Robin vs. Slash, which one do you prefer?

[gilld1]

After seeing NIN on Saturday it is clearly evident to me that Robin and Trent need to be with each other.  Trent is letting him shine more now than ever before and Robin has responded with brilliant playing.  Much in the same way that Perry and Dave from JA need and feed off of each other.  Great chemistry is what it all boils down to.

I enjoy the new GnR stuff, I 've seen them live a few times and I never saw that chemistry between Axl and Bucket or Robin.  I think Axl needs Slash as much as Slash needs Axl.

[Dayle1066]

An irrelevant point around here. People wont accept that this is how chemistry works in Axl and Slash's case. (This of course has nothing to do with who you prefer as a guitar player)

[-Rob-]

I think Slash easily out performs Robin on WTTJ and SCOM.   

Couldn't agree more. I'm seriously surprised this is even being debated.

But, lets look at the guitar work on Chinese Democracy compared to say Appetite.  Unfortunately, there is only 1 or 2 good riffs on CD and the guitar work overall aint that good.  Some of the solo's are just tired shredding and don't fit the songs. SCOM solo pisses all over TIL.

Nothing on CD has the swagger of Brownstone, Rocket Queen or is as aggresive as ISE or MM.

The guitar playing on Appetite has influenced a whole generation of  guitarists.   Chinese Democracy flopped quite quickly.

Again, I completely agree.

I would have thought with the album's high budget and multitude of individuals involved, there would have been more memorable solos that came out of these sessions. I'm not saying the guys aren't talented, I just don't think any of it was overly special. Almost as if it lacked any real "feel".

I did like TWAT solo. Very Estanged-ish feel. Easily the best of the bunch.

[Voodoochild]

Cool. More opinions stated as facts.

If TWAT, SOD, Better, TIL and Catcher's solos aren't "memorable" for you, I doubt you ever would like any other guitar solo (besides Slash's ones, of course ) in the world ever.

Get back to me when Robin writes a SCOM type timeless solo. Then we can have this discussion.

Street Of Dreams and This I Love are as good to me. You seem unable to have such a discussion with someone who disagree with you, so you'll never get anyways.

But, lets look at the guitar work on Chinese Democracy compared to say Appetite.  Unfortunately, there is only 1 or 2 good riffs on CD and the guitar work overall aint that good.  Some of the solo's are just tired shredding and don't fit the songs. SCOM solo pisses all over TIL.

No, it doesn't. And your ignorance on making such a statement about the guitar work on Chinese Democracy really shows you how a fanboy of Slash you are.

Nothing on CD has the swagger of Brownstone, Rocket Queen or is as aggresive as ISE or MM.

Riad is far more agressive than ISE to me. Also, the most agressive GNR song ever is rather Oh My God or Perfect Crime.

The guitar playing on Appetite has influenced a whole generation of  guitarists.   Chinese Democracy flopped quite quickly.

Great, another one more concerned about the popularity of the album than its quality.

I know you don't like it. Fair enough. Just don't tell me it's not good because it didn't had any influence on anyone, because it's a baseless assumption way too soon to be said and also more about its popularity.

I remember Faith No More's album King For A Day. It didn't went too well once it got released (it didn't have the same line-up and went way too far from the previous albums), but now it has a whole generation of guitarists influenced by it. IMHO, it's the best FNM album too.

You people are too funny. You just can't take it how some people prefer others. Tell me about being narrow minded.

[jacdaniel]

And your ignorance on making such a statement about the guitar work on Chinese Democracy really shows you how a fanboy of Slash you are.

So im ignorant for having an opinion about the guitar playing on CD?  All the songs on AFD are guitar driven with cool riffs and are Classics at this stage.  A lot of songs on CD aren't guitar driven.  There isnt really any brilliant Riffs.  Ive been playing guitar myself for years so I am in a postion where i feel i can make a decent comparision.   

maybe YOU'RE ignorant cos all you've done is passed me off as an "ignorant fanboy of Slash" when im giving my opinion about guitar playing???

[jacdaniel]

Again, I completely agree.

I would have thought with the album's high budget and multitude of individuals involved, there would have been more memorable solos that came out of these sessions. I'm not saying the guys aren't talented, I just don't think any of it was overly special. Almost as if it lacked any real "feel".

I did like TWAT solo. Very Estanged-ish feel. Easily the best of the bunch.

At least someone unnderstands! 

[Voodoochild]

What a surprise to see Rob and jacdaniel agreeing with each other.

And your ignorance on making such a statement about the guitar work on Chinese Democracy really shows you how a fanboy of Slash you are.

So im ignorant for having an opinion about the guitar playing on CD? 

No. The problem is you stating your OPINION as fact to disregard the album. Read the part where I quoted you again.

All the songs on AFD are guitar driven with cool riffs and are Classics at this stage.  A lot of songs on CD aren't guitar driven. 

