Chinese Democracy (Album) - Charting

[acompleteunknown]

The big difference between Black Ice and ChiDem is that with Black Ice...you can listen to 30 seconds of a song and get it.  with Chinese Democracy...you can't get a real grasp of a song without listening to the whole thing.  And each song on the album is completely different.  So unless you sit down and listen to the entire album...you can't really comprehend how musically expansive it is.  nothing wrong with ACDC or the simple 3-chord progressions.  But when it comes to shelling out sound bytes of the songs...ACDC is simpler to grasp.  Wheras I think Chi Dem appeals to a more mature ear.  Chi Dem is more like a Pink Floyd record, imagine trying to get a feel for Animals by listening to 30-second clips.

[ShotgunBlues1978]

Just for clarification, the MySpace thing includes worldwide listens

And CD has sold about as many copies worldwide as the previous MySpace record holder, which came out the week before CD

[GnR-NOW]

The songs on CD are deep,  well written songs.  They are not quick hitting rock songs with a catchy bullshit theme that they play over and over on the radio.

[Dr. Blutarsky]

imagine trying to get a feel for Animals by listening to 30-second clips.

Ha! That would be impossible.

Great album, one of my favorites.


RE the Promotion of it - - it has done very well worldwide.  Considering all the factors sounds like Axl is OK with sales #'s so far - I think he said he was humbled on how well it had sold considering the circumstances and after he gave it to the record co. his ideas of the promotion were thrown out the window by the record co. - I think Axl said it best : "Ask yourself why I would choose to prostitute myself to live with fortune and shame."

[ppbebe]

Take it easy man, the guy is allowed to differ. AIt's a matter of taste.

that's why we'd love to know what album he thinks is better than this. and stunk what's average about the guitars?

That's not what i meant. I meant just the guitars alone on this album would make me say it's better than an average good album.


Which is kind of my point. There are guitar parts on this album that some other bands wouldn't be able to replicate if they wanted to. Nevermind when you consider all other factors from orchestras to synths to vocals to production - it's just all of high quality. It's one thing to say subjectively that you prefer one type of music or another, or to say that one album has hit a higher artistic note.... but to try and say something objective and to say that "musically" this album wasn't at the very top this year is a big leap.

get it and totally agree. 
really what album can beat this one musically, i wonder.

[mrarkadin]

The big difference between Black Ice and ChiDem is that with Black Ice...you can listen to 30 seconds of a song and get it.  with Chinese Democracy...you can't get a real grasp of a song without listening to the whole thing.  And each song on the album is completely different.  So unless you sit down and listen to the entire album...you can't really comprehend how musically expansive it is.  nothing wrong with ACDC or the simple 3-chord progressions.  But when it comes to shelling out sound bytes of the songs...ACDC is simpler to grasp.  Wheras I think Chi Dem appeals to a more mature ear.  Chi Dem is more like a Pink Floyd record, imagine trying to get a feel for Animals by listening to 30-second clips.

That's true--especially with Rock N Roll Train being such a catchy fun song. I think the AC/DC promotion was the best ever conceived. I haven't wanted to buy an AC/DC album in 13 years but I bought Black Ice because of the hype bubbling. I listened to the entire album once and rate it somewhere along with the other 80s AC/DC records I could care less about.

[GeraldFord]

Six months from now, after a few more singles a tour(?) etc, let's see where we are...

[Sweet]

Ok let me understand this, if an album doesnt sell shitloads of copies in the next two weeks after it came out then it sucks? Its that a proven documented fact? or did some of you just came out of nowhere with such a brilliant conclusion?

Its incredible how 'short' is some people's mind.   

[western_chaos]

Yeah, a lot of people in the g'nr community pretend to know facts when it actuality they are just promoting their opinions. 

[lennonisgod]

I've never been one to really care about album sales...

We have our album and for some reason that just isn't enough for some of you. Sure, album sales do matter to a point... but that has shit to do with quality of the material. A million copies sold in the first week would have made us all happy but it didn't happen. So, let's just shut the fuck up about it and move on.

With that said, the album still has plenty of time (forever actually) to sell more copies... we have more singles coming and hopefully a tour. All of those things help. Who knows what can happen?? It's been said a thousand times before, but AFD didn't hit #1 on the chart until a year after it was already out. Of course these are TOTALLY DIFFERENT times now with the internet and downloading, but anything can happen. Just be happy we have a great fucking album with another one on the way in the next year or two.

