There are certain people who should not attend the next tour shows!

[Uber-Tech]

There are a number of people (apparently, I wasn't there, so I don't know for sure), who have been going to G N' R concerts, waiting for it to go a bit quiet, then shouting at the top of their voice "Where's Slash?" "We want Slash" etc.

Slash is not in G N' R.  Saying things like that is unfair, especially to the newer band members.  Taking to a stage in front of all those people is never easy.  Basically being told you're crap while you're slogging your guts out performing is just not right.

Why do people pay money and then do this?  If they want Slash, why don't they go to VR?  Or Snakepit.  Don't go to see a band he isn't in and then complain when he's not in it.

[bodine]

There are a number of people (apparently, I wasn't there, so I don't know for sure), who have been going to G N' R concerts, waiting for it to go a bit quiet, then shouting at the top of their voice "Where's Slash?" "We want Slash" etc.

Slash is not in G N' R.  Saying things like that is unfair, especially to the newer band members.  Taking to a stage in front of all those people is never easy.  Basically being told you're crap while you're slogging your guts out performing is just not right.

Why do people pay money and then do this?  If they want Slash, why don't they go to VR?  Or Snakepit.  Don't go to see a band he isn't in and then complain when he's not in it.

I either didn't hear that stuff at the concert I went to, or was too drunk to notice (quite possible).  I can see if someone didn't know that the old members were gone, but that should be old news by now.  I don't agree with those that say that people bitching about the time shouldn't attend, but I do agree that people shouldn't be there bitching about who's in the band.

[Bridge]

In regards to Axl's voice --

Personally, I understand that the guy isn't 25 years old anymore.  He can't sing like he used to and that's okay.  But my issue was more the choice of songs.  I mean sweet Jesus, he should at least realize his own limitations and not attempt to sing stuff like "Out to Get Me" in his squeaky voice of today.  It doesn't exactly sound pissed off as that song is supposed to sound.

I agree with this completely.  Saw them back in 06 in Tampa, and the worst thing about the late start is that fact that I only remember bits and pieces of the show due to the fact that I was completely hammered by time GN'R came on.

Isn't that what Gilby Clarke said about Axl on Behind the Music?  By the time Axl was ready to go on stage, he and the other guys were hammered.   

[Bridge]

it's like do you think axl will read this and say, 'oh okay... because this one guy doesn't like staying up late for a rock concert

More like thousands...

i can't believe you can be that selfish.  axl has one responbility:  axl.  not you,

The selfish comment is ironic because you're wrong.  When Axl goes on late, he's the selfish one.  Why?  Because your other statement is also wrong.  When thousands of people buy tickets which in turn pay Axl's salary, THEY are his responsibility.  That's his job.  Period.

I do agree that complaining won't change Axl, it certainly never has.  But don't delude yourselves into thinking that everyone has to concur with Axl's tardiness.  And it doesn't make someone any less of a "fan" because they don't agree with everything Axl does.

[Classic Case]

it's like do you think axl will read this and say, 'oh okay... because this one guy doesn't like staying up late for a rock concert

More like thousands...

i can't believe you can be that selfish.  axl has one responbility:  axl.  not you,

The selfish comment is ironic because you're wrong.  When Axl goes on late, he's the selfish one.  Why?  Because your other statement is also wrong.  When thousands of people buy tickets which in turn pay Axl's salary, THEY are his responsibility.  That's his job.  Period.

I do agree that complaining won't change Axl, it certainly never has.  But don't delude yourselves into thinking that everyone has to concur with Axl's tardiness.  And it doesn't make someone any less of a "fan" because they don't agree with everything Axl does.

I agree!

[Bridge]

Well the truth is, I can decide who my site is aimed at.

Not you.

So with that decision in mind, I can tell people that they might not be the kind of fans I'm doing this for.

Maybe you don't personify my idea of what a fan is. It's my opinion.

I believe I'm entitled to have one.

