Chinese Democracy (Album) - Charting

[Thorned Rose]

So is the U.S. debut out yet?

I'm really hoping for a #1

[acompleteunknown]

Best Buy really hasn't done that good of a job promoting the album.  I went to two different Best Buys and both of them had the standee hidden deep in the CD section rather up front by the entrance.  And in the Sunday paper...there was only a mention of the album rather than having a giant spread.  Instead they were giving a lot of space to Kung fu Panda.  I asked a guy working there on Tuesday how the album was selling and he said that he only sold 2 copies the entire day on monday...and went onto say that a lot of people don't even know it's out.   Customers would get up to the counter and ask when the album was coming out...when they found out it was already out...they didn't want to get out of line to go find a copy.  The store's focus the week of Thanksgiving was on the electronic merchandise...media purchases fell by the side.

But it wasn't just GNR....  Linkin Park released a new album of b-sides and rare tracks exclusively for Best Buy.  And I found a copy hidden on the racks.  There wasn't even a single bit of promotion for it.

[demanding_GNR_rock]

Lets just face up to the fact that possibly the best album in a decade has been let down by a shitty marketing campaign. Its alright saying the music will speak for itself, in a world not controlled by media it would but unfortunately as rankings are showing it dosn't. Is alright saying peoples have moved on to rap/hipity hop etc but the fact is people will buy what they are told to buy and they wernt told to buy CD. Why? Money most probably the reason the whole world is screwed  and the reason GNR got screwed. 

[Bitch Slap Rappin]

#1 This Week  Hot Mainstream Rock Tracks
AC/DC
Rock N Roll Train   
Columbia

2Apocalyptica Featuring Adam Gontier 
I Don't Care         20-20/Jive   |  Zomba

3   
Metallica 
The Day That Never Comes
    
4   
Shinedown 
Second Chance
Atlantic

5   
Disturbed 
Indestructible
Reprise

6      
Mudvayne
Do What You Do
Epic

7      
Guns N' Roses 
Chinese Democracy
Black Frog/Geffen   |  Interscope


Give it some time..........I know this is a hot singles chart.  The other groups/artists cd have been out for awhile now.......: )

[Billo]

CD is going well i think considering there has been no new video and no interview from AXL..these 2 things would really help sales.

[falungong69]

if axl's managers engineered the best buy and myspace plans, then maybe he should sue them for fucking up the monumental release.  i mean, if you hired the two best surgeons in the world to perform a life saving operation, and they killed you, wouldn't you want to sue them?  this is bullshit.  i mean, if dr. pepper can get sued for their hand in fucking this up, then i want best buy and the managers and the record company's heads on a plate too.  the biggest loser in all this isn't even axl or the fans -- it's the music world.  we NEED great music out there to inpsire us and stop stupid rap music.  this whole situation is seriously fucked.

[LunsJail]

if axl's managers engineered the best buy and myspace plans, then maybe he should sue them for fucking up the monumental release.  i mean, if you hired the two best surgeons in the world to perform a life saving operation, and they killed you, wouldn't you want to sue them?  this is bullshit.  i mean, if dr. pepper can get sued for their hand in fucking this up, then i want best buy and the managers and the record company's heads on a plate too. 

Look, we don't know what kind of promotion Best Buy agreed to.  That's really the band and the record company's job anyways. BB agreed to buy a certain amount of copies and did that.  Who knows, without Best Buy we may not even have this album in our hands.

As far as management and the record company, what else could they have done?  How many times do you see a commercial on prime time TV promoting an album? There is only so much you can do with zero band involvement.

[Allman]

frm Hitsdailydouble.com building album charts, 37.1% in:

LW TW artist / albumpower index
--    1 KANYE WEST 808S & HEARTBREAK 223,643
--    2 GUNS N' ROSES  CHINESE DEMOCRACY  148,183
4    3 TAYLOR SWIFT FEARLESS  128,291

[axl2]

frm Hitsdailydouble.com building album charts, 37.1% in:

LW TW artist / albumpower index
--    1 KANYE WEST 808S & HEARTBREAK 223,643
--    2 GUNS N' ROSES  CHINESE DEMOCRACY  148,183
4    3 TAYLOR SWIFT FEARLESS  128,291

That's it??

