CD w/ Label = Directly from Richard

[Ines_rocks!]

I tried to explain on the last page.

well yeah... but what?s with the "No, really" at the end? 


lol btw, looking at your avatar... I?m listening right now to Jimi Hendrix! hehe 

[madagas]

In my opinion, Jarmo not deleting this thread means the album was handed in...HUGE STEP. As for Richard's taste, I can only be impressed. Two of my three other favorite current bands are Wilco, Radiohead, and Tool. I especially liked his Radiohead comment...."In my opinion, they are still the most important band of the last two decades."...in other words best band since 1987!

[gunns1]

I tried to explain on the last page.

well yeah... but what?s with the "No, really" at the end??


lol btw, looking at your avatar... I?m listening right now to Jimi Hendrix! hehe?

their making a joke of chinese democracy again,

saying

"NO REALLY"

is like saying,

no really, its coming out this time, we mean it,
we know the other 10000s of times we said its coming out and it didnt,
but this time we really think its coming out...

[Voodoochild]

^^ What gunns1 said.

And yeah Ines, Jimi rocks! Just finished to read his biography by Sharon Lawrence, it makes me think about all the shit Axl had to deal with (not only legally, but also with "friends" and music).

Anyways, to get back on topic, I think there's a strong confidence now to have this album released in 2008. I hope it happens, also because a full world tour behind it will kick major ass.

[cineater]

"The great news is that the album is done. Just like Baz has said a while ago."

For those of us who jumped for joy when we first heard it only to freak when it all seemed to come to a dead stop when the label went down, where the fuck are we now?  lol  I'm still thinking GNR is their proven money maker and they need them and it will be their next move.

[cineater]

By the way, I'm from St. Louis.  No really means it's true.

[FunkyMonkey]

I tried to explain on the last page.

well yeah... but what?s with the "No, really" at the end? 


lol btw, looking at your avatar... I?m listening right now to Jimi Hendrix! hehe 

their making a joke of chinese democracy again,

saying

"NO REALLY"

is like saying,

no really, its coming out this time, we mean it,
we know the other 10000s of times we said its coming out and it didnt,
but this time we really think its coming out...

I took that to be a quote from Richard ("No, really") when asked what the next year holds.  Like cineater said, no really means it's true.


As for G n' R, Fortus hit Australia, Mexico, New Zealand and Japan with the band this year, and in 2008 he hopes to be touring in support of G n' R's long-awaited album, Chinese Democracy: "No, really."

[Montrealrocks]

I don't beleive how many fucking whiners there are here.

If you don't like it...JUST DON'T COME HERE!

IF YOU DON'T LIKE WHAT AXL DOES NOWADAYS......WHY THE FUCK YOU PAY TO GO SEE HIM AND GUNS N' ROSES IN CONCERT?

Either get on board...OR FUCK OFF!!!!!!

Who are u to tell someone to fuck off when u have been on here for like 2 minutes?


We, Youngunner and myself and countless others have been waiting patiently for over 5 years on here and u stick around through 5 more years of false starts and lets see how tested your patience gets and lets see if u are still singing that same bullshit tune.

If everyone had to choose I'd say the GNR fanbase would shrink considerably.

I am definitely no whiner or no hater but seriously, its been the same bullshit since 2002 after the VMA's.

we thought we were getting the album Spring 2003 then it was Summer, then it was November for sure

2004 same

2005 same

2006 same
2007 It HAD to be the year after the Axl press release, the firing of Merck, 2007 HAD to be the year.

So what makes anyone think 2008 will be any different?

Personally it doesn't bother me waiting, I don't bitch about it. I hate how Axl could've had the greatest comeback in music history but now has kind of ruined a lot of the magic that could've came out of it with a Great MTV performance, a video single the next day and the album in November of 2002.

It was all lined up for Axl and in my opinion they blew a great opportunity.

Who is to say the leaks weren't done purposely by the band to try and force the record label's hand.

I am kind of worried to be honest.

If The Record Label have CD, why the fuck wouldn't they release it?  Unless they feel it has no hits on it.................. To me, if a guy has taken a decade and he finally gives u the finished product, u would think u would release the damn thing and make it priority number 1.......

So there are a whole lot of questions left up in the air.

Sebastian may have said this and that, Richard and Bumble may have said this and that but I take one person's word and that is Axl

Still haven't heard it from his mouth.

Looks to me, if he already turned it in, He would've updated the fans like he promised in the last letter?

Hahaha, an you know for a fact that I am waiting for 2 minutes....

