2011 Baseball Season/Off-Season Discussion

[tim_m]

Another UGLY game for the sox. Getting raped by the 1-8 rays 12-2 ouch.

The optimist in me says, the Rays were bound to get out of their funk eventually.  They had scored 20 runs all season long, an average of just over 2 per game.  Tonight they put up 16.  Like they say, momentum is only as good as your next days starting pitcher.  As great as Beckett was last night, Dice K was a million times worse tonight.  From one of the best games pitched I've seen in awhile last night to one of the worst tonight.  Luckily I didn't get a chance to see it unfold, I'm sure I wouldn't have lasted long.  Tomorrow it's the 2 aces squaring off, Lester vs. Price.

I'd like to think the Sox will win back to back games at some point this season, but right now they just can't seem to get anything consistent going on a positive note.

A game that bad i would've turned off long before it got to 16 or i would've deposited my tv out my window!

[tim_m]

Got 5 free Yanks tickets for the game against the O's tomorrow night....Main level, 208, on the aisle.  Pretty good seats.

We're on the foul side of the right field pole...hopefully bring some balls home tomorrow night (and no bruises!).

The only problem: Phil Hughes pitching......

All that assuming the veritable monsoon that's supposed to move through over the next 24 hours has passed.

Have fun! It looks like the rain could let up enough by 8 or so. So i expect they'll play.

[D]

I just gotta say that I am convinced Ryan Howard and Pujols were juicers.

Pujols' numbers dropped last year and he has been terrible this year. people can say its "contract" all they want, but when HRs are down across the board, that makes me think everybody was using.

[pilferk]

I just gotta say that I am convinced Ryan Howard and Pujols were juicers.

Pujols' numbers dropped last year and he has been terrible this year. people can say its "contract" all they want, but when HRs are down across the board, that makes me think everybody was using.

Maybe.

But Howard is getting older...and if you look at guys "similar" to him, they all start to decline right around his age (which, granted, is still young).  I argued this last year when his contract was extended.  So far this season, he's been pretty solid...we'll see if he keeps those numbers up.

With Pujols...I don't know.  Honestly, it could be the same thing.  When looking at similar batters, you're looking at guys like Albert Belle, Juan Gonzalez, Hank Greenberg, Jason Giambi (yeah, I know...JUICE!!), and Jim Edmonds.

Almost all those guys started to see declines in their early to mid 30's.  Granted, Pujols decline is earlier than you would expect (at 31).  And it's probably too early to "panic" and call it a decline, really.  But IF it turns out that his production drops....there are other guys, similar guys, who saw the same type of thing.

Pujols has been an amazing athlete.  His defensive skills don't seemed to have slipped at first base, and he seems to have the same speed and flexibility he's had in previous seasons.  Could just be a cold stretch.  Could be the contract.  Could be he WAS juicing (something I'd actually be surprised at).  Or it could just be age starting to catch up to him.   I guess we'll see.

[sandman]

I just gotta say that I am convinced Ryan Howard and Pujols were juicers.

Pujols' numbers dropped last year and he has been terrible this year. people can say its "contract" all they want, but when HRs are down across the board, that makes me think everybody was using.

i disagree 100%. those are 2 of the star players in this league that i would bet never used. although i will never say i am absolutely convinced of anything since there's no way to know for certain.

did pujols numbers really drop last year? i thought he had great numbers across the board last year. and you can't judge a player after one week.

Howard's numbers dropped, but i think it's a combination of many other things, primarily pitchers pitching him better, and his new approach at the plate trying to reduce SOs. he is off to a great start this year. also, his ability to hit a HR to any part of the ballpark has never gone away.

when do you think these guys stopped juicing? if someone's numbers dropped significantly in 2007 or 2008 when the steroid thing with Pettite and others was at its peak, i would be more suspect. but these guys had some of their best seasons ever in those years. so if they were juicing in 2009, why would they all of a sudden stop?

