Are VR Sellouts?

[GNRreunioneventually]

But scott is a poser in my opinion but thats just me

What is he posing as, out of curiosity?

he's posing as some one that thinks he can sing as good as Slash plays

[RageNirvanaNIN]

I am seriously pissed the more I listen to this album.


SBQM was the first single cause it was the most "Slither" Sounding song which pisses me off.

Then Get out The Door has a Slash Solo ONLY because the label wanted it.


Now one of the best fuckin songs I have heard in a decade "Messages" was left off the album and I can already tell u fuckin why.


I can see all these suits sittin around saying:


SBQM will be the first single, it is a lot like "Slither" so people will recognize the band's signature style on the radio immediately.

When it comes to ballads, We got to throw a cover on there, cause cover songs are instantly liked and recognized songs.

They got this song "Messages" fuck its great but it's between Messages and Gravedancer and God damn if Grave Dancer doesn't sound a lot like "Fall to Pieces" which was a big hit on the last record.

Yeah let's recommend the band go with Gravedancer and the cover song.

If the record sales are slow, we can always repackage the album with Messages and something else and resale it


Genius!



I love VR but am pissed off at the same fuckin time.

U put a shitty fuckin cover over a brilliant original


That would've been like GNR putting Knockin On Heaven's Door on UYI2 and leavin off "Estranged"

Get out the door has a Slash solo because the record company wanted it , and how to you know this?? Not to mention you make it seem like everyone knows about ELO and the cover song? They are far from sell outs , they play what they want.

[GeraldFord]

I am seriously pissed the more I listen to this album.


SBQM was the first single cause it was the most "Slither" Sounding song which pisses me off.

Then Get out The Door has a Slash Solo ONLY because the label wanted it.


Now one of the best fuckin songs I have heard in a decade "Messages" was left off the album and I can already tell u fuckin why.


I can see all these suits sittin around saying:


SBQM will be the first single, it is a lot like "Slither" so people will recognize the band's signature style on the radio immediately.

When it comes to ballads, We got to throw a cover on there, cause cover songs are instantly liked and recognized songs.

They got this song "Messages" fuck its great but it's between Messages and Gravedancer and God damn if Grave Dancer doesn't sound a lot like "Fall to Pieces" which was a big hit on the last record.

Yeah let's recommend the band go with Gravedancer and the cover song.

If the record sales are slow, we can always repackage the album with Messages and something else and resale it


Genius!



I love VR but am pissed off at the same fuckin time.

U put a shitty fuckin cover over a brilliant original


That would've been like GNR putting Knockin On Heaven's Door on UYI2 and leavin off "Estranged"

To answer your question...no.

But if they hooked up with Desmond Child and made a Country album...yes.

[ZRO]

I am seriously pissed the more I listen to this album.


SBQM was the first single cause it was the most "Slither" Sounding song which pisses me off.

Then Get out The Door has a Slash Solo ONLY because the label wanted it.


Now one of the best fuckin songs I have heard in a decade "Messages" was left off the album and I can already tell u fuckin why.


I can see all these suits sittin around saying:


SBQM will be the first single, it is a lot like "Slither" so people will recognize the band's signature style on the radio immediately.

When it comes to ballads, We got to throw a cover on there, cause cover songs are instantly liked and recognized songs.

They got this song "Messages" fuck its great but it's between Messages and Gravedancer and God damn if Grave Dancer doesn't sound a lot like "Fall to Pieces" which was a big hit on the last record.

Yeah let's recommend the band go with Gravedancer and the cover song.

If the record sales are slow, we can always repackage the album with Messages and something else and resale it


Genius!



I love VR but am pissed off at the same fuckin time.

U put a shitty fuckin cover over a brilliant original


That would've been like GNR putting Knockin On Heaven's Door on UYI2 and leavin off "Estranged"

This is all just based on your assumption. It's very likely that the above never happened. I mean, if they were sellouts and all about the money like some in this thread have said, then don't you think they WOULD have included a propable surefire #1 single like "Messages"?

I can't say why they did it. Who knows? Maybe they felt there were enough ballads on the album? I'm just happy we get to hear the song, I don't care whether it's on the CD or not.

