2008 Baseball Season/Off-Season Discussion

[freedom78]

Manny's a Dodger, Griffey Jr. is on the White Sox, and Jason Bay is on the Red Sox. Sums up today I would think?

Not quite.  Cubs completed a four game road sweep of the Brew Crew.  Always nice to see that.

[faldor]

Manny's a Dodger, Griffey Jr. is on the White Sox, and Jason Bay is on the Red Sox. Sums up today I would think?

How about the Pirates pulling off a good deal for themselves for once?  They got FOUR prospects, three that can play right away for ONE player.  Makes you wonder more and more about the deal they made with the Yanks last weekend.  
Here's my final thoughts on Manny.  It just had to be done this time.  In years past he had sat out critical games and you never knew when and if he was gonna play, but the Red Sox had him under control contractually.  This year he saw the light at the end of the tunnel of free agency and the Sox really didn't have as much control anymore.  He clearly wanted out and the Sox were clearly not gonna pick up his options.  If they could've been guaranteed that Manny would be a good boy and play every day I'm sure they would've sucked it up.  But he couldn't be trusted.  He shut it down in 2006 when they dropped out of contention, so who's to say he wouldn't have done that again?  In fact, it was reported that he was going to request to be placed on the DL and miss the Yankees and Angels series altogether.  Who's to say there wouldn't be more of that down the stretch.  It was obvious Manny was more concerned with himself than the Red Sox.  He wanted to make sure he gets taken care of after this season.  So if his knee is giving him a little problem, he might not want to press it and go out there at less than 100%.  While Jason Bay may not be the hitter Manny is, you can pretty much guarantee he won't put up the antics and shenanigans that Manny did.  He'll go out there every day, as long as he's healthy enough, and do his best.  All in all, the Sox may be a weaker team on paper after this trade, I don't think the dropoff will be that great in reality.  

With all that being said, I expect Manny to have a great 2 months in LA and for the Dodgers to push past the D'backs.  And with all the headaches Manny has caused Red Sox Nation over the years, I hold no ill will towards him (even though he pretty much forced the Sox to trade him).  He earned every penny of the 160 million dollar contract he signed back in 2001.  And he was a huge part of two World Series teams.  For that I will be forever grateful.  So good luck Manny.  I hate to see him go, but it was time.  I just hope the fans don't put unfair expectations on Jason Bay.  He's not Manny Ramirez, let's remember that.

[tim_m]

If Manny goes to the NL, every AL manager is going to stand up at their desks, and do a happy dance.  Joe Girardi will likely send flowers, wine, candy, and whatever else he can think of (fruit baskets??!!) to the Red Sox front office.

I will personally raise a toast to the Red Sox front office if the deal goes through.....Manny KILLS us.  And if he goes to Florida, I''ll have to see him maybe once every 5 years (or possibly in the W.S., I guess).  That being said, I ain't celebrating til the deal gets done.  I fully expect Manny to continue to be Manny in beantown at 4:01 this afternoon.

And, FYI, Bay is a solid player.  But he's not Manny.  His numbers are similar, this year....but I don't think there is a player on the planet that is an "upgrade" from Manny at the plate in his position.  IMHO, the Sox, even if they get Bay, get WORSE when Manny goes.  He needs to go.  He should go.  But the Sox are going to have to hurt themselves to let him go, IMHO.  The question is: Will it hurt enough to take them out of contention.....

And on the Yanks/Pudge trade.....I must be one of the only Yanks fans to not be psyched about this trade.  I know Pudge is an all time great, but I just don't think he's the guy he was.  And the bullpen has been SOOOO good for the Yanks...I don't get why you break that up.  Farnsworth is, admittedly, one of those guys I cringe ever time he takes the mound...but not so much because of what he's done this year.  He's actually been pretty good this year.  I guess with Marte and Enwar Ramirez, you got a couple guys who can bridge that 7th or 8th (depending on what they decide...Veras in the 8th or 7th???), but I'm just not sure I'd want to part with Farnsworth for "rent-a-Pudge" this year.  I mean...C'mon...we all know, unless Posada's recovery from surgery goes completely awful and the guy can't throw again....Pudge isn't staying past this year.  He's a FA at the end of the season, in any event...and I can't think of a reason why the Yanks would sign him. 

