Chinese Democracy (Album) - Charting

[Spirit]

Chinese Democracy goes for ?2.99 on Play.com right now...

Not necessary a bad thing, 'cause it wasn't on the top-seller list yesterday, but today it's #49 


http://www.play.com/Music/CD/6-/TopSellers.html


Also making an entry to the all-time top 100 at #99

[plissken2013]

Sales of the latest Pearl jam album, already disappointing during the first week, sunk. The first week sales of the new Alice in chains album are, to say the least, disappointing:

http://www.mediatraffic.de/albums.htm

Those are supposed to be the WORLDWIDE sales!!!!

Those two bands are not despised by most of the press, like GN'R, they put out videos, interviews, and toured.

GN'R, although having had (let's be frank), disappointing sales (I guess Chinese democracy stands now at about 3 million copies sold, including all the non sold copies "given" to Best Buy), still beat the sales of those two bands...without a single video, with lots of bad press, with only two small interviews of Axl and without a single show.

It seems that Chinese democracy isn't the failure a lot of people say, after all...

The bolded portion is false.  Sales only include those at retail outlets to consumers, not TO retail outlets.

Ali

Really? Because if you go to that site and check the Chinese democracy sales from day 1 to its disappearance from the world charts, it seems "my" numbers are correct: they were off the world charts having sold "only" like 1.8 M copies...

There's no chance at all that they could have sold since then like 1 M copies worldwide: Chinese democracy's last week sales on its last week on the world charts (february 14): 31'000. It never came back on those charts, and it pretty doubtful they maintain sales of 30'000 for months! If you don't count all the CDs staying on the Best Buy shelves, Chinese democracy has been sold between 2 and 2,5 M copies worldwide, not much more. Not so bad, when you compare it to other bands, like I've said.

[Ali]

Sales of the latest Pearl jam album, already disappointing during the first week, sunk. The first week sales of the new Alice in chains album are, to say the least, disappointing:

http://www.mediatraffic.de/albums.htm

Those are supposed to be the WORLDWIDE sales!!!!

Those two bands are not despised by most of the press, like GN'R, they put out videos, interviews, and toured.

GN'R, although having had (let's be frank), disappointing sales (I guess Chinese democracy stands now at about 3 million copies sold, including all the non sold copies "given" to Best Buy), still beat the sales of those two bands...without a single video, with lots of bad press, with only two small interviews of Axl and without a single show.

It seems that Chinese democracy isn't the failure a lot of people say, after all...

The bolded portion is false.  Sales only include those at retail outlets to consumers, not TO retail outlets.

Ali

Really? Because if you go to that site and check the Chinese democracy sales from day 1 to its disappearance from the world charts, it seems "my" numbers are correct: they were off the world charts having sold "only" like 1.8 M copies...

There's no chance at all that they could have sold since then like 1 M copies worldwide: Chinese democracy's last week sales on its last week on the world charts (february 14): 31'000. It never came back on those charts, and it pretty doubtful they maintain sales of 30'000 for months! If you don't count all the CDs staying on the Best Buy shelves, Chinese democracy has been sold between 2 and 2,5 M copies worldwide, not much more. Not so bad, when you compare it to other bands, like I've said.

The problem is that you are assuming that site is accurate and absolute.  It is not.  It is just an estimate.  It is not official.  The only official estimate of worldwide sales position is from IFPI.  GN'R during the last month of 2008 outsold Britney Spears, Nickelback and other artists that you might not think they did outsell.  They ended up #14 on the worldwide sales chart for 2008.

Ali

[Loaded NightraiN]

Sales of the latest Pearl jam album, already disappointing during the first week, sunk. The first week sales of the new Alice in chains album are, to say the least, disappointing:

http://www.mediatraffic.de/albums.htm

Those are supposed to be the WORLDWIDE sales!!!!

Those two bands are not despised by most of the press, like GN'R, they put out videos, interviews, and toured.

GN'R, although having had (let's be frank), disappointing sales (I guess Chinese democracy stands now at about 3 million copies sold, including all the non sold copies "given" to Best Buy), still beat the sales of those two bands...without a single video, with lots of bad press, with only two small interviews of Axl and without a single show.

It seems that Chinese democracy isn't the failure a lot of people say, after all...

The bolded portion is false.  Sales only include those at retail outlets to consumers, not TO retail outlets.

Ali

Really? Because if you go to that site and check the Chinese democracy sales from day 1 to its disappearance from the world charts, it seems "my" numbers are correct: they were off the world charts having sold "only" like 1.8 M copies...