[mr. moustache]

The reason I say you're blind to music is you think nothing even comes close to CD so there's no way someone could prefer somethign different. Records I like more:

portishead - third - Best comeback of 2008, better than their earlier albums if I do say so myself. The tension on silence is better than anything on cd. The perfect sounds of hunter and the rip are also better.

Beck - Modern Guilt - really an awesome collection of beck tunes, he's taken his last 3 records and taken what's best about them put in to one sweet sweet album.

MGMT - Oracular Spectacular - It's like the 60's psychedelic for the new millennium, really nothing else like it right now

why? - alopecia - I know this won't go over well here, this is a classic rock forum really. But I like it much much more than cd. Absolutly nothing like it

Keep in mind these are opinions, I'm just proving a point that you shouldnt be ripping up prez because he thinks its an average album.

See, this shows what little you know. I like MGMT. That is indeed a great album. I played the fuck out of it earlier in the summer. Look man. I am sampling some of why? - alopecia as I type this. Pretty cool actually. See this is partly why I asked. I am always open to new things. Well, maybe not gay sex, not that there is anything wrong with that. I used to like Beck a lot. The whole Xenu thing is a turn off though. I will check this out as well but, I haven't really dug his last few and the Information got old for me quick. portishead - third. That is trippy as shit. I like it a lot.

Anyway, I respect you man. I respect you a lot more now then I did, and I sure as shit respect you more then the other dude who threw things out and backed his comments up.

... but saying that, yea there's no way someone could prefer these over Chinese motherfucking Democracy. Fucking crazy talk  

much respect man, I didn't expect that reply at all! hah

[Methanol]

Of course the quality doesn't have anything to do with the sales now that CD is not doing so well. If it was selling shitloads it would naturally just prove the tremendous quality of the album.

How original.

And when it didn't sell millions in its first week, that's your "proof" that nobody cares.

If it had sold all that, you would've just said it's because of the name and not about the quality.

So either way, you "win".


Since you're a fan of Izzy, I guess his albums must really suck since nobody buys them?

/jarmo

Well, none of Izzy's album were actually self hyped as "most anticipated album ever"... In that perspective and comparing to other Guns N Rises albums the only realistic word we can use is flop when it comes to sales. There's no way or need to hide it and pretend something else.

Could it simply be that outside the GNR fanbase people don't really care anymore about Guns N Roses?

[Gunner80]

Of course the quality doesn't have anything to do with the sales now that CD is not doing so well. If it was selling shitloads it would naturally just prove the tremendous quality of the album.

How original.

And when it didn't sell millions in its first week, that's your "proof" that nobody cares.

If it had sold all that, you would've just said it's because of the name and not about the quality.

So either way, you "win".


Since you're a fan of Izzy, I guess his albums must really suck since nobody buys them?

/jarmo

Well, none of Izzy's album were actually self hyped as "most anticipated album ever"... In that perspective and comparing to other Guns N Rises albums the only realistic word we can use is flop when it comes to sales. There's no way or need to hide it and pretend something else.

Could it simply be that outside the GNR fanbase people don't really care anymore about Guns N Roses?

And would that be a bad thing? I mean we got one of the greatest records ever put out and this is all some people can talk about.

GN'R aren't the biggest band anymore. 

[Continental Drift]

Of course the quality doesn't have anything to do with the sales now that CD is not doing so well. If it was selling shitloads it would naturally just prove the tremendous quality of the album.

How original.

And when it didn't sell millions in its first week, that's your "proof" that nobody cares.

If it had sold all that, you would've just said it's because of the name and not about the quality.

So either way, you "win".


Since you're a fan of Izzy, I guess his albums must really suck since nobody buys them?

/jarmo

Well, none of Izzy's album were actually self hyped as "most anticipated album ever"... In that perspective and comparing to other Guns N Rises albums the only realistic word we can use is flop when it comes to sales. There's no way or need to hide it and pretend something else.

Could it simply be that outside the GNR fanbase people don't really care anymore about Guns N Roses?

Or they care more than some other people realize. I saw some haters on Metal Sludge and the like seriously predicting that Chinese Democracy would sell 95,000 copies TOTAL.

The point is this is a completely unprecedented type of release (15 year delay, substantial line-up changes, breathtaking changes in downloading technology in the interim, decline of rock and rise of hip hop, etc.) and we're all speculating out of our asses now...

We'll know more about the true demand for this release and GN'R generally in the US once it's widely available and Guns do whatever they're going to do in 2009 in the way of promotion, videos, interviews and tours.