You certainly are entitled to have an opinion Jarmo.  But you're mistaken about the "truth" that you presented there.  The TRUTH is that you do not get to decide who this site is aimed at.  By emblazening the name GUNS N ROSES across your site, that very name is what determines who this site attracts.  Not you.  Because you see my friend, the name GUNS N ROSES is much bigger than the name Jarmo (I know, ouch!).

Fans from all over the world are attracted by that name, not the name Jarmo.  They bring to this site their own opinions, passions, and interpretations which are inspired by the name GUNS N ROSES.  You don't get to determine that for them.  The only thing you can do is single out those whose opinions you don't like and attempt to ostracize them from Guns N Roses' fanbase using whatever your definition of the word "fan" is.

You can spend your money to fashion this site as you wish, but as long as the name GUNS N ROSES is on the homepage, you have to accept that it's going to inevitably attract fans of Guns N Roses whose viewpoints are not necessarily in agreement with yours, and you can't change that any more than the rest of us can change the fact that Axl is always fucking late!   

I think people start threads sometimes without realizing exactly what they are saying.

People don't realize that a band can't be successful without fans. So for people to come on here and say things like:


"I don't care if CD sells 50k copies as long as I have it

"Certain People shouldn't go to shows'


Those statements even though u are trying to be a "FAN" u are really hurting the band and making it appear like u don't care about their success.

So I encourage everybody to go to the show whether u complain on a message forum or not. cause 10k looks a hell of a lot better in the stands, than 5k.

You are 100% correct.

This thread overall is ridiculous and distressingly naive.  If Axl himself were to say "I don't want complainers to buy tickets to my shows", he'd be shooting himself in the fucking foot.

Concert attendance is ultimately one thing.  A number.  That's it.  A number.  So are album sales.  It doesn't matter if protagonist John Doe, antagonist Joe Schmoe, or fucking Adolf Hitler comes to Axl's shows, a ticket sold is a ticket sold.  That's all that matters in the big picture.  All you people claiming to be "fans" of Axl's band need to realize how you're essentially wishing harm on the band by stating that certain people not buy tickets.

[Classic Case]

I dont agree with everything Axl says or do....but I still love the guy....I accept Axl how he is, thats my choice, and I dont think Im less fan than anyone here if Im not kissin Axls ass all day long, I know he will never show up on time....and maybe will upset me lil bit cuz waiting 2 hours in a crowd of thousands of people isnt funny, my feets and my back hurts like hell...but....I dont care!...I will get over it as soon I hear the first riff!...and I will do it over and over cuz just see GNR is the best thing!....I think by now (after 20 years) people and fans know how GNR rules...

[y2marmar]

I dont agree with everything Axl says or do....but I still love the guy....I accept Axl how he is, thats my choice, and I dont think Im less fan than anyone here if Im not kissin Axls ass all day long, I know he will never show up on time....and maybe will upset me lil bit cuz waiting 2 hours in a crowd of thousands of people isnt funny, my feets and my back hurts like hell...but....I dont care!...I will get over it as soon I hear the first riff!...and I will do it over and over cuz just see GNR is the best thing!....I think by now (after 20 years) people and fans know how GNR rules...

I agree with you. Axl has his faults. Admitting that doesn't make you any less of a fan. In fact, I prefer that to stepford fans, who see Axl as some sort of God who has no faults and can do no wrong.
He has his faults, he can be an asshole, but he still rocks!

[GypsySoul]

The selfish comment is ironic because you're wrong.  When Axl goes on late, he's the selfish one.  Why?  Because your other statement is also wrong.  When thousands of people buy tickets which in turn pay Axl's salary, THEY are his responsibility.  That's his job.  Period.

I do agree that complaining won't change Axl, it certainly never has.  But don't delude yourselves into thinking that everyone has to concur with Axl's tardiness.  And it doesn't make someone any less of a "fan" because they don't agree with everything Axl does.

'round and 'round we go......

