2009 Baseball Season/Off-Season Discussion

[Mal Brossard]

I would have been sooooo pissed if the phils won by 1 run, since Howard never came close to touching the home plate!

It doesn't matter since no one made an attempt to tag Howard out after the ball got by Posada or even appeal the play before the next pitch.  They had two additional chances to tag him out and didn't try either one.

[Loaded NightraiN]

I would have been sooooo pissed if the phils won by 1 run, since Howard never came close to touching the home plate!

It doesn't matter since no one made an attempt to tag Howard out after the ball got by Posada or even appeal the play before the next pitch.  They had two additional chances to tag him out and didn't try either one.

Thank you Tim McCarver, your point?

[tim_m]

I would have been sooooo pissed if the phils won by 1 run, since Howard never came close to touching the home plate!

It doesn't matter since no one made an attempt to tag Howard out after the ball got by Posada or even appeal the play before the next pitch.  They had two additional chances to tag him out and didn't try either one.

Thank you Tim McCarver, your point?

He has none that's his problem!

[Mal Brossard]

My point is that if they had lost by one run, the Yankees would have no one to blame but themselves.

[Loaded NightraiN]

My point is that if they had lost by one run, the Yankees would have no one to blame but themselves.

Yeah, no one said otherwise

[faldor]

I'd love to see a game 7 for obvious reasons.  But it'd be interesting to see how Philly would patch together their pitching staff in that game.  They can't have too much faith in Hamels at this point but I'd guess he'd be the starter.  Happ could start or be ready to go when Cole slips up.  Blanton would be on 3 days rest.  Lee could pitch a few innings out of the pen on 2 days rest I'm sure.

Obviously the Yanks would be all set with CC.  But he wasn't great in game one, and he was even less great last night, so who knows how he'd be pitching on short rest for the 2nd time in a week. 

Of course it all depends on Pedro and the Phils.  Do they have enough to force a game 7?  Burnett obviously wasn't nearly as effective tonight.  Was it the short rest?  How will Pettitte fair on short rest?  All these questions will be answered soon enough.  The Yankees still have a HUGE advantage, but don't give up just yet Phillies fans.

[tim_m]

Anything can happen. Just look at tonight's game. How big those 2 eighth inning homers were. Take those away and maybe we're still playing game 5. This yankees team has NO quit in them. If A-Rod had come up i could see him coming through there. It's gonna be tough for philly to take two in the bronx.

[faldor]

Anything can happen. Just look at tonight's game. How big those 2 eighth inning homers were. Take those away and maybe we're still playing game 5. This yankees team has NO quit in them. If A-Rod had come up i could see him coming through there. It's gonna be tough for philly to take two in the bronx.

You could say the same about the Phillies.  They could've easily had a bit of a letdown after last night's crushing loss.  Of course, there's no time for a letdown when your season is on the line, but still it wasn't the easiest game to bounce back from.  Having Lee on the mound probably helped but after he gave up a run in the first I wasn't liking the looks of things.  Burnett got his retaliation on Victorino (though again I don't think it was intentional) and that set the stage for Utley and for the rest of the game.  Yankees never quite recovered.

A fully rested Pedro vs. Andy on short rest.  Seems like a pretty even matchup on paper as long as Pedro continues pitching the way he has his last 2 starts.  Pedro just never seems to win at the Stadium though in recent years and Pettitte just always wins in these situations.  But, we'll have to see how it plays out.

[tim_m]

Anything can happen. Just look at tonight's game. How big those 2 eighth inning homers were. Take those away and maybe we're still playing game 5. This yankees team has NO quit in them. If A-Rod had come up i could see him coming through there. It's gonna be tough for philly to take two in the bronx.

You could say the same about the Phillies.  They could've easily had a bit of a letdown after last night's crushing loss.  Of course, there's no time for a letdown when your season is on the line, but still it wasn't the easiest game to bounce back from.  Having Lee on the mound probably helped but after he gave up a run in the first I wasn't liking the looks of things.  Burnett got his retaliation on Victorino (though again I don't think it was intentional) and that set the stage for Utley and for the rest of the game.  Yankees never quite recovered.

