"We're launching with a monumental campaign"

[demo23nz]

I've got a million other things in life that take a lot of effort man, and people that are relying on me for any number of things... You'll forgive me if I don't have the time or inclination to take on promotion duties for an album the band aren't (yet) pushing.

Now, if they announce a tour, I'll get a bunch of people along to the shows... If they do a video I'll be forwarding the link to friends... If they do an interesting interview I'll be telling folk they should check out the latest issue of whatever magazine it is. But until such time as those things eventuate, you'll forgive me if I've got bigger fish to fry in life.

[jarmo]

I've got a million other things in life that take a lot of effort man, and people that are relying on me for any number of things... You'll forgive me if I don't have the time or inclination to take on promotion duties for an album the band aren't (yet) pushing.

Now, if they announce a tour, I'll get a bunch of people along to the shows... If they do a video I'll be forwarding the link to friends... If they do an interesting interview I'll be telling folk they should check out the latest issue of whatever magazine it is. But until such time as those things eventuate, you'll forgive me if I've got bigger fish to fry in life.

It doesn't really require that much effort to tell your friends to listen to the album or buy a copy for somebody for Christmas....

I mean, if you're really wanting to spread the word.


I obviously wasn't asking you to go stand in the rain and hand out flyers.





/jarmo

[The Catcher]

I don't understand why I should let something I created be used as a tool to put down the band by people I can't relate to.

I think this comment pretty much sums up why comments that put the band down are removed and this place is the only "clean" and reliable GN'R site on the web. Would you appreciate it if people came to your party to bitch and moan about your friends and family instead of having a good time and discussing in friendly ways? No, you'd kick them the fuck out.

[TomFriend]

For a majority of the fans, I think, the release of Chinese Democracy wasnt only about finally hearing the music. A good portion of the fans had already heard most of it in one form or another.  It was about having the band back. 

If that's the honest truth, then it's basically what I've been saying all along.

Some will never be happy.

For years, all I read was "we just want an release date and the album". Having the band on tour wasn't good enough.

And now you're saying having the album out, which was supposed to be everything some of you ever wanted, isn't enough either....



So, you basically proved my point.

That's because I believe things are ahead that we don't know about.

Isn't that pure speculation on your part? The exact same thing you deride other people for?

Sure. You can call it that if you're negative.

Lookig ahead and being positive about the future is speculation and I should shut up. Instead we should all focus on what you're doing, whining about how there's no tour within two weeks of the album's release.

That's what's important and interesting!

How do you know it was released the way he wanted? He certainly hasn't said so publicly, and Geffen has tried to force his hand before.

Well, the fact that Shackler's Revenge was in Rock Band 2, If The World in Body Of Lies and the album being out, I think Axl wanted the music out.

So you're avoiding answering my actual question then?

Everything always seems to come down to "Why can't you all be perfect fans like me?" with you.

There's nothing to answer. Your answer to everything I say is "you know stuff I don't".

No matter what I say, you won't pay attention because your fantasies are way more interesting.



I never said I was perfect. Once again, that's your own little image in your head about how I see myself.

We never met or spoke, yet you have this weird image of me in your head just because I actually support the band instead of constantly trying to put them down.



I don't understand why I should let something I created be used as a tool to put down the band by people I can't relate to.




Talking about avoiding questions, you didn't answer me regarding the suspicion I have that some of you will never be happy.  

And what are you doing to help?

Are we supposed to help? I've bought the record for myself (and I think it's quite good) but except for that I'm not planning on going on a GNR crusade like some fanatical religious nut case.

Of course you're not.

Imagine if you would actually seem like somebody who loves the band.

How uncool and scary!

But I fail to see much reason why a fan should be expected to do anymore when the band hasn't done anything.

Of course you don't. It's easier to just complain.

Being constructive takes effort.

Horrible though.



Have any of you noticed how the focus is now on sales and the so called lack of promotion?

