There are certain people who should not attend the next tour shows!

[falungong69]

please just ban him already.  what's the point in this?  it's ruining everything for the real fans.

coming from someone who makes insane comments and threads


its funny how "the real fans" can make threads like this one and exclude people from being gnr fans yet when these "real fans" are called out on their own flaws its not cool and people want you banned. go figure

look man, i don't know how to make this any simpler for you... if you can't say something nice THEN DON'T SAY ANYTHING AT ALL!!!!  i don't care if you get mad that axl makes his setlist without consulting you.  i'm really sorry that axl doesn't let you manage his personal planner and schedule when he'll be ready to give his best performance.  so just deal with it!  what good does coming here and complaining do?  NOTHING!  do you think axl will read this and say, "Oh okay, whatever... that random guy on the internet is right, i'll just change whatever he wants me to change about myself."

so what's the point to all your complaining?  you're not changing anything.  you're just annoying everyone who wants to come here and support their favorite band and talk about their favorite music.  you're just bringing THE REAL FANS down and killing the mood with negativity.  

and jarmo... maybe you could just send this guy a freakin' pm so he'll lay off already.  you've always responded to my pm's, so i know you're a good guy and i know you take the time out to communicate with people.  

[SLCPUNK]

"Real fans"

 

[D]

fan is short for fanatic u know.

I think we are all pretty damn fanatical one way or the other.

[younggunner]

look man, i don't know how to make this any simpler for you... if you can't say something nice THEN DON'T SAY ANYTHING AT ALL!!!!  i don't care if you get mad that axl makes his setlist without consulting you.  i'm really sorry that axl doesn't let you manage his personal planner and schedule when he'll be ready to give his best performance.  so just deal with it!  what good does coming here and complaining do?  NOTHING!  do you think axl will read this and say, "Oh okay, whatever... that random guy on the internet is right, i'll just change whatever he wants me to change about myself."

so what's the point to all your complaining?  you're not changing anything.  you're just annoying everyone who wants to come here and support their favorite band and talk about their favorite music.  you're just bringing THE REAL FANS down and killing the mood with negativity. 

and jarmo... maybe you could just send this guy a freakin' pm so he'll lay off already.  you've always responded to my pm's, so i know you're a good guy and i know you take the time out to communicate with people. 

whos getting mad? Do I not go to the shows? Do I not wait hrs in line so I can get a good spot? Just because people comment on certain aspects of gnr doesnt mean we are complaining or arent fans. Its a god dam message board. Just talking. Why are you so sensitive? Its not like anyone is saying Axl sucks or gnr blows. We are just commenting on the ins and outs of gnr mostly based on how its presented to the public. Some of its good, some of its bad. Thats reality not fantasy. Axl makes mistakes. Everyone does. Hes fukin human. That doesnt mean he isnt the greatest frontman ever etc. He is. But that doesnt mean we have to sit here and think that the way he handles things is always right. We are in another silent stage of gnr. What do you expect people do during the wait? Capisce?

what is a "real fan"? please tell me so I can begin training.

[falungong69]

look man, i don't know how to make this any simpler for you... if you can't say something nice THEN DON'T SAY ANYTHING AT ALL!!!!  i don't care if you get mad that axl makes his setlist without consulting you.  i'm really sorry that axl doesn't let you manage his personal planner and schedule when he'll be ready to give his best performance.  so just deal with it!  what good does coming here and complaining do?  NOTHING!  do you think axl will read this and say, "Oh okay, whatever... that random guy on the internet is right, i'll just change whatever he wants me to change about myself."

so what's the point to all your complaining?  you're not changing anything.  you're just annoying everyone who wants to come here and support their favorite band and talk about their favorite music.  you're just bringing THE REAL FANS down and killing the mood with negativity. 

and jarmo... maybe you could just send this guy a freakin' pm so he'll lay off already.  you've always responded to my pm's, so i know you're a good guy and i know you take the time out to communicate with people. 

whos getting mad? Do I not go to the shows? Do I not wait hrs in line so I can get a good spot? Just because people comment on certain aspects of gnr doesnt mean we are complaining or arent fans. Its a god dam message board. Just talking. Why are you so sensitive? Its not like anyone is saying Axl sucks or gnr blows. We are just commenting on the ins and outs of gnr mostly based on how its presented to the public. Some of its good, some of its bad. Thats reality not fantasy. Axl makes mistakes. Everyone does. Hes fukin human. That doesnt mean he isnt the greatest frontman ever etc. He is. But that doesnt mean we have to sit here and think that the way he handles things is always right. We are in another silent stage of gnr. What do you expect people do during the wait? Capisce?

what is a "real fan"? please tell me so I can begin training.

okay, great.  you've now officially said your peace... you think axl should play your setlists.  you think axl should take the stage when you want.  you think axl should do eveyrthing you want.  your opinion has been stated and recorded for all time.

so now hopefully you won't need to keep saying it over and over and over again.  we get it.  we understand how you feel.  maybe one day axl will read your comments and decide to do as you say.  until then, can we agree that you've shared your feelings and don't need to keep saying the same stuff again and again? 

now how about saying something positive? 

