The same setlist is not the same setlist

[estebanf]

Here is a legitimate argument though - old GN'R went onstage every night and played different songs. Look at old setlist archives - they would play 10 dates in two weeks and on the 7th date for no reason they'd throw in "Locomotive" or "Coma" just for the hell of it. When they played four nights at the L.A. forum, they opened with Perfect Crime every night and maybe had the same couple of songs after that, but for the rest of the night, all bets were off. In my opinion that's what made them "phenomenal" and not just "great" as a live act.

What you say about Locomotive and Coma is simply not true. Those two songs were only played exceptionally: if I'm not wrong, ''Coma'' was played four times, one in 1991 (Richfield Coliseum), 2 in 1992 (Tokyo, Chicago) and one in 1993, which is the one allegedly included in the japanese version of Live Era. ''Locomotive'' was played just a few times, all in 1991 if I'm not wrong.

GNR setlists ALWAYS were very similar from one night to the next. Check 1993, for example. They were basically all the same, like now in 2007, that they are basically all the same: one night you have CD, one night you have Rocket Queen, one night you have madagascar...

I dont care about setlists. You will not find two identical ''Nightrains'' if you listen to all the 2006 boots. Every of them have something special, particular, different solos, Axl singing it different.

Of course I like ''surprises'' like in Madrid were TWAT was played, or in Detroit 2002 (or London 02) where Rhiad was played. But its a fact that only ''we, the nerds behind a monitor'' are the ones whining about setlists.

It would be cool to remind that Guns N' Roses dont do shows for us, the people sitting in a PC with a coffee with nothing better to do than that.

[Booker Floyd]

Velvet Revolver, the band who still says they're dangerous and unpredictable, play the same show every night which I pointed out and now you're trying to use that against me?

Seems like I hit a nerve.  I dont see what the problem is. 

I didnt bring VR up - this isnt about that band at all - I simply referenced your post criticizing a band for playing similar setlists during their tour. 

Here are some setlists from the European tour and some recent shows.

I was hoping they'd mix up the setlist for this new leg and play longer sets, but as you can see that has yet to happen.

Seems like Spectacle appears sometimes instead of Mr. Brownstone.

I don't know why they don't play longer sets.

Just adding two songs would be nice. Make it a little more different than the last leg.

They put on a great show, we know that already. I just wish they'd take more chances..... Mix it up a little.

Obviously as a concert goer I'd prefer three hour shows with different sets each night

As a fan, which would you prefer? The current type of set lists or the kind where they mixed them up more?

Nothing about "danger" or "unpredictability," just your honest wish to see a more varied setlist.  Some people here have the same feelings about GNR.  I saw GNR twice in 2006 and had no complaints about the setlist; Ive also defended their decision to not play any more new songs, so I disagree.  Im just pointing out that perhaps you can see where their coming from.  Your opinion on the issue is pretty clear from those quotes.  Why would that upset you?  Maybe you can explain?

[the dirt]

But its a fact that only ''we, the nerds behind a monitor'' are the ones whining about setlists.

It would be cool to remind that Guns N' Roses dont do shows for us, the people sitting in a PC with a coffee with nothing better to do than that.

I suppose being uninformed in this case would make everyone a little cooler, coffee or not.

[jarmo]

Seems like I hit a nerve.  I dont see what the problem is. 

Keep dreaming.

You're probably the most pathetic poster I've seen.

You keep quoting me to "prove" your point when the fact is I was talking about a different fucking band and a different situation, and you know it.

Or maybe you don't, after all you were the one who was gonna teach me about logical thinking.

I didnt bring VR up - this isnt about that band at all - I simply referenced your post criticizing a band for playing similar setlists during their tour. 

Nothing about "danger" or "unpredictability," just your honest wish to see a more varied setlist.  Some people here have the same feelings about GNR.  I saw GNR twice in 2006 and had no complaints about the setlist; Ive also defended their decision to not play any more new songs, so I disagree.  Im just pointing out that perhaps you can see where their coming from.  Your opinion on the issue is pretty clear from those quotes.  Why would that upset you?  Maybe you can explain?

Why didn't you quote this part then?

I find it funny how some band members keep pointing out in interview that they're unpredictable.