A fully rested Pedro vs. Andy on short rest.  Seems like a pretty even matchup on paper as long as Pedro continues pitching the way he has his last 2 starts.  Pedro just never seems to win at the Stadium though in recent years and Pettitte just always wins in these situations.  But, we'll have to see how it plays out.

You're right about Pettitte. He just seems to thrive in these situations. He just doesn't seem to know how to lose when its a possible clincher.  He's a winner and his postseason record speaks for itself. The Phils almost had that letdown in the ninth though. I mean what happens if Tex gets on? I think every philly fan collectively would've shit their pants after what he did in games 3 and 4.

[Layne Staley's Sunglasses]

[tim_m]

Weird seeing the original one come down.

[Layne Staley's Sunglasses]

Weird seeing the original one come down.

Those letters belong to one Reggie Jackson.

He's also taking home the black batters eye.

[pilferk]

McCarver is anti-Yankee?  Seriously, you have got to be kidding.  Frankly I find him to be a lot more balanced this season instead of his constant Yankee knob gobbling that we got from him up until the past season or two.

Anti-Yankee?  Maybe not.  Pro Phillies?  To some extent, in this series...then again, McCarver PLAYED for them for 8 or 9 years.  But still...you gotta leave that crap at home.   A good example was the 8th and 9th innings of game 4.  His reaction to the Phillies game tying HR vs his reaction to the Yanks 3 run rally.  VERY different and obvious. 

 When doing his broadcasts, he's usually rooting for "someone"....and I could do without it in a national broadcast. In years past, it's occasionally been the Yanks (but not against the Sox), which I find equally annoying in a national spot.  But it's not reserved for just Yanks games, from what I see (and it's about 90% of them) of the Fox Saturday games.

[pilferk]

 Burnett obviously wasn't nearly as effective tonight.  Was it the short rest?  How will Pettitte fair on short rest?  All these questions will be answered soon enough.  The Yankees still have a HUGE advantage, but don't give up just yet Phillies fans.

Maybe it was short rest...hard to tell.

Honestly, he looked to me JUST like he looked in Anaheim in game 5.  Velocity was the same, and his lack of command was the same...and THAT start was on full rest.  The big difference?  The Phillies offense was better, and actually able to make him pay AFTER the 1st inning.   AJ was able to battle through it in the ALCS game 5, but not last night.  Maybe that was rest...maybe it was just AJ being AJ.  He seems to get easily rattled and I think the Victorino HPB (which I STILL am not conviced was an HPB, but that's no excuse) rattled him.  Combine that with the fact that AJ has NOT been a great pitcher on the road, and has been massively inconsistent...and it may just be that this is a representative series for him:  Great one night, awful the next.  Or maybe it was losing the day of rest.  I don't know.....

And even through all that, the Yanks were able to make a game of it, late.  Jeter hitting into that double play in the 9th was the Rally Killer....and Tex striking out on shit in the dirt was the final nail.

Still, they had chances to tie that game, late, so it's hard to be too discouraged.

Luckily, it was a game the Yanks could afford to lose, up 3-1 going in.  And it's a game that, honestly, you had to think the Phillies had the advantage in anyway.  They're TOO GOOD to get swept at home.  It's been interesting to hear some of the doom and gloom on sports radio this morning.  Largely, they're painting this as a Yanks loss, rather than a good Phillies team winning with their backs against the wall, and I think that's unfair. 

We'll see how game 6 plays out. Again, I like our matchup with Andy (even on short rest) vs Pedro.  Andy can empty the tank in this one, because it'll be the last outing we see from him til at least next year. 

[pilferk]

Burnett got his retaliation on Victorino (though again I don't think it was intentional)

I'm not even convinced it was an actual HBP.

