Richard Fortus Talks To GnrDaily.com

[ppbebe]

Is it the open mindness that makes you always try to see a bad sign?
Is it objective to look at everything from a negative viewpoint?

Apparently it's the same thing...






/jarmo

well in the real world it's not and I guess it's called a paranoid mentality.

[Smoking Guns]

Second, and most important, you and this board since about 2003-2004 have been THE most damaging thing to happen to GNR. You have alienated countless numbers of fans. You have literally made fans bitter, and have turned them against Axl. Not the bashers but loyal GNR (new line up) fans. Your association with GNR, whatever it is, has turned a really cool site into a shell of what it once was. No real fan cares if Axl, beta, or fernando post here or read this board. It doesn't affect our lives in the slightest. We love the band and the music. That's all. But it remains that  it has brought out vultures who are only here to try and impress, or get the attention of Axl and his inner circle.

If you really did care for GNR your main goal should have been trying to bridge a gap between the fans and the band and try to find a middle ground, but you chose to alienate them for, to quote you jarmo, your own selfish reasons. Your actions have fractured this fanbase. And has directly lead to people boycotting shows and planning to download the album without paying for it and spreading it around the net. Right or wrong, that's a fact. These were people who were going to be memebers of the street team, to get people interested in GNR, and were going to buy multiple copies of CD. Try to deny it, but this all started with you and your treatment of fans.

This may not mean a thing to you, but it should to GNR. 

Hands down, the post of the yr! Right on the fukin head. Post of the Century.Seriously

Excellent posts MisterID. I have been telling Jarmo this for awhile now. particularly your first paragraph

Jarmo I hope you take comments like that and the stuff Ive been telling you and use it to get back on track. Your prob going to come with your "its my house" mentality. Which as I have told you is fine, but its really not cool.

Yea we can leave but you did have something cool here. We want it back. We dont want it your way or our way. We know GNR or this site isnt Burger King... We just simply want it the old way. Dont get Slash on us and get lazy and ruin something that was once great. Get back on track.

Wow, that was 2 strong opinions.  Nice and well written regardless if I agree.  I am now waiting for Scott's, I mean Jarmo's, response to these diatribes.

[jarmo]

I dont get that mentality. Just because someone might have a different perception of the band than you doesnt mean they should be booted out of here.

So just because you don't "get it" it's not right?

It's easy, if your perception of the band is that you have to find faults in everything and they're constantly trying to find ways to fuck with their fans, you're not on the right site.

Who is asking him to be one? Its very simple, is he or isnt he in the band? No comment means he is not. If he was he would say yea hes in the band or yea hes just on a break with NIN. WHat is so hard about that?

It does?

Maybe no comment means, that he's not going to comment on something that he's not sure about?

If the other side rarely speaks or never speaks then all you can do is speculate.

Sure, I understand that. But where does it say it should be always about assuming the worst?

I mean, if you dare to not take that path, then you're labeled a fan boy and zealot be people like this misterID....

Second, and most important, you and this board since about 2003-2004 have been THE most damaging thing to happen to GNR. You have alienated countless numbers of fans. You have literally made fans bitter, and have turned them against Axl. Not the bashers but loyal GNR (new line up) fans. Your association with GNR, whatever it is, has turned a really cool site into a shell of what it once was. No real fan cares if Axl, beta, or fernando post here or read this board. It doesn't affect our lives in the slightest. We love the band and the music. That's all. But it remains that  it has brought out vultures who are only here to try and impress, or get the attention of Axl and his inner circle.

If you really did care for GNR your main goal should have been trying to bridge a gap between the fans and the band and try to find a middle ground, but you chose to alienate them for, to quote you jarmo, your own selfish reasons. Your actions have fractured this fanbase. And has directly lead to people boycotting shows and planning to download the album without paying for it and spreading it around the net. Right or wrong, that's a fact. These were people who were going to be memebers of the street team, to get people interested in GNR, and were going to buy multiple copies of CD. Try to deny it, but this all started with you and your treatment of fans.

