Gilby talks about Guns N' Roses, Axl Rose, Slash and Chinese Democracy

[westcoast_junkie]

Oh sorry Ali, didn't mean to be a repeating monkey!

[Stoned_In_L.A.]

Again, not really.  He ALLOWS members to contribute.  How else can you explain how "Better" has always been described as a "Robin" song.  "The General", which we haven't heard, is supposedly a Tommy song.  Shackler's, Scraped, and Sorry were Brain/Bucket songs.  Dizzy and Paul's contributions are all over the album.  How is that not allowing members to contribute?

No one is denying that Axl has final say.  Guys IN the band have stated that.  I think that happens more frequently in bands then you'd like to believe.  Do you think Steven Adler, Matt Sorum, or Gilby ever had equal say in GNR?  How about the guys in Slash's solo band, you think they have equal say with Slash?  How about Dave Kushner, or even Matt Sorum in Velvet Revolver?  How about anyone not named Van Halen, in Van Halen?  The list goes on and on.

Maybe we're arguing different things here, but we're certainly not seeing eye to eye.

Did you bother to read my post after the one you quoted? Apparently not.

I don't think anyone is claiming that Axl isn't willing to consider what's brought to the table by whomever.

The actual debate is Axl being the one with the final say on whether or not it will be recorded.

Not all bands operate under that mentality, nor should they if it's truly a "band".

With that said, Gilby's comment can be justified when he says Axl should allow his bands to contribute.

I take "contribute" as work with the material even if it doesn't specifically fit Axl's vision.

[Limulus]

well, "IF" he means CD it might just be his thoughts that CD isnt that good -as many people do think aswell, no secret- and blames it on Axl's working method with CD band members....3 guitarists of them not that around anymore by the way.
maybe he talked about old Guns where his song writing was not wanted, maybe a combination of both, maybe just hoping for upcoming killer music, we just dont know from his short answer!!

also "Stoned_In_L.A." latest reply could make sense!

[westcoast_junkie]

Limulus: If you think it's so important that we don't speculate on what Gilby means with his short answer, why do u do it your self?

[DeN]

Not all bands operate under that mentality, nor should they if it's truly a "band".

not that I love feeding the trolls () but do you have some examples in mind? I'm curious.

[chineseblues]

"Shotgun Blues" and probably "My World" are two Rose songs that should have been on the cutting floor and weren't..  Go figure.

That's only your opinion. Plenty of people like both of those songs. 

[faldor]

Again, not really.  He ALLOWS members to contribute.  How else can you explain how "Better" has always been described as a "Robin" song.  "The General", which we haven't heard, is supposedly a Tommy song.  Shackler's, Scraped, and Sorry were Brain/Bucket songs.  Dizzy and Paul's contributions are all over the album.  How is that not allowing members to contribute?

No one is denying that Axl has final say.  Guys IN the band have stated that.  I think that happens more frequently in bands then you'd like to believe.  Do you think Steven Adler, Matt Sorum, or Gilby ever had equal say in GNR?  How about the guys in Slash's solo band, you think they have equal say with Slash?  How about Dave Kushner, or even Matt Sorum in Velvet Revolver?  How about anyone not named Van Halen, in Van Halen?  The list goes on and on.

Maybe we're arguing different things here, but we're certainly not seeing eye to eye.

Did you bother to read my post after the one you quoted? Apparently not.

I don't think anyone is claiming that Axl isn't willing to consider what's brought to the table by whomever.

The actual debate is Axl being the one with the final say on whether or not it will be recorded.

Not all bands operate under that mentality, nor should they if it's truly a "band".

With that said, Gilby's comment can be justified when he says Axl should allow his bands to contribute.

I take "contribute" as work with the material even if it doesn't specifically fit Axl's vision.

I did read your post, yes.  And once again, I think far more bands have certain members that have MORE say than others than you'd like to believe.  I know we'd all like to live in a world where everyone gets along and everyone has equal say and everyone's opinions are equal, but that's just not the case.  I gave you examples before, feel free to go over them again if you'd like.

D is a Bon Jovi fanatic and he admitted Bon Jovi is run in a similar manner.  Not really as uncommon as you'd think.

[faldor]

"Shotgun Blues" and probably "My World" are two Rose songs that should have been on the cutting floor and weren't..  Go figure.

That's only your opinion. Plenty of people like both of those songs. 

Yeah, completely subjective.  I quite like "Shotgun Blues".  I will say though, I'm with you on "My World".  Not a fan.

[Smoking Guns]

"Shotgun Blues" and probably "My World" are two Rose songs that should have been on the cutting floor and weren't..  Go figure.

That's only your opinion. Plenty of people like both of those songs. 

True, but if polled, they would be two of the least liked in the history of GNR....  Name two worse filler songs than those.. You will probably have a hard time.  I think the music is good in "Shotgun Blues", but damn, that chorus is bad.  I do like part of the versus, but the song "needed" more work.  So the point is, "if its up to Axl's standards, it can be used", or "if its Axl's idea no matter if it sucks or not, it can be used"... Just being the devil's advocate.  He has sole writing credits on both those tunes which are universally considered the two weakest tracks on the UYI2 album.

[Ali]

"Shotgun Blues" and probably "My World" are two Rose songs that should have been on the cutting floor and weren't..  Go figure.