There's no chance at all that they could have sold since then like 1 M copies worldwide: Chinese democracy's last week sales on its last week on the world charts (february 14): 31'000. It never came back on those charts, and it pretty doubtful they maintain sales of 30'000 for months! If you don't count all the CDs staying on the Best Buy shelves, Chinese democracy has been sold between 2 and 2,5 M copies worldwide, not much more. Not so bad, when you compare it to other bands, like I've said.

The problem is that you are assuming that site is accurate and absolute.  It is not.  It is just an estimate.  It is not official.  The only official estimate of worldwide sales position is from IFPI.  GN'R during the last month of 2008 outsold Britney Spears, Nickelback and other artists that you might not think they did outsell.  They ended up #14 on the worldwide sales chart for 2008.

Ali

That was for CD(alone) if im not mistaken... Not bad for 5 weeks of availability i'd say

[Ali]

Yes, I was referring to CD by itself, not total sales per artist.

Ali

[plissken2013]

I agree, those are estimations. But the fact is that if you compare the sales of Chinese democracy to those of the latest Metallica, AC/DC, U2 and The killers, for examples, GN'R sales have been behind those of those artists (in the cases of Metallica and even more AC/DC, FAR BEHIND). So, as long as somebody gives the official IFPI numbers, like you say, I'll stick firmly with "my" numbers: between 2 and 2,5 millions copies sold (not counting those sold to Best Buy).

Not that bad, not that bad, that was just my point...

[ppbebe]

http://www.ifpi.org/content/library/top50-2008.pdf

and according to billboard.com on 06 February 

"But the album has sold 2.6 million copies worldwide, according to Universal -- a number that counts only retail purchases "

more than 8 months ago.

[Ali]

I agree, those are estimations. But the fact is that if you compare the sales of Chinese democracy to those of the latest Metallica, AC/DC, U2 and The killers, for examples, GN'R sales have been behind those of those artists (in the cases of Metallica and even more AC/DC, FAR BEHIND). So, as long as somebody gives the official IFPI numbers, like you say, I'll stick firmly with "my" numbers: between 2 and 2,5 millions copies sold (not counting those sold to Best Buy).

Not that bad, not that bad, that was just my point...

I hate to break it to you, but when mentioning sales, only those sold to consumers are ever referenced and counted.  Soundscan works when a CD is scanned at a checkout booth, it racks up as a sale for a particular artist.  That wouldn't work for those shipped to retail outlets.  Not to be rude, but you or anyone else who thinks the total sold includes those sold to Best Buy, is flat out wrong.

Ali

[HBK]

http://www.ifpi.org/content/library/top50-2008.pdf

and according to billboard.com on 06 February 

"But the album has sold 2.6 million copies worldwide, according to Universal -- a number that counts only retail purchases "

more than 8 months ago.

Woldwide...

In USA.. 572.000

[plissken2013]

I agree, those are estimations. But the fact is that if you compare the sales of Chinese democracy to those of the latest Metallica, AC/DC, U2 and The killers, for examples, GN'R sales have been behind those of those artists (in the cases of Metallica and even more AC/DC, FAR BEHIND). So, as long as somebody gives the official IFPI numbers, like you say, I'll stick firmly with "my" numbers: between 2 and 2,5 millions copies sold (not counting those sold to Best Buy).

Not that bad, not that bad, that was just my point...

I hate to break it to you, but when mentioning sales, only those sold to consumers are ever referenced and counted.  Soundscan works when a CD is scanned at a checkout booth, it racks up as a sale for a particular artist.  That wouldn't work for those shipped to retail outlets.  Not to be rude, but you or anyone else who thinks the total sold includes those sold to Best Buy, is flat out wrong.

Ali

Read my posts again if you want: I KNOW there's a difference between CDs sold to consumers like me and you and CDs shipped to retailers.

That's why sales of Chinese democracy are between 2 and 2,5 million copies SOLD worldwide, I mean that's what I think.

Sorry if I don't believe in what Universal says about the sales of Chinese democracy...

Can't read now the ifpi document, does it say the same thing as billboard? If that's so, well, OK, that would (could?) mean about 2,8 - 3 million copies have been sold by now.

[Ali]

I agree, those are estimations. But the fact is that if you compare the sales of Chinese democracy to those of the latest Metallica, AC/DC, U2 and The killers, for examples, GN'R sales have been behind those of those artists (in the cases of Metallica and even more AC/DC, FAR BEHIND). So, as long as somebody gives the official IFPI numbers, like you say, I'll stick firmly with "my" numbers: between 2 and 2,5 millions copies sold (not counting those sold to Best Buy).

Not that bad, not that bad, that was just my point...