You mean the ballads? Which one exactly? Maybe because Chinese is not a AFD 2 and never pretended to be?

You're comparing an album with Catcher, Street of Dreams, Madagascar, This I Love e Prostitute with another who has only Sweet Child O' Mine (which is only "half-ballad"). What do you expect?

There isnt really any brilliant Riffs.  Ive been playing guitar myself for years so I am in a postion where i feel i can make a decent comparision.  

I've been playing guitar for 14 years and I say there is brilliant riffs like Better, Riad and Scraped. But I'm sorry, you're opinion is a fact.

maybe YOU'RE ignorant cos all you've done is passed me off as an "ignorant fanboy of Slash" when im giving my opinion about guitar playing???

I don't care about your opinion. Just read again what you write and you will understand why I said that.

When someone just disregard such a different work (tell me if I'm wrong, but where in the mainstream music do you hear such a complex guitar work) comparing to AFD (an essential hard rock album prety much straight foward), it is ignorance.

You don't like the album or its guitar work, fine. Just don't tell me it's a fact. Hell, I even bothered to explain in the other post. You ignored what I said just to take this part when I called you a fanboy. I won't bother with it again.

Again: I'm not saying you can't have a opinion. BUT you all need to understand how a lot of other people here don't feel the same, so it's not a matter of fact or which one is better because it sold more in the charts.

[Jim Bob]

maybe YOU'RE ignorant cos all you've done is passed me off as an "ignorant fanboy of Slash" when im giving my opinion about guitar playing???

going by your slash trolling and that stupid avatar you have, what else are we supposed to think? 

[oldgunsfan]

Get back to me when Robin writes a SCOM type timeless solo. Then we can have this discussion.

his playing of the solos sounds better to my ears.   is that so hard to understand?

the concept is not hard to understand;

but the reality of that statement: IMO, is impossible to fathom;

but - people ARE ALLOWED to have different preferences in this country

even if i think your fucking crazy

[oldgunsfan]

shouldn't this thread be locked? since robin's no longer in the band, does it matter who's preferred?

[seely]

No, that why its in the 'dead horse' section
and we can still discuss our opinions on the two

[ppbebe]

yes it should if dead horse was locked.

and no it don't matter

'Cause it would take a lot more hate than you
To end the fascination

[Jdog0830]

Get back to me when Robin writes a SCOM type timeless solo. Then we can have this discussion.

his playing of the solos sounds better to my ears.   is that so hard to understand?

Not that it's hard to believe people should be more understanding I mean back when GN'R did Sympathy For The Devil I think that version kicked the shit out of the Rolling Stones version but reguard less you should respect the classic version but I still am on slashes side on this.

By the way to the people who think Slash isn't creditable why don't you try to go through half the problems Slash and other Gunners (past and present) have gone through then try to discredit them.

[oldgunsfan]

Get back to me when Robin writes a SCOM type timeless solo. Then we can have this discussion.

his playing of the solos sounds better to my ears.   is that so hard to understand?

Not that it's hard to believe people should be more understanding I mean back when GN'R did Sympathy For The Devil I think that version kicked the shit out of the Rolling Stones version but reguard less you should respect the classic version but I still am on slashes side on this.

By the way to the people who think Slash isn't creditable why don't you try to go through half the problems Slash and other Gunners (past and present) have gone through then try to discredit them.

sympathy is a real bad example....axl had paul huge re-record some or all of his solo and that really really pissed slash off, and I think he was referring to fink's playing the solo of SCOM live as opposed to Slash's rendering and Fink's versions of Slash's solo's in general. 

[oldgunsfan]

What a surprise to see Rob and jacdaniel agreeing with each other.

And your ignorance on making such a statement about the guitar work on Chinese Democracy really shows you how a fanboy of Slash you are.

So im ignorant for having an opinion about the guitar playing on CD? 

No. The problem is you stating your OPINION as fact to disregard the album. Read the part where I quoted you again.

All the songs on AFD are guitar driven with cool riffs and are Classics at this stage.  A lot of songs on CD aren't guitar driven. 

You mean the ballads? Which one exactly? Maybe because Chinese is not a AFD 2 and never pretended to be?

You're comparing an album with Catcher, Street of Dreams, Madagascar, This I Love e Prostitute with another who has only Sweet Child O' Mine (which is only "half-ballad"). What do you expect?

There isnt really any brilliant Riffs.  Ive been playing guitar myself for years so I am in a postion where i feel i can make a decent comparision.  

I've been playing guitar for 14 years and I say there is brilliant riffs like Better, Riad and Scraped. But I'm sorry, you're opinion is a fact.

maybe YOU'RE ignorant cos all you've done is passed me off as an "ignorant fanboy of Slash" when im giving my opinion about guitar playing???