This is somewhat amusing since most of you always claimed to want to hear the music.

Maybe you didn't want the music, you just wanted GN'R to be promoted and talk about sales figures.

The music is secondary.   







/jarmo

So in summary, you love the band better than us and you're the bestest most favoritest fan ever in the whole wide world.

Rock Band 2 and Body Of Lies prove Axl wanted the record out now, because there's no way that the record company that paid for those songs to be made could license them out.

Jarmo's speculation is good, everyone else's speculation is bad.

We fantasize about Jarmo's relationship with the band.

Asking if Axl approves the release is very negative and bad.

I whined about there not being a tour within two weeks of the release (apparently...anyone care to find that post?)

If you don't go on a GNR crusade, you don't love the band.

Because I wonder whether Axl approves the release, I'll never be happy.

Are you getting rubberized wallpaper for Christmas by any chance?

[GNRBABY]

I've got a million other things in life that take a lot of effort man, and people that are relying on me for any number of things... You'll forgive me if I don't have the time or inclination to take on promotion duties for an album the band aren't (yet) pushing.

Now, if they announce a tour, I'll get a bunch of people along to the shows... If they do a video I'll be forwarding the link to friends... If they do an interesting interview I'll be telling folk they should check out the latest issue of whatever magazine it is. But until such time as those things eventuate, you'll forgive me if I've got bigger fish to fry in life.

It doesn't really require that much effort to tell your friends to listen to the album or buy a copy for somebody for Christmas....

I mean, if you're really wanting to spread the word.


I obviously wasn't asking you to go stand in the rain and hand out flyers.





/jarmo

exactly. I have purchased 6+ copies of CD so far, and that doesn't include the 3 vinyl I have bought. I tell everyone to listen to it. I told all my friends I would NOT be making free copies, because of all the years I've waited and all the shit I took from nay-sayers over the years, I'll be damned if some bloke is gonna get a free copy of CD from me just so he can phone me up and tell me "This doesn't sound like GNR" blah,blah,blah. I think if people pay money for the record then they will give it a fair shake.

[demo23nz]

I've got a million other things in life that take a lot of effort man, and people that are relying on me for any number of things... You'll forgive me if I don't have the time or inclination to take on promotion duties for an album the band aren't (yet) pushing.

Now, if they announce a tour, I'll get a bunch of people along to the shows... If they do a video I'll be forwarding the link to friends... If they do an interesting interview I'll be telling folk they should check out the latest issue of whatever magazine it is. But until such time as those things eventuate, you'll forgive me if I've got bigger fish to fry in life.

It doesn't really require that much effort to tell your friends to listen to the album

You must have missed the bit where I said I've been telling people it's good. And I'm sure someone will get it as a gift if there's someone I think will dig it that doesn't happen to have it closer to the time... But whether that earns me enough points to be able to criticise the promotional efforts thus far, I don't really care...

[jarmo]

So in summary, you love the band better than us and you're the bestest most favoritest fan ever in the whole wide world.

Once again, YOUR own little theory about me.

I never said anything like it.

Congratulations on not getting it and here you are attacking me for not understanding you.

How ironic.

Are you getting rubberized wallpaper for Christmas by any chance?

Ahh, insults.

And then you wonder why people like you get banned.

It's because you always have to resort to insults. Nine times out of ten, this is what happens.

Yet these people always say they got banned for "no reason". Amazing.

you think I'll just sit by and let you dictate what should be allowed in my house? Think again.




And you still didn't answer my question.


Axl saying he would share his Dr Pepper with Buckethead clearly means he was gonna put out the album.

Nice try again.



I didn't say you personally whined about no tour. You can mean more than one person.

For someone who knows me so well, I thought you'd know that!

You must have missed the bit where I said I've been telling people it's good. And I'm sure someone will get it as a gift if there's someone I think will dig it that doesn't happen to have it closer to the time...

 

I'm sure they'll appreciate it.





