VR cancel last 7 European dates

[ShotgunBlues1978]

You honestly think Contraband would've gone double platinum and won a Grammy if it was just a major label debut album made by a band of unknown musicians?  Come on

As a Guns N' Roses fan in particular you of all people should understand the importance of trading off the name of the band where you once made your most famous accomplishments.

Of course they were going to play that up at the time, as that is stuff they could justifiably put on their resumes. Every new band needs to use everything at its disposal to get itself out there and promote it in any way they can.

The name of a band undoubtedly influences how people will feel about a band. If Fallout boy and GNR released the exact same song note for note word for word people would automatically associate the GNR version with being better because they have an established brand often associated with releasing kick ass rock n' roll songs. So to lay the Contraband argument at the feet of VR as if they are the only band in the world that has ever benefited from name recognition/association as it is a little disengenuous.

No matter what people's opinion is on why it happened, fact is Contraband garnered enough commercial success and critical acclaim to make people take them seriously as their own band instead of just a record label formed super group because they brought the goods to the table. Then considering the fact there are almost no other rock bands of guys on the wrong side of 40 being commercially relevant these days and it just adds to how big a success this band has really been. They could just as easily have gone the way of Army of Anyone with a good album and no market to get it played for the masses.

None of what you said is wrong.  But the statement I referred to said that VR has developed their own identity outside of their previous groups.  I don't agree with that, at all.  I'd disagree if you said Audioslave developed their own identity away from Rage or Soundgarden as well.  Velvet Revolver's success and following has as much to do with what they did before VR even formed as what they've done since, even now.  I don't see how you can deny that.  They are basically a carbon copy of Audioslave, not musically, but in terms of the way they were formed, how they were marketed, and why they were popular.  Their level of success, both critically and sales wise, was nearly identical as well

[Naupis]

Velvet Revolver's success and following has as much to do with what they did before VR even formed as what they've done since, even now.  I don't see how you can deny that.

They have actually developed their own set of fans for the most part now. I am not saying there aren't people who still follow them who do it because of the Guns/STP connection, but in the beggining that is really all they had. Three years into this, they have developed a much bigger group of fans who like them for their music, and may not be old enough to really remember Guns/STP at all. They happen to be famous from their old bands, but like every other new band who sells a couple million albums you do develop a fan base that likes your sound.

Heck, look around here at the number of people who say they got into GNR because of the new band. Are you saying they automatically have to be exlcusive fans of the old band because they prefer the new one more? God forbid Axl ever releases an album I am sure there will be people who are into the band because of their new sound even if they never really liked Guns in the past. That is no different than people maybe being into VR's new style of music even if they never liked Guns/STP. There is always elements of the old fan bases around, but it is entirely possible for a band with famous members to grow a base of their own that isn't interested in what they were.

[Ines_rocks!]

cmon ppl... this thread is about the cancelled european dates.. let?s stay on topic.

anyway... days pass by and theres still no oficial announcement on this... im starting to get quite concerned u know....

[jarmo]

Concerned about what?




/jarmo

[Jimmy?]

Concerned about what?




/jarmo

That VR are going all "GN'R" on us, by keeping things quiet??

[Ines_rocks!]

Concerned about what?




/jarmo

that they eventually do not rechedule the shows and simply keep on with the tour as it is now and promoting the album... and that I dont get to see them live for the first time ever... something I?ve been expecting for 2 years now... especially seeing Slash live...that?s it.

[Mikkamakka]

Uhm, canceling dates for the sake of promotion isn't a fan friendly move. Not at all. Their only excuse is that the record was scheduled for an early May release, then the record company pushed it back by a month, then another month. So RCA kinda ruined their touring schedule.

[Intercourse]

Let's see where all the fucking whiners are now that VR cancelled gigs.?

Again you're ignoring the facts. People whined when GNR cancelled gigs to finish their album then re-scheduled the gigs and still no word about the album. Its the lack of an album not the lack of gigs that people are whining about. Also if you read through this tread quite a lot of people are angry with the re-scheulding.

It's a fact that bands cancel gigs. It happens.

So what are you getting so pissy about?

Or maybe the truth is that nobody really gives a fuck about this band.

You should ask the three million that bought the album and the 7,000 a night that are going to see them live if they agree.

No matter how much you people dislike GN'R, you still care enough to bitch when something negative happens.....

And the same goes for you with VR. You pounce like starving rat on anything you can use to push your very personal agenda against VR. Sadly, you're getting worse despite the genuine concern expressed by many people who have kept this board alive for the last decade.