Like in many other forums, some people talk without knowing fuck all

(and it's not an attack on Jarmo there...just my opinion on some posters)

Even if I don't post, I can read.

[AbominableHoman]

I tried to explain on the last page.

well yeah... but what?s with the "No, really" at the end? 


lol btw, looking at your avatar... I?m listening right now to Jimi Hendrix! hehe 

their making a joke of chinese democracy again,

saying

"NO REALLY"

is like saying,

no really, its coming out this time, we mean it,
we know the other 10000s of times we said its coming out and it didnt,
but this time we really think its coming out...

Isn't the fact that it's in quotations, as opposed to italics, mean it's said by Fortus? Maybe I'm an idiot, but I just thought that was some rule in journalistic writing.

[Jim Bob]

anybody who is seriously upset at the lack of an album as of yet, get a life.  i mean seriously?   i want CD as bad as the next guy, but until it comes out, its not out, and theres nothing i can do about that.... so be it.   

[jarmo]

In my opinion, Jarmo not deleting this thread means the album was handed in..

No, people seem to come to their own conclusions based on what threads we remove.

I don't know if it was handed in or not.

That is cool news.


I also thought it was cool in 2004 when Tommy said basically the same thing.

You mean when the album wasn't done?

Why is it that some of you seem to choose to ignore the fact that 2007 is the first time the album has had a tentative release date and it was finished?





/jarmo

[AbominableHoman]

anybody who is seriously upset at the lack of an album as of yet, get a life.  i mean seriously?   i want CD as bad as the next guy, but until it comes out, its not out, and theres nothing i can do about that.... so be it.   

My new years resolution is if I don't see Chinese Democracy come out this year, I won't ever see it. That's right, seppuku. December 31, 2008 11:59pm.

[HungerForChaos]

The Spirit of St. Louis

Two of the Lou's famous rockers fill us in on their favorites of 2007 ? and what the next year holds.

By Annie Zaleski
Published: December 26, 2007

Richard Fortus once attended a Replacements/X double bill at the legendary venue Mississippi Nights. At the time, he and 'Mats bassist Tommy Stinson were the same age. Two or so decades later, the two men are bandmates in the current incarnation of Guns 'n Roses.

It's a just reward for Fortus, a talented guitarist who first found fame in the '80s with St. Louis darlings the Eyes (who were later known as Pale Divine during their major-label days) and later in Love Spit Love, the criminally underrated '90s act that also featured Psychedelic Furs figurehead Richard Butler.

Fortus is still an in-demand musician today: In 2007, he played on albums by the Crystal Method, Puddle of Mudd, the Divinyls and Scott McCloud (ex-Girls Against Boys); worked on the Spiderman 3 video-game score and played on releases by three new (and completely separate) artists named Kerli, Krista and Karen.

As for G n' R, Fortus hit Australia, Mexico, New Zealand and Japan with the band this year, and in 2008 he hopes to be touring in support of G n' R's long-awaited album, Chinese Democracy: "No, really."

Rest of article: http://riverfronttimes.com/2007-12-26/music/the-spirit-of-st-louis/

Everyone's so busy arguing that most of them missed this great news!

The great news is that the album is done. Just like Baz has said a while ago.

But still, we have people going on and on about how this news isn't great. 



/jarmo

I know, but this just reinforces the facts.

[Howard2k]

Oh my god.? You DO know how to express yourself properly.? To be honest Jarmo you did a shit job of explaining yourself with your sarcastic and holier than thou one liners.? Go back and read your previous posts.? All you need to do it get off your high horse now and then and you're quite capable of having a conversation with us little people.

Maybe it's just that I have to explain everything to you a few times until it sinks in?

You can attack me all you want, I made my opinion known, instead of addressing the issue you came up with these "amusing" smart ass remarks....

The record company would be foolish not to count on those people for ticket sales and other possible pull through revenues.?

I think they're more interested in selling albums than ticket sales. Concert promoters sell the tickets.

At least that's how it used to work....

Anyway, in your opinion the nostalgia crowd is not an issue.? I think it is, especially in today's market when they should be thinking about maximizing revenues.? Neither of are experts (and I don't claim to be) so it's just opinions.

Certain former members probably wish that GN'R was about nostalgia.....



I think the record company should worry about how to reach all the rock fans who haven't heard a great album in years instead of worrying about who might show up at the shows.

Meaning, a concert ticket buyer isn't automatically a record buyer.

It seems like concerts aren't the great promotion tool for record sales like they used to be. Just like videos aren't because MTV stopped playing them.



The most optimal would obviously be if the person got the ticket, the shirt and the record. Everybody would be happy.