/jarmo

[TomFriend]

So in summary, you love the band better than us and you're the bestest most favoritest fan ever in the whole wide world.

Once again, YOUR own little theory about me.

I never said anything like it.

Congratulations on not getting it and here you are attacking me for not understanding you.

How ironic.

Are you getting rubberized wallpaper for Christmas by any chance?

Ahh, insults.

And then you wonder why people like you get banned.

It's because you always have to resort to insults. Nine times out of ten, this is what happens.

Yet these people always say they got banned for "no reason". Amazing.

you think I'll just sit by and let you dictate what should be allowed in my house? Think again.




And you still didn't answer my question.


Axl saying he would share his Dr Pepper with Buckethead clearly means he was gonna put out the album.

Nice try again.



I didn't say you personally whined about no tour. You can mean more than one person.

For someone who knows me so well, I thought you'd know that!

You must have missed the bit where I said I've been telling people it's good. And I'm sure someone will get it as a gift if there's someone I think will dig it that doesn't happen to have it closer to the time...

 

I'm sure they'll appreciate it.





/jarmo

A joke about rubberized wallpaper seems somewhat mild compared to you dubbing me and anyone who opposed your one-sided opinions 'whiny bastards' on the previous page dude. And the fact that you constantly criticize anyone who dares to have a differing opinion to you on any aspect of the band and make statements about them not being real fans, good fans, true fans etc. would seem to imply you consider yourself superior to them.

And sure, Axl talking about sharing his Dr Pepper with Buckethead does seem to signify he intended to release the album. But then again, he supposedly intended to release it every year for quite some time before that. His silence regarding the release causes me and some other fans concern as to whether he has an issue with the release itself, or the terms of the release. I still fail to understand why that makes me a bad fan or whatever, but so be it.

[jarmo]

A joke about rubberized wallpaper seems somewhat mild compared to you dubbing me and anyone who opposed your one-sided opinions 'whiny bastards' on the previous page dude.

Yeah, it's always a joke.

What if I said you're a moron and then claimed it was a joke? Would it be ok?


The way I see it, and I've said this many times, just complaining isn't helping anyone (well maybe yourself because maybe it makes you feel better, I don't know).

It's not very constructive to just whine and whine now is it?

So that makes you a whiny bastard!

Since you're not helping at all.... Get it?

And sure, Axl talking about sharing his Dr Pepper with Buckethead does seem to signify he intended to release the album. But then again, he supposedly intended to release it every year for quite some time before that.

And he didn't...

Now that he put it out, he still didn't want to.


He can never win I guess.





/jarmo

[The Catcher]

And sure, Axl talking about sharing his Dr Pepper with Buckethead does seem to signify he intended to release the album. But then again, he supposedly intended to release it every year for quite some time before that.

And he didn't...

Now that he put it out, he still didn't want to.


He can never win I guess.





/jarmo

Hahaha! That basically sums up how some "fans" treat Axl. He's wrong if he does something, he would have been wrong if he didn't do it...

[TomFriend]

A joke about rubberized wallpaper seems somewhat mild compared to you dubbing me and anyone who opposed your one-sided opinions 'whiny bastards' on the previous page dude.

Yeah, it's always a joke.

What, you think I was seriously asking if you were getting rubberized wallpaper for Christmas? I've got news for you. The chicken didn't really cross the road.

The way I see it, and I've said this many times, just complaining isn't helping anyone (well maybe yourself because maybe it makes you feel better, I don't know).

If you look through my posts and find one complaint directed at Axl, fine.

And sure, Axl talking about sharing his Dr Pepper with Buckethead does seem to signify he intended to release the album. But then again, he supposedly intended to release it every year for quite some time before that.

And he didn't...

Now that he put it out, he still didn't want to.


He can never win I guess.







/jarmo

Do you understand what a question is? I'm wondering if he wanted to put it out, not saying he didn't. Is it beyond the realms of possibility that he didn't want it to come out now? Did he want to put the Greatest Hits album out?