That's even more amusing....

There is nothing that shows you to be  'amused' by VR & their fans in your input lately, 'demented' would be a more suitable word to describe it.

The only ones who bring these things up are fellow GN'R fans who find it amusing how shitty you treat GN'R on a GN'R site, while VR can do no wrong in your eyes

More sweeping statements. Many VR fans have critized the first single as being weak, the EP as a money grab and have been angry with the cancelled dates. I don't see the blind worship you keep harping on about.
Your problem is that you cannot abide ANY criticism of your idol and his band. You have also implemented undemocratic methods to fit your own agenda (deleting posts and issuing karma points). I really don't get why you keep this section of the board open, it seems to cause you such personal outrage.
I come back here just to read how angry you get and I must say I'm impressed in a rather morbid way that you continue to ratchet up the hatred a notch every time. You should look at how Falcon behaves as a mod and learn something, take some time off and think about something other than saving GNR from the ravages of all the evil VR fans in the world. I think this would do you some good.

Intercourse.

[jarmo]

Undemocratic methods? Hahahaha!

I don't need to have a referendum every time I moderate on a board that I actually started years before you came around.


I've never been about doing things the way you think they should be done. Over the years, even when we had like ten people posting, there's always been somebody who was unhappy that I told him/her to stop or locked their thread.

What makes you think I'll listen to people like you now?


Wake up and smell the fucking coffee already.



Every band cancels gigs, but it seems only GN'R gets attacked by their own fans. Fans who are always unhappy.

I'm happy that you're happy with this money grabbing record company project band. Good for you.





/jarmo

[Intercourse]

I don't need to have a referendum every time I moderate on a board that I actually started years before you came around.

Well you could behave more in the spirit of what a real forum mod actually does, I never mentioned having referendums. What does the length of time you've been at this have to do with anything?

I've never been about doing things the way you think they should be done.

Like allowing free speech or respecting peoples opinions?

What makes you think I'll listen to people like you now?

I know you won't. No amount of reasoning from any members here seems to be moving you away from your rather extremist stance.

Wake up and smell the fucking coffee already.

Smell the coffee about what? I see this in many of your diatribes lately, you seem to think you are aware of some huge secret game going on here that the rest of us have missed? Please explain to me what I have failed to grasp about either band.

Every band cancels gigs, but it seems only GN'R gets attacked by their own fans. Fans who are always unhappy.

When GNR starts functioning like a proper fucking band, I think you'll see the attacks fall away.

I'm happy that you're happy with this money grabbing record company project band. Good for you.

Thanks. I'd like to think you're happy with GNR but your huge exertions against VR would indicate otherwise. I think shrinks call it 'projection', you're exhibiting all the classic symptoms. Congratulations.

[jarmo]

Free speech and GN'R fans don't mix.

I learned that the first time I tried to run an unmoderated forum back in 1999.

Giving assholes too much freedom does also not work. I've also learned that the hard way.



So please, continue with your advice and analyze me you wanna be shrink.




/jarmo

[torqued]

Quote
Like allowing free speech or respecting peoples opinions?

Another moron who doesn't how to use free speech.You do not have free speech when you're under someone else' umbrella (i.e.Forum,your JOB)Go to work and cuss your boss out and when he fires you ,sue him in the name of free speech and see how far it gets you.You do not have free speech when you're under someone else' umbrella.It's that simple,yet people just don't get it.This why free speech should be banned.People simply don't understand how it works.

[Naupis]

I'm happy that you're happy with this money grabbing record company project band.

Aren't you the one always telling us that you don't have to buy something if you don't want it when people make the exact same claim about GNR being a money grabbing touring band? I fail to see how VR releasing 75 versions of the same thing is really that much different than GNR coming through town multiple times playing the same setlist essentially. When people complain about that elsewhere I think you used to post something along the lines of you traded your money for a service, so there is nothing to complain about. If you don't want to goto that show then don't buy a ticket so you won't have to pay. Wouldn't that same standard apply to this? Aren't they both just a means of lining the band's and label's pockets?

Beside's, it is kind of hard to throw stones as a money grabbing record company project band when GNR's last 2 commercial releases have been a Live double album and a greatest hits all for a band with exactly 3.5 albums of original material. Talk about trying to milk a dry cow.

