Gilby talks about Guns N' Roses, Axl Rose, Slash and Chinese Democracy

[Ali]

i disagree when it comes to power, the GN'R vision etc.....then the name owning thing is VERY relevant. but lets take a look at that quote:

Q: I am hoping for GN'R's to still release their equivalent of Fleetwood Mac's "Rumours", you know, a new record with a new band incarnation playing new style of music (compared to their blues music with Peter Green, which was also great) which will be so great that people will stop comparing everything they do to the Appetite and Illusion era. Do you see it happen? Is Axl such a musical genius that he will be able to create an epic album that put all criticism to rest?

A: yes, but he would need to let his bandmates contribute & trust them.

since this is a recent interview and not from pre-CD times he didnt ask for CD but an future "epic" album (equivalent of Fleetwood Mac's "Rumours"), so actually any CD related stuff with writing credits is irrelevant here.
it comes over wrong when you interpretate that being CD related.....but it isnt. but yeah, though it lets room for your speculation its propbably just is critiques for the 1-person-who-took-the-name-issue thing, smth. which is all over this interview.


the circus end 1991-beginning 1993:
Gilby was in the band back then...shouldnt he know better than you, Soul Monster? 
but i also have read different things from that, anyone got other quotes from former band members regarding this issue?

The name-owing issue is 100% irrelevant to the question of contributions to the music.  Axl is the sole-owner of the GN'R name and yet of the 14 songs on CD, he received sole writing credit on only ONE SONG.  Therefore, you cannot draw any conclusion at all between having a stake in the band name and contributing to the song-writing.  Period.

Ali

the 1-person-name-band-issue is all over the interview, Ali, and again i disagree that this doesnt have anything to do with music contribution. yes, they got CD song writing credits but surely Axl picked the parts being used on it not them! Axl decided what was to be released officially musicwise. but that wasnt the main point, the thing you got wrong in the 1st place was that you've used and still use CD "booklet proves" for your theory when he was NOT talking about CD but an possible upcoming "epic" album, just re-read the quoted question and answer. Gilby agrees that Axl is a musical genius but doesnt seem to think that the current hired musicians are able to create such a thing. hell, we dont even know what Ashba brings to the table for Guns in the studio, that all will be proven in the future not in the past or on CD. and still you all took the room for speculation and implying that he was only talking about CD (Buckethead, Paul, Finck, Brain anyone by the way)?
about oter subjects in this interview it makes you sound desperate that now another old Guns related musician tells his version (similar to many others) aswell but not the one you'd like to have it being told or being accepted by the main public, some frustation to see Gilby jumping on the big wagon with so many others, huh?

I think you're missing the point from what little I could understand from your post.  I realize that Gilby wasn't directly talking about CD, but as Jarmo said, ""he would need to let his bandmates contribute & trust them"

It implies that he doesn't or hasn't in the past.

Which is false. As anybody who can read and owns a copy of Chinese Democracy can see".

If that isn't enough for you, Axl said during one of the Hammerstein shows (I believe the first) in 2006, that "Better" was a "Robin song".  Chris Pitman has said that he came up with the idea for "If The World" and then sent over the demo to Axl and he laid down vocal melodies over that.

So, the point still stands, the implication that Axl doesn't or hasn't let his bandmates contribute is completely, unequivocally false.

Ali

[chineseblues]

Q: Guns N' Roses during the Use Your Illusion tours was quite bloated and excessive. Did it ever feel like being part of some rock and roll parody rather than a real, serious touring band?

[...]it was axl's vision to have the back up singers & horns[...]

that circus was Axl's vision??

No that was Slash's idea to add horns and backup singers. If you didn't like it blame him. 

You are incorrect Slash did not want any back up singers or horns.

Wrong, Slash put the whole thing together. Axl said it during an interview back when the tour was going on.

[Smoking Guns]

Nice interview.  Gilby seems like a good guy.

[D]

nobody considers Gilby better than Izzy.....

u gotta be shitting me

izzy has more songwriting credits than Slash.

[D]

Q: Guns N' Roses during the Use Your Illusion tours was quite bloated and excessive. Did it ever feel like being part of some rock and roll parody rather than a real, serious touring band?

[...]it was axl's vision to have the back up singers & horns[...]

that circus was Axl's vision??

No that was Slash's idea to add horns and backup singers. If you didn't like it blame him. 

You are incorrect Slash did not want any back up singers or horns.

Wrong, Slash put the whole thing together. Axl said it during an interview back when the tour was going on.

I thought it was Axl's idea but Slash's responsibility to find the personnel?   I loved the horns and tracy and roberta for the record.

