2008 Baseball Season/Off-Season Discussion

[pilferk]

i'm surprised the yankees have not signed Texiera or Manny. i guess every team has their limits. maybe they really are feeling the pain of not selling thier luxury boxes.

I think with Manny..it's a wait and see thing.  There's really no competition, so there's no rush....and they want to make Boras and Manny sweat some, to bring down the price.

With Tex....I just don't think they wanna pay the price.  I think their early interest was just to help drive up the price on whoever ultimatley got him.

[faldor]

Ok pilferk.  NOW, I'm scared.  And pissed, outraged, whatever negative adjective you'd like to use.  Yanks have reportedly come to terms with Mark Texeira for 8 years and between 170 and 180 million.  Pretty much the same terms that were reported that the Sox were offering, who knows what to believe though.  Now the Yankees have the 4 highest paid players in baseball.  I hate to bring up the "money" issue because obviously the Red Sox aren't exactly a small market team, but that is just overly ridiculous.  Those 4 players (A-Rod, Jeter, Texeira, and Sabathia) make more than most teams altogether.  It's really sickening.  But, it's been proven that money doesn't buy championships for the last 8 years by the Yanks.  We'll see if they can buck that trend this year.  I'd say now they have a pretty good shot.  I'd have to say they're the favorites, but I don't think it's a slam dunk that they'll win it all.  Anything can happen.  Guys can get hurt, underperform, guys on other teams have career years.  The Rays and Sox still have real solid teams and I don't expect either of them to bow down.  Don't know what the Angels and Sox have planned now.  Angels are apparently not interested in Manny, so he'll probably end up staying with the Dodgers (unless the Yanks sign him too.  Hey why not?  What's another 70 million?).  Who knows what alternate plans the Sox have.  Adam Dunn?  Derek Lowe?  Ben Sheets?

[cotis]

I feel kinda bad for the Red Sox. As I said before, Tex was the one thing they were going to do this off season. Now, where do they turn? They have Drew, Ellsbury, Bay in the OF so that rules out Dunn, IMO. In the rotation they have Lester, Dice-K, Wakefield, Beckett, and Masterson. Move Masterson to the pen and sign Lowe or Sheets? Idk, but I think the same team is good nonetheless. But without any improvements, the Yankees certainly have capitalized on this off season and look to be the better team.

Biased opinion, of course because I'm a NYY fan.

[faldor]

I can't help but admit the Yankees are a better team on paper NOW!  I wasn't willing to admit that before today despite pilferk's pleas.  As I said before, who knows where the Sox go from here.  They really only need help at SS and C and those positions aren't exactly stocked with available talent right now.  They could sign Lowe or Sheets to fill out their rotation but I don't envision any FA signing helping the offense right now.  If they want to acquire a hitter it'd probably be through a trade.  Dunn could play 1B, although he's probably just as good/bad there as Ortiz.


Apparently the Mets are deep into talks with Derek Lowe.

Yahoo' Sports' Gordon Edes says the Mets and free agent Derek Lowe are now deep into talks.

It sounds like Lowe was hoping the Yankees would come through with a big offer, but there's very little chance of that now. The Red Sox aren't believed to have any interest in going past three years with him, while the Mets will probably be willing to sign him for four. He'll probably get $15 million-$16 million per year. Dec. 23 - 5:41 pm et
Source: Yahoo! Sports

[tim_m]

Wow i wasn't expecting us to get Tex too. The thing that is kinda amusing about all this with all the money we have spent this offseason our payroll will still actually go DOWN. It will be under 200 million for the first time in a long time.

[Layne Staley's Sunglasses]

Let 'em have their FA's, it's no big deal.

That organization has become the laughingstock of the league.

[sandman]

i'm surprised the yankees have not signed Texiera or Manny. i guess every team has their limits. maybe they really are feeling the pain of not selling thier luxury boxes.

I think with Manny..it's a wait and see thing.  There's really no competition, so there's no rush....and they want to make Boras and Manny sweat some, to bring down the price.

With Tex....I just don't think they wanna pay the price.  I think their early interest was just to help drive up the price on whoever ultimatley got him.

they paid the price alright.

but it's a good signing. i see less risk with this singing than any other. i think it makes alot of sense for them. their offense was as much a problem for them than anything at times.

on paper they are the best team. but if i had to bet who wins the division, i'd still be leaning towards TB. just the whole "team" thing vs. a collection of players. although it'll probably be tough for TB to pull off that kind of season again.

