is this english??

[russtcb]

Pointing out that you're constantly attempting insults doesn't mean I'm upset or offended, it's simply pointing it out.

Because it's a lie.

If I wanted to insult you, I would say it. 

And the reason why I ask such a question is because you seem to label many people who ask questions as "whiners" and before you get excited with the "generalizations" label again, remember that it's my person observation.

Asking questions makes you a curious person.

Asking the same questions over and over, especially if they've been answered, doesn't.


But you have to admit that some people (who see themselves as fans) have a tendency to put a negative spin on everything.



/jarmo

I guess I took you saying that some people have short attention spans or can't understand English, as attempted insults. When people don't see my point, I don't assume or guess that they're dumb, I generally try to explain myself better, but that's just me I guess.

As for some people who put a negative spin on everything; those people are all over the world. And of course there's gonna be some (many) in the GNR community who are the same way. But I honestly feel that this subject of "Where do we go now?" is a legit question on the part of concerned fans.

I'd like nothing more then to see my favorite performer of all time out with his band doing what I feel he does better than anyone else. So threads like this interest me where people discuss what may or may not happen. The only reason I felt the need to get involved is because people were literally getting yelled out for their opinion and being told that if they'd just shut up and request songs, everything would be all better. I replied with my opposing opinion and now here we are still talking about it as if it's there's some way my opinion could be "wrong".

[jarmo]

I guess I took you saying that some people have short attention spans or can't understand English, as attempted insults. When people don't see my point, I don't assume or guess that they're dumb, I generally try to explain myself better, but that's just me I guess.

I didn't assume people were dumb. Just that they might not understand the English words I use. I have to start assuming something since nothing seems to get through. How many times can you explain the same thing over and over again?

A lot of smart people don't speak English.

Implying that I've called people stupid, that's nice....

If I want to call somebody stupid, I'll point it out to that person. 

As for some people who put a negative spin on everything; those people are all over the world. And of course there's gonna be some (many) in the GNR community who are the same way. But I honestly feel that this subject of "Where do we go now?" is a legit question on the part of concerned fans.

Of course it's a legit question. We all would love to know what the next step is.

Unfortunately, some people feel the need to twist shit around.

Somebody asks "what's next" and another one is quick to point out how everything sucks and everything has failed etc.

There, discussion over.


That's the reason why I've pointed out that it'd be nicer if we didn't have that kind of shit, and instead had some kind of constructive discussions.

Just whining doesn't help anybody. That's the bottom line.






/jarmo

[Limulus]

constantly attempting insults by the mod himself in almost every reply in here is not something i'd call too positive and constructive. it leaves some negative vibe. maybe you could calm down a bit too, dont ya think,  Jarmo?

[jarmo]

constantly attempting insults by the mod himself in almost every reply in here is not something i'd call too positive and constructive. it leaves some negative vibe. maybe you could calm down a bit too, dont ya think,  Jarmo?

This coming from the same person who claims I'm bashing fans. 

Next time you want to make up fairy tales, keep me out of them please. Thanks.



/jarmo

[Limulus]

this discussion would end in the definiton of bashing and fans again. but i'm sure you got the point with the negative vibe. Thanks 

[ppbebe]

So,
where do you go now?

[jarmo]

this discussion would end in the definiton of bashing and fans again. but i'm sure you got the point with the negative vibe. Thanks 

You would know about that vibe, now wouldn't you....

You don't exactly come across as Mr Positive.





/jarmo

[russtcb]

I guess I took you saying that some people have short attention spans or can't understand English, as attempted insults. When people don't see my point, I don't assume or guess that they're dumb, I generally try to explain myself better, but that's just me I guess.

I didn't assume people were dumb. Just that they might not understand the English words I use. I have to start assuming something since nothing seems to get through. How many times can you explain the same thing over and over again?

A lot of smart people don't speak English.

Implying that I've called people stupid, that's nice....

If I want to call somebody stupid, I'll point it out to that person. 

As for some people who put a negative spin on everything; those people are all over the world. And of course there's gonna be some (many) in the GNR community who are the same way. But I honestly feel that this subject of "Where do we go now?" is a legit question on the part of concerned fans.

Of course it's a legit question. We all would love to know what the next step is.

Unfortunately, some people feel the need to twist shit around.

Somebody asks "what's next" and another one is quick to point out how everything sucks and everything has failed etc.

There, discussion over.


That's the reason why I've pointed out that it'd be nicer if we didn't have that kind of shit, and instead had some kind of constructive discussions.

Just whining doesn't help anybody. That's the bottom line.






/jarmo

Oh ok. So when you reference the "English speaking" thing, it was an insult targeted at non English speaking people, not just general people on your board.

I get it that "whining doesn't help anybody" I truly do. But at the same time, it's hard to be a fan of this band and have the fans be the only people who truly seem to care what goes on with it.

[jarmo]

Oh ok. So when you reference the "English speaking" thing, it was an insult targeted at non English speaking people, not just general people on your board.

I'm one of those whose first language isn't English. So you're saying I was talking about myself?