[Ali]

Q: Guns N' Roses during the Use Your Illusion tours was quite bloated and excessive. Did it ever feel like being part of some rock and roll parody rather than a real, serious touring band?

[...]it was axl's vision to have the back up singers & horns[...]

that circus was Axl's vision??

No that was Slash's idea to add horns and backup singers. If you didn't like it blame him. 

You are incorrect Slash did not want any back up singers or horns.

Wrong, Slash put the whole thing together. Axl said it during an interview back when the tour was going on.

I thought it was Axl's idea but Slash's responsibility to find the personnel?   I loved the horns and tracy and roberta for the record.

I think that may be the case, unless my memory is incorrect.  But, if you participate in finding the players and singers, I don't see how you can wash your hands of that situation.  In fact, I'd say that's a fairly significant level of involvement.

Ali

[Limulus]

Q: Guns N' Roses during the Use Your Illusion tours was quite bloated and excessive. Did it ever feel like being part of some rock and roll parody rather than a real, serious touring band?

[...]it was axl's vision to have the back up singers & horns[...]

that circus was Axl's vision??

No that was Slash's idea to add horns and backup singers. If you didn't like it blame him. 

i accidently messed up user names in my reply:
"the circus end 1991-beginning 1993:
Gilby was in the band back then...shouldnt he know better than you, Soul Monster chineseblues?"

sorry, "Soul Monster"!! 
------------
@Ali: about your thoughts of the horn section era "I don't see how you can wash your hands of that situation.".......well, Slash said that he did lots of things to "just to keep things rolling", not to make it too complicated, not to be "un"busy, just to avoid trouble. that makes sense to me, but yeah, cant get totally clean hands in here. would like to read more quotes about that horn section decision. Gilby here says it was Axl's idea.

@Ali:  as for your reply "I realize that Gilby wasn't directly talking about CD"

....finally you did!!
but then you started talking CD writing credits allover, eh....

if you take Gilby's direct quote then this is the fact:
he was NOT talking about CD but an possible upcoming "epic" album, just re-read the quoted question and answer. Gilby agrees that Axl is a musical genius but doesnt seem to think that the current hired musicians are able to create such a thing.

all the rest of your CD talking songs is what you're putting in between those lines.
my speculative take on it would be that Gilby does critizise the method of contribution of song parts being used in a 1-leader-band doesnt help much in creating a killer album when it worked out better before with band members on a similar/same level.

[faldor]

I think Gilby's still a little sore from being booted from the band because Axl wasn't pleased with what he was bringing to the table in a songwriting sense.  That's why he feels that Axl doesn't let band members contribute.  If what you bring to him isn't any good, then no, your contributions aren't needed.  Sorry Gilby, better luck next time. 

[Stoned_In_L.A.]

I think Gilby's still a little sore from being booted from the band because Axl wasn't pleased with what he was bringing to the table in a songwriting sense.  That's why he feels that Axl doesn't let band members contribute.  If what you bring to him isn't any good, then no, your contributions aren't needed.  Sorry Gilby, better luck next time. 

And maybe that's what Gilby meant by 'not allowing his bandmates to contribute' ...

[faldor]

I think Gilby's still a little sore from being booted from the band because Axl wasn't pleased with what he was bringing to the table in a songwriting sense.  That's why he feels that Axl doesn't let band members contribute.  If what you bring to him isn't any good, then no, your contributions aren't needed.  Sorry Gilby, better luck next time. 

And maybe that's what Gilby meant by 'not allowing his bandmates to contribute' ...

Like I said, Axl didn't like what Gilby had to offer so he turned him down.  Just like he offered to work with what Slash brought to him but Slash refused to have it tweaked in any way so he took it for himself for Snakepit.  Do you think Axl should use anything and everything that band members bring his way?  Not sure that'd be a smart move.

[Stoned_In_L.A.]

I think Gilby's still a little sore from being booted from the band because Axl wasn't pleased with what he was bringing to the table in a songwriting sense.  That's why he feels that Axl doesn't let band members contribute.  If what you bring to him isn't any good, then no, your contributions aren't needed.  Sorry Gilby, better luck next time. 

And maybe that's what Gilby meant by 'not allowing his bandmates to contribute' ...

Like I said, Axl didn't like what Gilby had to offer so he turned him down.  Just like he offered to work with what Slash brought to him but Slash refused to have it tweaked in any way so he took it for himself for Snakepit.  Do you think Axl should use anything and everything that band members bring his way?  Not sure that'd be a smart move.

What I do think is that most "band" decisions involve input from its members.

When one guy is calling the shots (as you suggested), it then justifies Gilby's comment about Axl needing to allow his band to contribute.