How?

They've basically had the same set list since May.

You're so fucking sad. You didn't even quote the post on the same page where I brought up the reason I posted that in the first place.


Keep digging that hole.



Let's see if you're man/woman enough to admit you were proven wrong.

Are you gonna do what you always do, hide and act like it never happened? Just like you never addressed why you would go against your lovely band's wishes by downloading the album and start hyping it before its official release.



/jarmo

[CheapJon]

I wonder what bookey will quote me on in 3 years.. then again... will he still be here in 3 years?

[jarmo]

I think you said something about not liking coffee three years ago and now you're drinking a Coke.

So, you know, it means he proved you wrong since both contain caffeine.


BookerLogic - If it doesn't make sense, it really does!.




/jarmo

[estebanf]

jesus, those multiquotes posts are turning really unbearable. The FBI is here with us...

[Jim Bob]

It is hard for me to accept I will never hear Civil War, Coma, Breakdown, or Dead Horse live - possibly ever again.   

I wouldn't say never.   They brought out old tunes in 2006 and 2007 that weren't played in 2001-2002 like Used to Love her, You're Crazy, Down on the Farm, and supposedly they have Perfect Crime in their options as well.   Who knows what they could add in the future.

[CheapJon]

It is hard for me to accept I will never hear Civil War, Coma, Breakdown, or Dead Horse live - possibly ever again.? ?

I wouldn't say never.? ?They brought out old tunes in 2006 and 2007 that weren't played in 2001-2002 like Used to Love her, You're Crazy, Down on the Farm, and supposedly they have Perfect Crime in their options as well.? ?Who knows what they could add in the future.

don't forget nice boys

[jarmo]

People often forget to mention the acoustic shows they did last year, the covers they played in Europe etc.

Or just like mentioned above, Nice Boys with Angry Anderson.





/jarmo

[Loaded NightraiN]

Hey what the hell... Ron does Don't Cry....

[Booker Floyd]

You're probably the most pathetic poster I've seen.

I didnt insult you, I dont think its fair to insult me.

You keep quoting me to "prove" your point when the fact is I was talking about a different fucking band and a different situation, and you know it.

I think Ive proven my point just fine...with your help of course.  Well, the 2004 you.  Apparently the 2007 you has a different opinion on bands playing similar playlists.  You were quite clear: you like bands to play varied playlists.  You thought it was a threadworthy complaint.  Now its no longer a concern of yours.  Im glad we agree on that now.  Again, Im just pointing out that you might understand when some posters make that complaint about a GNR show.  Do you not?

I find it funny how some band members keep pointing out in interview that they're unpredictable.

How?

They've basically had the same set list since May.

You didn't even quote the post on the same page where I brought up the reason I posted that in the first place.

Because its ancillary to the broader points you made in the quotes Ive posted.  Those points had seemingly nothing to do with "proving" that the band isnt dangerous or unpredictable, they simply expressed your dissatisfaction with them playing similar lists. 

As a fan, which would you prefer? The current type of set lists or the kind where they mixed them up more?

Maybe the 2007 you would like to answer that question.

Are you gonna do what you always do, hide and act like it never happened? Just like you never addressed why you would go against your lovely band's wishes by downloading the album and start hyping it before its official release.

Im sure youd like to think you "got" me, but the truth is that Im choosing to ignore most of your posts, especially ones that arent in response to mine.  Youve made a lot of posts with "Booker" in them lately. 

But since you brought it up: I downloaded the album because I have nothing against downloading, especially when one intends on buying the album.  I also have nothing against downloading bonus tracks.  Ive never expressed an opinion to the contrary.  As for discussing them against band managements/record labels wishes (because Ive seen nothing indicating that it was the bands decision, as youre stating), as long as its permitted on the board, Ill do so.  Pretty simple. 

But since you charged that I "hide" (again, Im sorry I gave you that impression, Im just ignoring most of your posts), you havent addressed how you heard VRs EP.  Are you hiding? 

Have you heard GNRs leaks?

If you fail to answer, Ill have to follow your example and assume youre hiding. 

[BKinNYC]

let me put it this way

are the shows good? no doubt

but is gnr is? a band that deserves to be followed while on tour?

