[football] FIFA's Southafrica 2010 World Cup

[GeorgeSteele]

WTF was that call that disallowed a game-winning goal for the US?  Shameful. 

[jarmo]

England was just pathetic today....

I guess they can't get worse.....



/jarmo

[Ignacio]

England is playing horrible! I doubt they will pass Group Stages.

Holland vs Japan is the match to watch tomorrow 

[D]

Yeah we got the shaft today.

i told u guys our Defense sucks though. how in the world do they just let the offensive player walk right to the goal?

[One.In.A.Million]

I can't believe how bad England played today.

I just can't imagine how we can beat the likes of Brazil, Italy, Argentina and Spain, if we can't win Algeria.


I also think Rooney lost it today, he seemed to get worse during the game. Regarding his comment at full time, I don't think you can blame the fans for booing. With how bad we played, it was only expected and deserved.

The only saving grace for England in my view is that other world class teams have also started poorly. For instance France, Italy and Spain, have also not lived up to expectations.

[Mandy.]

I also think Rooney lost it today, he seemed to get worse during the game.

Rooney was unrecognizable! I don't know what happened to him today... And I also think Capello is taking too long to put Crouch and Wrigh-Phillips in the game. I actually think this last one shouldn't be on the bench, but on the starting line-up. It's getting tough for England. They'll have to beat Slovenia, or they will be eliminated.


By the way, see what I meant a few posts ago when I said "let's not forget it was just Australia", when Germany won that first game?


Spain, Germany, England, Italy (well, these 2 were draws, but they were pretty much losses to me) and France losing. And Brazil won with a not-very-convincing performance. I'm quite curious to see the outcomes of such a weird World Cup.

[One.In.A.Million]

I also think Rooney lost it today, he seemed to get worse during the game.

Rooney was unrecognizable! I don't know what happened to him today... And I also think Capello is taking too long to put Crouch and Wrigh-Phillips in the game. I actually think this last one shouldn't be on the bench, but on the starting line-up. It's getting tough for England. They'll have to beat Slovenia, or they will be eliminated.


By the way, see what I meant a few posts ago when I said "let's not forget it was just Australia", when Germany won that first game?


Spain, Germany, England, Italy (well, these 2 were draws, but they were pretty much losses to me) and France losing. And Brazil won with a not-very-convincing performance. I'm quite curious to see the outcomes of such a weird World Cup.

I agree, I think our manager is putting Crouch on way too late for him to make an impact on the match.

I love watching Brazil because of the way they play, even with all of my favourite players like Ronaldo and Rivaldo retired, I still love their style. And Brazil won comfortably against North korea, with them playing average. Can you imagine how good they will be when they are playing at the top of their game. 

I think Brazil and maybe Argentina are the only teams that have showed they have the potential to win this contest so far.

[estebanf]

So...Argentina in the next phase 

Great match against South Korea!!!. Open play from both teams, one of the most entertaining games I have seen so far. Charly Tevez played very well, must be his Xeneixe's blood of course   

First of all, Argentina is not in the next phase yet. If Argentina loses for more than 3 goals against Greece and then Korea wins against Nigeria for 3 or more goals, Argentina would be eliminated. Pretty much impossible, but this is football, and you never know...

Of course nothing is impossible. Hey, didn't Argentina need to win the game against Peru with a 4 goals difference to eliminate Brazil in 1978? And didn't they win scoring, like, 6 goals? But let's not get into that...

yeah, we better not start discussing that. i imagine what your point is. But anybody who knows *just a bit* football, knows that Argentina played a brilliant, masterclass of football that day, and could have won like 11 - 0 considerating how dominant and how many approches to the goal had during that game. Its too easy to think ''meh, that game was payed''. People need to know that you cant ''pay'' a shot on goal that hits the post and goes all over the line of goal, when the match is 1-1 in the 88th minute of the world cup final. And people who knows just a *bit* of football knows that Argentina was the undeniable best team in Argentina's 78 world cup.

Now, if you want to talk about brazilian players getting asleep in Argentina 1-0 Brazil in 1990's world cup due to clorophorm, you can just start talking 

ahh, memories 

England was just pathetic today....

I guess they can't get worse.....



/jarmo

Yeah, absolutely.

What is kinda incredible is England doesn't lose a match in world cups since their elimination in 2002 against Brazil... same for Argentina... Argentina doesnt lose since 0-1 against England in the second match of the first round in Korea-Japan (the day of Beckham's revenge and Veron's historic catastrophe)

[nekomex]

So...Argentina in the next phase 

Great match against South Korea!!!. Open play from both teams, one of the most entertaining games I have seen so far. Charly Tevez played very well, must be his Xeneixe's blood of course   

First of all, Argentina is not in the next phase yet. If Argentina loses for more than 3 goals against Greece and then Korea wins against Nigeria for 3 or more goals, Argentina would be eliminated. Pretty much impossible, but this is football, and you never know...

