2009 NFL Season/Off Season discussion

[faldor]

On NBC they just said Brady has a fractured index finger on his throwing hand.  I respect your opinion Faldor, but I do believe they f'd up in Houston.

Again, I respectfully disagree.  And strongly for that matter.  The injury to Welker could've happened on any day of any week, in or outside of a football game.  It was a freak injury.  Those things happen.  You can't just not play guys fearing they'll get hurt.  Even the Colts played their guys SOME of the game the last 2 weeks.  If Manning had a freak injury would you be screaming it was stupid of them to play him even one snap?  You seem to be praising them for sitting their starters after getting their reps.  Welker was hurt on the first series.  Seems a bit hypocritical.  Just because the Colts escaped without any freak injuries they did the right thing?

Brady has been banged up all season.  The "cracked" ribs resulted from a hit he took in the PRE-SEASON when big Albert Haynesworth slammed him to the ground.  They were reaggravated in the game against Miami about a month ago.  So if you're point is to sit guys who aren't 100%, Brady shouldn't have played at all this season until he healed.  Again, not the way to run a football team.  Also, the Patriot offense hasn't exactly been hitting on all cylindars this season, especially lately.  Sitting Brady yesterday is not gonna magically make him healthy next week.  He's gonna be banged up all season long, accept that fact.  Sitting him is also not gonna help the offense going forward.  They need their reps.  ESPECIALLY after Welker went out.  It was pretty clear it was a serious injury and they wouldn't have him for the rest of the year, so it was important to get Brady used to playing with Edelman since he'll be taking his place next week.

The Colts and Patriots situation is a bit different and you really can't compare them.  The Colts were 14-0 and playing well.  Now by easing up at the end they may have lost some momentum, we'll see.  The Pats were 10-5 and had been up and down all season.  They've played well at home but poorly on the road.  They're only gonna get one home game, unless they beat the Ravens and Chargers and the Colts lose their first playoff game.  So they're gonna have to win on the road.  It would've been nice to have finally beaten a winning team on the road yesterday.  It didn't happen.  The defense did their usual 4th quarter meltdown and the offense sputtered down the stretch with their 3 and outs, like they have all season.  They were trying and hoping to correct these things.  Unfortunately it didn't happen.  But you can be sure, by sitting Welker, Moss, Brady, Taylor, Watson, Springs, Banta Cain, Burgess, Thomas, whoever else you want to sit.  That wouldn't have solved anything.

This just isn't the year for the Patriots, with or without Welker.  Yesterdays game just further exemplified that.  I'm sorry, but the Patriots had the right idea going into yesterday.  Things just didn't work out in the end, and an unfortunate injury occurred.

Also, Hoyer played the end of each half to get him end of the game experience, in case he's ever thrown into that situation.  Apparently that was the plan going into the game.  Brady was not pleased, he wanted to play at the end of the 4th.

[loretian]

As a Vikings fan, things went really well for me yesterday.  D, what do you have against AP?  He's not doing great now, but how can be overrated?  His past numbers speak for themself.  I might be a little biased, he's goes to Church a few blocks from where I live.     But he's a great player, from what I hear, a great guy, and every good player has a slump now and then.

Favre is incredible!  Superbowl, baby, can't wait - we can beat Philly, Dallas, Cardinals, or GB in the ole' dome, and we'll play well in the Superdome for a championship game, I believe.

[Drew]

I loved seeing the Cowboys just destroy Donny boy and the Eagles, 24-0! 

Great to see Brett Favre and the Vikings run right over the Giants, 44-7!

If the Colts don't win the Superbowl now, the head coach will look like a complete ass. 

[Bill 213]

When Green Bay and Minnesota meet in the NFC Divisionals Best playoff game ever!!!!

[freedom78]

If the Colts don't win the Superbowl now, the head coach will look like a complete ass. 

I'm pretty sure the decision came down from team Pres. Bill Polian.  It was policy when Dungy was there, as well.

Not saying I agree, but I'd be surprised if this was purely a coaching choice.

[sandman]

eagles shit the bed.

here's mcnabb's take on the game...

"We showed our youth," the quarterback said. "We showed our youth in situations where everyone would begin to look around to see who was going to make the play instead of stepping up and making that play. That's something that comes with the territory when you have a young group. I think at this time, having discussed it with the guys, everybody understands it."