NO

why?

cause the setlist is always the same

u have seen one show , u have seen them all

That's a great post. ?I think people's minds get clouded rather easily around here. ?Like, if you want a new setlist, you must "hate the band."

You know what it is? ?I've been a fan since '88, and I'm spoiled, because I KNOW that they can be more unpredictable. ?

For example (I'm not posting the link, but you can find it online) take a look back at the setlists in '91, before the Illusions came out. ? I went to my first show at the CNE in '91. ?Look at that setlist, and tell me it wasn't amazing. ?People were yelling out songs that they only heard the titles of, and the band would play it. ?Think they'd do that now if you shouted out "The General" or "There was a Time?" ?

Like I said, the majority of the people who seem to be satisfied with this setlist probably didn't get a chance to see them back in the day. ?That's sad, because they truly were the most unpredictable band, and it was a real find to go to a cd show and find a boot of Indiana or Toronto or something because it was always different.

[badapple81]

In Australia, a lot of the crowds, especially where second shows were added, were very much Greatest Hits crowds.. so one might argue that the crowd would have been disappointed if they added in tracks like Perfect Crime etc. at the expense of the 'classics'. A lot of the fans didn't even know My Michelle and Out Ta Get Me.

The show if for fans, both the strong followers and casual fans, who are attending a single show, not complainers reading it in front of a monitor. If you are attending multiples shows like I did, then that's your problem if you don't like the same set.

[badapple81]

let me put it this way

are the shows good? no doubt


but is gnr is? a band that deserves to be followed while on tour?

NO

why?

cause the setlist is always the same


u have seen one show , u have seen them all

GN'R do not play for people following on tour. They play for people coming to see a show. If you want to follow them, be it on the computer screen or on tour, and you don't like the setlist, then that's your problem.

[jarmo]

I didnt insult you, I dont think its fair to insult me.

If you treat me like an idiot, you did.

Because its ancillary to the broader points you made in the quotes Ive posted.  Those points had seemingly nothing to do with "proving" that the band isnt dangerous or unpredictable, they simply expressed your dissatisfaction with them playing similar lists.

Funny.

I asked a question "which would you prefer?" and I showed how this "unpredictable" band isn't so unpredictable.

Which is basically what you VR fan still accuse me of doing.

Im sure youd like to think you "got" me, but the truth is that Im choosing to ignore most of your posts, especially ones that arent in response to mine.  Youve made a lot of posts with "Booker" in them lately. 

Of course you ignore them, it's more convenient for somebody like you.

People who are never wrong because when they are, they just change the subject!


You even said I said nothing about the whole unpredictability thing and there it was on the same page.

Nothing about "danger" or "unpredictability,"

Yet you didn't quote that part.

Isn't that what some call a lie since there was a part about the unpredictability on the same page?

Maybe you could explain why you feel the need to lie about my posts?

Waiting for your explanation and apology for lying about me not saying anything about the unpredictability.


Maybe I won't insult you if you can actually keep from lying about me.



Somehow that's so typical of you. Only quoting one line at the time to prove your point.

Taking things out of context and ignoring other parts or posts.

But since you brought it up: I downloaded the album because I have nothing against downloading, especially when one intends on buying the album.  I also have nothing against downloading bonus tracks.  Ive never expressed an opinion to the contrary.  As for discussing them against band managements/record labels wishes (because Ive seen nothing indicating that it was the bands decision, as youre stating), as long as its permitted on the board, Ill do so.  Pretty simple. 

Management represents the band. 

But since you charged that I "hide" (again, Im sorry I gave you that impression, Im just ignoring most of your posts), you havent addressed how you heard VRs EP.  Are you hiding? 

I did answer, I told you there are several ways to acquire the EP without actually spending money on that band.  You just need to figure it our because I'm not gonna help you.

Have you heard GNRs leaks?

Yes I have.




/jarmo

[ibelieveinaxl]

let me put it this way

are the shows good? no doubt

but is gnr is? a band that deserves to be followed while on tour?

NO

why?

cause the setlist is always the same

u have seen one show , u have seen them all

That's a great post. ?I think people's minds get clouded rather easily around here. ?Like, if you want a new setlist, you must "hate the band."