That's only your opinion. Plenty of people like both of those songs. 

True, but if polled, they would be two of the least liked in the history of GNR....  Name two worse filler songs than those.. You will probably have a hard time.  I think the music is good in "Shotgun Blues", but damn, that chorus is bad.  I do like part of the versus, but the song "needed" more work.  So the point is, "if its up to Axl's standards, it can be used", or "if its Axl's idea no matter if it sucks or not, it can be used"... Just being the devil's advocate.  He has sole writing credits on both those tunes which are universally considered the two weakest tracks on the UYI2 album.

Universally? Until you can show me the poll numbers from a statistically significant sample size, I'm calling complete and utter horseshit. I'll take "Shotgun Blues" over "14 Years" and "Pretty Tied Up". I know others that feel the same way. Until you can show me the poll you mentioned, you're just projecting your opinion onto a majority.

Ali

[Smoking Guns]

You would take "shotgun blues" over "14 years" (great izzy tune) and "pretty tied up" (a song guns thought was good enough to play live very often)? 

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20090706153425AAwBqYQ

http://www.newgnr.com/forum/index.php?topic=43317.0

http://www.last.fm/group/Guns+N%27+Roses/forum/193/_/113503

Three threads from three sites....  Everyone for the most part thinks My World blows hard.. Then lots of arguing over what is worse among the others.  Shotgun Blues gets plenty of mentions...

[Trist805]

I always liked Shotgun Blues...thought it captured some of their raw energy, and is fast paced.  I would put it above "So Fine". 

[D]

Out of all the UYI songs.. if we are being objective but i like them all in some way but the worst songs are:

UYI:
Garden of Eden

My World of course is worst song in GNR history.. i dont think anybody would dispute that. I like My World but i also liked silk Worms.....


It took me 10 years to even remotely like Garden of Eden
so it may be with my world my least favorites.

[Limulus]

So the point is, "if its up to Axl's standards, it can be used", or "if its Axl's idea no matter if it sucks or not, it can be used"

thats a good point! and even much more with the new members.

[HBK]

So the point is, "if its up to Axl's standards, it can be used", or "if its Axl's idea no matter if it sucks or not, it can be used"

thats a good point! and even much more with the new members.

What New Members ?

[lynn1961]

If Jon doesn't approve, it doesn't make the record. 

[westcoast_junkie]

You would take "shotgun blues" over "14 years" (great izzy tune) and "pretty tied up" (a song guns thought was good enough to play live very often)? 

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20090706153425AAwBqYQ

http://www.newgnr.com/forum/index.php?topic=43317.0

http://www.last.fm/group/Guns+N%27+Roses/forum/193/_/113503

Three threads from three sites....  Everyone for the most part thinks My World blows hard.. Then lots of arguing over what is worse among the others.  Shotgun Blues gets plenty of mentions...

Shotgun Blues raaawks!!!!

But has that anything to do with this discussion if that ol' song is good or bad? Just a quiestion.....

Think you die hard "old" Guns fans never will admit that "new" Guns can make an epic album, even if they did (and in my opinion they've already put one).....And u gonna bitch about Axls and Guns way of working, even if we really don't know how they work. Gilby don't, I don't, Limulus don't..But we have quotes from current members, like Tommy, and that's really the most reliable source we have. Gilby worked with GnR almost two decades ago...

[Limulus]

we can "speculate" about Tommys words aswell 
they never played "Shotgun Blues" live by the way.
more music and (to me) better music would be appreciated. though i'd rather not go for "epic" stuff but a killer hard rock record.

[Bodhi]

D is a Bon Jovi fanatic and he admitted Bon Jovi is run in a similar manner.  Not really as uncommon as you'd think.

Bon Jovi is a little different than most bands.  Jon got that record deal for "Runaway" on his own,  then filled in his band accordingly.  It is a very unique deal that works for them.  The members of Bon Jovi are paid employees of Jon and ALWAYS have been since the beginning, they were never really a band to begin with.  It has always surprised me that Bon Jovi has had the longevity and success that it has had without too many problems with egos etc.  Then again if you really look at it, the dudes in Bon Jovi are getting a sweet paycheck without having to deal with any of the bullshit.  Its great for guys like Tico Torres who really isn't that passionate about music, but does the gig so he can have money and free time to work on his art projects.  Also I can't really see David Bryan bitching either, i mean where else is a keyboard player going to make that kind of cash and play to those size crowds?  Richie is also a pretty humble dude.  Almost 30 years going and all Jon had to do personnel wise was kick a bass player out of the band.  The band members also dont have to deal with any bullshit besides playing music, all the business stuff is Jons headache.  It is one of those super rare instances in rock where everybody wins.

[D]

well no, they had a rift after New Jersey album and the band came close to breaking up.  They hired a psychologist to help them work out their problems like Metallica did later on....... Richie was ExTREMELY jealous cause he felt he co wrote all the big songs and he was right.

What happened u ask??

Jon released a solo album.. Young Guns II soundtrack with a number 1 hit and it sold 4 million copies

Richie released a solo album and it barely cracked the top 50..........


They realized they better get their ass in gear cause Jon didn't really need them as bad as they needed him.

GNR are a bit different cause Slash did have some success with the Snakepit thing and now of course Contraband and his solo album were very successful

If Snakepit absolutely bombed... I think Slash would've crawled back.