record company and CD

[gunns1]

I thought the band already had a contract with a label. To attempt to renegotiate when they already have a deal, is bad enough, but to do so when the album has taken so long, is as I said greed. There is no other word for it. It isn't like there was no deal already in place. I guess they have just decided they want a better one than the one they previously agreed to.

Always good to see another expert of record companies.

Have you considered that perhaps, for instance, when they first started making the record that things like digital downloads weren't accounted for?

True, but at the same time, theirs many ways around this, and the Record company, as many other record companies have learned to adapt to the changes of the music industry. Sure, its hard to make a profit on music in todays society, but at the same time,
just as technology has moved forward, so has the way of releasing music in different ways, and different ways of marketing/cashing in.
The record company has had like what, 5- or so years to adapt to the age of digital downloads,
Its not like its happened overnight, Napster was the start of the digital music evolution, and that is , off memory, over 7 years ago, so
Its the record companies fault for not changing with the times, and just sitting back  with fingers crossed hoping that everyone will go out and spend 30 bucks on
an album again. The people who stand still are the people that get left behind.

The record company need to have a good marketing plan implemented such as (this was mentioned in the marketing thread)
Have like 250 000 Cds ready for pre order, and until every order has been sold, only then Release the cds to the people who have pre purchased it
this maximises sales thus profit/etc. Kinda like a hostage tactic, which is necessary in todays world when dealing with pirates.

[quarky]

I am not sure why so many think the "hostage tactic" will solve all the problems. Simply buy 10 copies, and then return 9 of them via the "Distance Selling Act" or whatever your local version is..

[jarmo]

I thought the band already had a contract with a label. To attempt to renegotiate when they already have a deal, is bad enough, but to do so when the album has taken so long, is as I said greed. There is no other word for it. It isn't like there was no deal already in place. I guess they have just decided they want a better one than the one they previously agreed to.

Always good to see another expert of record companies.

Have you considered that perhaps, for instance, when they first started making the record that things like digital downloads weren't accounted for?

Yes I have. Why do *you* think digital downloads make any difference?

So an artist shouldn't get paid for digital album sales because it's not mentioned in the original contract that was drafted out before the invention of digital downloads?



/jarmo

[wight gunner]

The whole dynamic has changed with digital, no manufactoring costs to speak of, distribution from a central source and above everything else, the costs that once were claimed by and agreed in respect of the label have shrunk, thus meaning a whole lot more wedge for the label without doing anything.

The %ages of costs would be needed to be re arranged to cope with the 2008 situation rather than what was agreed in the last century    contract...

[quarky]

I thought the band already had a contract with a label. To attempt to renegotiate when they already have a deal, is bad enough, but to do so when the album has taken so long, is as I said greed. There is no other word for it. It isn't like there was no deal already in place. I guess they have just decided they want a better one than the one they previously agreed to.

Always good to see another expert of record companies.

Have you considered that perhaps, for instance, when they first started making the record that things like digital downloads weren't accounted for?

Yes I have. Why do *you* think digital downloads make any difference?

So an artist shouldn't get paid for digital album sales because it's not mentioned in the original contract that was drafted out before the invention of digital downloads?



/jarmo

It seems logical that contracts work on "product sales", unless you are claiming that everyone had to rush to redo contracts when tapes came out, then when CD's came out, then DVD's etc. If you have any information to share on this, I would be more than happy to read it, otherwise it looks like a cash-grab (which I have defended the band against when it comes to tours).

Not that I have any problem with it, *except* when people claim that GnR are some kind of mythical band who are doing it purely for the art. They are not. They are band like any other, who want to profit from their record like any other. Lets stop turning Axl into the messiah.

Oh, and before you claim that the contact would be specific on formats (rather than product sales), then the label would have no right to publish it digitally either without the bands consent (unless you are going to claim that the renumeration is based on CD/tape, while the publishing rights are done with broad sweeping statements).

[quarky]

The whole dynamic has changed with digital, no manufactoring costs to speak of, distribution from a central source and above everything else, the costs that once were claimed by and agreed in respect of the label have shrunk, thus meaning a whole lot more wedge for the label without doing anything.

