Norwegian arsonist and murderer released from state-prison

[C0ma]

He killed a man! 21 years is not disproportionate

Yes it is, and everyone knows it.

Do you know anything at all about the norwegian court-system?

Het got the harshest punishment because of his views, plain and simple.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benjamin_Hermansen
Benjamin Hermansen (May 29, 1985 ? January 26, 2001) was a Norwegian boy with an Ghanaian father and Norwegian mother. He was stabbed to death at Holmlia in Oslo, Norway, just before midnight on January 26, 2001 by people from the Neo-nazi group BootBoys. Joe Erling Jahr, Ole Nicolai Kvisler and Veronica Andreassen were convicted of the murder and sentenced to 18, 17, and 3 years in prison respectively.

18 years and Joe didn't ILLEGALLY burn down 3 churches... a year a church seems pretty reasonable to me.

[Bandita]

Is neo-nazi-ism a big issue in Norway?  Seems so.

[Lisa]

ever feel like you're beatin' a dead horse?

[PJ]

the only thing we shloud beat is racism
racism = stupidity
racism = insecurity
racism = ignorance
racism = mediocrity

[Nytunz]

I have not managed to read every post in this thread. But it has been drawn way out of its picture.
Some facts about things that have been said.

Fact:
- Varg has done his time in prison. The norwegian law has spoke, and is ha free man. That is a good thing. Not because im a fan of what this guy has done. But because, he now has a chance to get back to his life. Be a better person. Thats what prison i Norway is about. Its not about putting people away and make theyr life miserable
- Nordic mythology has nothing to do with racism
- Racism should not spoil our cultural heritage
- Stave-churches today is not only preserved for christianity. Its a source to knowlege and understanding of the "dark ages" and historical period (1030 AD), its a source for people who are generaly interested in history, iconography, architecture, archaeology etc.
- There can be seen some connections with Bronze age religions and nordic ironage age religion. But theres is no one that can say this 100% for sure.
- Christianity was a cruel religion and threat for the nordic people.
- People have abused religion, both Christianity, nordic mythology, islam, etc etc to get theyr absured ideas to life.
- Vidkun was not choosen to primeminister in Norway, he made himself primeminister.
- If it wasnt for imigration, there would not live a single person in Norway today
- The first humans sat theyr feet on what today is called Norway about 12 000 years ago.
- We still dont know for sure if the samii people came from the east, or was a part of the imigrantwave via the Norwegian coast
- In the 1800 and early/mid 1900 Nordic science have had a bad habit to try to fith norwegian pre-cultures to the germanic / vestern evolution image, and made distance from the Samii, and far north eras pre cultural image.

[norway]

Really, cause we have 6 pages here of you saying how awesome this guy is,

You really need to stop making things up.

If you gonna try to make fun of someone, at least try using facts-
-and regarding that avatar...gonna quite Axl from, was it Leeds? "I think I'm owed some rent-money."

You referred to him as a "folk-hero".

And you've been defending him and his acts for pages now.

I said in the first page how I feel about the stavechurches.

Go back and read, I clearly said his actions were extreme.
It's not just right and wrong, the truth is always some place in the middle.

I am also a fan of an "insane, racist asshole" who sings about immigrants and faggots, scam colleges, bites people and hit fans.

See? I can do it too. Things aren't always as black and white.

They're making him into a satanist, nazi, vile murderer without much to back up themself with.

If he weren't treated diferent from the law and ocstrasized so much in the press-
- then no one would called him a folk-hero.

Since thats the case, fine...allthough the press has started writing more civil about this now tho

It's an very eager focus on that murder and some views people make up, why?

So people find another excuse to let out a certain side to them.

While displaying opinions that have never led to anything good.

I find the assertion irrational.

And it's not entirely true either, northern-europe was (is?) a paradise compared to most other places.

- Christianity was a cruel religion and threat for the nordic people.

Yes, and yet you have so many "defending it and the acts".

[Bandita]

Can you please let this thread die already?  We all know your sick and narrow views by now and it's obvious that no one here is going to help change them.