[faldor]

I think Gilby's still a little sore from being booted from the band because Axl wasn't pleased with what he was bringing to the table in a songwriting sense.  That's why he feels that Axl doesn't let band members contribute.  If what you bring to him isn't any good, then no, your contributions aren't needed.  Sorry Gilby, better luck next time. 

And maybe that's what Gilby meant by 'not allowing his bandmates to contribute' ...

Like I said, Axl didn't like what Gilby had to offer so he turned him down.  Just like he offered to work with what Slash brought to him but Slash refused to have it tweaked in any way so he took it for himself for Snakepit.  Do you think Axl should use anything and everything that band members bring his way?  Not sure that'd be a smart move.

What I do think is that most "band" decisions involve input from its members.

When one guy is calling the shots (as you suggested), it then justifies Gilby's comment about Axl needing to allow his band to contribute.

Not really.  Axl is still allowing band members to contribute.  It's just that not everything is used that is brought to the table.  Hell, I'm sure Axl himself has come up with stuff that he later scrapped because it wasn't good enough.  Seems like a pretty simple concept to me, and not a dictatorship as you're trying to portray.

[Stoned_In_L.A.]

I think Gilby's still a little sore from being booted from the band because Axl wasn't pleased with what he was bringing to the table in a songwriting sense.  That's why he feels that Axl doesn't let band members contribute.  If what you bring to him isn't any good, then no, your contributions aren't needed.  Sorry Gilby, better luck next time. 

And maybe that's what Gilby meant by 'not allowing his bandmates to contribute' ...

Like I said, Axl didn't like what Gilby had to offer so he turned him down.  Just like he offered to work with what Slash brought to him but Slash refused to have it tweaked in any way so he took it for himself for Snakepit.  Do you think Axl should use anything and everything that band members bring his way?  Not sure that'd be a smart move.

What I do think is that most "band" decisions involve input from its members.

When one guy is calling the shots (as you suggested), it then justifies Gilby's comment about Axl needing to allow his band to contribute.

Not really.  Axl is still allowing band members to contribute.  It's just that not everything is used that is brought to the table.  Hell, I'm sure Axl himself has come up with stuff that he later scrapped because it wasn't good enough.  Seems like a pretty simple concept to me, and not a dictatorship as you're trying to portray.

Not good enough for Axl.

That doesn't necessarily mean that the material wasn't good enough to Gilby, you, I, or anyone else.

It does seem like a pretty simple concept.

In most bands, a consensus is involved.

If approval is required by one specific member (as you suggested), that would justify Gilby's comment about the need to allow the bandmates to contribute.

[westcoast_junkie]

I think Gilby's still a little sore from being booted from the band because Axl wasn't pleased with what he was bringing to the table in a songwriting sense.  That's why he feels that Axl doesn't let band members contribute.  If what you bring to him isn't any good, then no, your contributions aren't needed.  Sorry Gilby, better luck next time. 

And maybe that's what Gilby meant by 'not allowing his bandmates to contribute' ...

Like I said, Axl didn't like what Gilby had to offer so he turned him down.  Just like he offered to work with what Slash brought to him but Slash refused to have it tweaked in any way so he took it for himself for Snakepit.  Do you think Axl should use anything and everything that band members bring his way?  Not sure that'd be a smart move.

What I do think is that most "band" decisions involve input from its members.

When one guy is calling the shots (as you suggested), it then justifies Gilby's comment about Axl needing to allow his band to contribute.

Not really.  Axl is still allowing band members to contribute.  It's just that not everything is used that is brought to the table.  Hell, I'm sure Axl himself has come up with stuff that he later scrapped because it wasn't good enough.  Seems like a pretty simple concept to me, and not a dictatorship as you're trying to portray.

Not good enough for Axl.

That doesn't necessarily mean that the material wasn't good enough to Gilby, you, I, or anyone else.

It does seem like a pretty simple concept.

In most bands, a consensus is involved.

If approval is required by one specific member (as you suggested), that would justify Gilby's comment about the need to allow the bandmates to contribute.

This can go many ways, but after all Axl is the singer. U can't force an artist to work with something he or she doesn't feel like working with. Like "hey Axl, the rest of the band has voted that u should write lyrics to this piece of music, if not we have a back up plan: Gilby write the lyrics, and then we decide in the spirit of democracy that u have to sing his lyrics, even if they don't mean shit to you!"

Maybe that's the way a lot of the mainstream-artist does it, but I believe the real ones perform music that means something....

[Soul Monster]

i accidently messed up user names in my reply:
"the circus end 1991-beginning 1993:
Gilby was in the band back then...shouldnt he know better than you, Soul Monster chineseblues?"

sorry, "Soul Monster"!! 

Hah, no problem .