[falungong69]

if axl's managers engineered the best buy and myspace plans, then maybe he should sue them for fucking up the monumental release.  i mean, if you hired the two best surgeons in the world to perform a life saving operation, and they killed you, wouldn't you want to sue them?  this is bullshit.  i mean, if dr. pepper can get sued for their hand in fucking this up, then i want best buy and the managers and the record company's heads on a plate too.

Look, we don't know what kind of promotion Best Buy agreed to.  That's really the band and the record company's job anyways. BB agreed to buy a certain amount of copies and did that.  Who knows, without Best Buy we may not even have this album in our hands.

As far as management and the record company, what else could they have done?  How many times do you see a commercial on prime time TV promoting an album? There is only so much you can do with zero band involvement.

maybe there was zero band involvement because best buy and the managers fucked up so badly.

we know exactly what kind of promotion was agreed upon... MONUMENTAL.  for a while, i defended the promotion because i expected it to keep getting bigger and bigger.  but NO! 

just answer me this... if chinese democracy was the most anticipated album ever AND the retailer and managers succeeded in creating a MONUMENTAL MARKETING CAMPAIGN, then why would this most anticipated album ever also be the biggest selling album?  even if only for a week?  that simply doesn't add up and it doesn't take an advanced marketing degree to realize that.

[Ali]

frm Hitsdailydouble.com building album charts, 37.1% in:

LW TW artist / albumpower index
--    1 KANYE WEST 808S & HEARTBREAK 223,643
--    2 GUNS N' ROSES  CHINESE DEMOCRACY  148,183
4    3 TAYLOR SWIFT FEARLESS  128,291

That's it??

That's 37.1% in.  That's not final numbers.  If there is a linear relationship between % in and albums sold, then by my calculations the final number will be about 400,000.  That would be 33% higher than HDD's initial estimate.

Ali

[Allman]

frm Hitsdailydouble.com building album charts, 37.1% in:

LW TW artist / albumpower index
--    1 KANYE WEST 808S & HEARTBREAK 223,643
--    2 GUNS N' ROSES  CHINESE DEMOCRACY  148,183
4    3 TAYLOR SWIFT FEARLESS  128,291

That's it??

That's 37.1% in.  That's not final numbers.  If there is a linear relationship between % in and albums sold, then by my calculations the final number will be about 400,000.  That would be 33% higher than HDD's initial estimate.

Ali

To their credit, they did predict 300k - 500.000k "depending who you speak to"

What's worrisome, only 20k above Taylor Swift so far 

[Ali]

frm Hitsdailydouble.com building album charts, 37.1% in:

LW TW artist / albumpower index
--    1 KANYE WEST 808S & HEARTBREAK 223,643
--    2 GUNS N' ROSES  CHINESE DEMOCRACY  148,183
4    3 TAYLOR SWIFT FEARLESS  128,291

That's it??

That's 37.1% in.  That's not final numbers.  If there is a linear relationship between % in and albums sold, then by my calculations the final number will be about 400,000.  That would be 33% higher than HDD's initial estimate.

Ali

To their credit, they did predict 300k - 500.000k "depending who you speak to"

What's worrisome, only 20k above Taylor Swift so far 

Initially, yes.  But then last Tuesday (I believe), they restated their projection as being 300,000.  I know it might not seem like much in terms of pure units, but being 33% off on a projection is quite significant statistically.  Of course, that's if my linear assumption holds exactly.  It may not.  But, I think it will be much more than 300k.

Ali

[demo23nz]

if axl's managers engineered the best buy and myspace plans, then maybe he should sue them for fucking up the monumental release.  i mean, if you hired the two best surgeons in the world to perform a life saving operation, and they killed you, wouldn't you want to sue them?  this is bullshit.  i mean, if dr. pepper can get sued for their hand in fucking this up, then i want best buy and the managers and the record company's heads on a plate too.

Look, we don't know what kind of promotion Best Buy agreed to.  That's really the band and the record company's job anyways. BB agreed to buy a certain amount of copies and did that.  Who knows, without Best Buy we may not even have this album in our hands.

As far as management and the record company, what else could they have done?  How many times do you see a commercial on prime time TV promoting an album? There is only so much you can do with zero band involvement.

maybe there was zero band involvement because best buy and the managers fucked up so badly.

we know exactly what kind of promotion was agreed upon... MONUMENTAL. 