They're certainly loaded for bear, NOW....

Well lets break out the wine and have a few drinks. Manny is gone! I can't see one pitcher or manager in the AL not happy about this outside of boston.

[Layne Staley's Sunglasses]

Dem Bums got hosed.

We have the worst outfield in the MLB.

Manny, Fatdruw, and whoever is in right these days.

Manny played at Fenway, a tremendously hitter friendly park.

Chavez Ravine?  Not so much!  He might hit 5-10 HR's, but that's it.  The Diamondbacks just punched their ticket to the playoffs.

NedCo = Worst GM in baseball.

[faldor]

Dem Bums got hosed.

We have the worst outfield in the MLB.

Manny, Fatdruw, and whoever is in right these days.

Manny played at Fenway, a tremendously hitter friendly park.

Chavez Ravine?  Not so much!  He might hit 5-10 HR's, but that's it.  The Diamondbacks just punched their ticket to the playoffs.

NedCo = Worst GM in baseball.

Wow, you're the first person I've heard that hasn't loved this deal for the Dodgers.  Well, actually the second.  I just read a guys opinion on www.rotoworld.com.  He thought the Dodgers gave up a lot, with LaRoche and Morris.  I think Manny will hit just fine.  Although the more I think about it.  The Dodgers lineup is not the Red Sox lineup.  And as you pointed out, Dodger Stadium is not Fenway Park.  And yes Manny might just get lost in the spacious outfield in LA.  That should lead to some interesting plays.  My initial thought though was that Manny would push the Dodgers past the D'backs, so I'm gonna stick with that for now.  It's like a Boston reunion there with Nomar, D-Lowe, and Manny.  Too bad Bill Mueller and Grady Little have moved on.

[faldor]

If Manny goes to the NL, every AL manager is going to stand up at their desks, and do a happy dance.  Joe Girardi will likely send flowers, wine, candy, and whatever else he can think of (fruit baskets??!!) to the Red Sox front office.

I will personally raise a toast to the Red Sox front office if the deal goes through.....Manny KILLS us.  And if he goes to Florida, I''ll have to see him maybe once every 5 years (or possibly in the W.S., I guess).  That being said, I ain't celebrating til the deal gets done.  I fully expect Manny to continue to be Manny in beantown at 4:01 this afternoon.

And, FYI, Bay is a solid player.  But he's not Manny.  His numbers are similar, this year....but I don't think there is a player on the planet that is an "upgrade" from Manny at the plate in his position.  IMHO, the Sox, even if they get Bay, get WORSE when Manny goes.  He needs to go.  He should go.  But the Sox are going to have to hurt themselves to let him go, IMHO.  The question is: Will it hurt enough to take them out of contention.....

And on the Yanks/Pudge trade.....I must be one of the only Yanks fans to not be psyched about this trade.  I know Pudge is an all time great, but I just don't think he's the guy he was.  And the bullpen has been SOOOO good for the Yanks...I don't get why you break that up.  Farnsworth is, admittedly, one of those guys I cringe ever time he takes the mound...but not so much because of what he's done this year.  He's actually been pretty good this year.  I guess with Marte and Enwar Ramirez, you got a couple guys who can bridge that 7th or 8th (depending on what they decide...Veras in the 8th or 7th???), but I'm just not sure I'd want to part with Farnsworth for "rent-a-Pudge" this year.  I mean...C'mon...we all know, unless Posada's recovery from surgery goes completely awful and the guy can't throw again....Pudge isn't staying past this year.  He's a FA at the end of the season, in any event...and I can't think of a reason why the Yanks would sign him. 