I hate to break it to you, but when mentioning sales, only those sold to consumers are ever referenced and counted.  Soundscan works when a CD is scanned at a checkout booth, it racks up as a sale for a particular artist.  That wouldn't work for those shipped to retail outlets.  Not to be rude, but you or anyone else who thinks the total sold includes those sold to Best Buy, is flat out wrong.

Ali

Read my posts again if you want: I KNOW there's a difference between CDs sold to consumers like me and you and CDs shipped to retailers.

That's why sales of Chinese democracy are between 2 and 2,5 million copies SOLD worldwide, I mean that's what I think.

Sorry if I don't believe in what Universal says about the sales of Chinese democracy...

Can't read now the ifpi document, does it say the same thing as billboard? If that's so, well, OK, that would (could?) mean about 2,8 - 3 million copies have been sold by now.

Apparently, you don't know the difference.  Perhaps you should go back and read ppbebe's post, especially the italicized portion.  Unless, you have reason, not just cynicism, to doubt Universal, the sales in February were 2.6 million worldwide and the sales as of now, are 3.2  million worlwide (according to the NY Daily News, not Universal by the way).

Ali

[younggunner]

chart this.....

CD is brilliant

[russtcb]

chart this.....

CD is brilliant

Word.

I don't get why so many people seem so serious about proving or disproving sales numbers for this album.

[plissken2013]

I agree, those are estimations. But the fact is that if you compare the sales of Chinese democracy to those of the latest Metallica, AC/DC, U2 and The killers, for examples, GN'R sales have been behind those of those artists (in the cases of Metallica and even more AC/DC, FAR BEHIND). So, as long as somebody gives the official IFPI numbers, like you say, I'll stick firmly with "my" numbers: between 2 and 2,5 millions copies sold (not counting those sold to Best Buy).

Not that bad, not that bad, that was just my point...

I hate to break it to you, but when mentioning sales, only those sold to consumers are ever referenced and counted.  Soundscan works when a CD is scanned at a checkout booth, it racks up as a sale for a particular artist.  That wouldn't work for those shipped to retail outlets.  Not to be rude, but you or anyone else who thinks the total sold includes those sold to Best Buy, is flat out wrong.

Ali

Read my posts again if you want: I KNOW there's a difference between CDs sold to consumers like me and you and CDs shipped to retailers.

That's why sales of Chinese democracy are between 2 and 2,5 million copies SOLD worldwide, I mean that's what I think.

Sorry if I don't believe in what Universal says about the sales of Chinese democracy...

Can't read now the ifpi document, does it say the same thing as billboard? If that's so, well, OK, that would (could?) mean about 2,8 - 3 million copies have been sold by now.

Apparently, you don't know the difference.  Perhaps you should go back and read ppbebe's post, especially the italicized portion.  Unless, you have reason, not just cynicism, to doubt Universal, the sales in February were 2.6 million worldwide and the sales as of now, are 3.2  million worlwide (according to the NY Daily News, not Universal by the way).

Ali

Apparently I fuckin' know the difference, that's why I've given TWO different numbers. I'm not saying "my" numbers are THE truth, I'm just thinking they are true...well, let's say closer to the truth than other numbers I've read on this board. That's all, OK? Do I have the right to think that way? And I couldn't care less about what the NY Daily News says (an authority on worldwide CD sales, I presume?), so...

Cynicism against a big corporation like Universal, Sony, and Co? Oh, come one, we all know those people ALWAYS tell the truth!

I you wanna continue to argue, that's fine with me (I'm pretty good at that, that's part of my job), but by PM, not to bore the rest of this forum members.

I'll stick with the MAIN point of my first point: Comparerd to other bands whose latest CD has been given much more promotion (Pearl jam, Alice in chains, Bruce Springsteen, etc.), Chinese democracy hasn't been the commercial failure a lot of people tend to describe...

P.S.: some guy looked at my GN'R t-shirt two or three weeks ago, and told me something like "Oh, I see, the album is out, isn't it?". I told him CD has been out since November 2008. He laughed when I said "Well, lots of promotion for that album, don't you think?". And he sure doesn't live in a cave...

[Ali]

I agree, those are estimations. But the fact is that if you compare the sales of Chinese democracy to those of the latest Metallica, AC/DC, U2 and The killers, for examples, GN'R sales have been behind those of those artists (in the cases of Metallica and even more AC/DC, FAR BEHIND). So, as long as somebody gives the official IFPI numbers, like you say, I'll stick firmly with "my" numbers: between 2 and 2,5 millions copies sold (not counting those sold to Best Buy).

Not that bad, not that bad, that was just my point...