[Bodhi]

[


A lot of folks owe Colts' Coach Caldwell an apology.  Belichek fucked up BIG TIME!  Brady's got 2 broken ribs and Welker blew his knee out in a meaningless game.  Fucking stupid.

Why???   

"Coach" Caldwell wont be in this league as a head coach for more than 4 years.  I think 99% of their success is thanks to Coach Manning, dont you?   You have the opportunity to go UNDEFEATED and win the Super Bowl, and Caldwell says "no thanks."?  Even if the Colts win the Super Bowl this year, so what?  Peyton Manning has already won a Super Bowl.  They had an opportunity at football immortality and all they had to do was beat a mediocre Jets and Bills team, they blew it...and by the way how has babying Peyton Manning down the stretch of the season worked out for the Colts before?  The only title they have won is when he had to play the whole way through.

[D]

Don't get me wrong, I like Adrian Peterson, but he isn't the best rb in the NFL.

So he is overrated cause people act like he is the greatest rb in NFL history when he is anything but. 3 100 yard rushing games all season and they came against KC, Cle.. not good catching the ball, and fumbles too much.

Chris Johnson is way better and gets none of the acclaim or hype.



In my money league, we have what we call "Beer" weeks. week 17 is one and whoever scores the highest wins 135 dollars... i missed out by 4pts cause McNabb played like pure shit. if he has any type of performance, i am sitting pretty with 135 bucks.......

[tim_m]

I am a Dallas fan but I fully Expect Philly to tear us a new asshole next week.

Romo the idiot will surely find some way to blow it. He always does in big games.

[faldor]

[


A lot of folks owe Colts' Coach Caldwell an apology.  Belichek fucked up BIG TIME!  Brady's got 2 broken ribs and Welker blew his knee out in a meaningless game.  Fucking stupid.

Why???   

"Coach" Caldwell wont be in this league as a head coach for more than 4 years.  I think 99% of their success is thanks to Coach Manning, dont you?   You have the opportunity to go UNDEFEATED and win the Super Bowl, and Caldwell says "no thanks."?  Even if the Colts win the Super Bowl this year, so what?  Peyton Manning has already won a Super Bowl.  They had an opportunity at football immortality and all they had to do was beat a mediocre Jets and Bills team, they blew it...and by the way how has babying Peyton Manning down the stretch of the season worked out for the Colts before?  The only title they have won is when he had to play the whole way through.

Well, two Super Bowls are better than one.  Trent Dilfer and Doug Williams have won Super Bowls.  Peyton would put himself, and the Colts in more select company with a second trophy.  So, if they win this year, their season won't be tarnished because they didn't go 19-0.  In the back of people's minds, they'll wonder what could have been.  But winning the Super Bowl is the ultimate goal.

With that being said, the Colts made the wrong move tanking these last 2 games, EVEN if they end up winning. 

[gilee7]

eagles shit the bed.

here's mcnabb's take on the game...

"We showed our youth," the quarterback said. "We showed our youth in situations where everyone would begin to look around to see who was going to make the play instead of stepping up and making that play. That's something that comes with the territory when you have a young group. I think at this time, having discussed it with the guys, everybody understands it."

Still trying to find silver lining in the loss, I think it's better that the Eagles lost the way they did than if they had lost by a FG or something. A close loss is more debilitating. By getting embarrassed like they did, hopefully it'll light a fire under the team's ass. The Cardinals got embarrassed last year in New England, then ended up almost winning the Superbowl.

As far as all the bitching and moaning about the Colts resting guys, I don't know why's it's such a big deal or why so many people are still talking about it, not just on here but everywhere. Tony Dungy always believed in resting his players. If everything was wrapped up, you put the team on coast and stay healthy for the playoffs. Going undefeated was never that important to them. The ultimate goal is to win a Superbowl. The Patriots went 18-1, 16-0 during the regular season, but people only remember that the Giants beat them in the Superbowl. In the end, their perfect regular season record meant absolutely shit. The Vince Lombardi trophy is all that matters in the NFL.