They're certainly loaded for bear, NOW....

Well lets break out the wine and have a few drinks. Manny is gone! I can't see one pitcher or manager in the AL not happy about this outside of boston.

Agreed that most of the AL teams fighting for a playoff spot are probably smiling a little wider tonight.  But before they get so giddy, let me say this.  Manny is a great hitter and he will be greatly missed by the Red Sox IF they make the playoffs.  But I'm not so sure how much he'll be missed for the next 2 months.  His act had finally worn on the team, both management and players.  His antics, for the first time in his tenure with the Sox, outweighed his offensive output.  And the uncertainty of when and if Manny was going to play on a day to day basis is now gone.  They can go with a solid group every day from here on out.  And let's not forget that Jason Bay is a pretty good hitter.  His numbers are comparable to Manny's.  And of course Manny is in a much better lineup and played in a much more hitter friendly park.  Of course, Bay played in the NL which has inferior pitching and has never played for a winning team so it remains to be seen how he reacts.  But on the face of it, at least they got someone who can hit and fill in some of the gaps that come with the loss of Ramirez.  They will still send a pretty darn good lineup 1-7 every day.  But of course, the 3/4 goes from deadly to now just, good.

And I meant to comment on this before.  Pilferk commented on the Pudge deal and how he wasn't too psyched about it.  I think people looked at that deal and got excited because Pudge is a flashy household name.  But ever since he stopped using ster-, I mean got skinnier, he hasn't been the same hitter.  He's still a good offensive catcher, which few teams have.  But Molina is better defensively at this stage, and did the Yankees really need another hitter in their lineup?  I mean I know they've lacked offense from the catching position this year, but who hasn't?  It's not always necessary to have a .300 hitter at every position.  Again, I'm not saying it's a bad deal, but I don't think it's the big blockbuster steal that some people are making it out to be.

[Layne Staley's Sunglasses]

Dem Bums got hosed.

We have the worst outfield in the MLB.

Manny, Fatdruw, and whoever is in right these days.

Manny played at Fenway, a tremendously hitter friendly park.

Chavez Ravine?  Not so much!  He might hit 5-10 HR's, but that's it.  The Diamondbacks just punched their ticket to the playoffs.

NedCo = Worst GM in baseball.

Wow, you're the first person I've heard that hasn't loved this deal for the Dodgers.  Well, actually the second.  I just read a guys opinion on www.rotoworld.com.  He thought the Dodgers gave up a lot, with LaRoche and Morris.  I think Manny will hit just fine.  Although the more I think about it.  The Dodgers lineup is not the Red Sox lineup.  And as you pointed out, Dodger Stadium is not Fenway Park.  And yes Manny might just get lost in the spacious outfield in LA.  That should lead to some interesting plays.  My initial thought though was that Manny would push the Dodgers past the D'backs, so I'm gonna stick with that for now.  It's like a Boston reunion there with Nomar, D-Lowe, and Manny.  Too bad Bill Mueller and Grady Little have moved on.

Dodger Stadium- Where Red Sox greats come to die.

I have to admit, I am a big LaRoche fan boi, he's going to be great!

Oh by the way, the Red Sox won't make the playoffs.

[faldor]

Dem Bums got hosed.

We have the worst outfield in the MLB.

Manny, Fatdruw, and whoever is in right these days.

Manny played at Fenway, a tremendously hitter friendly park.

Chavez Ravine?  Not so much!  He might hit 5-10 HR's, but that's it.  The Diamondbacks just punched their ticket to the playoffs.

NedCo = Worst GM in baseball.

Wow, you're the first person I've heard that hasn't loved this deal for the Dodgers.  Well, actually the second.  I just read a guys opinion on www.rotoworld.com.  He thought the Dodgers gave up a lot, with LaRoche and Morris.  I think Manny will hit just fine.  Although the more I think about it.  The Dodgers lineup is not the Red Sox lineup.  And as you pointed out, Dodger Stadium is not Fenway Park.  And yes Manny might just get lost in the spacious outfield in LA.  That should lead to some interesting plays.  My initial thought though was that Manny would push the Dodgers past the D'backs, so I'm gonna stick with that for now.  It's like a Boston reunion there with Nomar, D-Lowe, and Manny.  Too bad Bill Mueller and Grady Little have moved on.