This just keeps getting more and more fun!

Are you serious about this too, because I definitely see some humor in it. No offense!


No, I was talking about anybody who has trouble understanding basic English for whatever reason it might be (language barrier, short attention span, unwillingness to understand etc.).


I don't discriminate. 


What's so offensive about writing a numbered list to those who do have trouble understanding and/or short attention spans?

Is it the same thing that's offensive when I point out that not everybody claiming to be a fan is an actual fan (in my opinion)?

 



/jarmo

[russtcb]

Oh ok. So when you reference the "English speaking" thing, it was an insult targeted at non English speaking people, not just general people on your board.

I'm one of those whose first language isn't English. So you're saying I was talking about myself?

This just keeps getting more and more fun!

Are you serious about this too, because I definitely see some humor in it. No offense!


No, I was talking about anybody who has trouble understanding basic English for whatever reason it might be (language barrier, short attention span, unwillingness to understand etc.).


I don't discriminate. 


What's so offensive about writing a numbered list to those who do have trouble understanding and/or short attention spans?

Is it the same thing that's offensive when I point out that not everybody claiming to be a fan is an actual fan (in my opinion)?

 



/jarmo

No it's not the same. See because attempting to insult some folks intelligence and calling them a non-GNR fan are two different things.

[jarmo]

No it's not the same. See because attempting to insult some folks intelligence and calling them a non-GNR fan are two different things.

It's the same thing since I didn't do neither in the way you described. Pointing out that some fans aren't fans in my opinion is similar to pointing out that maybe some have trouble understanding the posts. You're not talking about everybody, you're talking about a small group. Yet you like to make it seem like I insulted everybody.



They're not the same literally of course. That's like saying black and white is the same color.

You only managed to get those impressions from my posts.  So both fall under the lies category.



By the way, are you still being serious?





/jarmo

[-Rob-]

I never realized that being a fan of Axl's band was such serious business.  

While I personally don't want to get involved with the flame debate of "what makes a bigger fan", I would like to re-iterate that everyone here probably is a fan to some degree. Some just take the responsibilities of being a fan more serious than others.

I'll be the first to admit that I wish 'Chinese Democracy' would have received better reception. But it didn't, so no reason to piss and moan as to why that didn't happen. Like I said in an earlier post, I think the decision to release the album was made fairly quickly, by all parties involved. And I think that reason had alot to do with Cogill making 3/4 of the album available online last summer. From there, I think it was just a "let's hurry up and get it out there" approach. Like Axl said, it was almost as if "the record company wanted to wash their hands of the situation." That's not to say that Axl wasn't happy with the final product, but I think Cogill's actions left Axl and the record company with very little time and options.

I don't think the leaks hurt the actual sales nearly as much as it hurt proper promotional efforts being put in place. But that's not to say that I think Axl would have handled the situation all that much differently. I don't think he ever had any real intentions to sit down with Letterman or Leno to discuss the album. I think he was well aware those interviews would have turned into " so, what's your relationship with Slash these days" type questions. I do think Azoff, Universal, and Best Buy may have put some additional efforts into promoting it had there been more time.

In the end, it obviously wasnt the fans responsibility to promote this album. And I don't think the admin here was ever really suggesting that it was. I think we, as fans, should be concerned about the prospect of future releases coming from Axl and his band. If he doesn't have more material that is finished, I think he's going to have a hard time receiving advances from his label to complete that material. And if he isn't touring to generate funds to complete that material, it could be a long, long time before we see another album baring the GNR name sitting on the store shelves.

[russtcb]

No it's not the same. See because attempting to insult some folks intelligence and calling them a non-GNR fan are two different things.

It's the same thing since I didn't do neither in the way you described. Pointing out that some fans aren't fans in my opinion is similar to pointing out that maybe some have trouble understanding the posts. You're not talking about everybody, you're talking about a small group. Yet you like to make it seem like I insulted everybody.



They're not the same literally of course. That's like saying black and white is the same color.

You only managed to get those impressions from my posts.  So both fall under the lies category.



By the way, are you still being serious?





/jarmo

Of course I'm being serious. I understand that you disagree with what I'm saying but continually asking if I'm serious isn't really getting us anywhere.

And just to be clear; I'm "lying" because I got a certain impression from posts?

[jarmo]

Of course I'm being serious. I understand that you disagree with what I'm saying but continually asking if I'm serious isn't really getting us anywhere.

It's not easy to know!

Because some of the "accusations" have been quite ridiculous. Just my opinion. Don't get upset.

So I figured it was all a joke. That would explain the ridiculous accusations.

And just to be clear; I'm "lying" because I got a certain impression from posts?

It's a lie if it's not true isn't it?




/jarmo

[russtcb]

Of course I'm being serious. I understand that you disagree with what I'm saying but continually asking if I'm serious isn't really getting us anywhere.

It's not easy to know!

Because some of the "accusations" have been quite ridiculous. Just my opinion. Don't get upset.

So I figured it was all a joke. That would explain the ridiculous accusations.

And just to be clear; I'm "lying" because I got a certain impression from posts?

