Norwegian arsonist and murderer released from state-prison

[SLCPUNK]

Don't be a shower!

[ppbebe]

I think someone needs to put up or shut up, until then it's nothing but duschcreme.

who?

Not you.

I knew. 

[Butch Français]

Here's something shocking for you to ignore: Norway, the country, isn't perfect!

Your apparent attempt at making a gay joke also failed. Feeling insecure?

The truth is, I didn't say a negative thing about your country. Unless saying your culture has been influenced by other cultures or that food is expensve in Norway is negative?

I was having a discussion with an ignorant guy from your country. I actually know people in Norway who aren't like him, and at least one of them wasn't upset with my posts. Ironic.

Norway isn't perfect, I know.
gay joke? no it's called swearing.
your friends are not upset? strange as it may seem, they know you. people on a messageboard don't and might take offence when you say stupid things.

I don't have time to point out exacly what I found stupid, but I'll get to it I suppose.

[ppbebe]

no country is perfect.

[BlowUpYourVideo]

no country is perfect.

Even Canada??

[ppbebe]

I bet there're good Canadians and bad Canadians.

[jarmo]

gay joke? no it's called swearing.

"fuck me in the ass Suomilainen" is swearing?

Hmm....

It's almost like you're trying to paint all Finnish people as homosexuals.

Which is like the lowest form of comeback, also known as the insult.

I don't have time to point out exacly what I found stupid, but I'll get to it I suppose.

You obviously had time to "fuck you in the ass".  


Please do. I'm all for learning new things, so if there were some wrong things that you object to, please correct me.

Unless you want to lecture me on race biology and white power issues. Then I might not be interested, sorry.  





/jarmo

[ppbebe]

Unless you want to lecture me on race biology

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Recent_single-origin_hypothesis

[Jim]

In all honestly, I do not have the time nor the inclination to re(-?)cap Norway's views on anything. That does sound like a cop out and it probably is... But it would take far too long, I'd make a right mess of it (posting a paragraph takes me long enough, I've never been all that eloquent) and it would undoubtebly be misinterpreted and misunderstood as my advocating such views.... Which, I can comfortably say that I do not. (I did say as much in my previous post...) Rather, I'll just try and clarify what I mean by understanding, and why I think that it's important.

Right. Err. A clarification first, then.

I think he would like to have Jim re-cap what he believes are Norway's "views" that he apparently thinks none of us understand.

Some of you would come off a lot better in opposing Norway's views (I sure as hell don't agree with them) if you actually understood them.

Now... What I meant by understanding his views was not to understand them in as far as them being a justifiable point of view, but rather to understand where they come from and what they are based on. Actually... That isn't quite what I meant. The real importance is understanding why Norway holds these views.

A response to views such as Norway's (if you are truly interested in combating them, and not merely here to reassure, to yourself and to others, of your spot on the moral high ground (which in my opinion you will have (that's safe, whatever happens now, you're going home with that), even if it isn't always for the right reasons) should never be a knee-jerk reaction. A is bad, I think that all cases of A are bad, B holds opinion A therefore B is a tool!

Unfortunately, it doesn't work like that. The world is far too diverse a place, too few actions bear as much similarity as we would perhaps like them to, and the faint similarity that they do have seems to be in abundance when compared to the similarity in motive. A point of view needs to be looked at the same way... To do it any other way breeds bad logic and narrow mindedness. Now... I don't mean that we should all open our minds to the possibility that racism could be a good thing, of course I don't think that. And if anybody thought for one moment that was what I was insinuating, then you are absolutely nuts.

I just got annoyed because a lot of what I read in this thread didn't seem to be going anywhere. "I think this..." "... Well, I think that."

I am certainly no relativist, but I just feel that it is so ignorant to think that you have a fixed morality, and even if you do, can you explain to me, right now, where exactly it came from? I don't hate Norway, but I sure as hell hate his views. Surely then there is more worth in attempting to understand where they come from, where all views come from, than this. How does it come to be, what is it that governs our morality... I certainly don't know. Not yet, anyway. It would be great if somebody could enlighten me... Because of that, "Oh my god!, what a disgusting point of view," while true, does absolutely nothing for me... It's boring, pointless and utterly devoid of any merit. No good can come from that!

Hmm. Morality and most that surrounds it fucking stinks. If you do not choose your morality, and it isn't chosen for you, then unless you resort to God or ascribe anything metaphysical then whatever you deem to be moral is always going to be relative to you! Again, that may sound relativist, but it really isn't... I don't think that morality is a case of ignorance. Two people can hold the exact same view point, for completely different reasons, and yet both in our opinion hold the 'right' point of view. How can that possibly be? Well, namely because, as I said, morality is not a case of ignorance of intelligence. Sure, there is correlation, you better believe it. But not in the positive sense that, again, we would like to believe. Some of the most intelligent people that I know have the most deplorable ethical stances, likewise do some of the less intelligent... I think of it as a layered system. A few books may make you a better person, while a few more could make you a bad one... It all depends on what you are reading.