Dodger Stadium- Where Red Sox greats come to die.

I have to admit, I am a big LaRoche fan boi, he's going to be great!

Oh by the way, the Red Sox won't make the playoffs.

We'll see.  It's not gonna be easy.  There's a 3 team race in the Central and the East, 6 teams only 3 spots.  I think they have just as good a shot as any of those 6 teams though.  The Angels are the only team that's separated itself from the pack.  The Sox need to get their pitching in order.  Beckett needs to pitch more like Beckett.  I'm convinced he's not gonna get back his form of last year, but he's got to pitch better than he is now.  Lester is the only guy going well right now.  I'm hoping Colon can come back and join the rotation as the #5 starter and they can move Buccholz to the pen, because he's certainly not helping as the #5 right now.  Sounds crazy to say, but even with the loss of Manny I'm more concerned with the pitching than I am with the offense.  They'll still score plenty of runs.

[Layne Staley's Sunglasses]

Dem Bums got hosed.

We have the worst outfield in the MLB.

Manny, Fatdruw, and whoever is in right these days.

Manny played at Fenway, a tremendously hitter friendly park.

Chavez Ravine?  Not so much!  He might hit 5-10 HR's, but that's it.  The Diamondbacks just punched their ticket to the playoffs.

NedCo = Worst GM in baseball.

Wow, you're the first person I've heard that hasn't loved this deal for the Dodgers.  Well, actually the second.  I just read a guys opinion on www.rotoworld.com.  He thought the Dodgers gave up a lot, with LaRoche and Morris.  I think Manny will hit just fine.  Although the more I think about it.  The Dodgers lineup is not the Red Sox lineup.  And as you pointed out, Dodger Stadium is not Fenway Park.  And yes Manny might just get lost in the spacious outfield in LA.  That should lead to some interesting plays.  My initial thought though was that Manny would push the Dodgers past the D'backs, so I'm gonna stick with that for now.  It's like a Boston reunion there with Nomar, D-Lowe, and Manny.  Too bad Bill Mueller and Grady Little have moved on.

Dodger Stadium- Where Red Sox greats come to die.

I have to admit, I am a big LaRoche fan boi, he's going to be great!

Oh by the way, the Red Sox won't make the playoffs.

We'll see.  It's not gonna be easy.  There's a 3 team race in the Central and the East, 6 teams only 3 spots.  I think they have just as good a shot as any of those 6 teams though.  The Angels are the only team that's separated itself from the pack.  The Sox need to get their pitching in order.  Beckett needs to pitch more like Beckett.  I'm convinced he's not gonna get back his form of last year, but he's got to pitch better than he is now.  Lester is the only guy going well right now.  I'm hoping Colon can come back and join the rotation as the #5 starter and they can move Buccholz to the pen, because he's certainly not helping as the #5 right now.  Sounds crazy to say, but even with the loss of Manny I'm more concerned with the pitching than I am with the offense.  They'll still score plenty of runs.

The Rays will win the AL East.

The Yankees will take the Wild Card spot.

End of.

[freedom78]

The Rays will win the AL East.

That would rule.

[Layne Staley's Sunglasses]

The Rays will win the AL East.

That would rule.

Tell me about it!  Dick Vitale would wet himself!

The Yankees are the best in the AL in my opinion.  They are just warming up.

[tim_m]

The Rays will win the AL East.

That would rule.

Tell me about it!  Dick Vitale would wet himself!

The Yankees are the best in the AL in my opinion.  They are just warming up.

I'm not sure i agree with you and i'm a yankee fan. I think the angels are at least at the moment.