It's a lie if it's not true isn't it?




/jarmo

Again; not getting upset. There's very little anyone on the internet could do to upset me. And could you clarify where I've accused you of anything outside of obvious attempts at insults?

[jarmo]

And could you clarify where I've accused you of anything outside of obvious attempts at insults?

There were two, you accused me of making fun of non-English speakers and calling people stupid.

None of which were "obvious attempts at insults".

More to do with the fact that I read a lot of ridiculous accusations from people who see what they want to see in my posts.

You need to let it go.

You can't keep repeating something after it was explained to you that your skewed interpretation is incorrect.

 



There's no insult in my post:

I'll break it down for those who have short attention spans:

1. I don't hate all fans.
2. I don't think fans are responsible for promoting the album.
3. I don't think the US sales of the album are due to the fans not promoting the album.
4. I don't think pointing out that there are some assholes in a group of people means you hate everybody.

Thank you.

In my opinion, it's easier to read that list than to have me write a long post detailing those same things.



By the way, I still think you're taking the piss out of this whole thing...

What other reasonable explanation is there for your need to prove that I'm "insulting people"?





/jarmo

[russtcb]

And could you clarify where I've accused you of anything outside of obvious attempts at insults?

There were two, you accused me of making fun of non-English speakers and calling people stupid.

None of which were "obvious attempts at insults".

More to do with the fact that I read a lot of ridiculous accusations from people who see what they want to see in my posts.

You need to let it go.

You can't keep repeating something after it was explained to you that your skewed interpretation is incorrect.

 



/jarmo

Good back and read. I never said you were making fun of people who don't speak English. I said you weren't making your point clear enough (or at all for that matter) so you resorted to insinuating that those who disagree with you are don't understand English or must have short attention spans.

[jarmo]

I said you weren't making your point clear enough (or at all for that matter) so you resorted to insinuating that those who disagree with you are don't understand English or must have short attention spans.

I made a numbered list for those who like to take a post of mine and twist shit around.

I made a comment that when I point out that there's an unhappy bunch of people among the so called fanbase, those same people claim I hate the whole GN'R fanbase. To me it seems like these people don't seem to understand English.

To me, with my limited English knowledge, it makes very little sense who you can interpret singling out a (small) group within a bigger group into meaning the whole big group!

That's like saying "I hate Poison" into meaning "I hate music". It makes no fucking sense. Does it make sense to you?


There's no fucking insults involved! It's got nothing to do with agreeing with me or not, it's got to do with people accusing me of shit that are nothing but lies.

It's also funny how you're never insulted, yet here you are trying to convince everybody that I'm insulting people to the left and right.

You gotta be fucking kidding me....



To those who are easily insulted, I apologize, even though I didn't insult you in the first place. But apparently some claim I insulted people even thought they're not insulted themselves and they know better than myself what I meant.

So apologies for accidentally insulting you via second hand invalid interpretations of my posts.





/jarmo

[ppbebe]

talk about english comprehension,

was november the 23rd 2008 tuseday?
and shouldn't the supposed re release date be after the supposed expiring date and not before?

who said is gonna be a re-release of the album?

I still don't get why this reply to that post.    looks absolutely random to me.

Do they have any with pictures of the new band, album?

coming soon when the merch is up @ the official site, maybe?

You're so eager to buy goods with pictures of the band and cd. 

[russtcb]

I said you weren't making your point clear enough (or at all for that matter) so you resorted to insinuating that those who disagree with you are don't understand English or must have short attention spans.

I made a numbered list for those who like to take a post of mine and twist shit around.

I made a comment that when I point out that there's an unhappy bunch of people among the so called fanbase, those same people claim I hate the whole GN'R fanbase. To me it seems like these people don't seem to understand English.

To me, with my limited English knowledge, it makes very little sense who you can interpret singling out a (small) group within a bigger group into meaning the whole big group!

That's like saying "I hate Poison" into meaning "I hate music". It makes no fucking sense. Does it make sense to you?


There's no fucking insults involved! It's got nothing to do with agreeing with me or not, it's got to do with people accusing me of shit that are nothing but lies.

It's also funny how you're never insulted, yet here you are trying to convince everybody that I'm insulting people to the left and right.

You gotta be fucking kidding me....



To those who are easily insulted, I apologize, even though I didn't insult you in the first place. But apparently some claim I insulted people even thought they're not insulted themselves and they know better than myself what I meant.

So apologies for accidentally insulting you via second hand invalid interpretations of my posts.





/jarmo

There again, I didn't say you succeeded in insulting anyone, I said you attempted to. And again you're dancing around the issue that your remarks ("people with short attention spans", "those who don't understand English") were aimed at those who disagree with you.

I could honestly care less what you're opinion of the fan base is. But I do know that this whole discussion happened because I disagreed with someone else and you jumped in to lump me in with the "whiners" who don't want to do anything "constructive". I started to make a case for why I don't believe I fall into either of those categories. Along the way these (what I feel are) general insults popped up and I found it amusing that you had to keep resorting to them.