This may not mean a thing to you, but it should to GNR. 

Let me get this straight, the site that actually shoots down numerous rumors and worked on getting you ticket pre-sales in 2006 are the worst thing that ever happened to GN'R? Well that sounds objective....


I have nothing to do with the other web sites, yet they're filled with these bitter "fans". I guess all blame for that should be put on me for the fact that I don't want them here?

All this time you've all been telling me I'm not special in any way, I'm just this little insignificant person and now I've managed to do all this?


You don't think many of these fans are bitter because they have no control over GN'R and it pisses them off? Or the fact that they have no control over this site.




Like you and younggunner keep going on about, "we want it how it once was". Well guess what, things have changed!

You fail to see that.

You don't have to be the same bitter person you were in 2004 when there were no tours or no news.

So why should I have to be stuck in that time?




You go on about how I should try to use this as a bridge between the band and the fans. Yet you claim nobody cares if Fernando or Beta posts here.

If that's not a bridge between the band and the fans, then what is?

What do you want? You can't attack me for providing that bridge and then saying nobody gives a fuck!



Like the objective person you are, you chose to ignore everything I've actually done so you can just take a dig at me.



Regarding my so called selfish reasons, if you knew anything about me, you'd know how far from the truth that is.


I would love to hear what your definition of supporting a band is about.

I mean, we shoot down rumors and try to get the most accurate story as possible from people who know what's going on.

That must be really horrible right? Imagine if people actually choose to believe that the band isn't a bunch of guys who's idea is to lie to their fans and screw them over time after time.

No, you can't do that because if you do, you're turning fans against the band they claim to love!




There's always been people who hate what I do.

It's nothing new. Some of them claim they're speaking on behalf of what's "best for the site" when in fact it's just selfish reasons.

Some seem to confuse our policy of supporting the band as me trying to control what people think. That's like saying a metal festival is trying to turn people who like rap into Warrant fans.


Sometimes it's just based on jealousy and lies.

There have been people who were happy when it was announced that Merck was no longer involved with the band. Not that it matters to them who manages the band, they were just happy that this site and I lost our connection to the band. Is that only because they don't like the site or is that personal?

Certain people are constantly trying to discredit me and what I do. They discredit Mysteron and myself, but were quick to sign up for the 2006 pre-sales. You guys are full of shit and we hate you, but give us tickets!


People hate the fact that people in the GN'R camp post here. Why? Just because they wish they'd post on their site instead.





/jarmo

[bazgnr]

I'm grateful for what this site provides - the closest thing to accuracy and rumor control as one is likely to find regarding GnR these days, as well as other bonuses (such as the pre-ticket sales) for which many of us were - and continue to be - very appreciative.

That said, the change in tone has been noticeable over the past few years.  It is frustrating to suddenly have to take great care in what is said, and - more importantly - how it is said, and to have to essentially tip-toe around certain people, topics, etc. (I'm only speaking for myself when I'm reading and posting, as I have no interest in getting banned, negative karma, etc., when my sole reason for coming here is my continued love and support of all things GnR).   

All in all, is it a fair price to pay for what HTGTH has evolved into?  That's a question everyone has to answer individually, I suppose.   There are certainly plenty of other forums to frequent.  However, it's clear that HTGTH offers a unique place (and perspective) for fans of the band to communicate. 

To be honest, the most alienating thing about spending time here isn't any "unwritten code" of what can and cannot be posted in terms of individual opinions, it's the way most threads *constantly* degenerate into back-and-forth personal attacks. 

Like this one.      So.  How about that Richard and his interview?  Good stuff!     

 

[jarmo]

To be honest, the most alienating thing about spending time here isn't any "unwritten code" of what can and cannot be posted in terms of individual opinions, it's the way most threads *constantly* degenerate into back-and-forth personal attacks. 

It's because as soon as I say "but what if..." it becomes "well you're a mentally disturbed ass kisser and fan boy".



Regarding the so called tip toeing. Just use common sense.

Do you think that link to a leak is a good idea to post? How about that bullshit story that's attacking the band?