The problem with your (and others) argument concerning "goes on late" and "tardiness" is that just because YOU consider it "late" or "tardy" DOES NOT MAKE IT FACT!!!  The tickets people buy indicate that the overall show starts at 8 PM or whatever ..... and I'm pretty sure that that's the time the opening act DOES IN FACT hit the stage.

As far as I know, IN THEIR ENTIRE HISTORY, GNR HAS NEVER GIVEN AN ETA FOR WHEN THEY WOULD HIT THE STAGE!!!

Also, if you check out the history of the time GNR hits the stage, I believe you'll find that it's fairly consistent in proportion to the time the opening act starts.

Just like 'beauty', apparently 'tardiness' is in the eye of the beholder, too.


FACT:  Whatever time GNR does hit the stage, 97% of their 'ticket-buying-bosses' always gives them an "OVERALL OUTSTANDING JOB PERFORMANCE" rating in their evaluations. 

[D]

yeah gypsy but u are twisting what he is saying though.

Bridge, from what I read hasn't said the show isn't "GREAT" that isn't what is being said.



What I have been saying is, we live in a microwave society. Everybody wants what they want NOW.  waiting 2 hours when u are the biggest band in the world and when everyone is hanging on your every move and you have a sold out tour and are selling tens of millions of albums is one thing.

Doing the same thing TODAY, when u are trying to introduce a new band people are already lukewarm about, makes that uphill climb even steeper.


The numbers don't lie. U can blame the economy for CD's sales, but u can't blame it for the US tour and the half empty arenas.

people *not me* I am speaking of the general public, don't want to wait around 2 hours to see a concert.

Hell, I don't think people would do that to watch a sporting event or anything else.


People are fast movers these days, everybody is rushed and busy trying to fit a ton of shit into a small window and most don't have a few hours to just sit around waiting.


If Axl wants to play at 2am, that is fine

however, I don't want to hear lame excuses about people not being "fans" when GNR are playing clubs and theaters and overseas festivals.


I'll use my restaurant analogy again.  there could be a restaurant that has the absolute greatest food in the world, but, if u consistently get shitty service, food cooked wrong, order wrong, have to wait an hour for your food to come, find a hair in it etc  chances are, u aren't gonna frequent that restaurant even though the food is the greatest.

[Classic Case]

The selfish comment is ironic because you're wrong.  When Axl goes on late, he's the selfish one.  Why?  Because your other statement is also wrong.  When thousands of people buy tickets which in turn pay Axl's salary, THEY are his responsibility.  That's his job.  Period.

I do agree that complaining won't change Axl, it certainly never has.  But don't delude yourselves into thinking that everyone has to concur with Axl's tardiness.  And it doesn't make someone any less of a "fan" because they don't agree with everything Axl does.

'round and 'round we go......

The problem with your (and others) argument concerning "goes on late" and "tardiness" is that just because YOU consider it "late" or "tardy" DOES NOT MAKE IT FACT!!!  The tickets people buy indicate that the overall show starts at 8 PM or whatever ..... and I'm pretty sure that that's the time the opening act DOES IN FACT hit the stage.

As far as I know, IN THEIR ENTIRE HISTORY, GNR HAS NEVER GIVEN AN ETA FOR WHEN THEY WOULD HIT THE STAGE!!!

Also, if you check out the history of the time GNR hits the stage, I believe you'll find that it's fairly consistent in proportion to the time the opening act starts.

Just like 'beauty', apparently 'tardiness' is in the eye of the beholder, too.


FACT:  Whatever time GNR does hit the stage, 97% of their 'ticket-buying-bosses' always gives them an "OVERALL OUTSTANDING JOB PERFORMANCE" rating in their evaluations. 

If takes 2 hours after the headline finish playing to show up THATS BEEN LATE, and we all know that, and maybe some people will not put up w that, if I show up late at work almost everyday I gonna get fired no matter how good I am, not everybody are hard die fans like us and not everybody gonna support GNR like us, this is just my opinion, and as I said bfore, I still love Axl and still support him, and I will be there in the next show regardless at what time they show up.