The %ages of costs would be needed to be re arranged to cope with the 2008 situation rather than what was agreed in the last century    contract...

No they don't. It isn't the labels fault that the album too so long as do. It was a contract that the band still have not fulfilled.

As I said though, I have no problem with the band going for more money as long as everyone recognises it as such.

[jarmo]

It seems logical that contracts work on "product sales", unless you are claiming that everyone had to rush to redo contracts when tapes came out, then when CD's came out, then DVD's etc. If you have any information to share on this, I would be more than happy to read it, otherwise it looks like a cash-grab (which I have defended the band against when it comes to tours).

Not that I have any problem with it, *except* when people claim that GnR are some kind of mythical band who are doing it purely for the art. They are not. They are band like any other, who want to profit from their record like any other. Lets stop turning Axl into the messiah.

Oh, and before you claim that the contact would be specific on formats (rather than product sales), then the label would have no right to publish it digitally either without the bands consent (unless you are going to claim that the renumeration is based on CD/tape, while the publishing rights are done with broad sweeping statements).

Correct me if I'm wrong, but artists get paid a percentage of the price of a LP, cassette or CD.

In the case of digital downloads, shouldn't the percentage be different since the distribution method differs from traditional releases?




/jarmo

[quarky]

You tell me? I thought the artist gets a % of the price for each sale. I don't know if it differs by media type or not in their contract.

As I said though, if it does, then obviously LP, Cassette, and CD are in the contract. That is why the label can release the album on those formats right? If digital downloads are not listed in the contract, but the other formats are, then the label cannot release on that format anyway since it hasn't been included. So again, it comes down to the band wanting more money which every way you dice it.

As I said though, I have no problems with the band wanting more money, lets just all open and accept it for what it is.

[ppbebe]

or the label wanting more money. it depends on from what angle you're looking at it.
either way it's still a rumour we don't know if there's any truth to it.


quarky, making something purely for the art doesn't make the artist a messiah.
to be greedy for good music, that's also greed. we're all somewhat greedy.

[jarmo]

I don't think things are that easy.

Everybody knows that music sales have declined.

Bands put out music for free because they know they can make more money other ways.




/jarmo

[GNR4L]

I don't know if Axl could do this but could he buyout he and the bands contract from Geffen and take the album to say Live Nation and sign a deal with them and a tour ?

[bazgnr]

I don't think things are that easy.

Everybody knows that music sales have declined.

Bands put out music for free because they know they can make more money other ways.

/jarmo

Agreed.  The music - free or otherwise - is used to fuel concert tickets, merchandise, and any and all other ways of generating income in light of dwindling album sales.  However, I think that the key phrase in what you wrote is "bands put out music."  I have no doubt that new GnR music would fuel the touring and merchandise machine, but first, they have to actually release something in some form.  Which brings us back full circle to all of the various "what's the holdup now?"  discussions.   It seems reasonable to assume that *everyone* wants the music released, leaving speculation to legal issues, format and timing of album(s) release, etc.   Here's to new music, and soon!

[lakersaregreat]

I don't know if Axl could do this but could he buyout he and the bands contract from Geffen and take the album to say Live Nation and sign a deal with them and a tour ?

yes, he can. it will only cost $$$$.

[Crowebar]

I bet it's a bit confusing trying to figure out who's going to get what $$$ considering the amount of people that have worked on this monstrosity of a project.   

I can't wait to see the liner notes to read all the names. 

Bet ya' ten bucks that Izzy's name pops up somewhere, somehow. 

[*Timothy*]

I have beeen sing and dancing ...to the same old song and dance.

[misterID]

I'm starting to think that there may not be that big of a hold up anymore.

[daviebuckethead]

meaning??

[ppbebe]

things are moving as you sing and dance to the same old song and dance. that I suppose is the meaning.

[bodine]

I'm starting to think that there may not be that big of a hold up anymore.

What's changed?

[GNR4L]

I'm starting to think that there may not be that big of a hold up anymore.

I agree I think around spring time we will have what we have all waited for !!! sounds like 2008 is gonna be the summer of Rock.