I'm personally not sure what the final result will be... it may very well NOT be the mass hysteria that surrounded the Illusions Era- very few bands EVER get the privilege to experience something like that- much less twice in the same career- BUT when the dust settles- I think Axl and GN'R (despite all the challenges and obstacles) will be shown to STILL have a substantial US following and a VERY rabid international fanbase  to boot.... and as a recording artist... that's more than enough IMHO.

[The Prez]

"Chinese Democracy is an average good album (musically)" - The Prez

Wow.

There is nothing average about Chinese Democracy. Look. You threw that out there. You made it not just about sales. I think your choice of words is disturbing. You throw something like that out, crazy talk, then you should expect to get flamed. Unless of course that is what you wanted. I figure you do with the lame condescending use of  .

If you thin that CD is average (I personally think its the best music in the last 15 year), please tell us what album you think is better. Don't dodge this Prez. You threw it out there not back your shit up. What album came out this year that is better, in your opinion? I bet you are not going to answer. You made this personal.
 

Black Ice is a better (comeback) album.

[The Prez]

Dude I just got done tripping out to it then came on here before getting ready to go and I read that. Good fine its his opinion and everyone has a right to there opinion opinions are like assholes blah blah blah. Fucking PC horseshit for this now overly pussified generation.

I think his opinion sucks. I want him to back up his words. You call CD average then say what has been better. You really aren't interested to hear what album, that came out this year, someone thinks is better then Chinese Democracy? The album is, and righfully so, beloved here. Someone can't just throw a comment like that out and not expect to have to respond to it. I mean they can, but it would be awefully suspicious. I am calling him on it. I am also not the only one. I didn't come here looking for a fight but, those were fighting words  .

I will even say more Mister Buddha (strange nick for a person who talks that way...): I don't compare CD to what's out there NOW, I just say that it is an average good album. There many many records made and still be made which are and will be better. I like CD as I already stated but most rock listeners don't.

So in your opninion, if someone says that CD is just an average good album and nothing more, shouldn't post that here? Eventhough the person as such likes the album?
'average good' is not equal to bad!! It seems you do not understand that. Evenmore, what the fuck is wrong with the fact someone likes the album but not as much as you do apparently!?

[NicoRourke]

Average 

What is a good album for you then ?

[The Prez]

I respect you a lot more now then I did, and I sure as shit respect you more then the other dude who threw things out and backed his comments up.

... but saying that, yea there's no way someone could prefer these over Chinese motherfucking Democracy. Fucking crazy talk  

What the fuck is wrong with you Buddha!? First of all, when I do not answer, that's because I'm not online. I have a life...  
The fact you find CD the best album out there, great for you. I don't.

I find the following this year released albums better (and this without sales figures in mind):
MGMT, Black Ice, The Bronx, 4:13 Dream, 'Berlin, Live at St. Ann's Warehouse', Off with Their Heads, Tell Tale Signs, 'I Started Out with Nothing and I still Got Most of It Left' (>> really really great album!), Only by the Night

And ofcourse you, and probably most of you, will find CD better. I respect that. But that's a matter of taste.
It's not because I like another album more, that Guns is not my fav band and that I don't like CD...because I do.

[carmiedisco12]

Radiohead Ok computer is better, arguably Hail to the thief also.
Id rate the newest ...The Verve album on par with CD....maybe even higher (CD has a greater range and variety...whereas I feel The Verve shit on songs like Madagascar, in a similar vein)
Nick Cave Let Love In
Arguably various lesser know albums / bands - depending on taste....but there are numerous brilliant massively original albums out there by barely known acts if u have an open mind and willing to get out of the cocoon. Remember The velvet Underground and various other artists were not commercially huge acts but released groundbreaking music at the time....if u look there are similar artists now. Too many people on here are so musically close minded.
Personally Id rate The Strokes last album above CD.....for me its the most genuine raw and brilliant pure rock album since AFD.

That said CD is an excellent album, worthy of the GNR name.....for my personal tastes I feel it is overproduced in parts , and the production on IRS and TWAT is a mystery....both sound muffled and strange??, like demo's when compared to the production on the title track......and the rock songs whilst very well played/recorded really are very average 'songs'

[The Prez]

Also, the fact that some people defend CD because of the high quality of the guitars and other technical stuff I can understand, but the fact an album is good or not, is not a matter about the 'technical difficulty' but about the music.
And again, I like CD but clearly not as much as most here. I still find it my 'average good album'