By the way, wouldn't most of the people who attended the 2006 and/or 2007 tours be considered part of the "nostalgia crowd" since there's no new material released??

I don't consider myself part of that group. I'm a fan and I try to go see my favorite band as often as possible.





/jarmo

I would absolutely consider a portion of the 06/07 attendees a part of the nostalgia crowd. ?I know people who went who don't give a shit about the new material. ?They heard it, thought it was ok, but were totally unaware that GNR had new material to play. ?They were there to hear the hits, but many walked away with shirts and I'm sure MIGHT have bought Chi Dem had it been available. ?The nostalgia crowd % would vary by region and there's no way I could quantify it. ? But again, the record company is in it for the economics. ?Not for pleasing the fans. ?They'll have some estimation at some scale. ?That's why I mention pull through revenue. ? People buy tickets to see concerts, but at the concerts they buy merch. ?These are pull through revenue opportunities. ?To put it in perspective, HTGTH is one of the larger GNR sites out there, yet the stats in the top right hand corner show 8,442 members. ? At the last GNR show I went to, there were more than 8,000 people. ? The hard core GNR fan base is probably NOT representative of the mass concert going audience. ? Bands like KISS, Def Leppard etc. are also in this position. ? While I'm sure that all 8,442 members would have happily sung along to Better, ?the vast majority of the crowd at my last GNR show had no idea. ? We're a small slice of the pie. ? There will be plenty of people who will buy Chi Dem, listen to it once and then let it gather dust. ? They're still important people to the record company, if they can get Chi Dem in the hands of those people (as well as the 8,442 members of this forum) then that's significantly better than JUST getting Chi Dem into the hands of the 8,442 members of the forum. ?

And that wasn't an attack. ?An attack would be "Jarmo, you're a fucking tool". ? I merely commented that you did a crap job of explaining yourself, and I stand by my comments since this post I'm replying to shows that you are capable of well thought out conversation. ?

The fact that the concert/record linkage is not as profitable as it used to be is even more reason to ensure that the strategy is well thought out. ?And again, that means well thought out for a profitable release, not well thought out for a "fan pleasing" release.

Baz said that Axl wanted Chi Dem out this year. ?I don't think that Axl held the album up for so long out of spite. ?But even the artists only have so much clout. ? As an incredibly crass generalization you could almost say that in general the artists care about the fans and the money, while the record company is more in it for the money. ? We know that getting an album out there is not rocket science (generally), we have good reason to believe that Axl wants it out, we know that the industry is in a tough position after some really glorious decades. ?

Anyway, the horse is dead. ?I'm not expecting Chi Dem before mid 08, because I believe that the decision to release the record will be decided largely on the ROI. ?But I hope I'm wrong, I genuinely do.

[*Timothy*]

In my opinion, Jarmo not deleting this thread means the album was handed in..

No, people seem to come to their own conclusions based on what threads we remove.

I don't know if it was handed in or not.

That is cool news.


I also thought it was cool in 2004 when Tommy said basically the same thing.

You mean when the album wasn't done?

Why is it that some of you seem to choose to ignore the fact that 2007 is the first time the album has had a tentative release date and it was finished?





/jarmo

No I mean when Tommy said he heard final mixes.


Album no Album who gives a shit . I just hope they tour in 08.

[gunns1]

at the end of the day,

tentative or no tentative,

it means jack shit,

Axl must have known that it wasn't going to come out in march 6th,
because by the sounds of it, back then, seeing how the recording supposedly just finished,
then They would of needed a few weeks/months to plan the marketing campaign,

surely axl must have known that march 6th was just not enough time to release a record of its magnitude,

So at the end of the day,
words are just words,
everything is a lie until it comes true, Thats what I  have learnt in this, just dont expect anything,
dont even hold your breath for anything,
and if something does happen, you will be happy and suprised, but if nothing happens, you havent lost any time waiting for it,

How many times has axl said "fall late fall the album will be out", "people will hear music this year" etc..

Let the ball keep on moving , just dont expect it to be coming to a stop anytime soon

[HungerForChaos]

at the end of the day,

tentative or no tentative,

it means jack shit,

Axl must have known that it wasn't going to come out in march 6th,
because by the sounds of it, back then, seeing how the recording supposedly just finished,
then They would of needed a few weeks/months to plan the marketing campaign,

surely axl must have known that march 6th was just not enough time to release a record of its magnitude,

So at the end of the day,
words are just words,
everything is a lie until it comes true, Thats what I  have learnt in this, just dont expect anything,
dont even hold your breath for anything,
and if something does happen, you will be happy and suprised, but if nothing happens, you havent lost any time waiting for it,

How many times has axl said "fall late fall the album will be out", "people will hear music this year" etc..