Do you think fans like to read articles about how much the band they love sucks written by people who have no clue?



People seem to make broad generalizations here. Like criticism isn't allowed.

It's wrong.

The thing we object to is the pointless criticism that leads nowhere. I guess some people just have to whine to get it out there. But get a fucking diary or something.....




/jarmo

[jazjme]

Um this , now has gone way off topic.. I am tired of the BS, and the attacking of fans. done by each other. Can I stop it? Probably not, but hence the name GUNS N ROSES. Ive been a long time fan, and been here for many yrs..there are otehr aves to use if you dont like something, and if so use them. Or do so cause you want to .

[russtcb]

What if the question was:

"Richard, is Axl Rose still in GNR?"

would Richard say, "No Comment", or "Hell Yes, Axl is Guns N Roses", or, "Damn, right, Axl is our frontman." 

The point that alot of us are making is that no one expected Richard to comment on Robin's current status.

The thing alot of people don't understand is having no comment on a simple issue such as the origin of a cover.

[ppbebe]

What if the question was:

"Richard, is Axl Rose still in GNR?"

would Richard say, "No Comment", or "Hell Yes, Axl is Guns N Roses", or, "Damn, right, Axl is our frontman." 

The point that alot of us are making is that no one expected Richard to comment on Robin's current status.

The thing alot of people don't understand is having no comment on a simple issue such as the origin of a cover.

alternatively who do you think picked the cover?

@ smoking I guess No cComent would be most appropriate for an absurd q.
And Richard wasn't asked if anyone was still in or not.

[russtcb]

What if the question was:

"Richard, is Axl Rose still in GNR?"

would Richard say, "No Comment", or "Hell Yes, Axl is Guns N Roses", or, "Damn, right, Axl is our frontman." 

The point that alot of us are making is that no one expected Richard to comment on Robin's current status.

The thing alot of people don't understand is having no comment on a simple issue such as the origin of a cover.

alternatively who do you think picked the cover?

@ smoking I guess No cComent would be most appropriate for an absurd q.
And Richard wasn't asked if anyone was still in or not.

Ofcourse he was... in a roundabout way. The "do you think you'll continue to play with Robin in the future" question was an attempt at getting an answer about Robin's status from Richard.

As far as the cover goes, I have no idea. That's why I wish he'd have answered the question.

[bazgnr]

To be honest, the most alienating thing about spending time here isn't any "unwritten code" of what can and cannot be posted in terms of individual opinions, it's the way most threads *constantly* degenerate into back-and-forth personal attacks. 

It's because as soon as I say "but what if..." it becomes "well you're a mentally disturbed ass kisser and fan boy".



Regarding the so called tip toeing. Just use common sense.

Do you think that link to a leak is a good idea to post? How about that bullshit story that's attacking the band?

Do you think fans like to read articles about how much the band they love sucks written by people who have no clue?



People seem to make broad generalizations here. Like criticism isn't allowed.

It's wrong.

The thing we object to is the pointless criticism that leads nowhere. I guess some people just have to whine to get it out there. But get a fucking diary or something.....

/jarmo

When i said "tip-toeing," I was solely referring to myself.  As I've said before, I spend way to much time around here, and I don't want either my support for the band or my appreciation of this place to ever be misconstrued.  You can only read so many pages of arguing and re-iterating why someone got negative karma, doesn't properly support the current band, etc., before you tend to get a little paranoid about making sure what you say comes across properly, or sometimes just not saying anything.  And I agree, it does come down to common sense.  It's unfortunate that everyone doesn't have it in equal amounts...

[bazgnr]

What if the question was:

"Richard, is Axl Rose still in GNR?"

would Richard say, "No Comment", or "Hell Yes, Axl is Guns N Roses", or, "Damn, right, Axl is our frontman." 

The point that alot of us are making is that no one expected Richard to comment on Robin's current status.

The thing alot of people don't understand is having no comment on a simple issue such as the origin of a cover.

Exactly.  Although the theory of "better to say nothing rather than accidentally opening up doors" is feasible.  I was just glad to read Richard has put time in on the new Furs album...