You know what it is? ?I've been a fan since '88, and I'm spoiled, because I KNOW that they can be more unpredictable. ?

For example (I'm not posting the link, but you can find it online) take a look back at the setlists in '91, before the Illusions came out. ? I went to my first show at the CNE in '91. ?Look at that setlist, and tell me it wasn't amazing. ?People were yelling out songs that they only heard the titles of, and the band would play it. ?Think they'd do that now if you shouted out "The General" or "There was a Time?" ?

Like I said, the majority of the people who seem to be satisfied with this setlist probably didn't get a chance to see them back in the day. ?That's sad, because they truly were the most unpredictable band, and it was a real find to go to a cd show and find a boot of Indiana or Toronto or something because it was always different.

i agree, totally. we had a post about this a little while ago. i pretty much said the same thing you just said....here's the link... ? http://www.heretodaygonetohell.com/board/index.php?topic=46594.msg946924#msg946924

[BKinNYC]

let me put it this way

are the shows good? no doubt


but is gnr is? a band that deserves to be followed while on tour?

NO

why?

cause the setlist is always the same


u have seen one show , u have seen them all

GN'R do not play for people following on tour. They play for people coming to see a show. If you want to follow them, be it on the computer screen or on tour, and you don't like the setlist, then that's your problem.

OK - but do you understand how lazy this makes the band looks, when it comes to the setlist?

Back in '91, there was no internet.  You only knew what the setlist was by word of mouth, or from a newspaper review.  No one followed them "online," because there WASN'T an online.  Yet, they still changed their setlist every night, when no one would've known the difference!!

All I know is that the first time I saw them in '91 was the best.  You think those crowds knew "Civil War" or "November Rain," or anything else off of the Illusions?  No.  But we ate it up, because they were so damn unpredictable.

[just_one]

let me put it this way

are the shows good? no doubt

but is gnr is? a band that deserves to be followed while on tour?

NO

why?

cause the setlist is always the same

u have seen one show , u have seen them all

That's a great post. ?I think people's minds get clouded rather easily around here. ?Like, if you want a new setlist, you must "hate the band."

You know what it is? ?I've been a fan since '88, and I'm spoiled, because I KNOW that they can be more unpredictable. ?

For example (I'm not posting the link, but you can find it online) take a look back at the setlists in '91, before the Illusions came out. ? I went to my first show at the CNE in '91. ?Look at that setlist, and tell me it wasn't amazing. ?People were yelling out songs that they only heard the titles of, and the band would play it. ?Think they'd do that now if you shouted out "The General" or "There was a Time?" ?

Like I said, the majority of the people who seem to be satisfied with this setlist probably didn't get a chance to see them back in the day. ?That's sad, because they truly were the most unpredictable band, and it was a real find to go to a cd show and find a boot of Indiana or Toronto or something because it was always different.

i wasnt even talking about playing new songs

they can perfect change lets see

out to get me , my michelle for other old songs

[Booker Floyd]

Yet you didn't quote that part.

Isn't that what some call a lie since there was a part about the unpredictability on the same page?

No, its just a misunderstanding on your part.  The points that I quoted were separate from your criticism about their "danger," so there was nothing about "danger" in those points.  In fact, some of the posts from which I quoted were made before you said anything about danger or unpredictability.   

You asked:

As a fan, which would you prefer? The current type of set lists or the kind where they mixed them up more?

This has nothing to do with anything the band said about danger.  This is you asking a fan what they prefer.  You didnt answer it, so Ill ask you:

As a fan, which would you prefer? The current type of set lists or the kind where they mixed them up more?

You also avoided another question asked: as somebody who complained about similar setlists, do you not understand where somebody is coming from when they make the same exact complaint you did in the first post of that thread about GNR?

Management represents the band. 

So management/record labels dont occasionally make decisions the band has nothing to do with?

I did answer, I told you there are several ways to acquire the EP without actually spending money on that band.  You just need to figure it our because I'm not gonna help you.

Thats not an answer, thats hiding.

Yes I have.

How did you hear them, out of curiosity?  Considering you do follow their every instruction, perhaps GNRs management gave you permission.  Is that the case?