[western_chaos]

The Yankees have gotton Mark Texiera. I feel like I'm dreaming...

http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news;_ylt=AqevYOz0xVrxJNSooMEpJhCFCLcF?slug=ap-yankees-teixeira&prov=ap&type=lgns

[Jbat81]

NYY pitching looks good, i wish they would sign Abreu, I think hes a good #3 hitter. Arod clean up n Tex on the 5th hole. Lethal... Specially w/Tex now...They can trade Melky and Nady....but itll prob wont happen... Anyway, its lookin real good, hope they perform like they "can/should"!!!
Jbat

[Bodhi]

its about fuckin time the Yankees started taking things a little more seriously...now maybe ill make my way over to a few Yankee games this year...last year I didnt even bother...

[pilferk]

Ok pilferk.  NOW, I'm scared.

And now, you should be.  Not worried...scared.  Because not only have the Yanks gotten significantly better, not only have added a YOUNG big bat, not only have they added some pretty big "protection" for Arod in the lineup...they've also taken the ONE move the Sox could have made in the off season, to radically upgrade them, away.

  And pissed, outraged, whatever negative adjective you'd like to use.  Yanks have reportedly come to terms with Mark Texeira for 8 years and between 170 and 180 million.  Pretty much the same terms that were reported that the Sox were offering, who knows what to believe though.

The difference was about 12 million over the life of the contract.  The Sox were at 168 million for 8 years.  So blame John Henry....who apparently scoffed at less than 2 million per year.  I wouldn't "blame" the Yanks for making a long term move that upgrades them at a position they had a SERIOUS weakness at.  They "get" that you have to spend money to make money.  So, that's what they do.  With the increased projected revenue from the new ballpark, revenues from the YES network, endorsements, merchandise.....they can afford it.  And a LOT of those things COME from spending money.  I don't know how anyone can fault them for spending it...well, I do, but I think it largely stems from the fact they hate the Yankees...since that's the precise argument made against many of the small market teams getting the Yanks money in the form of revenue sharing and luxury tax contributions:  They pocket it and don't reinvest it in the team.

Now the Yankees have the 4 highest paid players in baseball.  I hate to bring up the "money" issue because obviously the Red Sox aren't exactly a small market team, but that is just overly ridiculous. 

Why?  They do it because they can.  I don't get how anyone can question anyone else about the way they spend money......the Sox, the Mets...neither have exactly SMALL payrolls.  AND, I might point out, even with these signings, the Yanks are about 20 to 30 million BELOW last years payroll.

Those 4 players (A-Rod, Jeter, Texeira, and Sabathia) make more than most teams altogether.  It's really sickening.

Which isn't much different than last year...when those players were A-rod,Jeter, Abreu (or Mussina, if you prefer), and Giambi.  Well, it's only different because you'd expect more productivity from Sabathia and Tex this year, for the $$.

But, it's been proven that money doesn't buy championships for the last 8 years by the Yanks.  We'll see if they can buck that trend this year.  I'd say now they have a pretty good shot.  I'd have to say they're the favorites, but I don't think it's a slam dunk that they'll win it all.  Anything can happen.  Guys can get hurt, underperform, guys on other teams have career years. 

I agree.  They still have to play the games.  Witness what happened to us last year.  We had a pretty good lineup and rotation...not stellar, but competitive in comparison.  But they had a pretty big string of injuries and underperforming parts (at least, in part, IMHO, because all the cogs weren't working or in the lineup).

The Rays and Sox still have real solid teams and I don't expect either of them to bow down.  Don't know what the Angels and Sox have planned now.  Angels are apparently not interested in Manny, so he'll probably end up staying with the Dodgers (unless the Yanks sign him too.  Hey why not?  What's another 70 million?).  Who knows what alternate plans the Sox have.  Adam Dunn?  Derek Lowe?  Ben Sheets?

I've heard that Manny is still on the table...but I'd be shocked.  I think it's more likely they'll take Pettite for 12 million a year, and be done.  They might surprise me....they did with Tex.  I just don't see any options open for the Sox to really help them much.  I don't think Lowe or Sheets is a significant ENOUGH upgrade in the rotation for them, and I don't think there's a bat available to upgrade the lineup...unless the Ghosts of Christmas past, present and future visit Manny and convince him to return to Boston and the SAME ghosts visit the Sox ownership and team execs and convince them it's worthwhile to put up with "Manny being Manny" again.  I just don't think the MLGA (Major League Ghosts Association) would allow that kind of work load...I think it violates the union rules.

There's certainly no joy in Beantown this Christmas.

[Layne Staley's Sunglasses]

Tex's inflated numbers come from playing in a WEAK AL West.

[cotis]

Source: http://www.rallymonkey.com/morestats.php?plast=Teixeira&pfirst=Mark


Looking at his stats at different ballparks against different teams, Tex does really well against the Blue Jays, Astros, Angels, Yankees, Orioles, Rays, Indians, A's, Mariners, Houston, Mets, and the Nationals in a large amount of games, about 25+ for each team.