Of course nothing is impossible. Hey, didn't Argentina need to win the game against Peru with a 4 goals difference to eliminate Brazil in 1978? And didn't they win scoring, like, 6 goals? But let's not get into that...

yeah, we better not start discussing that. i imagine what your point is. But anybody who knows *just a bit* football, knows that Argentina played a brilliant, masterclass of football that day, and could have won like 11 - 0 considerating how dominant and how many approches to the goal had during that game. Its too easy to think ''meh, that game was payed''. People need to know that you cant ''pay'' a shot on goal that hits the post and goes all over the line of goal, when the match is 1-1 in the 88th minute of the world cup final. And people who knows just a *bit* of football knows that Argentina was the undeniable best team in Argentina's 78 world cup.

Now, if you want to talk about brazilian players getting asleep in Argentina 1-0 Brazil in 1990's world cup due to clorophorm, you can just start talking 

ahh, memories 

England was just pathetic today....

I guess they can't get worse.....



/jarmo

Yeah, absolutely.

What is kinda incredible is England doesn't lose a match in world cups since their elimination in 2002 against Brazil... same for Argentina... Argentina doesnt lose since 0-1 against England in the second match of the first round in Korea-Japan (the day of Beckham's revenge and Veron's historic catastrophe)

i dont want to start an argument, but in 78 Argentina was not considered the best team of the tournament, and still today many people that "know" about football agree that they won because they were in home not because they were the best.

and am not saying they fixed the game against Peru or that they were a bad team, i think people has to accept that Argentina won fair and square, but the team wasnt great.

[Mandy.]

So...Argentina in the next phase 

Great match against South Korea!!!. Open play from both teams, one of the most entertaining games I have seen so far. Charly Tevez played very well, must be his Xeneixe's blood of course   

First of all, Argentina is not in the next phase yet. If Argentina loses for more than 3 goals against Greece and then Korea wins against Nigeria for 3 or more goals, Argentina would be eliminated. Pretty much impossible, but this is football, and you never know...

Of course nothing is impossible. Hey, didn't Argentina need to win the game against Peru with a 4 goals difference to eliminate Brazil in 1978? And didn't they win scoring, like, 6 goals? But let's not get into that...

yeah, we better not start discussing that. i imagine what your point is. But anybody who knows *just a bit* football, knows that Argentina played a brilliant, masterclass of football that day, and could have won like 11 - 0 considerating how dominant and how many approches to the goal had during that game. Its too easy to think ''meh, that game was payed''. People need to know that you cant ''pay'' a shot on goal that hits the post and goes all over the line of goal, when the match is 1-1 in the 88th minute of the world cup final. And people who knows just a *bit* of football knows that Argentina was the undeniable best team in Argentina's 78 world cup.

Now, if you want to talk about brazilian players getting asleep in Argentina 1-0 Brazil in 1990's world cup due to clorophorm, you can just start talking 

ahh, memories 

Oh. My. God. Are you serious, Esteban? You truly believe it's because Argentina had a better team?! There are several books, articles, documentaries made about that World Cup! Everyone knows what happened. Everyone knows Argentina was under a very severe dictatorship (just like most countries in South America, including Brazil). In fact, there'll be a documentary airing about it tomorrow! Oh, and yeah, let's not forget that the Peruvian goalkeeper in 1978 was Argentinian and didn't even have a Peruvian citizenship! I'm truly scared and in awe, if you are serious when you say Argentina won it fair and square. It wasn't Argentina who played brilliantly. It was Peru that played NOTHING that match. And everyone who knows *just a bit* about football, knows that Peru had a pretty good team that year and there's NO WAY they would've played liked that under normal conditions.

For those who don't know about it, you can google it up. You'll find tons of things about it. This one is quite interesting: http://www.twohundredpercent.net/?p=6786

[estebanf]

bah, its simply not worth the discussion. Just believe your twisted theories if you feel happy with that. People love to repeat these kind of things instead of thinking and actually taking the time to see the 90 minutes of that game. Believing all this bullshit is simply more entertaining (and easier) than believing the truth.

I love football, I was born and live in Argentina, I study communications and I was born at the end of that dictatorship. And I've seen the 90 minutes of all our nations matches. I really dont need anyone who can only give an opinion from ''what people say'' out there to tell me if I'm serious or not, or to ''open my eyes with the unquestionable truth'' regarding this subject. Of course I am serious.

Explain how you can pay the example I made of the ball hitting the post and rolling all over the line of goal at the last minute of the final, with the score 1-1.

yes, i know you cant explain that. people like you say ''i never said Argentina payed the title, just the game against peru''. Simply lame.

Now i need someone (i will not mention any specific nation) to say ''yeah, you payed Argentina 78, and you cheated in Mexico 86 with Maradona's hand of god, you got no legit world championships''. Trust me: i've read/heard it all...

[estebanf]

So...Argentina in the next phase 

Great match against South Korea!!!. Open play from both teams, one of the most entertaining games I have seen so far. Charly Tevez played very well, must be his Xeneixe's blood of course   

First of all, Argentina is not in the next phase yet. If Argentina loses for more than 3 goals against Greece and then Korea wins against Nigeria for 3 or more goals, Argentina would be eliminated. Pretty much impossible, but this is football, and you never know...