He squared around, hands are ON THE BAT, and look to be IN THE STRIKE ZONE.   He didn't look like he tried to move out of the way of the pitch or pull back the bunt.  That, to me, is incidental contact.

It's no excuse for what came afterwards, for sure.  And it's a close enough call that I'm not going to take issue with it, with the umps.  But THAT CALL, IMHO, is what unravelled AJ, mentally.  I shouldn't, for sure....but that's where it all went south from there.

[pilferk]

You're right about Pettitte. He just seems to thrive in these situations. He just doesn't seem to know how to lose when its a possible clincher.  He's a winner and his postseason record speaks for itself. The Phils almost had that letdown in the ninth though. I mean what happens if Tex gets on? I think every philly fan collectively would've shit their pants after what he did in games 3 and 4.

If you're Manuel, you've gotta be a little concerned about your ability to close out a close game, should it come down to one.

He had a 6 run lead going into the 8th inning....and the Yanks brought the tying run to the plate, twice (Jeter, before the DP and Tex, after Damon's hit).  That can not give him warm fuzzies. 

I suspect the Phililes are thanking the Liberty Bell that Tex decided to play farmer, and bail them out of having to face A-Rod.  They should sent Tex a fruit basket.

[pilferk]

Anything can happen. Just look at tonight's game. How big those 2 eighth inning homers were. Take those away and maybe we're still playing game 5. This yankees team has NO quit in them. If A-Rod had come up i could see him coming through there. It's gonna be tough for philly to take two in the bronx.

I thought the same thing, as Coke was giving them up.  He's prone to giving up the long ball and when I saw those 2 HR's....I'm thinking "I bet Girardi thinks those are meaningless...but I bet they come back to haunt the Yanks".  Sure enough.

The bullpen actually did pretty well last night, with the exception of Coke.  That's encouraging, all things considered.  Hughes actually looked competent last night.

[faldor]

Burnett got his retaliation on Victorino (though again I don't think it was intentional)

I'm not even convinced it was an actual HBP.

He squared around, hands are ON THE BAT, and look to be IN THE STRIKE ZONE.   He didn't look like he tried to move out of the way of the pitch or pull back the bunt.  That, to me, is incidental contact.

It's no excuse for what came afterwards, for sure.  And it's a close enough call that I'm not going to take issue with it, with the umps.  But THAT CALL, IMHO, is what unravelled AJ, mentally.  I shouldn't, for sure....but that's where it all went south from there.

I agree to a point.  I also question whether it should've been called a HBP, as Victorino didn't really have time to try and get out of the way.  But the ball didn't hit him in the strike zone.  It was clearly inside and hit his right hand, which was closest to his body.  I think the right call was made, but if they ruled he didn't get out of the way and the hand is a part of the bat, I wouldn't have been surprised.

[pilferk]

If it was inside, it was close enough to the strike zone that the "hand is part of the bat" paradigm should have held up:



To me, he looks like he's CLEARLY squared around to bunt (I just wish I coulf find a better pic that showed where the plate is).  I've seen DOZENS of hitters foul balls off their hands, both swinging and bunting...and it's never called a HBP.  I think they got it wrong...but again:  This wasn't "obviously bad", so it's hard to fault the ump.

Again, it shouldn't have mattered.  It put 2 on, with no out....and mabye it should have led to a "cheap" run for the Phillies.

It should not have lead to 3.  AJ just crumpled when it was called a HBP...his night was functionally over, right there.  That's 100% on AJ.

[Falcon]

Kind of what I expected last night..

Quick takes..

Utley maybe the best player on either side, he's running away with the MVP poll on Dan Patrick this morning although I'd go with Jeter or Mo if the Yanks take care of biz..

Ibanez should be removed for defensive purposes late innings, shoulda had ARod's last er...um...."hit"..

Victorino looked clearly squared to bunt to me...

The Yanks never "go quietly", they could have packed bags after the Phils got the add on runs late but didn't..

We're set up for some great baseball theatre tomorrow..