[Layne Staley's Sunglasses]

The Rays will win the AL East.

That would rule.

Tell me about it!  Dick Vitale would wet himself!

The Yankees are the best in the AL in my opinion.  They are just warming up.

I'm not sure i agree with you and i'm a yankee fan. I think the angels are at least at the moment.

Who cares about the regular season anyway?

The Angels will bow out during the ALDS.

[tim_m]

The Rays will win the AL East.

That would rule.

Tell me about it!  Dick Vitale would wet himself!

The Yankees are the best in the AL in my opinion.  They are just warming up.

I'm not sure i agree with you and i'm a yankee fan. I think the angels are at least at the moment.

Who cares about the regular season anyway?

The Angels will bow out during the ALDS.

Yankees have to get there first though. 

[pilferk]

The Rays will win the AL East.

The Yankees will take the Wild Card spot.

End of.

We have to start winning games again for that to happen.

And Minnesota is going pretty hot right now.

I HOPE you're right.  By the same token, it wouldn't shock me to see BOTH the Yanks and the Sox on the outside looking in at the end of the year.

[pilferk]

How about the Pirates pulling off a good deal for themselves for once?  They got FOUR prospects, three that can play right away for ONE player.  Makes you wonder more and more about the deal they made with the Yanks last weekend. 
Here's my final thoughts on Manny.  It just had to be done this time.  In years past he had sat out critical games and you never knew when and if he was gonna play, but the Red Sox had him under control contractually.  This year he saw the light at the end of the tunnel of free agency and the Sox really didn't have as much control anymore.  He clearly wanted out and the Sox were clearly not gonna pick up his options.  If they could've been guaranteed that Manny would be a good boy and play every day I'm sure they would've sucked it up.  But he couldn't be trusted.  He shut it down in 2006 when they dropped out of contention, so who's to say he wouldn't have done that again?  In fact, it was reported that he was going to request to be placed on the DL and miss the Yankees and Angels series altogether.  Who's to say there wouldn't be more of that down the stretch.  It was obvious Manny was more concerned with himself than the Red Sox.  He wanted to make sure he gets taken care of after this season.  So if his knee is giving him a little problem, he might not want to press it and go out there at less than 100%.  While Jason Bay may not be the hitter Manny is, you can pretty much guarantee he won't put up the antics and shenanigans that Manny did.  He'll go out there every day, as long as he's healthy enough, and do his best.  All in all, the Sox may be a weaker team on paper after this trade, I don't think the dropoff will be that great in reality. 

With all that being said, I expect Manny to have a great 2 months in LA and for the Dodgers to push past the D'backs.  And with all the headaches Manny has caused Red Sox Nation over the years, I hold no ill will towards him (even though he pretty much forced the Sox to trade him).  He earned every penny of the 160 million dollar contract he signed back in 2001.  And he was a huge part of two World Series teams.  For that I will be forever grateful.  So good luck Manny.  I hate to see him go, but it was time.  I just hope the fans don't put unfair expectations on Jason Bay.  He's not Manny Ramirez, let's remember that.

I agree...damned if they do, damned if they don't with Manny.

But I disagree about it all working out on paper.  First off, there's no way Bay is a "replacement" for Manny.....maybe for a "dogging it" Manny, but not for the Manny who was such a big part of those two WS championships.  In addiition, Bay is certainly not going to protect Ortiz like Manny did....it doesn't even look like he's going to hit right after him in the lineup.  Lowell, who looks like he's going to inherit Manny's spot in the lineup. is not going to protect Ortiz, either.  Losing Manny ultimately effects your entire lineup AND the way pitchers approach it....make it a LOT easier for opposing teams.  And that's the one thing Manny provides even when he's "dogging it".  As long as he's on the field, you just don't know which Manny is going to be at the plate....so you have to approach it like it's the "regular Manny" and not the "dogging it" Manny...cause there's just no way to tell when he'll decide it's time to bite.