@Nytunz-burning down things for what they may have stood for in the past is still not a valid reason.  If the people of Norway ALL so strongly feel that a building should no longer stand then there are proper ways to demolish them.  It doesn't make some face painted loon with a battle axe a martyr for doing it.

@the fact that this loser has done his time and has been rehabilitated-then why was he on the run in 2003 with military grade weapons in the car?

As I know that common sense has not prevailed in this thread I don't expect any reasonable answer to this question so kindly view it as rhetorical.

[jarmo]

- Nordic mythology has nothing to do with racism

True.

But when a person uses it as an excuse to say things like "I want Europe to be white" or "race mixing should be avoided", it really doesn't help does it?

Like you said, Norway was built by immigrants, still this guy is against immigration....


By the way, this guy still hasn't responded to my questions about immigration. 




/jarmo

[norway]

Wanting Europe to be white is racistic? Going up against multi-ethnic societies?

I spoken up against todays disregard for nature and man-
-population growth is a serious problem and immigration surely doesn't help.

Same with the double-standards of many issues, which should be covered in this thread by now.

Varg is a great musician and writer many hold dear, and it's great to see artists continue to attack christianity publicly.

the only thing we shloud beat is racism

Forget racism, once we defeat the blind intoleranse and shallow thought it's an non-issue.

By the way, this guy still hasn't responded to my questions about immigration. 

PS/

Jarmo, I don't view any of the northern-european folkgroups as immigrants. Finns are (90%?) european and pagan too.

Neither is the samii's, and I hope we preserve the people and the culture.

See?

Should I move from Norway you think? Or should samii's (which have their own flagg ), nordics, kvens etc live there?

[jarmo]

Wanting Europe to be white is racistic?

Well you want to exclude certain people from the continent based on their race and origins.

Isn't that the definition of racism?


Noun
racism

   1. The belief that each race has distinct and intrinsic attributes.
   2. The belief that one race is superior to all others.
   3. Prejudice or discrimination based upon race.


Sounds a lot like what you're saying.....

Jarmo, I don't view any of the northern-european folkgroups as immigrants. Finns are (90%?) european and pagan too.

Oh, so we're not immigrants because of the race issue.

Noun

Singular
immigrant
      
Plural
immigrants

immigrant (plural immigrants)

   1. A person who comes to a country to permanently settle from another country.


Another word that you have your own definition of to fit your agenda.

 




/jarmo

[Nytunz]

@Nytunz-burning down things for what they may have stood for in the past is still not a valid reason.  If the people of Norway ALL so strongly feel that a building should no longer stand then there are proper ways to demolish them.  It doesn't make some face painted loon with a battle axe a martyr for doing it.

@the fact that this loser has done his time and has been rehabilitated-then why was he on the run in 2003 with military grade weapons in the car?

As I know that common sense has not prevailed in this thread I don't expect any reasonable answer to this question so kindly view it as rhetorical.

Did you even read my Post? Then i guess you missed this:

- Stave-churches today is not only preserved for christianity. Its a source to knowlege and understanding of the "dark ages" and historical period (1030 AD), its a source for people who are generaly interested in history, iconography, architecture, archaeology etc.

If there is anyone on this board who really cares about stave-chirches, thats me.. I study Archaeology and the iconography and symbols from this timeframe is really interesting.

We also need to remember that the cultural heritage, can be abused, is abused, and will be abused also in the future, in political and ideological ways. And this i DO NOT support

There are lots of examples, but to name a few ABUSES:
- German archaeological artefacts in the 1930. To "prove" wester-german supriority
- The middle east conflict. Artefacts "proves" Israels rights to the land

The same way some people use Nordic mythology and other kinds of cultural heritage.. so they can identify with, and say! This is US not You!
But what these people dont Understand, IS. That this Mythology often have roots from the middle east, even to west India. Lots of artefacta
found in Scandinavia, is MADE in the middle east. or in southern parts of europe. People did communicate, trade and socialise with people
from other places in the world. The Viking as a barbarian, is a view more or less developed. Yeah, it did happend, but it also happens today.