One can argue whether or not resting players hurts or helps a team. Personally, I'd rather have my guys healthy than risk a serious injury to an important player in a game that, in the long run, is just as meaningless as a pre-season game. I'm an Eagles fan, and once it was clear the Cowboys were going to win last Sunday, I was wishing that Andy Reid would pull the starters and just get ready for next week. Every time McNabb dropped back to pass, I held my breath just hoping nobody would hit him and end up injuring him.

Tony Dungy's fingerprints are still all over the Colts' franchise. That's why I'm shocked that so many are so surprised that they rested Peyton. It's what Dungy would've done, so that's why Caldwell did it.

In my mind, the Chargers are the best team in the AFC. I think they were even before the Colts lost their first game. Regardless of whether or not they ever rested their starters, I think they were going to lose in the AFC Championship game. And even if they had went undefeated and won the Superbowl, which accomplishment is more important? In my opinion, it's the Superbowl. The undefeated season is just an asterick to go along with it, something for the media to talk about and for the fans to brag.

I could care less if my favorite team goes 19-0, or just sneaks into the playoffs with a 9-7 record, as long as the final result is the same: which is the lasting image of the players on the stage, wearing championship shirts and hats, confetti falling in the air, hoisting the Vince Lombardi trophy. Maybe that's because my favorite team has never even won a fucking Superbowl (Goddamn it!), but I think too many people are losing track of what the ultimate goal is.

I think every team that was already in the playoffs and had nothing to gain, should've rested their players. To the Patriots, I don't think there's any difference in a 3 seed or 4 seed, so a win for them was meaningless. Why even start any of their star players? And if Brady's had all these injuries all season, isn't that even more reason to sit him down, let him rest and heal, and come back stronger next week? I think momentum is overrated. Sure, the Packers won, beating the Cardinals' bench players, but now Woodsen is banged up. Was that win and supposed momentum more important than possibly not having their best defensive player next week? I don't think so. When you have players as good as Peyton, Brady, etc., a week or two off isn't going to affect them. It's not like they aren't practicing or preparing themselves both mentally and physically every single day.

[faldor]

As I said before, what good would resting Brady have done?  Say he was 85% last week, what would he be 87% next week?  Is that really that big a difference.  He wasn't gonna magically heal to 100%.  No one is at this point in the season.  The Patriots weren't in a position where they could just coast into the playoffs.  Their seeding may not have mattered much, but the way they were playing did.  IF they could've won a game on the road against a winning team for once that could've instilled some much needed confidence into the team.  But it didn't happen.  I have absolutely no problem with the way they went about the game against the Texans.  My only regret is they let the Texans score 21 unanswered points on the way to another disappointing road loss.

I don't remember all this "resting" players ever resulting in a Super Bowl victory.  The Colts did it a bunch and didn't win (they didn't "rest" their players the year they won).  The Eagles have done it a bunch and never won.  Not saying it hurts teams to rest their stars, but it certainly isn't proven that it helps.  Especially with a team that isn't clicking on all cylindars like the Pats and still has plenty of work to do.

[D]

McNabb said they showed their youth.. hasn't he been playing for 20 years........ LOL

When u are clicking, u don't fuck with that momentum. I don't care what your record is. Look at New Orleans for instance... I bet they get put out first playoff game.

its all about when u peak... Indy and NO are on the downslide... Indy thanks to terrible decisions and coaching

[D]

eagles shit the bed.

here's mcnabb's take on the game...

"We showed our youth," the quarterback said. "We showed our youth in situations where everyone would begin to look around to see who was going to make the play instead of stepping up and making that play. That's something that comes with the territory when you have a young group. I think at this time, having discussed it with the guys, everybody understands it."

Still trying to find silver lining in the loss, I think it's better that the Eagles lost the way they did than if they had lost by a FG or something. A close loss is more debilitating. By getting embarrassed like they did, hopefully it'll light a fire under the team's ass. The Cardinals got embarrassed last year in New England, then ended up almost winning the Superbowl.

As far as all the bitching and moaning about the Colts resting guys, I don't know why's it's such a big deal or why so many people are still talking about it, not just on here but everywhere. Tony Dungy always believed in resting his players. If everything was wrapped up, you put the team on coast and stay healthy for the playoffs. Going undefeated was never that important to them. The ultimate goal is to win a Superbowl. The Patriots went 18-1, 16-0 during the regular season, but people only remember that the Giants beat them in the Superbowl. In the end, their perfect regular season record meant absolutely shit. The Vince Lombardi trophy is all that matters in the NFL.