[The Catcher]

lol @ the GH comparison.
Axl publically stated (at least through lawyers) how he disagreed with the record company's decision to put that album out.
He certainly didn't say "I'll be sharing my soda with Slash" or anything to that extent. Nobody forced him to make that comment.

[TomFriend]

lol @ the GH comparison.
Axl publically stated (at least through lawyers) how he disagreed with the record company's decision to put that album out.
He certainly didn't say "I'll be sharing my soda with Slash" or anything to that extent. Nobody forced him to make that comment.

My point was to illustrate that Geffen has proven itself capable of putting out GNR material without Axl's consent.

The fact is, if Axl does approve this release, I'm thrilled. Jarmo, if you can tell me now - concrete - that you know this album has been released in the form Axl intended it to be heard, I'll take you at your word and it will, if anything enhance my enjoyment of it.

Its not about promotion for me - if Axl doesn't care how much it sells, good for him. If he doesn't want to make a music video, fine. If he doesn't want to tour it, that's too bad, but ok. If this is the last GNR project, so be it. It's the one we've all waited for, and its every bit as excellent as at least most of us hoped.

But if you think its stupid to have doubts as to Axl's approval of the release when he doesn't give so much as a brief press statement about it, fine, but some of us do and are curious as to whether we're hearing this guy's masterpiece the way he wanted us to hear it.

[jarmo]

What, you think I was seriously asking if you were getting rubberized wallpaper for Christmas? I've got news for you. The chicken didn't really cross the road.

I get it.

But, next time you attack me for being mean to you, see it as a joke.  

Do you understand what a question is? I'm wondering if he wanted to put it out, not saying he didn't. Is it beyond the realms of possibility that he didn't want it to come out now? Did he want to put the Greatest Hits album out?

Nice, you're the guy who refuses to answer my simple question and here you are asking me if I know what a question is.

That's some funny shit.



He tried to stop Greatest Hits.

Did you see that happen this time? Maybe I'm missing something.

I'm assuming he did want the album out in 2008.

I don't think he could've been forced to put it out. If that was the case, they could've forced him in 2007....

My point was to illustrate that Geffen has proven itself capable of putting out GNR material without Axl's consent.

That was a compilation of previously released material.

This is something else.





/jarmo

[TomFriend]

What, you think I was seriously asking if you were getting rubberized wallpaper for Christmas? I've got news for you. The chicken didn't really cross the road.

I get it.

But, next time you attack me for being mean to you, see it as a joke.  

Do you understand what a question is? I'm wondering if he wanted to put it out, not saying he didn't. Is it beyond the realms of possibility that he didn't want it to come out now? Did he want to put the Greatest Hits album out?

Nice, you're the guy who refuses to answer my simple question and here you are asking me if I know what a question is.

That's some funny shit.



He tried to stop Greatest Hits.

Did you see that happen this time? Maybe I'm missing something.

I'm assuming he did want the album out in 2008.

I don't think he could've been forced to put it out. If that was the case, they could've forced him in 2007....

My point was to illustrate that Geffen has proven itself capable of putting out GNR material without Axl's consent.

That was a compilation of previously released material.

This is something else.





/jarmo

What is this question you keep saying I'm ignoring? I'm not being sarcastic, I genuinely must have overlooked it. Ask me again and I'll answer.

I don't think he could've been forced to put it out. If that was the case, they could've forced him in 2007....

Not necessarily. As you yourself often remind people, we don't know what goes on behind the scenes. Perhaps another incentive was offered, or another deadline passed. I don't know who owns the rights to the masters, but if its Geffen (and presumably they paid for the majority of recording, so it could well be) then its not impossible for them to have released the album without Axl's approval.

You know how you always used to say to believe a release date when you hear it from the band themselves? Well, I'll believe this is the album released as Axl intended it when we hear any kind of endorsement of it from Axl. What's so wrong with that?