[GeorgeSteele]

Sure most of you have heard, but Josh Hamilton is out 2 months after breaking his arm trying to tag from 3rd on an infield pop-up (the 3rd base coach sent him).  Anyway, Bobby Valentine opines that it happened because Hamilton was a drug addict:

http://deadspin.com/#!5791474/espns-joe-morgan-replacement-bobby-valentine-is-not-making-a-whole-lot-of-sense

[faldor]

Sure most of you have heard, but Josh Hamilton is out 2 months after breaking his arm trying to tag from 3rd on an infield pop-up (the 3rd base coach sent him).  Anyway, Bobby Valentine opines that it happened because Hamilton was a drug addict:

http://deadspin.com/#!5791474/espns-joe-morgan-replacement-bobby-valentine-is-not-making-a-whole-lot-of-sense

Tough break for the Rangers.  Unfortunately Hamilton seems to be a great talent who just seems to be a bit high on the injury risk meter.

And I agree with the Bobby Valentine stuff.  I watched Sunday Night baseball this week and the broadcast team was AWFUL.  Made me long for Tim McCarver and  Joe Buck, who were slightly less awful on Saturday.

[tim_m]

What's everyone think about Hamilton's comments about the third base coach? Is he right to say what he did or do you think he's being a crybaby?

[Falcon]

I just gotta say that I am convinced Ryan Howard and Pujols were juicers.

Pujols' numbers dropped last year and he has been terrible this year. people can say its "contract" all they want, but when HRs are down across the board, that makes me think everybody was using.

Good fucking Lord D, are you serious?

Taking a slow start (he had a slower start in 07) and declaring it evidence of "juicing" throughout an untarnished career is fucking silly.
 
Albert led the league in homers and RBI's last year for cryin' out loud, give me a fucking break.

Dude's set the bar so God damn high over the greatest first 10 years in the history of the game and you pass judgment on a 11 game sample?

You should be ashamed of yourself.

[GeorgeSteele]

What's everyone think about Hamilton's comments about the third base coach? Is he right to say what he did or do you think he's being a crybaby?

Normally I say you keep that stuff in-house, but I'll give him the benefit of the doubt on the basis that, for a recovering addict, the prospect of doing nothing for 2 months while recovering from an injury must be legitimately terrifying for him.  So I think this goes beyond a typical crybaby lashing out because he got injured.  I think the last time he fell off the wagon was during an injury. 

By the way, in defense of the 3rd base coach, it wasn't that bad of a play.  Nobody was covering home and the catcher barely made it back in time.

[GeorgeSteele]

April 13, 2011

Bonds Guilty of Obstruction of Justice

By JULIET MACUR

SAN FRANCISCO ? Barry Bonds, the former outfielder who hit more career home runs than anyone else in baseball history, was convicted Wednesday of a single count of obstruction of justice, but a federal jury here could not reach a verdict on the question of whether Bonds had lied about never knowingly using steroids during his career.

The conviction, rendered by a jury that listened to nearly three weeks of often graphic testimony about Bonds?s alleged steroid use, amounted to an extremely limited victory for federal prosecutors who had spent years pressing their case against Bonds, 46, in an effort to establish that he had used performance-enhancing drugs during his historic career, and then lied about it under oath.

Still, the conviction on the obstruction of justice charge ? the jury agreed that Bonds had misled or impeded a 2003 grand jury hearing evidence about steroid use by elite athletes ? makes Bonds the most prominent publicly tried culprit in what has become known as baseball?s steroid era. The verdict is certain to diminish the legacy of a player who seemed, even early in his career, to be destined for the sport?s Hall of Fame.

Bonds faces a possible sentence of 10 years in federal prison, although he is not expected to receive anywhere near that length of prison time, if any.

Bonds, a seven-time most valuable player in the National League, last played for the San Francisco Giants in 2007, the year he broke Hank Aaron?s career home run record.

The week after the Giants, just two miles away, raised their 2010 World Series championship flag at their home opener at AT&T Park on Friday, Bonds found himself at the end of a long road at the courthouse. He had provided his grand jury testimony more than seven years ago and was first formally charged four years later. But the case stretched on for years with pretrial legal wrangling.

The jurors ? eight women and four men ? took over three days to return with a verdict. After hearing closing arguments Thursday, which took more than four hours, they deliberated Friday, Monday, Tuesday and a part of Wednesday.

The court clerk read the verdict as Bonds looked on in silence from the defense table. Bonds is the 11th and final person to be convicted of a crime as a result of steroid distribution by the Bay Area Laboratory Co-operative, which the government began investigating in 2002. Three of those convicted ? the Olympic sprinter Marion Jones, the former N.F.L. defensive tackle Dana Stubblefield and the cyclist Tammy Thomas ? were convicted of perjury or lying to federal agents in connection with the Balco investigation.