One can argue whether or not resting players hurts or helps a team. Personally, I'd rather have my guys healthy than risk a serious injury to an important player in a game that, in the long run, is just as meaningless as a pre-season game. I'm an Eagles fan, and once it was clear the Cowboys were going to win last Sunday, I was wishing that Andy Reid would pull the starters and just get ready for next week. Every time McNabb dropped back to pass, I held my breath just hoping nobody would hit him and end up injuring him.

Tony Dungy's fingerprints are still all over the Colts' franchise. That's why I'm shocked that so many are so surprised that they rested Peyton. It's what Dungy would've done, so that's why Caldwell did it.

In my mind, the Chargers are the best team in the AFC. I think they were even before the Colts lost their first game. Regardless of whether or not they ever rested their starters, I think they were going to lose in the AFC Championship game. And even if they had went undefeated and won the Superbowl, which accomplishment is more important? In my opinion, it's the Superbowl. The undefeated season is just an asterick to go along with it, something for the media to talk about and for the fans to brag.

I could care less if my favorite team goes 19-0, or just sneaks into the playoffs with a 9-7 record, as long as the final result is the same: which is the lasting image of the players on the stage, wearing championship shirts and hats, confetti falling in the air, hoisting the Vince Lombardi trophy. Maybe that's because my favorite team has never even won a fucking Superbowl (Goddamn it!), but I think too many people are losing track of what the ultimate goal is.

I think every team that was already in the playoffs and had nothing to gain, should've rested their players. To the Patriots, I don't think there's any difference in a 3 seed or 4 seed, so a win for them was meaningless. Why even start any of their star players? And if Brady's had all these injuries all season, isn't that even more reason to sit him down, let him rest and heal, and come back stronger next week? I think momentum is overrated. Sure, the Packers won, beating the Cardinals' bench players, but now Woodsen is banged up. Was that win and supposed momentum more important than possibly not having their best defensive player next week? I don't think so. When you have players as good as Peyton, Brady, etc., a week or two off isn't going to affect them. It's not like they aren't practicing or preparing themselves both mentally and physically every single day.

Right which is why Tony Dungy won 1 Superbowl even though he had the best team in the league *Counting TB* for about 6 seasons. It just doesn't work. NFL is about timing and game speed... u lose those when u don't play.. Practice doesn't come anywhere near duplicating that.

So now u aren't sharp and the playoffs get amped up to another level.. and teams just get too out of sync.

[sandman]

McNabb said they showed their youth.. hasn't he been playing for 20 years........ LOL

he's placing the blame on others. which is another example of why i question his leadership abilities. DeSean Jackson made this comment yesterday...

?He basically is saying just step it up,? Jackson said. ?Everyone has to play their abilities. He takes responsibility for himself also. He kinda gives and takes. At the end of the day we have to be on our A game. For us to win and be where we need to be, everyone needs to play good. All that pointing fingers and saying it?s my fault. It?s not time for that right now. We have to play A ball.?

Co-host Harry Mayes followed the clip of McNabb?s news conference with this: ?How about him making a play? He?s an 11-year veteran. He?s been to multiple Pro Bowls. Take some responsibility, put it on yourself and make a play.?

Jackson?s response: ?Yes, sir ? Understood ? Definitely ? Without a doubt.?

Jackson said the players remain insulated from the talk surrounding the team, but added, ? If you played that [sound bite] through the locker room, that?s not something nobody wants to hear.?


but no sense arguing about d-mac now. if he plays well this saturday, last sunday won't matter at all.

this is a huge game for him and his legacy. he only has one more year on his contract. it would be strange to see him go into next season as a lame duck.   

[Axl4Prez2004]

Sandman, I agree that Donovan shouldn't have said that.  I will say it was probably one qucik sentence in addition to 50-100 others, but that's the one that gets aired over and over.  But, agreed...not good.

I see this Philly-Dallas game as too close to call.  If I had to rely on Romo or McNabb in a playoff game, my money's on Donovan.  Eagles should cover being +4 1/2.