Yep, but I think you might be looking at this ass-backwards.
Best Buy agreed to fork over however much money for exclusivity, and odds are one of the things they would have worked into the deal/asking price would be the amount of promotion they could expect from the label/band. Now, the label haven't really done that bad. People are hearing Chi Dem on sports shows, computer games, movies, it has been reviewed everywhere... But you can only expect them to spend so much (especially after what this album has cost), so you really need the free press that band promotion can generate via public appearances, interviews etc...

Looking at the lack of band presence thus far it's hard not to wonder if either:

a) They got the album cheap because the band weren't going to be out there promoting it; or

b) They bought the exlusivity having been assured Axl would be in the media doing interviews etc, in which case THEY are the ones who should be pissed.

[neon2002]

Sales figures will not be available until next week, but early estimates put the first-week total at 300,000 copies

KANYE WEST's new album, "808s and Heartbreak", will be No. 1 on next week's Billboard chart with a total that looks to be between 450,000 and 500,000.

If this turns out to be true, the Best Buy idea was a bust.

Seriously, why not just release it to every retailer?  Put it everywhere, instead of just one store that some people don't even go to.

Because Bestbuy agreed to buy a certain number of copies in order to get the exclusive. The figure that I heard was that they bought 3 million copies. That pretty much pays back all the money that was spent on the recording process over the past years.

The record company gets all its money back and Bestbuy pays for the advertising.

[veritas55]

Sorry, but there is just no way to call these first week sales in the US (which look to be in the 300,000 to 400,000 range) anything but disappointing.  Azoff is a great manager and a great promoter of bands who COOPERATE in the promotion.  Look at how many units the Eagles moved with their Wal-Mart exclusive (more than 700,000 in the first week).  But note that the Eagles (and AC/DC) were all over the place, doing interviews, videos, talk shows, etc.  Now, we can all talk about how many fewer Best Buys there are than Wal-Marts, Kanye, the changing times, etc., but the unmistakable fact here is that it is always difficult to promote an album/CD when the band itself does ZERO promotion.  More importantly, when Axl himself does nothing to promote the CD.

Does anyone seriously think that buzz and hype don't move a substantial amount of units?  Imagine the first week totals if:

1.  Guns played Better and Street of Dreams (or insert whatever) on Saturday Night Live.
2.  Axl did an exclusive interview and got a cover on Rolling Stone
3.  Guns did AMAs (to reach a more general demographic)
4.  Guns did David Letterman or Leno.
5.  Tour was announced and opened this week.


And so forth.  Please note that all the above are just standard things that just about every band does (in some fashion or other) to promote the album.  I know, I know, Axl marches to a different drummer and this is art over commerce.  But I think it is a shame because the album is quite good and ambitious, and should reach people.  Secondly, dare I mention, that a lot of money went into this project and doesn't Axl have an obligation to try to repay that money?  Third, the success or failure impacts the whole band, not just Axl.

Anyway, these first week's numbers in the US are pretty dire for CD doing much more than going platinum, if that.   Setting aside Kid Rock's strange sales pattern, the great majority of CDs (like movies nowadays) make the bulk of their sales in the first couple of weeks.  Unless a big single hits down the road, this will be the high water week sales-wise, and then you should see standard drop-offs.

[Shaggins13]

Sorry, but there is just no way to call these first week sales in the US (which look to be in the 300,000 to 400,000 range) anything but disappointing.  Azoff is a great manager and a great promoter of bands who COOPERATE in the promotion.  Look at how many units the Eagles moved with their Wal-Mart exclusive (more than 700,000 in the first week).  But note that the Eagles (and AC/DC) were all over the place, doing interviews, videos, talk shows, etc.  Now, we can all talk about how many fewer Best Buys there are than Wal-Marts, Kanye, the changing times, etc., but the unmistakable fact here is that it is always difficult to promote an album/CD when the band itself does ZERO promotion.  More importantly, when Axl himself does nothing to promote the CD.

Does anyone seriously think that buzz and hype don't move a substantial amount of units?  Imagine the first week totals if:

1.  Guns played Better and Street of Dreams (or insert whatever) on Saturday Night Live.
2.  Axl did an exclusive interview and got a cover on Rolling Stone
3.  Guns did AMAs (to reach a more general demographic)
4.  Guns did David Letterman or Leno.
5.  Tour was announced and opened this week.