- Nordic mythology has nothing to do with racism

True.

But when a person uses it as an excuse to say things like "I want Europe to be white" or "race mixing should be avoided", it really doesn't help does it?

Like you said, Norway was built by immigrants, still this guy is against immigration....


By the way, this guy still hasn't responded to my questions about immigration. 

/jarmo

Sure. It doent help. And what happend in the neolithic period?? When the agriculture start spreading around europe.. rapid diffusion or adoption/immigration? Well i would go for the last one..

[jarmo]

The same way some people use Nordic mythology and other kinds of cultural heritage.. so they can identify with, and say! This is US not You!
But what these people dont Understand, IS. That this Mythology often have roots from the middle east, even to west India. Lots of artefacta
found in Scandinavia, is MADE in the middle east. or in southern parts of europe. People did communicate, trade and socialise with people
from other places in the world. The Viking as a barbarian, is a view more or less developed. Yeah, it did happend, but it also happens today.

I've been trying to tell your fellow Norwegian that.

People have always been curious about other parts of the world, other cultures etc.

Yet he says people should just stay where they are and not mix with others etc.


Yet mankind has been immigrating, moving, mixing, learning, trading etc. for thousands of years....




/jarmo

[Bandita]

Did you even read my Post? Then i guess you missed this:

I stopped after the drivel you wrote about him getting back to a normal life.

Next time make the good point 1st.

[norway]

Isn't that the definition of racism?

Won't even define it, there is no definite definition. A keyword to me has always been discrimination.

Very magic word however.

Oh, so we're not immigrants because of the race issue.

And that wasn't my point.

Sure I stand for it, but do you speak towards Israel? Tibet? The Indians?
The Samii's when they were christianisized in the 1800? Their flag and samii-thing? Lets stick to norwegians?

I'm against it, what happened to the greeks as so on.

Am fully aware I fit into a stereo-type, it's not me however. I'm pagan wanting to preserve people and culture.

And there is absolutely nothing christian about our nordic culture or people.

PS/

Give her up already Nytunz

Yet mankind has been immigrating, moving, mixing, learning, trading etc. for thousands of years....

Followed by conflict and cultures, folkgroups disappearing...

[jarmo]

Yet mankind has been immigrating, moving, mixing, learning, trading etc. for thousands of years....

Followed by conflict and cultures, folkgroups disappearing...

And what has followed your way of thinking?

Did you forget already?

Isn't that the definition of racism?

Won't even define it, there is no definite definition. A keyword to me has always been discrimination.

Of course you won't. The dictionary definition doesn't fit your agenda.

 

I'm pagan wanting to preserve people and culture.

The ironic thing is that the people and culture are the results of immigration and mixing.... Just like Nytunz pointed out to you.


If you want to preserve your culture etc., shouldn't you disregard any kind of advances that have been made in the last thousand years?

What do you think would happen if you put a Norwegian pagan from 2000 years ago to live in today's Norway?


Shouldn't you logout right away in order to make sure your own culture isn't affected by the constant bombardment of influences?

Don't read the papers, don't watch TV, stay away from the movies, theater and the Internet. Your culture and people might be affected by the outside world. The horror!




/jarmo

[norway]

And what has followed your way of thinking?

Did you forget already?

Great cultures and people!

Mr.Brownstone...School-shooting...see a pattern? It has NOTHING to do with what you think.

shouldn't you...

I'm sure I should, it's written in the book of stereo-types somewhere....

What do you think would happen if you put a Norwegian pagan from 2000 years ago to live in today's Norway?

Same thing with a christian, or multi-culturian from 2000 years ago.

I am fully aware how priviligied I am to be in a modern society where I still can mean whatever I wan't, for now.

Remember-
-we're still a pagan people, with pagan values, ideals, democracies, traditions, customs etc.

Hope more open their eyes to see it.