Let the ball keep on moving , just dont expect it to be coming to a stop anytime soon

Things happen. He said all of that stuff, because he wanted it and expected it to be out, but I'm sure there were things that happened to hold it up.

[SterileEyes]

Greatest Hits albums are the ultimate cash grab and u better believe the label released it to recoup money for CD.



Record labels USE to get 6 dollars an album, back when CDS were sold for almost 20 bucks. not sure what they get now that CDS are a bit cheaper. U best believe they get at least 4 dollars. The band probably gets about 2.

Out of that 2 it is split however many ways to satisfy the band members. The record label's 4 dollars IS THEIR MONEY. They don't split their cut with the band, thats where the band's 2 dollars come from.

So Greatest Hits cost ZERO to make as they songs were already recorded.

They may have used less than 1 million dollars to press and promote this album.

The album worldwide has easily sold 8 million.

8 million mutiplied by 4 dollars would be a gross profit of 32 million for the record label.  That is the CD money and profit.

...so the label went through all that trouble and blew their load with a GN'R greatest hits...to make...10 or 15 million dollars. Worldwide.

Right.

Once again, even if it sold 100 million copies and the label made $10 tax-free per album, Greatest Hits is not the Chinese Democracy Funding Apparatus. It was a way to make money in 2003.

And now I'm going to be a hypocrite and say "isn't this thread about Richard's e-mail"?

[cybercurves]

What's with this obsession about wanting to know if the album has been handed in?  It's none of our business anyways.  If the record company is causing the delay, what difference does it make if the CD was handed in or not? 

cybercurves

[younggunner]

How the fuck is that possible considering recording was done in January?

Why is it that things need to be explained to you time after time?

Something you worked on this year and finished couldn't have been finished before you did the last work on it.

Isn't that basic logic?

Every time there's any news about the album, you and your kind are here to remind us of the past. Time to move on?

"It's been done for years". Funny.

so your telling me that for the first time ever Chinese Democracy is considered finished? You cant be serious. What Bach has said in regards to the album has been said countless times by band members and people around the band in the past.

Axl even told us about the 3 album plan back in London in 02. We have known about that for years. CD has been finished for years. It could have been released at anytime from 00-2006. Over time the album has changed. Luckily Axl was smart enough not to release it when he first came back during RIO. I think the album that we will be hearing didnt begin to take shape till around 03-05ish. The Bucket Era.

 During the past 7 yrs Axl has stated on different occasions the release of CD. To think that the album hasnt been finished this whole time is being naive. If it hasnt been finished over the yrs why would Axl bring up potential release dates over time?

This way: Whine, whine, whine.... We get it.

You're a big fan? I guess you're a big fan as long as the band does what you want them to,. The other times, you just like to point out how everything sucks.

Constructive criticism is one thing, but some of you go beyond that.

Does it really fill some kind of fucking void in your life to put the band, you claim to be fans of, down?


Don't wanna give you any ideas....?

Yea, you are correct. Im not a fan. Im a person who wants to hear his favorite bands upcoming album that I have been PATIENTLY waiting for for almost 7 yrs now. I am a person who wants to rock out and hear studio cuts of a new band that he knows has the talent and potential to make great music. Silly me.

You keep insinuating that I have no life or am bitter over this situation. We have had this argument a zillion times.
JUST BECAUSE YOU CRITIQUE SOMETHING DOESNT MEAN YOU ARE NOT A FAN. If you would come back to Earth like the rest of us for just one day you would realize that. We all dont party with the band. So mabe for you its harder to knock the process. For me it isnt. The situation is what it is. And again, I could careless about the wait. "I have a life". As do many others. Some things have been handled poorly over the yrs. What is so wrong about that? Get Bfoots guitar out of your ass. Your way to wound up.

I think the main thing that is dissapointing is what D touched on. A lot of us feel like Axl built up the mystique and anticipation and then blew his shot at a memorable comeback. To add on that, nothing will compare to the mystique and excitement this band created from lets say 00-04/05ish. But the delays, the tours, the lack of a gameplan, or lack of execution has killed that spark. Which is fine. Its not a big deal because when the album drops most of us will get pumped again. But your attitude along with others is comical. Its corny. especially jim bob. You all need to get off your knees.
Unfortunately there is "no logic here today". Its all gone. Everything is go axl, where can gnr play next, and if u dont like that fuck off. which is lame. its not what gnr is about.