One thing I can actually say we agree on is that while I and others obviously don't love the content filtering, I would be exactly the same way if it were my forum. My ball, my rules. Owning the ball certainly does allow one to make the rules because at anytime you can take it and go home. People need to reconcile with that fact of life.

[estrangedpaul]

can't believe how badly you are trolling this board... it's painful to watch...

Go look at some riddles then.


Let's see where all the fucking whiners are now that VR cancelled gigs.


It's a fact that bands cancel gigs. It happens.

What's interesting is the total lack of comments from the people who were there to bash GN'R for doing the same AND for giving a reason.

That's fucking priceless!


Or maybe the truth is that nobody really gives a fuck about this band......

No matter how much you people dislike GN'R, you still care enough to bitch when something negative happens.....

Maybe that's it.

That's even more amusing....


The only ones who bring these things up are fellow GN'R fans who find it amusing how shitty you treat GN'R on a GN'R site, while VR can do no wrong in your eyes.

You really are on the wrong message board "VR only fans"......





/jarmo

I don't agree. Many fans of VR, who loved their first album are disappointed by many aspects of VR lately. Including the first single She Builds Quick Machines and the released clips. It's obvious from reading the threads on it. I personally loved Slither, Fall To Pieces, Loving The Alien, Sucker Train Blues, etc. and of course You Got No Right, which I consider the best song since 1993 by any ex or present member of GnR, and liked many other songs from CB. There were no bad songs as such. I seen them live in 2005 and thought it was great. I bought tickets for the Who & VR in Dublin.

However, I find SBQM to be really boring, Let it Roll is average, and the clips don't do anything for me, even Last Fight sounds plain but has potential. I'm pissed that they've cancelled these gigs, even if the one I was going to was as support. The so-called "most dangerous band in the world" and the saviour of "Rock n' roll" would prefer to do promotion (we've already had a million interviews we don't need a million more) than play for their fans who've bought tickets. Supporting the Who would have brought in so many new fans, and would have been much better promotion than anything else they could plan. It's very disappointing, ?to say the least. The last thing we need is VR turning into media whores instead of Rock N' Rollers.

[Booker Floyd]

Another moron who doesn't how to use free speech.

I would presume that somebody who chastises another poster for not understanding the rules of this forum would know better than to break those rules himself with name-calling.

[CheapJon]

Hultsfred, Sweden aint cancelled that's all that matters to me

[Intercourse]

This why free speech should be banned.People simply don't understand how it works.

There was an angry little man who once ruled Germany in the thirties who agreed fully with your view. Being called a moron by you is a compliment.

[Intercourse]

Free speech and GN'R fans don't mix.

Wow.

Giving assholes too much freedom does also not work. I've also learned that the hard way.

Quite the wounded one aren't you? What was the hard lesson? I'd love some examples of how you suffered so I can try to understand what drives all of this nastiness.

So please, continue with your advice and analyze me you wanna be shrink.

Better than being a wanna be dictator.

[chineseblues]

So please, continue with your advice and analyze me you wanna be shrink.

Better than being a wanna be dictator.

Grow the fuck up. If you hate the rules here so much then why not just fucking leave? Theres lots of boards out there that allow you to bash the current form of guns. I'm sure you can find them, go there and leave us adults alone. 

[jarmo]

I don't need to give you examples.

Anybody who has paid attention over the years know what I'm talking about.


You, Booker, Mikkamakka, Naupis and Genesis obviously haven't. The little clique of "GN'R fans" who love nothing more than to put down the band for their "shitty business" (among other things) because they refuse to do things your fucking way.


You're probably the kind of people who love to post shit and if something bad happens, you'll say "what did I tell you? I knew it would happen!"

Then when the opposite happens it's "I always supported this band and I knew they could do it!".

You never lose.


Axl is held responsible for everything. Even things that happen that are out of his control, but when VR fucks up, it's always management and/or the record company.... Axl's apparently a liar, but you can't prove it. You keep saying he promised you an album and promised to be back next summer. 


Some of you are fans of something that doesn't exist anymore and you're probably holding Axl (and the band) responsible for standing in the way of that reunion dream from happening.

Better than being a wanna be dictator.

Is that supposed to be funny?

Since you're such and expert, how do you advise a person who starts a web site should run it?

Take into account what everybody says so it's "democratic"? I'm sorry, but I won't let some 12 year olds run my site for me.



You're as amusing as the rest of the little clique. You're all too good to be GN'R fans because of your "objective" point of views. In reality, you (like the rest of us) don't know shit about the band and yet you think you have all the answers to everything.





/jarmo