[tim_m]

April 13, 2011

Bonds Guilty of Obstruction of Justice

By JULIET MACUR

SAN FRANCISCO ? Barry Bonds, the former outfielder who hit more career home runs than anyone else in baseball history, was convicted Wednesday of a single count of obstruction of justice, but a federal jury here could not reach a verdict on the question of whether Bonds had lied about never knowingly using steroids during his career.

The conviction, rendered by a jury that listened to nearly three weeks of often graphic testimony about Bonds?s alleged steroid use, amounted to an extremely limited victory for federal prosecutors who had spent years pressing their case against Bonds, 46, in an effort to establish that he had used performance-enhancing drugs during his historic career, and then lied about it under oath.

Still, the conviction on the obstruction of justice charge ? the jury agreed that Bonds had misled or impeded a 2003 grand jury hearing evidence about steroid use by elite athletes ? makes Bonds the most prominent publicly tried culprit in what has become known as baseball?s steroid era. The verdict is certain to diminish the legacy of a player who seemed, even early in his career, to be destined for the sport?s Hall of Fame.

Bonds faces a possible sentence of 10 years in federal prison, although he is not expected to receive anywhere near that length of prison time, if any.

Bonds, a seven-time most valuable player in the National League, last played for the San Francisco Giants in 2007, the year he broke Hank Aaron?s career home run record.

The week after the Giants, just two miles away, raised their 2010 World Series championship flag at their home opener at AT&T Park on Friday, Bonds found himself at the end of a long road at the courthouse. He had provided his grand jury testimony more than seven years ago and was first formally charged four years later. But the case stretched on for years with pretrial legal wrangling.

The jurors ? eight women and four men ? took over three days to return with a verdict. After hearing closing arguments Thursday, which took more than four hours, they deliberated Friday, Monday, Tuesday and a part of Wednesday.

The court clerk read the verdict as Bonds looked on in silence from the defense table. Bonds is the 11th and final person to be convicted of a crime as a result of steroid distribution by the Bay Area Laboratory Co-operative, which the government began investigating in 2002. Three of those convicted ? the Olympic sprinter Marion Jones, the former N.F.L. defensive tackle Dana Stubblefield and the cyclist Tammy Thomas ? were convicted of perjury or lying to federal agents in connection with the Balco investigation.

I don't get how they could find him guilty on that charge but the others. They agree he lied to federal investigators but not the grand jury? Seriously? If he liked to investigators don't you think they'd think he lied to the grand jury as well.

[D]

If ARod juiced, i am convinced every major hitter also did.

I think its naive to believe otherwise with everything that has come out.

[Falcon]

If ARod juiced, i am convinced every major hitter also did.

Ya, that's a well thought out conclusion.

This just in:

The earth is flat, up is down and day is night.

[cotis]

Is it time for me to drop Francisco Liriano? I've stuck with him thus far...

My other SP include CJ Wilson, Tim Lincecum, and John Danks.

Need someone's opinion other than mine!

[faldor]

Is it time for me to drop Francisco Liriano? I've stuck with him thus far...

My other SP include CJ Wilson, Tim Lincecum, and John Danks.

Need someone's opinion other than mine!

I haven't followed his decline too closely, though I've heard he's struggling mightily.  I don't think I'd give up on him just yet though.  He's got a pretty solid track record as recent as last season.  Could be just a slow start.  Unless injuries are playing a part yet again.  Also depends what you'd pick up after dropping him.  And if you did drop him, I'd keep a close eye on him to see if he gets it going again.

[cotis]

I've always loved "stream-lining" starters as my friends call it - picking one SP spot and dropping/adding weekly depending on who is hot and who they're going up against.

Liriano's spot could be that - and I could watch him through FA and make sure no one else grabs him...

[D]

If ARod juiced, i am convinced every major hitter also did.

Ya, that's a well thought out conclusion.

This just in:

The earth is flat, up is down and day is night.

I just honestly think pretty much everybody used. sucks i am that jaded with MLB, but i don't  believe anything i see anymore which is why i rarely watch a game anymore and it use to be right there with the NFL and NBA for me.

[Falcon]

Need someone's opinion other than mine!

I dropped him 2 starts in - bad location, declined velocity...

I keep a few core starters and drop/add according to matchups, seems to work OK.

[cotis]

Though he did have a nice outing tonight....

damn you Liriano!

I'll wait til next start..