The 'Weak AL West' was great offensively for him, but I don't see how they 'inflate' the numbers...as he does well against numerous teams. Just has more games against AL West opponents.

[Layne Staley's Sunglasses]

Let's see how well he does against Sux and Ray pitchers.

[cotis]

I'd wager on it

[novemberparadise23]

As a yank fan im very excited. For all fans of other teams who complain about the yanks spending i have one thing to ask.... If your team had the means and capabilities to be able to "buy" a player to improve your team, would you not do so? 

[tim_m]

As a yank fan im very excited. For all fans of other teams who complain about the yanks spending i have one thing to ask.... If your team had the means and capabilities to be able to "buy" a player to improve your team, would you not do so? 

Of course they would. Their complaints are rather stupid and pointless, just look at who was in the world series this year. Two teams with payrolls well under $100 million. The luxury tax system is working. People just like to complain.

[faldor]

From Curt Schilling's blog.

from 38 Pitches:

Personally I am glad Youk is staying at first and Mike is at third. Adding Mark's bat is absolutely going to make the Yankees tougher.

Haven't we been down this road before? That's not to say this Yankees team can't win 110 games, it can. But so much has to happen for that to work out.

Please stop with the greedy bum statements too, all of you screaming that would be saying nothing if the Sox had ante'd up. I'm surprised but I don't think nearly as much as most others. Why? Because not once, never, did you hear ANYTHING from Mark in this entire charade. This is how Scott Boras works, and his clients love him for it. Mark never said he wanted Boston, sources 'close to negotiations' did. That and a handful of nickels will get you a quarter.

---------------------

Tex would certainly have made this lineup more potent, but scoring the most runs isn't the solution. You need run prevention and the Sox have that too. Now so do the Yanks, but are you believing that the Yanks just put out $400 mm-plus in contracts and all three players will be worth the deals? When has that ever happened ACROSS a free agent class much less one team.

I think the Steinbrenners, coming off a miserable last season in Yankee Stadium, are dead set on opening the new stadium with a World Series and they don't care how much it costs. Good for them. You can ***** all you want about the Yankees and greed but they spend money in a sincere effort to win it all, every year. What fan wouldn't want their teams to do that.

Theo's not done, at least in my opinion. The club is stocked with VERY tradable young talent and you can bet with this economy teams will be hell bent on unloading supreme talent where possible. Teams other than the NY's, Anaheim's and Boston's.

The AL East just got tougher, if that's possible, and I don't think the counter punches are done being thrown.





That's pretty much how I feel.  I didn't mean to sound like a poor fan of a mid level team that can't compete financially with the Yankees.  The Sox can certainly spend plenty of money, even though NO team can come close to matching the Yanks.  But the Yankees are doing nothing wrong, they're not breaking any rules, they're spending their money to try to win.  That's an admirable thing.  But is it fair?  Should there be a salary cap?  This would hurt the Sox, but it might make things a little more fair across the board.  I mean, you can't honestly say the Pittsburgh Pirates and New York Yankees are playing on an even field?  Then again, plenty of teams have been competitive in recent years with low payrolls, so obviously as has been said plenty of times, money can't buy championships.  So a salary cap may not be the answer, but you can't be surprised when teams like the Marlins or Brewers get a little miffed when the Yankees go out and overspend for a multitude of players.

(That last paragraph was mine, not Curt's)

[tim_m]

Schill is right. They are simply spending the money they have the way they want to, just like every other team is. They may have more than others but that isn't their fault and blaming them for it is wrong. If any other team had their kinda money you bet your ass they'd spend it on players to try and make their team better and thats just what the yankees are doing.

[faldor]

Schill is right. They are simply spending the money they have the way they want to, just like every other team is. They may have more than others but that isn't their fault and blaming them for it is wrong. If any other team had their kinda money you bet your ass they'd spend it on players to try and make their team better and thats just what the yankees are doing.

That's part of the problem actually.  Obviously no other team has as much money as the Yankees, but there are plenty of teams whose owners make a fair amount of money and just pocket it instead of re-investing it into the team to acquire players and make the team better.  All the money that is paid in luxury taxes by the Yankees, Sox, Mets, Angels, etc. that's distributed to the other teams but not all use it as they should.  I really don't have a problem with the Yankees spending the money the way they do.  If they had won the last 8 World Series I might think differently but they haven't won since they started building their teams through free agency, so it's not a proven recipe for winning.  The one thing it does seem to do, is it's hard to ever imagine the Yankees having a BAD season.  I mean last year was a bad season in their terms, but most teams would kill to be in the playoff hunt into September.  Teams that don't spend money can strike gold once in awhile and have great seasons, but that doesn't happen consistently.  The Yanks have had a huge payroll ever since 2000 and while they haven't won it all, they've ALWAYS been in the thick of things.