I hate to break it to you, but when mentioning sales, only those sold to consumers are ever referenced and counted.  Soundscan works when a CD is scanned at a checkout booth, it racks up as a sale for a particular artist.  That wouldn't work for those shipped to retail outlets.  Not to be rude, but you or anyone else who thinks the total sold includes those sold to Best Buy, is flat out wrong.

Ali

Read my posts again if you want: I KNOW there's a difference between CDs sold to consumers like me and you and CDs shipped to retailers.

That's why sales of Chinese democracy are between 2 and 2,5 million copies SOLD worldwide, I mean that's what I think.

Sorry if I don't believe in what Universal says about the sales of Chinese democracy...

Can't read now the ifpi document, does it say the same thing as billboard? If that's so, well, OK, that would (could?) mean about 2,8 - 3 million copies have been sold by now.

Apparently, you don't know the difference.  Perhaps you should go back and read ppbebe's post, especially the italicized portion.  Unless, you have reason, not just cynicism, to doubt Universal, the sales in February were 2.6 million worldwide and the sales as of now, are 3.2  million worlwide (according to the NY Daily News, not Universal by the way).

Ali

Apparently I fuckin' know the difference, that's why I've given TWO different numbers. I'm not saying "my" numbers are THE truth, I'm just thinking they are true...well, let's say closer to the truth than other numbers I've read on this board. That's all, OK? Do I have the right to think that way? And I couldn't care less about what the NY Daily News says (an authority on worldwide CD sales, I presume?), so...

Cynicism against a big corporation like Universal, Sony, and Co? Oh, come one, we all know those people ALWAYS tell the truth!

I you wanna continue to argue, that's fine with me (I'm pretty good at that, that's part of my job), but by PM, not to bore the rest of this forum members.

I'll stick with the MAIN point of my first point: Comparerd to other bands whose latest CD has been given much more promotion (Pearl jam, Alice in chains, Bruce Springsteen, etc.), Chinese democracy hasn't been the commercial failure a lot of people tend to describe...

P.S.: some guy looked at my GN'R t-shirt two or three weeks ago, and told me something like "Oh, I see, the album is out, isn't it?". I told him CD has been out since November 2008. He laughed when I said "Well, lots of promotion for that album, don't you think?". And he sure doesn't live in a cave...

You misunderstand me.  I don't blame you for being cynical of  big corporations, but  cynicism alone isn't a valid counterpoint.  Sure, Universal may lie to inflate the sales numbers.  But, they would also know better than anyone exactly how many albums their artists have sold.  If one were to follow that path of cynicism then no artists overall sales figures can be believed because all labels have a predisposition towards making themselves look better by inflating sales numbers.

And with that, I will agree with Youngguner's point that CD is a great album.  That's all that really matters.

Ali

[Jdog0830]

The important thing for me is that Chinese democracy is great and Pearl jam Backspacer is great i guess times change albums dont sell like they used to and these 2 bands will never be considered "cool" like they once were. I personally dont give a fuck. New Pearl Jam new Alice in Chains and GnR about to step out on stage again lifes good

I blame the rise of Rap

[CheapJon]

The important thing for me is that Chinese democracy is great and Pearl jam Backspacer is great i guess times change albums dont sell like they used to and these 2 bands will never be considered "cool" like they once were. I personally dont give a fuck. New Pearl Jam new Alice in Chains and GnR about to step out on stage again lifes good

I blame the rise of Rap

I blame Terrance and Phillip, them and Canada! 

[robd788]

Bon Jovis new one went to no1 last week with only 165 000 sold.  Now supposedly one of the biggest bands in the world.  These figures from last year dont see so bad now lol

[russtcb]

Bon Jovis new one went to no1 last week with only 165 000 sold.  Now supposedly one of the biggest bands in the world.  These figures from last year dont see so bad now lol

Now here's a great comparison point; Bon Jovi has done everything GNR "should do" (according to many over the last year). They tour, they've been on talk shows morning noon and night, they've got videos out. their single is in several commercials, they even have a new documentary out.... and look at the sales numbers compared to Chinese.... interesting.

[faldor]

Bon Jovis new one went to no1 last week with only 165 000 sold.  Now supposedly one of the biggest bands in the world.  These figures from last year dont see so bad now lol

Now here's a great comparison point; Bon Jovi has done everything GNR "should do" (according to many over the last year). They tour, they've been on talk shows morning noon and night, they've got videos out. their single is in several commercials, they even have a new documentary out.... and look at the sales numbers compared to Chinese.... interesting.

It's all relative though.  Sales are WAY down, even over the last year.  But it is clear, sales for CD were actually quite good out of the gate.  Afterwards, not so much.  But that's the case for most albums.  Maybe touring will do some good, but I'm not expecting it.  People just aren't buying albums these days.