[ppbebe]

I used to get a kick reading posts made by people who want to run other peoples' lives.

It's gotten totally pathetic now.

Freaks.

Totally.

'the band should do this and shouldn't do that"

"A Real Fan should do this and shouldn't do that"

"A board admin should be blah"

Shove it.

[russkwtx]

Some suggestions to the contrary, there is no relationship between starting late and quality of the show or quality of the experience.

[falungong69]

Some suggestions to the contrary, there is no relationship between starting late and quality of the show or quality of the experience.

hm.. on one hand we have what axl says, and on the other hand we have what you, some random guy on the internet thinks.  since the issue is about when axl thinks he performs best, i think i'll listen to axl.  if the issue was how to use an internet forum, i'd trust you.

[Layne Staley's Sunglasses]

what rule have I broken.

You are insane. That might not even be the word.

Calling somebody insane when you're not a doctor, or qualified to make that kind of diagnosis, is in many circles considered an insult.







/jarmo

I'm stealing this line from you.

[carmiedisco12]

hm.. on one hand we have what axl says, and on the other hand we have what you, some random guy on the internet thinks.  since the issue is about when axl thinks he performs best, i think i'll listen to axl.  if the issue was how to use an internet forum, i'd trust you.
[/quote]


 
I Guess that's why all the shows in the AFD era that were on time and the Freddie Tribute were so terrible then I cant see Axl leaving a hot girl lying in bed for 2 hrs till he feels he's at peak readiness.
I guess the late starts that resulted in cancelled shows and riots were great?? I guess aggravating the audience the support acts the stage crew the promoters etc makes for a good show??  The kids who had to leave the gig halfway through to get home???

This really is dead horse territory though. If you go to a GNR show unfortunately thats par the course, I do however believe that the casual fan has a legitimate gripe, and the notion that anyone who's life gets shafted by late starts shouldnt attend is just deluded snobbery.

[Gargh!]

This really is dead horse territory though. If you go to a GNR show unfortunately thats par the course, I do however believe that the casual fan has a legitimate gripe, and the notion that anyone who's life gets shafted by late starts shouldnt attend is just deluded snobbery.

Bingo. Late starts can be a real pain in the arse if you have to travel for the gig.  I mind when I stayed for the encores at a Maiden show in Glasgow and missed the last train back to Edinburgh as a result, now that was my fault, I didn't have to stay for the encores (actually, Hallowed Be Thy Name was closer, so yes I did) - but I'd have been right pissed off if they were only halfway through the show at that point. 

Aslo, not everyone knows in advance about Axl's insistance in going on so late.  Most people will see the show advertised, buy a ticket and turn up - only a minority spend as much time as we do on message boards.

[The Prez]

Am I the only one who actually love the fact that they show up (mostly) too late?

[carmiedisco12]

Am I the only one who actually love the fact that they show up (mostly) too late?

Despite my opinion of the late starts , I personally dont mind it as im a night person and enjoy the buildup ( my only gripe is that if im liquored up and have made the effort for a good position I cant have a toilet break hahah)

My argument is purely against the people that cant see the point from the general publics perspective....there are people on here unfortunately that verge on religious nutbag territory that view any alternate point of view or dissent as blasphemous

[Uber-Tech]

So .............. they take to the stage later than some people would like.

This has been ongoing for a very long time.  It has been a widely publicised fact.  The only people who may be unaware that they go on stage late may be people who are not fans at all.  Given the prices charged for tickets, would someone who is not a fan pay for a ticket to see them?  Not normally.  Therefore, as a fan, you are aware of the likelihood of a late night, in fact it's almost a given. 

If the day after the show was a working day, I would take a days holiday.

Personally, I am willing to wait until Axl is ready to go on.  I would rather wait hours and see a fantastic show than see a mediocre show that started earlier.

It is not the same as turning up for 'work' on time.  If Axl treated what he did the same way as the majority of people treat their own jobs, it would be a very poor band (and yes, I know that saying the 'majority' is a gross generalisation, but the number of people I've met who don't really care about what they do every day, and are just doing it to earn money far outweighs those who actually care about what they are doing).

It is well known that some people are 'night' people.  For example, I know many people who work nights, starting around 10pm, and prefer it that way because they are just 'night' people.  They believe that they accomplish their best work at night, and I see no reason to disagree with them.