I really do not think that I have made a lot of the points that I would have liked to, but I really do not have the time to write much more... I did feel the pressure to post now, to say something now, in order to try and clarify what I meant. I guess that what I am saying is that unless you try to understand why the fuck it is that Norway can think such fucked up shit, then all you are doing is squaring your morality off against another. And what is the point of that? Now, by all means, do it, sure, yeah, why not. You certainly won't be hurting anybody. But you won't be helping anybody either.

[ppbebe]

to me it's more to do with humanity than morality.

[Jim]

Your humanity is dependent on your morality...

... to me! Whoops, I almost left that bit out.

[ppbebe]

Your humanity is dependent on your morality...

Not always.

Morals can vary according to the society. Humanity can't.

[Butch Français]

gay joke? no it's called swearing.

"fuck me in the ass Suomilainen" is swearing?

Hmm....

It's almost like you're trying to paint all Finnish people as homosexuals.

Which is like the lowest form of comeback, also known as the insult.

I don't have time to point out exacly what I found stupid, but I'll get to it I suppose.

You obviously had time to "fuck you in the ass".  


Please do. I'm all for learning new things, so if there were some wrong things that you object to, please correct me.

Unless you want to lecture me on race biology and white power issues. Then I might not be interested, sorry.  





/jarmo

what is it with your passion to label norwegians as racists and bigots?

and I'll use your comeback:

I have several finnish friends that wouldn't be offended by what I said with the assfucking.
to me it's swearing. in my language/dialect (northern), swearing is as important as anything to make any kind of point, and Im not used to people picking it to pieces.
Im sorry if it was offensive, but our swearing are similar to the way they do it in, say Scotland or something. and I have many northern british friends that say a lot worse things than that just for swearing, doesn't mean they hate anyone.
and just for a note, finnish people rule. several people in my extended family are finnish and I have many finnish friends.


edit: and I suppose many of the stupid things I thought you said were actually directed against the poster "norway", and not the country. but in general, you seem to speak of norwegians in sort of a derogatory way in this thread.

[jarmo]

what is it with your passion to label norwegians as racists and bigots?

Show me where I did that!

It seems like you are personally offended by my comments aimed at one individual!

I think I've pointed out multiple times that racist idiots are found everywhere in the world. Yes, including Norway! Does that offend you?



Now start looking for the things you disagree with me instead of just attacking me for ridiculous shit.

If you don't like me, that's fine. I don't give a fuck.

Just say it instead of looking for "clues" that are not there just so you can come after me with your ass jokes.



Am I offended by your jokes/swearing? No.

As I said, I consider it the lowest form of comeback.

When a person can't say anything else, he/she can always say "well you're a moron". Or in this case, add some ass fucking remarks.





/jarmo

[The Catcher]

It is not socially accepted to be racist in Norway. This person does not represent Norwegians in any way. Varg Vikernes is considered human garbage in Norway, not a hero.

[The Catcher]

For the record, I'm disguisted by this discussion so I haven't been following it, but I do want to remind people, before someone takes this too far, that labeling Norwegians as these racist viking brutes has the same effect on as labeling all Africans primitive monkeys. A lot of feelings are involved, and as someone who knows what he is talking about when it comes to this subject, I encourage people to watch their steps when labeling any culture and people in a certain way.

[TAP]

For the record, I'm disguisted by this discussion so I haven't been following it, but I do want to remind people, before someone takes this too far, that labeling Norwegians as these racist viking brutes has the same effect on as labeling all Africans primitive monkeys.

Clearly...

[jarmo]

that labeling Norwegians as these racist viking brutes

Nobody's done that.

The only thing I've said is that even back in the days of the vikings, they were traveling around and experiencing new cultures.

They probably brought those experiences with them home and it influenced their lives in some way. That in turn probably influenced all generations afterward.


Mankind has always been curious and wanted to explore the unknown. Be it the other side of the sea or the moon.

That's why I don't buy the whole idea of living in your own little bubble and thinking it solves all problems.


/jarmo

[Bandita]

OK Jim, I think you are now stating how someone such as Norway's (person not country) views came to be and why he might feel this way.

You sort of got a little convoluted after that but you seem not to understand or like his views either so I fail to see the point you were trying to make.

As for getting annoyed where a thread heads on a message board, well....not much I can do about that.

You state the world to be a diverse place yet someone like Norway does not seem to appreciate diversity at his home base.

Now if you will excuse me, my cat has accidentally dipped himself in sticky wax and I must attempt to get it off...yes, seriously.

[The Catcher]

that labeling Norwegians as these racist viking brutes

Nobody's done that.

The only thing I've said is that even back in the days of the vikings, they were traveling around and experiencing new cultures.

They probably brought those experiences with them home and it influenced their lives in some way. That in turn probably influenced all generations afterward.


Mankind has always been curious and wanted to explore the unknown. Be it the other side of the sea or the moon.

That's why I don't buy the whole idea of living in your own little bubble and thinking it solves all problems.


/jarmo

I didn't say anybody has said or even implied that but judging by Hillel's reaction of attacking Norwegians I just wanted to give a little heads-up to people before things get out of hand...