Of course nothing is impossible. Hey, didn't Argentina need to win the game against Peru with a 4 goals difference to eliminate Brazil in 1978? And didn't they win scoring, like, 6 goals? But let's not get into that...

yeah, we better not start discussing that. i imagine what your point is. But anybody who knows *just a bit* football, knows that Argentina played a brilliant, masterclass of football that day, and could have won like 11 - 0 considerating how dominant and how many approches to the goal had during that game. Its too easy to think ''meh, that game was payed''. People need to know that you cant ''pay'' a shot on goal that hits the post and goes all over the line of goal, when the match is 1-1 in the 88th minute of the world cup final. And people who knows just a *bit* of football knows that Argentina was the undeniable best team in Argentina's 78 world cup.

Now, if you want to talk about brazilian players getting asleep in Argentina 1-0 Brazil in 1990's world cup due to clorophorm, you can just start talking 

ahh, memories 

England was just pathetic today....

I guess they can't get worse.....



/jarmo

Yeah, absolutely.

What is kinda incredible is England doesn't lose a match in world cups since their elimination in 2002 against Brazil... same for Argentina... Argentina doesnt lose since 0-1 against England in the second match of the first round in Korea-Japan (the day of Beckham's revenge and Veron's historic catastrophe)

i dont want to start an argument, but in 78 Argentina was not considered the best team of the tournament, and still today many people that "know" about football agree that they won because they were in home not because they were the best.

and am not saying they fixed the game against Peru or that they were a bad team, i think people has to accept that Argentina won fair and square, but the team wasnt great.

I can accept that. I dont agree, but your opinion's acceptable and respectable.

All i can accept is Netherlands had a GREAT team, so do Italy, and Netherlands could have won that world cup if Cruyff was there. Netherlands was not ''the best netherlands'' available, and that's true.

[jarmo]

Holland still isn't playing like they are capable of....



/jarmo

[kaasupoltin]

Holland still isn't playing like they are capable of....



/jarmo

True. But you also got to give credit to Japan and their defensive play. But if you compare Holland and Germany, the difference is huge; Germany can create dangerous scoring opportunities with one pass (?zil) and one good run (Podolski, Klose). Whereas Holland just keeps the ball and moves it around without creating anything dangerous. That said, how many opportunities does Podolski need to score once..?

[Halo69]

Portugal better show their true colors or ill be really mad

[Genesis]

The US have been unlucky, but with the way England is playing I don't think they should be worried.
Some real shocker results so far.

[jarmo]

Holland still isn't playing like they are capable of....



/jarmo

True. But you also got to give credit to Japan and their defensive play. But if you compare Holland and Germany, the difference is huge; Germany can create dangerous scoring opportunities with one pass (?zil) and one good run (Podolski, Klose). Whereas Holland just keeps the ball and moves it around without creating anything dangerous. That said, how many opportunities does Podolski need to score once..?

It's because Holland doesn't move forward fast enough. Instead they stop and pass the ball from side to side...



/jarmo

[Mandy.]

bah, its simply not worth the discussion. Just believe your twisted theories if you feel happy with that. People love to repeat these kind of things instead of thinking and actually taking the time to see the 90 minutes of that game. Believing all this bullshit is simply more entertaining (and easier) than believing the truth.

I love football, I was born and live in Argentina, I study communications and I was born at the end of that dictatorship. And I've seen the 90 minutes of all our nations matches. I really dont need anyone who can only give an opinion from ''what people say'' out there to tell me if I'm serious or not, or to ''open my eyes with the unquestionable truth'' regarding this subject. Of course I am serious.

Explain how you can pay the example I made of the ball hitting the post and rolling all over the line of goal at the last minute of the final, with the score 1-1.

yes, i know you cant explain that. people like you say ''i never said Argentina payed the title, just the game against peru''. Simply lame.

Now i need someone (i will not mention any specific nation) to say ''yeah, you payed Argentina 78, and you cheated in Mexico 86 with Maradona's hand of god, you got no legit world championships''. Trust me: i've read/heard it all...

Esteban, I understand and respect your point of view, which is why I'm not going any further with this discussion. Of course everything I said was about "what other people say". But that doesn't make it a lie. I mean, I'm a historian, that's what I have to do - rely on other people's words. I studied the dictatorships in South America exhaustively, for a whole year last year, which is why I have about a 100 reasons to believe in what I posted yesterday. But if you don't, I'm sure you have your reasons too and I'm fine with that. Sorry, I was a little bit harsh on my other post.

It's the kind of thing we'll talk about some day, over a few beers, after a River Plate game, when I go to Argentina.


As for "the hand of God", I have nothing to say about that. I mean, sure, according to the rules, that's not legal, but before people start contesting it and saying the title wasn't legit, I'll kindly ask to, please, point out one single football match where a referee hasn't made one mistake. It just happens. It's a sport played by humans and judged by humans. I think Argentina's title in 1986 was legit indeed.


------


I wish I had seen the games this morning, but I was out. Seems like Holland wasn't too good, from what I read. It's a shame, I had really high hopes for them in this World cup.

[jarmo]

Cameroon vs Denmark. What a weird game!





/jarmo

[kaasupoltin]

Cameroon vs Denmark. What a weird game!





/jarmo

One of the best games so far.