And so forth.  Please note that all the above are just standard things that just about every band does (in some fashion or other) to promote the album.  I know, I know, Axl marches to a different drummer and this is art over commerce.  But I think it is a shame because the album is quite good and ambitious, and should reach people.  Secondly, dare I mention, that a lot of money went into this project and doesn't Axl have an obligation to try to repay that money?  Third, the success or failure impacts the whole band, not just Axl.

Anyway, these first week's numbers in the US are pretty dire for CD doing much more than going platinum, if that.   Setting aside Kid Rock's strange sales pattern, the great majority of CDs (like movies nowadays) make the bulk of their sales in the first couple of weeks.  Unless a big single hits down the road, this will be the high water week sales-wise, and then you should see standard drop-offs.

I do not disagree with any of this, but here is what I think: Axl simply just doesn't care if the album sells or does not.  I think we fans care more in order to justify our love & loyalty to a band that has been MIA for 14 years and rendered "irrelevant" by today's state of American music.  Don't get me wrong, I wanted it to be #1 and personally refused to burn a copy of the CD for 2 friends because I wanted units to sell.  I have just resigned myself to the conclusion that Axl flat out doesn't give a shit if it sells or not, now that the record has been released and it is off his plate.  His loyal fans will continue to buy his new music and pay to see the band live whether Finck, Slash, Buckethead are on stage with him. 

[damnthehaters]

Sorry, but there is just no way to call these first week sales in the US (which look to be in the 300,000 to 400,000 range) anything but disappointing.  Azoff is a great manager and a great promoter of bands who COOPERATE in the promotion.  Look at how many units the Eagles moved with their Wal-Mart exclusive (more than 700,000 in the first week).  But note that the Eagles (and AC/DC) were all over the place, doing interviews, videos, talk shows, etc.  Now, we can all talk about how many fewer Best Buys there are than Wal-Marts, Kanye, the changing times, etc., but the unmistakable fact here is that it is always difficult to promote an album/CD when the band itself does ZERO promotion.  More importantly, when Axl himself does nothing to promote the CD.

Does anyone seriously think that buzz and hype don't move a substantial amount of units?  Imagine the first week totals if:

1.  Guns played Better and Street of Dreams (or insert whatever) on Saturday Night Live.
2.  Axl did an exclusive interview and got a cover on Rolling Stone
3.  Guns did AMAs (to reach a more general demographic)
4.  Guns did David Letterman or Leno.
5.  Tour was announced and opened this week.


And so forth.  Please note that all the above are just standard things that just about every band does (in some fashion or other) to promote the album.  I know, I know, Axl marches to a different drummer and this is art over commerce.  But I think it is a shame because the album is quite good and ambitious, and should reach people.  Secondly, dare I mention, that a lot of money went into this project and doesn't Axl have an obligation to try to repay that money?  Third, the success or failure impacts the whole band, not just Axl.

Anyway, these first week's numbers in the US are pretty dire for CD doing much more than going platinum, if that.   Setting aside Kid Rock's strange sales pattern, the great majority of CDs (like movies nowadays) make the bulk of their sales in the first couple of weeks.  Unless a big single hits down the road, this will be the high water week sales-wise, and then you should see standard drop-offs.

You ever think that maybe GNR and Axl WILL do these things?  Like I mentioned earlier...I don't think it's a bad thing to promote over time instead of shooting your wad all in the first month!  I would much rather sell more records in the long run than in just the first week.

[crow316]

Who really thinks that doing the late night or award show circuit is the way to go?  I dont.  Can you really see Axl sitting next to Leno or Letterman? It would be lame and cheesy, plus all they would want to ask about are the same tired old questions. And performing on these type of shows is out too. With the way Axl performs, it would have to be pre-recorded.  Award shows like the VMAs, Grammys, AMAs etc. aint what they used to be. What they ned to do is tour. An old fashioned tour I think is there only option. Do radio interviews to support and promote the tour. Thats what I'd want to see.

[Tyson]

http://www.hitsdailydouble.com/sales/salescht.cgi

US chart update.  Not looking too good.