[Booker Floyd]

"Messages" is not a single.  It likely wouldnt be a hit; Im not sure why so many of you think it would.

[D]

Some of u on here are so dillusional


Bands need hits and songs to grow their fanbase.


YGNR as a single and "Messages" in my opinion would grow VR's fanbase. People would really love these songs.


Booker how can u say "Messages" wouldn't be a hit?


SBQM sure as hell ain't blowing up the charts and if Fall To Pieces can be the huge hit it was, Messages certainly could be as big as FTP.



Good job Dick Nixon tryin to slam BJ in a VR thread.

WOW Bon Jovi have the balls to make an album they want to make instead of the same ole shit and they get riduculed? but if they would've made another rock/pop album it would've been the same ole playing it safe shit I guess.........

[GeraldFord]

Good job Dick Nixon tryin to slam BJ in a VR thread.

WOW Bon Jovi have the balls to make an album they want to make instead of the same ole shit and they get riduculed? but if they would've made another rock/pop album it would've been the same ole playing it safe shit I guess.........

I'm just busting your balls D.

I don't like BJ, but I admire you for sticking up for them since you like them so much.

[Oddy]

actually D doesn't stick up for BJ unconditionally.

he'll call them out when they release shit.

[GeraldFord]

actually D doesn't stick up for BJ unconditionally.

he'll call them out when they release shit.

So he's called them out every time they release an album??

[audjon]

A lot of their shows sold out, so my guess is that they are 'sellouts'. 

[D]

In case people havent read every post.

Sell out is probably the wrong word.

Its just established Vets like VR should be able to call a lot of the shots and I just can't think of any reason on earth why They wouldn't put GAADL and Messages on the real album when they are both innovative and better than a lot of the stuff that did make the album.

Messages doesnt have to be about 9/11. I interpret it as other t hings when I hear it.

[badapple81]

Why did they allow themselves to have poor decisions made for them by the label?

[RageNirvanaNIN]

You blame the label , I mean what if they didn't want it on there?

[mrlee]

id say they did sell out, especially this radio friendly album

[bart123]

D, they are not sellouts.? They are putting out a good album and touring behind it and making the other available even if not on the album.? I really think the guys tried hard on this album and that is all I can ask.?

As far as leaving their greatest song ever off the album?? I too am speachless.

how do u now messages was there greatest song??have u heard it.the only piece of it is on the vlog!!

[Grouse]

D, they are not sellouts.? They are putting out a good album and touring behind it and making the other available even if not on the album.? I really think the guys tried hard on this album and that is all I can ask.?

As far as leaving their greatest song ever off the album?? I too am speachless.

how do u now messages was there greatest song??have u heard it.the only piece of it is on the vlog!!

Yikes! where have you been for the past couple of days .....

[Irish rose]

maybe they have plans to use messages on a soundtrack or something..its definitely a great song but theres gotta be a good reason for leaving it out...same goes for gas and a dollar laugh..that shoulda been there aswell

[chineseblues]

But scott is a poser in my opinion but thats just me

What is he posing as, out of curiosity?

He is posing as whatever he thinks will make him the most money at any given time.

Iggy posted this over on the sludge boards and I think it gives a pretty good idea of what Scott is really like.

"Over the years, I'd hear something like "Sour Girl", or "Big Bang Baby", and find myself nodding along to the DeLeo Brothers catchy pop hooks, but for the most part, these Pilots seemed like bandwagon jumping con artists to me."

"So those of us who'd known the band, Big Bang Babies in Hollywood, were put-off when Stone Temple Pilots shaved their corny grunge facial hair and mohair sweaters and used that obscure glam band's name as a song title"

"it felt like, if all these grunge people were so bloody cool, why didn't they ever have the imagination to come up with their own non-glam shit"

"Fuck, man - I could show you pictures of me in 1989-1994 when I weighed 120 lbs, shirtless, in the same nazi hat and silver leather pants Scott Weiland wears now in Velvet Revolver, and pictures of him from the same year with the Anthrax facial hair and Mister Rogers sweater. It's weird. So anyway, when I saw the STP video for "Big Bang Baby" that was made to look like the sort of early MTV low budget new wave bands I loved, I was starting to get a little annoyed, cos I thought he was supposed to be the tortured, smacked out, depressed, flannel wearing, grunge guy"