I like Baltimore straight-up in NE.  Cincy will win and cover over the Jets...no problem.  GB will win over AZ.

Faldor, you made great points.  Welker's injury was a fluke thing that could have happened at practice, and Brady's ribs have apparently looked like Marc Bulger's for the whole season, so that's no difference.
I still wouldn't play for the win.  One quarter, two quarters tops to stay fresh.   

btw, I won't mention how much it pisses me off to hear DeSean Jackson's horrendous grammar...double-negatives...grrr!      

[faldor]

Let me just say once again, AFTER Welker got hurt, that was even more of a reason to play Brady longer in the game.  He needed to build up some sort of rapport with Julian Edelman since he's gonna take over as the slot receiver.  They haven't worked together too much this season so it was important for them to get some game time experience in before a full week of practice.

As for the game itself.  It certainly wouldn't surprise me if the Ravens beat the Patriots.  BUT, I think it's a good matchup for the Pats.  They struggle against high powered offenses and are stout against the run (with Wilfork and Warren in the lineup).  The Ravens are a running team, not much of a passing team.  Granted Chad Henne was able to light up the Pats, but their D seems to play better at home.  But the way to beat the Pats is to throw on them, and I don't think that's to the advantage of the Ravens.  Conversely, the Ravens D is tough against the run but their secondary is kind of porous.  The Pats strength on offense is obviously through the air.  The Ravens defense just isn't as good as it has been in years past.  Obviously the Patriots offense isn't as good either, but I'd still give them an edge.  So I'll feel pretty confident walking into Gillette Stadium come Sunday.  Hopefully I'll leave with a smile on my face or it'll be a long, depressing ride home.  I'll fully accept a loss to the Chargers next week.  That game, I wouldn't expect to win.  But this one, is quite winnable.

[sandman]

Sandman, I agree that Donovan shouldn't have said that.  I will say it was probably one qucik sentence in addition to 50-100 others, but that's the one that gets aired over and over.  But, agreed...not good.

I see this Philly-Dallas game as too close to call.  If I had to rely on Romo or McNabb in a playoff game, my money's on Donovan.  Eagles should cover being +4 1/2.

I like Baltimore straight-up in NE.  Cincy will win and cover over the Jets...no problem.  GB will win over AZ.

Faldor, you made great points.  Welker's injury was a fluke thing that could have happened at practice, and Brady's ribs have apparently looked like Marc Bulger's for the whole season, so that's no difference.
I still wouldn't play for the win.  One quarter, two quarters tops to stay fresh.   

btw, I won't mention how much it pisses me off to hear DeSean Jackson's horrendous grammar...double-negatives...grrr!      

i agree, i think the eagles and cowboys are about even. but right now they have such a huge mental edge. as bad as mcnabb played, we lost that game cause we couldn't stop the run, or stop anything. it could turn out to be a great game - something like 31-28. and it absolutely could go either way. the thing that worries me is if the cowboys have success on their first couple of drives and we fall behind again, that could snowball quickly into another blowout loss.

and if it is close, dallas seems set up better to convert those 3rd downs have put together a long drive in crunch time.

although one good thing about reid is that he has been great in bouce-back kind of games. he's good at making adjustments prior to big games, and has been good when facing a team a second time (last week not withstanding).

nothing would surprise me, but using my head over my heart i gotta say cowboys win 24-20.

one stat that really bothers me....eagles are 0-4 against teams that made the playoffs this year.   

[gilee7]

one stat that really bothers me....eagles are 0-4 against teams that made the playoffs this year.   

One stat that should help you feel better, though: Reid and McNabb have never lost a playoff opener.

[D]

haha u guys are hitting my biggest pet peeve of all time... STATS

teams losing game 1 of the World series are 4-102 all time..... *not really* but u get what Im saying.. that has nothing to do with THIS series.

The game is brand new, no snaps have been made.. its 50/50, history has nothing to do with it.

I like D McNabb, but that guy gets too big of a pass on shit. He singlehandedly started the TO feud, but TO got all the flak for it

reminds me of how Evander Holyfield hid behind his religious image to get away with cheating in fights by intentionally headbutting.