[ppbebe]

Ofcourse he was... in a roundabout way. The "do you think you'll continue to play with Robin in the future" question was an attempt at getting an answer about Robin's status from Richard.

As far as the cover goes, I have no idea. That's why I wish he'd have answered the question.

Maybe for  forum fans 'of course' he was but  you can't be so sure if he thought he was.
not only the roundabout but it involved too many questions at once.

about the cover I think I saw some having ideas in japan show threads. 

[misterID]

jarmo -

I've given you credit for what you've done in the past, and so has younggunner. Whether you want to aknowledge that or not, perhaps you were ignoring it, is up to you.

That doesn't give you license to attack fans. You're the one who decided to define what a fan is. Not me. Don't you wonder why so many old schoolers here have left?

Maybe you don't care and you're happy with the "change" you've underwent, but it was a huge hit to this community.

Regarding my so called selfish reasons, if you knew anything about me, you'd know how far from the truth that is.

All I know is what you put out. If there's a different side to you I'd love to see it.

I would love to hear what your definition of supporting a band is about.

That's the thing jarmo, there is no definition. I'm not bashing or being critical. I'm stating what I observe. I'd like to see the negative posts I've made regaurding the band that's made you put me in a basher category.

No one is ever going to agree on everything and people shouldn't be made to. That's why there are message boards, so we can discuss differing opinions. No one can say who's right or wrong on the inner workings of the band, but having that discussion isn't a bad thing.

I mean, we shoot down rumors and try to get the most accurate story as possible from people who know what's going on.

That must be really horrible right? Imagine if people actually choose to believe that the band isn't a bunch of guys who's idea is to lie to their fans and screw them over time after time.

jarmo, you do a good job for the band. No one is questioning that. Your treatment of the fans is a different story.

It's a lot easier to believe the band when you're not attacking people over trivial questions or comments, that you find negative.

If you don't understand how poorly you treat people here, then I don't know what to tell you.

No, you can't do that because if you do, you're turning fans against the band they claim to love!

You are. That's the sad thing. Not because of the work you do, but how you make everything personal. You reflect on the band. When you treat people like shit, it's like the band is treating them like shit. Because of your work with the band you are a represenation of GNR on this board.

There's always been people who hate what I do.

It's nothing new. Some of them claim they're speaking on behalf of what's "best for the site" when in fact it's just selfish reasons.

Some seem to confuse our policy of supporting the band as me trying to control what people think. That's like saying a metal festival is trying to turn people who like rap into Warrant fans.


Sometimes it's just based on jealousy and lies.

I don't doubt you put up with a lot of shit. I'm not telling you how to run your site, only to take a look on how you're treating people here, and how that reflects on the band.

I don't hate you. I don't hate what you do.

Certain people are constantly trying to discredit me and what I do. They discredit Mysteron and myself, but were quick to sign up for the 2006 pre-sales. You guys are full of shit and we hate you, but give us tickets!

I know there are some assholes. But do you honestly think that everyone here, ones that side with me, actually thinks that way?

People hate the fact that people in the GN'R camp post here. Why? Just because they wish they'd post on their site instead.





/jarmo

I don't hate that they post here, I don't like the posts that are made that are entirely directed at getting the GNR camps attention.
 

[BurningHills]

At the end of the day, is it REALLY that big of a deal if Richard answers a question about why they chose to play an X-Japan song?

I honestly don't think that it is.

Ladies & gents - there's many more important things to worry about in the world these days than whether GN'R's guitarist reveals the origin of a cover song that they performed. Think about where it lands in the grand scheme of things. It's no skin off of my back. I find it cool that Richard was willing to do the interview in the first place.

As for how Jarmo runs the board - and I have no problem with the way he does business - why does THAT matter to you? If any of you folks run your own message board, you'll know that it's NOT an easy job. You can try to cater to the masses o

HTGTH has been around since 1996 and has over 20 million hits - that speaks volumes. Jarmo chooses to keep all of the other garbage that bogs other forums down on the way - and he's not the first, nor will he be the last admin to run their board that way.