"So for a moment, I got to thinking, that maybe the brothers in the band STP were actually the frustrated frontmen brains of the operation and that maybe they DID have talent, and at least some good taste in the music they always chose to rip off, and it was just their dumb manikin of a vocalist who was the one opportunistically imitating anyone who came along with their own style and vision. But that was only until my producer friend tried to make me sit through their band after the rehab-related breakup with Weiland when they got an even worse singer, called TALK SHOW, which was mostly still more unlistenable homages to each trendy target market, demographic that existed at the time."

"to me, it always seemed like this Scott Weiland fella was just so desperate for stardom and addicted to reading his own press clippings like he'd go to each and every length to try to stay vital, keeping up with musical fashion trends, no matter which way the wind blew, kinda like Tommy Lee and Courtney Love."

"Scott Weiland's kinda like Lenny Kravitz-he's got some ability, he wants to rock, he just don't fully get it."

"The Evan Dandos and Scott Weilands and Ryan Adams and Gavin Rossdales of the world are always enabled and given access to make all their shitty, boring, brazenly derivative music, Kid Rock and Sheryl Crow-but almost everybody I ever fully dug, respected, loved or believed in's been silenced, shut-out, retired, dead, or chased into seclusion by the merciless lumpen herd who never get it."

"it's kinda challenging to stay that focused on Scott Weiland's shamefully derivative oeuvre for that long, cos well, it's all thoroughly redundant even dissecting his heavily sampled, cut 'n' paste, xerox'n'roll cos all his best stuff's predominantly montages of other people's sounds and visions turned upside down and pedaled off to a sadly programmed generation and a half of kids who don't know any better"

"Scott Weiland usually DOES manage to pull off all these shop-lifted melodies and appallingly-"influenced" pop culture pastiches in an aesthetically pleasing, nearly tasteful way-he's marvelous really, at sewing everyone else's shit together and passing it off as his own. He's a little more subtle than Puff Diddy. At least the guy does have an eye, or ear, for what WAS cool, and authentic, even if he probably realizes deep down, that it ain't him-that deep down, there's no deep down, just a cool t-shirt, some tailored leather strides and rock candyTM mascara. At least he's hip enough to WANT IT, savvy enough to gravitate TOWARDS IT, instinctively, and dumbly brave enough to even occasionally GRASP FOR IT! Hell, I'd probably be a bit charmed by W if he was some kid who was just discovering the Misfits via Blink 182 or something. Problem is - he got the millionaire figurehead rockstar gig me and a zillion other bitter rock ranters all wanted and it hurts to see the winners all suck so bad. He does remind me of some mildly gifted, and clever young punk geeks I meet sometimes who ain't sorted it all out yet, but know the Velvet Underground were supposed to be cool if only cos some shite band they like, likes them. Scott's radar's always up, you can see him searching, but aside from his struggle with drug addiction, and plush, purple lifestyle, you can see how he has really yet to develop an identity of his own. It's always struck me as if poor Scott's really such a timid follower, with a spine of ?clair, that all he really ever does is regurgitate whatever someone else has already said better, and first."

http://www.sleazegrinder.com/flashmetalsuicideScottWeiland.htm

The above is only quotes taken from that page as it's too long to post it all.

[oldleadbelly]

But scott is a poser in my opinion but thats just me

What is he posing as, out of curiosity?

He is posing as whatever he thinks will make him the most money at any given time.

Iggy posted this over on the sludge boards and I think it gives a pretty good idea of what Scott is really like.

"Over the years, I'd hear something like "Sour Girl", or "Big Bang Baby", and find myself nodding along to the DeLeo Brothers catchy pop hooks, but for the most part, these Pilots seemed like bandwagon jumping con artists to me."