[jarmo]

What is this question you keep saying I'm ignoring? I'm not being sarcastic, I genuinely must have overlooked it. Ask me again and I'll answer.

Are you one of those people who will never be happy and will continue to look for things that are wrong with GN'R?

Not necessarily. As you yourself often remind people, we don't know what goes on behind the scenes. Perhaps another incentive was offered, or another deadline passed. I don't know who owns the rights to the masters, but if its Geffen (and presumably they paid for the majority of recording, so it could well be) then its not impossible for them to have released the album without Axl's approval.

I think the masters had to be delivered to them for them to release it?

They already had the masters for the old albums and therefore could put out a compilation album.




/jarmo

[faldor]

Why can't it be the other way around TomFriend?  Why don't you BELIEVE the album was released the way Axl intended it to be unless he says otherwise.  Why do you feel this was against his will?  I'm sure you're gonna say, the lack of promotion, no word from Axl.  It's possible he's working on other things (getting the lineup in order for one) before he addresses us.  Maybe, like he said, he wants the music to do the talking and he'll speak when he's good and ready.  It could be a number of things other than Axl sitting at home all steamed because the record company forced the album out against his will and therefore he's refusing to promote or endorse it.  I'll admit I hoped/thought we'd have heard something by now.  But I certainly didn't expect to see Axl on Ellen, Larry King, Leno, Letterman, Oprah, etc.  

[IKnowWhereIAM]

...He tried to stop Greatest Hits...

I am willing to bet that played a major part in the perceived 'delay'...if it were me, obstinate bastard that I am, I would have given the label NOTHING after they beat me in court.   By actually releasing CD Axl has proven himself to be quite the opposite of what the naysayers claim...anyone with a slightly oversized ego, that is not missing mortgage payments, would try to outlast the label after a very public loss in court.  Axl is obviously not missing mortgage payments...so I can only assume that his loyalty to his art, or fans, won out over any ego he may/may not have.

I am thankful for CD...it is AMAZING...I blame the economy for any shortcomings in the 'monumental campaign' or sales...but I still have MY COPY of amazing f'n CD.  If I had access to Axl, all I would say is 'Thanks' - and thanks to everyone who was a part of this release.  

[TomFriend]

Are you one of those people who will never be happy and will continue to look for things that are wrong with GN'R?

I don't think there's anything wrong with GNR. There's a hell of a lot of confusion that never seems to lift, that's for sure, but I love the new album. In fact I'd say the 2006 gig I saw was the best I've seen, and C.D. moves me more than any of the old albums. Besides that, I have a lot of respect for Axl and his artistry, especially the painstaking process of making this album, and want to make sure that what I'm hearing is what he intended us to hear.

Not necessarily. As you yourself often remind people, we don't know what goes on behind the scenes. Perhaps another incentive was offered, or another deadline passed. I don't know who owns the rights to the masters, but if its Geffen (and presumably they paid for the majority of recording, so it could well be) then its not impossible for them to have released the album without Axl's approval.

I think the masters had to be delivered to them for them to release it?

They already had the masters for the old albums and therefore could put out a compilation album.




/jarmo

Well, certainly the masters would have had to be in the hands of the label - but that could happen by several means. For instance, on a lengthy project such as this, its usual for a label to receive unfinished tracks as a means of gauging progress - perhaps this is how the demos were leaked in the past. But all this is way too open to speculation, which is why it would be great, at least from my pov to have some clarification that this is the real deal, completed to Axl's satisfaction.

[D]

I think certain things are happening:

1. I think Axl is just gonna enjoy the holidays seeing as once Guns N Roses start back, his life will be hectic and he won't have these carefree moments anymore

2. maybe he is waiting on Obama to become President and maybe the economy to get better before touring.  Right now is probably not the best time for a comeback tour.

3. Just further building the anticipation. Use the initial album anticipation and once that is over, kick his end in high gear to give the album another gear.