I don't care about your opinion. Just read again what you write and you will understand why I said that.

When someone just disregard such a different work (tell me if I'm wrong, but where in the mainstream music do you hear such a complex guitar work) comparing to AFD (an essential hard rock album prety much straight foward), it is ignorance.

You don't like the album or its guitar work, fine. Just don't tell me it's a fact. Hell, I even bothered to explain in the other post. You ignored what I said just to take this part when I called you a fanboy. I won't bother with it again.

Again: I'm not saying you can't have a opinion. BUT you all need to understand how a lot of other people here don't feel the same, so it's not a matter of fact or which one is better because it sold more in the charts.

your both ridiculous and both make good point
AFD had catchier riffs
CD has better Ballads
AFD sold way more and was critically acclaimed
CD has gotten good reviews but hasn't taken off, and has got to be one of the most highly anticipated,
worst promoted, most expensive albums of all-time
------------
can we agree these are "facts and not opinions"
or am I missing something?

[jacdaniel]

going by your slash trolling and that stupid avatar you have, what else are we supposed to think? 

Jim Bob, you NEVER offer anything interesting to ANY thread.  I might not agree with Voodoo Child but at least he takes the time to make a point.  All u do is throw random insults around at anybody who doesn't wanna suck Axl off.

You really cant mention the word troll to anyone when all you do is lurk around the Slash/VR threads throwing in some random/sarcastic comments every once in a while.

The thread is called "Robin vs Slash, which one do you prefer?", so if i wanna give my opinions on Slash, I WILL do. 

And don't worry Jim Bob, I wont tell anyone that you're a secret Slash fan!

can we agree these are "facts and not opinions"

You're pretty much right.  Although id say more ballads is more accurate.

[Voodoochild]

your both ridiculous and both make good point
AFD had catchier riffs
CD has better Ballads
AFD sold way more and was critically acclaimed
CD has gotten good reviews but hasn't taken off, and has got to be one of the most highly anticipated,
worst promoted, most expensive albums of all-time
------------
can we agree these are "facts and not opinions"
or am I missing something?

You may be missing what kind of review AFD got back when it got released. Also should consider all the prejudice the new album got because of the "its-not-GNR" shit and/or because the time it took. At the end of the day, its still a matter of opinion. But aside of that, I pretty much agree with what you said.

sympathy is a real bad example....axl had paul huge re-record some or all of his solo and that really really pissed slash off

No man, Paul Tobias didn't re-record Slash's solos. All he did was to add an extra layer in some small parts of the first solo, doing an effect like a "mirror guitar", like Slahs himself called. If you listen to the song with earphones you'll notice Paul's guitar in the left channel only, while Slash solo is the middle as usual.

What pissed Slash off was the level of volume on Paul guitar (louder than what he would like) and even its inclusion without his aknowledge. If you believe in my unbiased (at my best) opinion in this case, I think Paul Tobias guitar are as loud as Izzy's one on AFD, so no harm there. But we all know Slash didn't want another rhythm guitar that way by that time.

I love the song the way it is and I think it really shows how good Paul is - way more than any other new song. Slash's work there is awesome too. What really makes me sad is how I got the impression by that time that we would have a new GNR album and how the new approach seemed heavier than before with Paul and Slash, what was really good to me. Saddly, things got worse after SFTD and we never got anything more from this lineup.

Still, I love the new sound so much that I don't really miss what could happen.

[oldgunsfan]

i was trying to keep opinions and prejudices out of the analysis and be completely objective;

didn't remember exactly what huge/tobias changed on Sympathy, only that it really pissed off slash and may have contributed to his desire to leave the band

[jacdaniel]

only that it really pissed off slash and may have contributed to his desire to leave the band

After Izzy left, it seemed to be Slash that had the say in getting a guitar player (Gilby), but of course it had to be agreed with Axl also.  However, after Gilby left/got fired, Axl seemed to be looking to bring in people like dave navarro and zakk Wylde.  Then came SFTD which you've just explained above and i dont think it all sat well with Slash.

Being a lead guitarist, you should be the one who chooses who is gonna play with you.

[oldgunsfan]

only that it really pissed off slash and may have contributed to his desire to leave the band

After Izzy left, it seemed to be Slash that had the say in getting a guitar player (Gilby), but of course it had to be agreed with Axl also.  However, after Gilby left/got fired, Axl seemed to be looking to bring in people like dave navarro and zakk Wylde.  Then came SFTD which you've just explained above and i dont think it all sat well with Slash.

Being a lead guitarist, you should be the one who chooses who is gonna play with you.

according to his book, slash was pissed when axl fired gilby and started to force feed him guitarists like tobias/huge; b/c for whatever reason, slash just didn't like the dude and he saw no reason to fire gilby having toured w/ him for over two years

looking back, that seems to be the beginning of the end for slash, matt and duff and there stay in GnR