"So those of us who'd known the band, Big Bang Babies in Hollywood, were put-off when Stone Temple Pilots shaved their corny grunge facial hair and mohair sweaters and used that obscure glam band's name as a song title"

"it felt like, if all these grunge people were so bloody cool, why didn't they ever have the imagination to come up with their own non-glam shit"

"Fuck, man - I could show you pictures of me in 1989-1994 when I weighed 120 lbs, shirtless, in the same nazi hat and silver leather pants Scott Weiland wears now in Velvet Revolver, and pictures of him from the same year with the Anthrax facial hair and Mister Rogers sweater. It's weird. So anyway, when I saw the STP video for "Big Bang Baby" that was made to look like the sort of early MTV low budget new wave bands I loved, I was starting to get a little annoyed, cos I thought he was supposed to be the tortured, smacked out, depressed, flannel wearing, grunge guy"

"So for a moment, I got to thinking, that maybe the brothers in the band STP were actually the frustrated frontmen brains of the operation and that maybe they DID have talent, and at least some good taste in the music they always chose to rip off, and it was just their dumb manikin of a vocalist who was the one opportunistically imitating anyone who came along with their own style and vision. But that was only until my producer friend tried to make me sit through their band after the rehab-related breakup with Weiland when they got an even worse singer, called TALK SHOW, which was mostly still more unlistenable homages to each trendy target market, demographic that existed at the time."

"to me, it always seemed like this Scott Weiland fella was just so desperate for stardom and addicted to reading his own press clippings like he'd go to each and every length to try to stay vital, keeping up with musical fashion trends, no matter which way the wind blew, kinda like Tommy Lee and Courtney Love."

"Scott Weiland's kinda like Lenny Kravitz-he's got some ability, he wants to rock, he just don't fully get it."

"The Evan Dandos and Scott Weilands and Ryan Adams and Gavin Rossdales of the world are always enabled and given access to make all their shitty, boring, brazenly derivative music, Kid Rock and Sheryl Crow-but almost everybody I ever fully dug, respected, loved or believed in's been silenced, shut-out, retired, dead, or chased into seclusion by the merciless lumpen herd who never get it."

"it's kinda challenging to stay that focused on Scott Weiland's shamefully derivative oeuvre for that long, cos well, it's all thoroughly redundant even dissecting his heavily sampled, cut 'n' paste, xerox'n'roll cos all his best stuff's predominantly montages of other people's sounds and visions turned upside down and pedaled off to a sadly programmed generation and a half of kids who don't know any better"

"Scott Weiland usually DOES manage to pull off all these shop-lifted melodies and appallingly-"influenced" pop culture pastiches in an aesthetically pleasing, nearly tasteful way-he's marvelous really, at sewing everyone else's shit together and passing it off as his own. He's a little more subtle than Puff Diddy. At least the guy does have an eye, or ear, for what WAS cool, and authentic, even if he probably realizes deep down, that it ain't him-that deep down, there's no deep down, just a cool t-shirt, some tailored leather strides and rock candyTM mascara. At least he's hip enough to WANT IT, savvy enough to gravitate TOWARDS IT, instinctively, and dumbly brave enough to even occasionally GRASP FOR IT! Hell, I'd probably be a bit charmed by W if he was some kid who was just discovering the Misfits via Blink 182 or something. Problem is - he got the millionaire figurehead rockstar gig me and a zillion other bitter rock ranters all wanted and it hurts to see the winners all suck so bad. He does remind me of some mildly gifted, and clever young punk geeks I meet sometimes who ain't sorted it all out yet, but know the Velvet Underground were supposed to be cool if only cos some shite band they like, likes them. Scott's radar's always up, you can see him searching, but aside from his struggle with drug addiction, and plush, purple lifestyle, you can see how he has really yet to develop an identity of his own. It's always struck me as if poor Scott's really such a timid follower, with a spine of ?clair, that all he really ever does is regurgitate whatever someone else has already said better, and first."

http://www.sleazegrinder.com/flashmetalsuicideScottWeiland.htm

The above is only quotes taken from that page as it's too long to post it all.

Wow, I just read the "article," and what really strikes me is the author railing and rambling against Weiland and STP for being posers, all the while hypocritically revealing himself as a trendy, band name-dropping, scene-whore.  It's like, damn dude, are you angry at Weiland, or do you dislike yourself so much that you've written a thesis-length diatribe against someone you don't even know (poorly researched I might add).

[D]

the guy who wrote that sounds like some Wanna be Rockstar that never got to be so he is jealous and mad.