[russtcb]

The selfish comment is ironic because you're wrong.  When Axl goes on late, he's the selfish one.  Why?  Because your other statement is also wrong.  When thousands of people buy tickets which in turn pay Axl's salary, THEY are his responsibility.  That's his job.  Period.

I do agree that complaining won't change Axl, it certainly never has.  But don't delude yourselves into thinking that everyone has to concur with Axl's tardiness.  And it doesn't make someone any less of a "fan" because they don't agree with everything Axl does.

'round and 'round we go......

The problem with your (and others) argument concerning "goes on late" and "tardiness" is that just because YOU consider it "late" or "tardy" DOES NOT MAKE IT FACT!!!  The tickets people buy indicate that the overall show starts at 8 PM or whatever ..... and I'm pretty sure that that's the time the opening act DOES IN FACT hit the stage.

IN THEIR ENTIRE HISTORY, GNR HAS NEVER GIVEN AN ETA FOR WHEN THEY WOULD HIT THE STAGE!!!

Not true. On the '91 tour my tickets CLEARLY said "around 8pm" 

[commissioner]

I do agree that complaining won't change Axl, it certainly never has.  But don't delude yourselves into thinking that everyone has to concur with Axl's tardiness.  And it doesn't make someone any less of a "fan" because they don't agree with everything Axl does.
[/quote]

___________________________________________________________________________

Yes but people buy tickets to the shows knowing this and still complain about it?   

[jarmo]

The TRUTH is that you do not get to decide who this site is aimed at.  By emblazening the name GUNS N ROSES across your site, that very name is what determines who this site attracts.  Not you.  Because you see my friend, the name GUNS N ROSES is much bigger than the name Jarmo (I know, ouch!).

Fans from all over the world are attracted by that name, not the name Jarmo.  They bring to this site their own opinions, passions, and interpretations which are inspired by the name GUNS N ROSES.  You don't get to determine that for them.  The only thing you can do is single out those whose opinions you don't like and attempt to ostracize them from Guns N Roses' fanbase using whatever your definition of the word "fan" is.

Are you really that clueless? Nowhere did I say they come here because of me. But that's what you had to do. Make it personal. Since you got no case to rest on.



By your logic, any place that has a sign that says Bar should allow anyone in as long as they like to drink. Hey, after all, bars are for drinking and drinkers right?

So by your logic, a bar could not kick out any idiots that disturb their operations.


How about a Guns N' Roses concert?

It doesn't matter what kind of a moron it is, he/she is a fan and can not be evicted. Right?

 


Get a clue. You need to understand that all these GN'R sites aren't listed in your rights.

The sooner you become a bit more humble, the better.

I'll use my restaurant analogy again.  there could be a restaurant that has the absolute greatest food in the world, but, if u consistently get shitty service, food cooked wrong, order wrong, have to wait an hour for your food to come, find a hair in it etc  chances are, u aren't gonna frequent that restaurant even though the food is the greatest.

The reservation is at 8PM so the main course should arrive at 8:10PM at the latest. Otherwise it's LATE.

Also, everything about the food should be just like you specified, no matter if the menu says they don't do what you asked for.

And you have the right to decide who cooks the food too.

And then in the end, you get a $300 meal and pay like a third. But yet you complain because all of the above didn't happen.



/jarmo

[Dayle1066]

I love this site and always visit and I hope to see Axl on tour in the UK this year, but it doesnt change the fact that this IS a GN'R site for all fans of GN'R regardless of how you view them(not that it puts you inthe wrong, your entitled to have a view how this site works).

Anyway, even if you go to a show knowing what Axl can be like, and fully expecting him to go on "late" doesnt make it right to make people wait for so long. Its irrelevant anyway, Axl knows what he does, clearly isnt apologetic for it so its down to the people if they wanna go or not. I dont think its down to anyone to tell someone else to not go and if there are people there shouting for Slash or whatever its down to Axl and the band to shut them up by putting on a great show...