[Ali]

Q: Guns N' Roses during the Use Your Illusion tours was quite bloated and excessive. Did it ever feel like being part of some rock and roll parody rather than a real, serious touring band?

[...]it was axl's vision to have the back up singers & horns[...]

that circus was Axl's vision??

No that was Slash's idea to add horns and backup singers. If you didn't like it blame him. 

i accidently messed up user names in my reply:
"the circus end 1991-beginning 1993:
Gilby was in the band back then...shouldnt he know better than you, Soul Monster chineseblues?"

sorry, "Soul Monster"!! 
------------
@Ali: about your thoughts of the horn section era "I don't see how you can wash your hands of that situation.".......well, Slash said that he did lots of things to "just to keep things rolling", not to make it too complicated, not to be "un"busy, just to avoid trouble. that makes sense to me, but yeah, cant get totally clean hands in here. would like to read more quotes about that horn section decision. Gilby here says it was Axl's idea.

@Ali:  as for your reply "I realize that Gilby wasn't directly talking about CD"

....finally you did!!
but then you started talking CD writing credits allover, eh....

if you take Gilby's direct quote then this is the fact:
he was NOT talking about CD but an possible upcoming "epic" album, just re-read the quoted question and answer. Gilby agrees that Axl is a musical genius but doesnt seem to think that the current hired musicians are able to create such a thing.

all the rest of your CD talking songs is what you're putting in between those lines.
my speculative take on it would be that Gilby does critizise the method of contribution of song parts being used in a 1-leader-band doesnt help much in creating a killer album when it worked out better before with band members on a similar/same level.

I don't know if it it's because of selective reading, stubbornness or just a lack of comprehension, but you completely missed the point, again, about why what Gilby said is off-base.  I explained it, Jarmo explained it, and you still don't get it.  There's no point in mentioning it again.

Ali

[Ali]

I think Gilby's still a little sore from being booted from the band because Axl wasn't pleased with what he was bringing to the table in a songwriting sense.  That's why he feels that Axl doesn't let band members contribute.  If what you bring to him isn't any good, then no, your contributions aren't needed.  Sorry Gilby, better luck next time. 

And maybe that's what Gilby meant by 'not allowing his bandmates to contribute' ...

Like I said, Axl didn't like what Gilby had to offer so he turned him down.  Just like he offered to work with what Slash brought to him but Slash refused to have it tweaked in any way so he took it for himself for Snakepit.  Do you think Axl should use anything and everything that band members bring his way?  Not sure that'd be a smart move.

What I do think is that most "band" decisions involve input from its members.

When one guy is calling the shots (as you suggested), it then justifies Gilby's comment about Axl needing to allow his band to contribute.

Not really.  Axl is still allowing band members to contribute.  It's just that not everything is used that is brought to the table.  Hell, I'm sure Axl himself has come up with stuff that he later scrapped because it wasn't good enough.  Seems like a pretty simple concept to me, and not a dictatorship as you're trying to portray.

Not good enough for Axl.

That doesn't necessarily mean that the material wasn't good enough to Gilby, you, I, or anyone else.

It does seem like a pretty simple concept.

In most bands, a consensus is involved.

If approval is required by one specific member (as you suggested), that would justify Gilby's comment about the need to allow the bandmates to contribute.

Are you drinking from the same punch-bowl as Limulus?  Look at the songwriting credits for CD.  The band contributed, so there is no reason for Gilby to imply otherwise.  If that's not enough, there's this quote from Tommy Stinson from 2004:  "He likes to take all the members of the band and get the best out of each guy for each song," Stinson said. "It's a brilliant process that gets everyone involved so everyone owns a piece of the song because they've put themselves into it. That way you don't have people going, 'Well, I'm not gonna play on his song if you're not gonna sing on my song.' And that's a lengthy process because you have to get eight people to basically write a song together that everyone likes."

As far as the Snakepit example, that is a shit one to use as an example of one person, i.e. Axl, needing to approve material because even Gilby admits that both Duff and Axl didn't want to work on the material.

Ali

[Limulus]

ha, still talking CD writing credits when he didnt even talk about that, Ali? whats our punch-bowl?

[AxlReznor]

ha, still talking CD writing credits when he didnt even talk about that, Ali? whats our punch-bowl?

You're just refusing to understand a word he's saying, aren't you.

[jacdaniel]

Guns N Roses these days is basically Axl and whoever he decides to work with.  I dont think anybody can deny that....  
Yes the band members contribute but Axl will have final say on what makes the album, whose in the band etc etc.  

He even said in the early 90's that Guns was basically him, Slash, Duff and Doug.  Everyone else involved was hired to do a job.  

Of course there is nothing wrong with that, it just is what it is.