honest, Mary.
MARY: But Lloyd, I really can't --
LLOYD: Come on, give it to me straight. I drove a long way to see you, the least you can do is level with me. What are my chances?
MARY: Not good.
LLOYD: You mean not good, like one out of a hundred?
MARY: I'd say more like one out of a million.
LLOYD: So you're telling me there's a chance?




/jarmo

 

Haha i love that movie!
Touch? Sir Jarmo

[GeorgeSteele]

as much as it wouldn't feel complete, it'd still be really cool to see the original other 4 play without axl. 

Assuming Axl doesn't want to perform, this is exactly what I'd love to see. The 4 of them play through three or four classics, without a singer. The "Missing Man" formation.

You'd essentially have VR.

Couldn't bill themselves as GnR, though.

I don't think the matter what they would be billed as is much of a concern. People will get the point.

What would be the point of that exactly?

Entertainment. That's pretty much what the night is about, for the fans anyway. They are buying tickets to be entertained.
I'm not sure I'd be interested in watching them play w/o a singer, though.
I'd like to say all or nothing. Come together and perform, or don't.
Don't half ass it, or continue the feud in public by playing w/o Axl, or playing w/o Slash.
At the same time though, the fans, and the guys who want to play shouldn't be punished by the ones who don't.
Personally I'd like to see Slash and Izzy jam with the Faces. Seeing Rod attempt to return to his roots is almost as interesting to me as the GN'R fiasco.
I think the Faces have issues of their own though, so unfortunately it appears as though what could have been one of the most exciting evenings in RHOF history could could shape up to be a real snooze fest. Maybe Axl can front the Faces and vice versa...
Anything to keep the Beastie Boys off of the stage.

A lot of people, including me, would definitely be very entertained by Slash/Izzy/Duff/Steve performing (with Duff, Izzy singing), but at a ceremony honoring GnR?  The awkwardness of it would overwhelm any entertainment value.  Seems like that would only be done for 'fuck you' purposes and I don't think any of those 4 have that motivation. 

[LongGoneDay]

as much as it wouldn't feel complete, it'd still be really cool to see the original other 4 play without axl. 

Assuming Axl doesn't want to perform, this is exactly what I'd love to see. The 4 of them play through three or four classics, without a singer. The "Missing Man" formation.

You'd essentially have VR.

Couldn't bill themselves as GnR, though.

I don't think the matter what they would be billed as is much of a concern. People will get the point.

What would be the point of that exactly?

Entertainment. That's pretty much what the night is about, for the fans anyway. They are buying tickets to be entertained.
I'm not sure I'd be interested in watching them play w/o a singer, though.
I'd like to say all or nothing. Come together and perform, or don't.
Don't half ass it, or continue the feud in public by playing w/o Axl, or playing w/o Slash.
At the same time though, the fans, and the guys who want to play shouldn't be punished by the ones who don't.
Personally I'd like to see Slash and Izzy jam with the Faces. Seeing Rod attempt to return to his roots is almost as interesting to me as the GN'R fiasco.
I think the Faces have issues of their own though, so unfortunately it appears as though what could have been one of the most exciting evenings in RHOF history could could shape up to be a real snooze fest. Maybe Axl can front the Faces and vice versa...
Anything to keep the Beastie Boys off of the stage.

A lot of people, including me, would definitely be very entertained by Slash/Izzy/Duff/Steve performing (with Duff, Izzy singing), but at a ceremony honoring GnR?  The awkwardness of it would overwhelm any entertainment value.  Seems like that would only be done for 'fuck you' purposes and I don't think any of those 4 have that motivation. 

Yeah I agree.
That's why I mention jamming with the Faces or something that couldn't be construed as an F U.
Just entertainment.