Some people really think about these things WAY too much, when there's more important stuff in the world.

Just my two cents.

[Smoking Guns]

MisterID, do you feel like because you know the board is read by the GNR Camp, Jarmo feels that their feelings may get hurt, so he wants to present a more positive image of the site?  Do you feel if Beta, or Fernando didn't post here, Jarmo may be "more" honest about his thoughts in regarding GNR.  But since Mystereon, Beta, Fernando, maybe Axl post here some, we must limit negativity from fear of losing our contacts.

That is a tough question.  That is a great debate.  Do you sacrifice you integrity for the bigger prize of have inside info from the GNR Camp, or do you say, "Fuck it, this is how I feel, I will always support GNR, but if they don't like what I say about something GNR does, I can't worry about.  I will just be as honest as I can."  

I think Jarmo feels his angle he took is best for the site and for the fans.  The sacrifice is that we may not always get Jarmo's "genuine" thoughts.  As long as everyone else is 100% honest I don't care.  And I understand the position Jarmo is in.  Thanks Jarmo for all that you do.

[Neemo]

Do you sacrifice you integrity for the bigger prize of have inside info from the GNR Camp, or do you say, "Fuck it, this is how I feel, I will always support GNR, but if they don't like what I say about something GNR does, I can't worry about.  I will just be as honest as I can."  

i said "Fuck it, this is how I feel, I will always support GNR, but if they don't like what I say about something GNR does, I can't worry about.  I will just be as honest as I can." Axl & GnR, in my eyes, has always stood for sticking up for yourself and telling it like it is...

that being said, Jarmo can run the board how he wants, since its his baby and it sucks to see the lack of respect that some people give towards him cuz he has put up with alot of crap over the years, even so though i dont think its right to paint the fans that disagree with some things the band does, all with the same brush...seems to be the case sometimes...

People hate the fact that people in the GN'R camp post here. Why? Just because they wish they'd post on their site instead.

definately not in my case....but i know that you (and alot of other peopel think its cool) so more power to you you've battled in the trenches a long time so my hat's off to you that you have been noticed by the inner circle of Axl's camp....but when those "people" in the gnr camp start attacking the fans and driving them from your board, i dunno it would make me wonder wtf is going on and what their angle is...and i'm not sure of the point in having people "in the know" if they dont really tell the fans anything...i dunno maybe you get told more than the rest of us...but most fans dont know shit we are constantly in the dark and all people want to know is whats happening and when we can finally be able to buy the album....i dont think its too much to ask to get a status update on the album since it was "tentatively" scheduled for release overa year ago and we still haven't heard shit ..... even when the lead guitarist fucked off to a new band

all that being said...i think people are over-reacting to this Fortus interview

[Nicos]

Guys (Jarmo and MisterID),

I think you both need to light up big time... This is supposed to be fun!!

Give each other a call and solve your issues, don't pollute the greatest GN'R fan site with it!

Cheers,

N ! 3 |(

[jarmo]

I've given you credit for what you've done in the past, and so has younggunner. Whether you want to aknowledge that or not, perhaps you were ignoring it, is up to you.

Well since I'm the "worst thing that has happened to the band", it sure as hell don't seem like it.

That doesn't give you license to attack fans. You're the one who decided to define what a fan is. Not me. Don't you wonder why so many old schoolers here have left?

Is it ok for them to attack me?

You don't seem to realize what's going on.

You think I just attack people. That's a lie.

I challenge people to think. To try to understand that everything isn't just black or white.

None of us are in the band, we don't know how things work. Yet some like to think they know how things should be handled.

If you believed the posts, we have a board filled with managers, agents, booking agents, promoters, media people, advertising experts and musicians here!



People have been coming and going for as long as this site has been around.

I know for a fact that some have left because they don't like being challenged. It's a king of the hill thing for some.

Some leve because they got nothing positive to say and they don't feel welcome. Which is correct since we're here for one reason: We support GN'R today and tomorrow.