Documentary coming soon about some of this for those intrested and wanna watch.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hT4vdXg5Xb8

[ppbebe]

Did you even read my Post? Then i guess you missed this:

I stopped after the drivel you wrote about him getting back to a normal life.

a drivel? hardly. It's not like the Norwegian ex criminal would invade your country.

[jarmo]

Great cultures and people!

Say hello to the nazis!

Germania and all that.... People who think they're better than others.

Choose race as an excuse to go after others etc.

-we're still a pagan people, with pagan values, ideals, democracies, traditions, customs etc.

Democracy was invented in Greece.

So, how come you mention it?

It was imported from an outside culture into yours....

Surely, you should invent your own traditions etc. instead of importing things from those non-Nordic cultures!


Do you use algebra?

Also not invented by Norwegians with axes.



Since when has isolation been the answer to everything?



By the way, nice try to shift the focus all the time into something else.

The dictionary's definition of racism fits quite nicely to what you're saying, but instead of acknowledging that you just say the definition is wrong. 





/jarmo

[Izzy]

As this is evidently the thread to air the most rascist and despicable things u can think of...

...well I might as well join in,

I hate Martians - just hate em, I dont even think they are human - yeah, thats right - thats how low I rate them

I might not even show them to my leader - and I'm proud of my views!

Earth for the Earthers!

[norway]

Say hello to the nazis!

Like a broken record... "and all that" is enough.


Exactly what good has come out from your thinking?
Extinction? Conflicts? Strife? Violence? Daily rapes? Drugs? Organised crime? Pollution? Human fires?

I should be more positive to it (in it's entirety) just to not fit into a vivid classification?

I wanna preserve people and culture, not exhange it with obnoxious mass-culture and racemixed people.

Often you have species (both human and animal) going extinct and cultures going lost because of such importations.

The immigration of today is ridiculous, no one knows wether or not this is wanted from the indigenous populations or not.

Democracy was invented in Greece.

And Parlamentarism on Island.
The Greeks (european too) worshipped exactly the same pagan gods under diferent names aswell.

Heard about the olympics? Know about it's origin? Know about the ancient skandinavian democracy?

So, how come you mention it?

And you call me narrowminded

It was imported from an outside culture into yours....

Yes, and? Didn't quite fit?

Does local culture, folkgroups, ancestry, continental heritage and such mean anything at all to you?

It's not like I don't get we gotten great art and ideas from other cultures.
African (you know, that continent down there, not here, with unique people) rythms is an exellent compliment in music.

The dictionary's definition of racism fits quite nicely to what you're saying, but instead of acknowledging that you just say the definition is wrong. 

We got an anti-discrimination law in Norway, thats plenty-
-using a magic word to prevent simple facts or theories about race to exist is pretty totalarian imo.

Either it's hexen, juden, racist, nazi, nonbeliver,...used to satisfy the intolerant, cruel side of man or permit harassment.

And all those magic words evidently had no root with reality considering the usage and context.

Also not invented by Norwegians with axes.

You can knock it off and study what religion is all about. Heard about the egyptians?

Thats a good way to start.

I have no idea why the vikingage is looked upon with so much pride-
-or why people associate nordic paganism with the people that lived here that era to that extenct.

http://www.vikingfestivalen.no/ It's always about the vikings

Hm...maybe because all else of our (european people) collective pagan past is unofficial or erased history?

Maybe thats why most people have no idea who santa claus is?

It's not a viking actually, it's on viking.
You will hear about these barbarians but nothing about the bloody saxonwars which led to the pagan attacks.

The destruction of Irminsul might ring a bell to some.

We still have diferent suls in Norway.

nice try to shift the focus all the time into something else.

I'm not the one making a big deal about it.

My focus was at Varg's attacks on Christianity-
- and how he is treated in a diferent standard by the legal system because his views (and probably race) don't fit.

I hate Martians - just hate em, I dont even think they are human - yeah, thats right - thats how low I rate them

What about the proto-germanians?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ngczrvDgaE