Axl believes that he owes the fans the best show he can possibly give them.  If he performs best late at night, then that's what he'll do.

[carmiedisco12]

The only people who may be unaware that they go on stage late may be people who are not fans at all



Well speaking of snobbery and one person defining a 'real fan'.

They are attending the show, so id contend they are fans of the music and may not FOLLOW the quirks of the band....let me tell you that many people that attend dont know that its accepted that GNR come onstage late....and why should they??? stop blaming the fans , the beaten wife syndrome is weird.

Anyone attending is either a 'fan' or at least curious as to what GNR is about....as ive said many 15 year old kids attend, just like i would have at 15 if Led Zep showed up......If at 15 id been forced to wait 2 hrs inbetween sets ( and Ive yet to hear a coherent reason why???)  and forced to ditch the gig halfway through, like many of the kids at the gig I saw...then hell yeh Id be annoyed

[Limulus]

it would be interesting to get some more inside information about Axl's late showing up. he "is actually doing something" [to prepare for the show with the classic line-up] were some of his recent forum words...so whats that? meditiation stuff? physical work-out? business?? relaxing? all combined?
i'd also like to know if the venue times do have an effect....like if he is told about "venue HAS and WILL be closed at 0 a.m." and if this has an significant effect on his showing-up? it kinda should have? but then he could also do it on purpose being late....and that would be unrock. it also could be a problem for the show length being shortened cause they did go on late but the city orders the venue to be silent ~after midnight and threaten with $$$$$$ overplaying-time-fees. apparently that was the case in Holland06.
Rock Am Ring06 the organizers had an opened slot for Axl and the band the whole friday night....which was kinda cool. knowing that he wanted to go on stage at 3am but then made it 1:45am, still people were waiting more than 2h and it was very very cold (also to be seen in the Proshot video WDR ROCKPALAST aired....check when the band is breathing, looks like some Godzillas on stage at points). the setlists were similar, i might never see the point of them being that stable and still think more different setlists wouldnt hurt the band but doing them more good (like the Bon Jovi setlists mentioned being more Rock N Roll). some of this information is coming from people backstage with VIP passes and yes, i was at both shows.

[carmiedisco12]

If the day after the show was a working day, I would take a days holiday.

Well Id probably tell my boss Ima  night person and just show up late sheesh......and despite what you think when your pulling in $100k a gig and people make travel plans to see you and young kids scrimp and save to see the band , no matter how 'rock n roll rebellious' going on late is....you better harden up and get on.

Noone has explained why the AFD gigs were so awesome when Axl used to get onstage on time???
I fully understand Axls not being ready and the internal clock thing i really do.....but sometimes you have to comromise and as the slogan say 'just do it'....the balance between art and integrity is blurry, but your being paid 100k or more by people who often are very poor.....so toughen the fuck up and get out there.

[jarmo]

Axl: I've been an after midnight type since I was sneakin' out of my house in Jr. High. With old Guns we preferred 12am or so. When we moved to theaters etc obviously that changes but it's never changed inside me. Doesn't matter what I do so generally that's when I'm more myself. This isn't to mess with anyone that has an early schedule to keep it's just personal preference.

And in regard to the size venues I'm on record as preferring what ever venues allow for our schedule but management and promoters can do a lot in their own interests behind the scenes that can rarely be avoided and their greed or whatever leads to a lot of double talk and ugly behind nonsense that generally eventually ruins things for everyone. Translated once a tour is scheduled however it's like parting the seas to change.

As far as being late, I've been that way my whole life. It drove Izzy crazy but he would check himself and freely admit I was generally actually doing something that had to get done rather than watching basketball etc.



He prefers to go on when he thinks he can give the crowd the best show. So many of you are saying how you understand that people are different, but here you are not being able to accept it after all.



You think that sucks because it might push back your beauty sleep for one night of the year.....



/jarmo

[Jdog0830]

I love this site and always visit and I hope to see Axl on tour in the UK this year, but it doesnt change the fact that this IS a GN'R site for all fans of GN'R regardless of how you view them(not that it puts you inthe wrong, your entitled to have a view how this site works).

Anyway, even if you go to a show knowing what Axl can be like, and fully expecting him to go on "late" doesnt make it right to make people wait for so long. Its irrelevant anyway, Axl knows what he does, clearly isnt apologetic for it so its down to the people if they wanna go or not. I dont think its down to anyone to tell someone else to not go and if there are people there shouting for Slash or whatever its down to Axl and the band to shut them up by putting on a great show...

thats vary true

[ppbebe]

nope. not very true.
like I said he has apologised for making the crowd wait.
made it pretty clear that he can't do anything for that. who cares whether it's perfectionism, autonomic imbalance or whatever.
A band can't go before everything is ready. Sometimes early sometimes late.