[jarmo]

I love this site and always visit and I hope to see Axl on tour in the UK this year, but it doesnt change the fact that this IS a GN'R site for all fans of GN'R regardless of how you view them(not that it puts you inthe wrong, your entitled to have a view how this site works).

Some concerts are 18+. How can they decide it's not for younger fans? Every fan should have the right to attend according to your logic.






/jarmo

[younggunner]

The sooner you become a bit more humble, the better

The sooner you take your own advice, the better

[SLCPUNK]

The selfish comment is ironic because you're wrong.  When Axl goes on late, he's the selfish one.  Why?  Because your other statement is also wrong.  When thousands of people buy tickets which in turn pay Axl's salary, THEY are his responsibility.  That's his job.  Period.

I do agree that complaining won't change Axl, it certainly never has.  But don't delude yourselves into thinking that everyone has to concur with Axl's tardiness.  And it doesn't make someone any less of a "fan" because they don't agree with everything Axl does.

'round and 'round we go......

The problem with your (and others) argument concerning "goes on late" and "tardiness" is that just because YOU consider it "late" or "tardy" DOES NOT MAKE IT FACT!!!  The tickets people buy indicate that the overall show starts at 8 PM or whatever ..... and I'm pretty sure that that's the time the opening act DOES IN FACT hit the stage.

As far as I know, IN THEIR ENTIRE HISTORY, GNR HAS NEVER GIVEN AN ETA FOR WHEN THEY WOULD HIT THE STAGE!!!

Also, if you check out the history of the time GNR hits the stage, I believe you'll find that it's fairly consistent in proportion to the time the opening act starts.

Just like 'beauty', apparently 'tardiness' is in the eye of the beholder, too.


FACT:  Whatever time GNR does hit the stage, 97% of their 'ticket-buying-bosses' always gives them an "OVERALL OUTSTANDING JOB PERFORMANCE" rating in their evaluations. 

Who cares what their rating are after the performance? It's irrelevant to the argument.

Axl is always late, and that kind of sucks. I have obviously always stuck around, but it would be more considerate to all the people who bought tickets to not leaving them waiting around all night.

[jarmo]

The sooner you become a bit more humble, the better

The sooner you take your own advice, the better

This coming from one of the people who keeps whining about how I choose to run the site. 

By the way, you're one of the last people I take advice from.





/jarmo

[downzy56]

It's quite simple really... If you bought a ticket, you deserve to go and if you didn't like the show afterwards, it's your right to voice your unhappiness.  Now I agree it's a little lame for people to complain about setlists and start times to shows that they weren't even there for.  However, when the show starts at 12:30 on a Wednesday night (now Thursday morning) as it did in Toronto in 2006, I'll bet a vast majority of people who were excited to see GNR (even without Slash and the former members) wouldn't have minded an earlier start time.  I came with fourteen people and left with nine at the conclusion of Paradise City as five of my friends had to leave due to work the next morning or couldn't afford cab fare because the subway system in Toronto shuts down at 1:30.  

People shouldn't have to wait two to three hours for a band to get their asses on stage.  I don't care how "bad-ass" you think Axl and co. are, it's a shitty thing to do and does little help the mood for the rest of the night.  I know how initially people's anger turns into ecstasy when the band finally does come on, but an hour later, after the second or third guitar solo, most people were back in their seats, some making very little noise.  Had it been a Friday or Saturday night, then I'd be a little more empathic to the band, but not on a Wednesday fucking night.  Axl might be a rock star, but the rest of us are not and he should respect that since we are the ones supporting his lifestyle.

Bottom line, I'm taking issue with the shows that I attended because I paid for a ticket.  If you weren't there, you shouldn't complain about those who were and weren't happy about logistical errors.

Cheers,

Andrew