One thing:  You Sox fans now have a reason to hate Scott Boras as much as we do.  You KNOW this whole thing was because Manny has it in his head he can get a 100 million, 4 year deal if he's a free agent next year.  And he didn't want the Sox picking up his option for next year.   It has shades of the debacle with A-rod, LAST year, all over it.  Granted, handled very differently, but still:  Someone is whispering those numbers to Manny....and, IMHO, they're completely unreasonable expectations....and I'll give you one guess who that is....

[faldor]

Yeah this whole thing with Manny sure did spiral out of control so quickly.  He seemed so happy and like a new guy at the beginning of the year.  He got off to a hot start and he looked destined to have a huge year and silence the critics who thought he was on a downturn after a below average year (for his standards).  I don't know how, when, or why things changed.  But they did, and fast.  Even with his pushing the travelling secretary (Costanza), to the in dugout fight with Youkilis, I never dreamed he would've been traded until the incidents after the all star break.  It's like Boras got to him during the break and told him it was time to start operation piss off the Sox and force them to trade you right away.  And it worked. 

I hear you pilferk.  Obviously the Sox aren't any better today than they would be with Manny, and all the AL teams would agree.  But I honestly believe that they were at the point of no return and as a Sox fan I have to look at it as you weren't going to have the 100% committed Manny for the final 2 months.  You'd have the dogging it, don't know what to expect Manny.  And they couldn't have continued on that road.  So in that sense, they are not much worse off.  Compared to the 2 world series teams, obviously they're weaker, but the chances of this team reaching that level died after the all star break.  They've been horrible the last 2 weeks and a change was needed.  Obviously Ortiz doesn't have the same protection, although Lowell filled in just fine hitting cleanup last year when Manny was injured.  I still contend that the Sox will be okay for these final 2 months.  The loss of Manny would be far more evident in the playoffs, IF they were to make it that far.  It all comes down to their pitching, as I think they will be able to score enough runs.  The loss of Manny doesn't turn them into the Mariners or Padres overnight.  They still have plenty of good hitters in their lineup, but if their pitching doesn't improve they won't make the playoffs.

I also agree, it wouldn't surprise me one bit if both the Yankees and Red Sox miss out on the playoffs this year.  The Twins are a solid bunch and the Tigers are back in the mix.  And I don't agree with Archie that the Yankees are the best team in the AL.  The Angels are the best, hands down.  The Yankees still have plenty of questions up and down their roster, they are far from flawless.  The Angels have folded in the post-season the past couple of years because they haven't been good enough.  They have a far better team this year with the additions of Texeira and Hunter, and they're pitching better as well.  It should be an interesting and exciting stretch run.

[Layne Staley's Sunglasses]

How about the Pirates pulling off a good deal for themselves for once?  They got FOUR prospects, three that can play right away for ONE player.  Makes you wonder more and more about the deal they made with the Yanks last weekend. 
Here's my final thoughts on Manny.  It just had to be done this time.  In years past he had sat out critical games and you never knew when and if he was gonna play, but the Red Sox had him under control contractually.  This year he saw the light at the end of the tunnel of free agency and the Sox really didn't have as much control anymore.  He clearly wanted out and the Sox were clearly not gonna pick up his options.  If they could've been guaranteed that Manny would be a good boy and play every day I'm sure they would've sucked it up.  But he couldn't be trusted.  He shut it down in 2006 when they dropped out of contention, so who's to say he wouldn't have done that again?  In fact, it was reported that he was going to request to be placed on the DL and miss the Yankees and Angels series altogether.  Who's to say there wouldn't be more of that down the stretch.  It was obvious Manny was more concerned with himself than the Red Sox.  He wanted to make sure he gets taken care of after this season.  So if his knee is giving him a little problem, he might not want to press it and go out there at less than 100%.  While Jason Bay may not be the hitter Manny is, you can pretty much guarantee he won't put up the antics and shenanigans that Manny did.  He'll go out there every day, as long as he's healthy enough, and do his best.  All in all, the Sox may be a weaker team on paper after this trade, I don't think the dropoff will be that great in reality. 