Maybe you don't care and you're happy with the "change" you've underwent, but it was a huge hit to this community.

GN'R touring and playing for the excited fans is a huge hit?

As I said, I could understand you feeling upset in 2004 or 2005 when pretty much nothing was happening.

I don't understand the anger and frustration that some of you have since 2006....

That's the thing jarmo, there is no definition. I'm not bashing or being critical. I'm stating what I observe. I'd like to see the negative posts I've made regaurding the band that's made you put me in a basher category.

No one is ever going to agree on everything and people shouldn't be made to. That's why there are message boards, so we can discuss differing opinions. No one can say who's right or wrong on the inner workings of the band, but having that discussion isn't a bad thing.

I have my definition and I chose to run this site based on that.

What else do you think I should do?


I bet you have your morals and ethics and you try to live by them. Why do you think I'm different?


The discussion becomes bad when people who think they know start spreading their assumptions as facts.

How many times have you read the following: "There's a rumor that...."

When you ask that person where he heard the rumor, the answer is "nowhere". Then it turns out it's not a rumor at all, it's just this guy's own personal assumption!

One guy reads it and posts it somewhere else and then it's on Blabbermouth!

jarmo, you do a good job for the band. No one is questioning that. Your treatment of the fans is a different story.

It's a lot easier to believe the band when you're not attacking people over trivial questions or comments, that you find negative.

If you don't understand how poorly you treat people here, then I don't know what to tell you.

What a broad generalization!

Way to go.


I don't treat "people" poorly. I just don't have that much respect for people who stab the band in the back on a regular basis while yelling "we love GN'R!".

You are. That's the sad thing. Not because of the work you do, but how you make everything personal. You reflect on the band. When you treat people like shit, it's like the band is treating them like shit. Because of your work with the band you are a represenation of GNR on this board.

Once again, two different messages.


On one hand, I got people like you telling me I'm a nobody and now I'm made a spokesperson for the band?

I post what I think, unless I say it's from somebody else.


You and others like you, for example younggunner, seem to have this hole "you're not in the band" thing going.

You made it up, not me!


You're putting me down and then you're lifting me up so you can have another reason to put me down.

I don't doubt you put up with a lot of shit. I'm not telling you how to run your site, only to take a look on how you're treating people here, and how that reflects on the band.

As I said, you are making some broad generalizations.


I have a lot of people who respect what this place is about.

Maybe they're not "people" because you already labeled them as "zealots" and having mental problems.

I don't hate that they post here, I don't like the posts that are made that are entirely directed at getting the GNR camps attention.

So you don't hate it, but you attack me for it.

Weird.

Do you feel if Beta, or Fernando didn't post here, Jarmo may be "more" honest about his thoughts in regarding GNR. 

Are you serious?

I tell my opinion just like everybody else.



I just don't see the point in whining about stuff I have no control over especially when I know the band are trying their hardest to make things happen.

I'm gonna be really excited the day the album comes out, but it doesn't mean I have to post "give us a release date" day after day. It just seems like a waste of time to me.




For those of you who see me as the worst thing that has happened to GN'R, I feel sorry for you. Really.

Having that kind of jealous anger just seems like a total waste of energy. I hope it makes your days better.







/jarmo

[cybercurves]

If jarmo is... "THE most damaging thing to happen to GNR"... then why is this Board the most credible?  Seems to me the guy who's making the accusations can't handle the truth. 

[daviebuckethead]

this board is the most credible because it is almost run by the band in some shape or form.

on this board we talk about about what the band allow us to talk about. essentially we are censored by Jarmo, but it comes down from high.

there have been a lot of points made in this thread and i can see both sides, both pros and cons.

I Jarmo, we have a webmaster who is directly spoken to by GnR representatives, which is good. On other the otherhand the censorship issue's, posts being deleted and labelling of people as "bashers" because the dont tow the party line has driven a lot of people away. People dont like being told what the can and cant think/ say, and see the censorship as the band trying to stifle opinions/ free speech, ultimately it generated a lot of bad feeling by people who were real die hards.