With all that being said, I expect Manny to have a great 2 months in LA and for the Dodgers to push past the D'backs.  And with all the headaches Manny has caused Red Sox Nation over the years, I hold no ill will towards him (even though he pretty much forced the Sox to trade him).  He earned every penny of the 160 million dollar contract he signed back in 2001.  And he was a huge part of two World Series teams.  For that I will be forever grateful.  So good luck Manny.  I hate to see him go, but it was time.  I just hope the fans don't put unfair expectations on Jason Bay.  He's not Manny Ramirez, let's remember that.

I agree...damned if they do, damned if they don't with Manny.

But I disagree about it all working out on paper.  First off, there's no way Bay is a "replacement" for Manny.....maybe for a "dogging it" Manny, but not for the Manny who was such a big part of those two WS championships.  In addiition, Bay is certainly not going to protect Ortiz like Manny did....it doesn't even look like he's going to hit right after him in the lineup.  Lowell, who looks like he's going to inherit Manny's spot in the lineup. is not going to protect Ortiz, either.  Losing Manny ultimately effects your entire lineup AND the way pitchers approach it....make it a LOT easier for opposing teams.  And that's the one thing Manny provides even when he's "dogging it".  As long as he's on the field, you just don't know which Manny is going to be at the plate....so you have to approach it like it's the "regular Manny" and not the "dogging it" Manny...cause there's just no way to tell when he'll decide it's time to bite.

One thing:  You Sox fans now have a reason to hate Scott Boras as much as we do.  You KNOW this whole thing was because Manny has it in his head he can get a 100 million, 4 year deal if he's a free agent next year.  And he didn't want the Sox picking up his option for next year.   It has shades of the debacle with A-rod, LAST year, all over it.  Granted, handled very differently, but still:  Someone is whispering those numbers to Manny....and, IMHO, they're completely unreasonable expectations....and I'll give you one guess who that is....

Yeah, and Ned Coletti is that guy.  (Who will pay Manny the big bucks.)

He gave Fandruw Jones a fat contract.  Juan Pierre is making huge bucks sitting on the bench, and Jason Schmidt is being paid handsomely to pitch in AA.

I don't see the Yankees missing the playoffs with the addition of Pudge.  That position was their weakest, and now they have filled that hole.

Manny makes his debut tonight, thank Axl he didn't have to face Webb last night.  0 for 4 with 4 K's, that would have been his stat line.

[faldor]

I'm sorry, Archie I've gotta disagree with you a bit here.  While adding Pudge is a plus for the Yanks, I certainly don't see it as the "missing piece".  Even if he does improve their offensive output at the catcher position (how many teams have good hitting catchers anyway) they still are not flawless in all other areas.  I suggest you re=evaluate their roster.  Again I'm not saying they're a bad team, they have obviously improved their team with the recent trades, but they needed to do so.  They weren't a playoff caliber team before, now they MAY have reached that level.  It's still gonna be a fight though.  Pudge of 1997 may have put them over the top, but Pudge 2008, I'm sorry he's just a slight improvement.

[Layne Staley's Sunglasses]

I'm sorry, Archie I've gotta disagree with you a bit here.  While adding Pudge is a plus for the Yanks, I certainly don't see it as the "missing piece".  Even if he does improve their offensive output at the catcher position (how many teams have good hitting catchers anyway) they still are not flawless in all other areas.  I suggest you re=evaluate their roster.  Again I'm not saying they're a bad team, they have obviously improved their team with the recent trades, but they needed to do so.  They weren't a playoff caliber team before, now they MAY have reached that level.  It's still gonna be a fight though.  Pudge of 1997 may have put them over the top, but Pudge 2008, I'm sorry he's just a slight improvement.

He's better than Molina!

Bay had a nice debut for Boston, helping them win the game and all.